Client Etiquette: Don’t ask how much, and then say it’s too much…

[Jarrod_Uncut]

This is become, and has always been: a pet peeve. RentMasseur is particularly prone to this, I find. But other sites like Adam can have more than their fair share of it. For example on my Twitter I posted:

#1 If you KNOW you have a budget, don’t ask what an escort/masseur charges. Save the guessing games and make an offer.

#2 My rate is in my ad OR website. Repeating it is extra work=fee

#3 I know my worth. Don’t gaslight me.

I know there was a recent discussion about haggling that I didn’t get to “in time”. But this isn’t about haggling. It’s about basic decency. I imagine most out there have common sense and an idea that a full service SWer is going to ask $200-$300. If someone isn’t prepared to pay that amount, they shouldn’t be approaching off the bat, asking what someone charges. They need to be saying right off the bat: I don’t know your prices (even though it’s on my site, which further proves some stupidity and inability to read), but I’m able to afford X, can you assist? Versus trying to be cunning and make me make the first move. 
 

Also, it’s not like I walked up to said person offering to sell him something. Said person came and DM’d me. If someone knows they can probably only afford a certain amount, common courtesy would be to simply INCLUDE an offer. For example:

 

Notice how he had time to say everything else, but didn’t have time to say what he could afford to pay. This is just time wasting and playing guessing games. 
 

Meanwhile, I’m supposed to be able to afford to visit a different city: spend on commuting, hotel and pay my bills at home, off some phantom amount less than what I charge. But I’m too expensive? Okay...

I feel my prices are decent because couple weeks ago, I had 4/5 back to back bookings in a couple days, who all paid what I asked without trying to talk me down or say it’s too much. And the other day, met a great first time client who sent deposit ahead, booked the room/session and was accommodating from before to after the appointment.

If they can do it, there shouldn’t be any excuses from others not to maintain proper etiquette. 

Edited April 22, 2023 by Jarrod_Uncut

[+ Coolwave35]

You’re 1,000% right. 

[RadioRob]

If you simply expect people to make an offer, wouldn’t you just later be mad when you spend your time with lowball offers? 

I would set my price and as soon as they say too expensive, just move on. Having them make an offer first just sets you up for the lowball offers out the gate as it’s now haggling. 

[+ nycman]

[SouthOfTheBorder]

this issue can largely be avoided by posting hourly rates on the various platforms designed for providers.  If a provider makes the choice to use social networking sites that prohibit provider ads, then don’t be surprised by the troublesome “clients” that come through on those platforms
 
not posting rates on RM, masseurfinder, etc is my pet peeve because it forces me to ask the question - and with recent price increases in major cities, it does make a difference in my decisions: $300 is a yes, $500 is a no.  I’m not a rate negotiator, but it seems like smart advertising to state clearly if rates are non-negotiable or if the provider is open to some sort of discount situation such as multiple hours, military, etc   

I feel like small subset of providers avoid posting hourly rates in the hope of engaging the client and then persuading/guilting them into a meeting.

why not just post the rates and make it clear ? I’d also suggest making it clear if the provider can host and a general description of the environment (downtown luxury hotel, etc).  The idea is to answer basic potential client questions and thus, avoid unnecessary interaction w the provider.  

Edited April 21, 2023 by SouthOfTheBorder

[omgazn]

I agree with southoftheborder. I doesn't hurt to answer some potential common questions. Reviews, location and cost is a pretty big factor in this area.

[Simon Suraci]

5 minutes ago, SouthOfTheBorder said:

providers avoid posting hourly rates in the hope of engaging the client and then persuading/guilting them into a meeting.

why not just post the rates and make it clear ?

I agree. I assume the same when providers don’t post rates, like they want the client to engage and then be more likely to book if they are already in a conversation, even if the rate is too high.

There’s nothing wrong with the client asking and saying sorry, I can’t afford it and you both move on. Clients ask questions all the time about stuff clearly posted to the ad. It’s just people being dumb, not reading it. That’s what people do. It’s just part of the biz. Politely respond and move on. Not everyone can afford you.

A few possibilities:

Providers may set rates differently for each client, both for good reasons and bad ones, usually bad.

Providers offer multiple rates for different levels of service and duration. For example, a BDSM session is X, vanilla full service is Y, oral only is Z. Massage or combination massage/escort is another rate. Maybe topping has a different rate than bottoming or vers play. Overnights and weekends may have their own rates. In that case the provider needs to know what the client wants before he can appropriately quote the rate or total fee.

Rate fluctuation based on travel city. Someone in San Francisco may be more likely to pay a higher rate than someone in Kansas City. Sometimes a provider feels this out, sometimes he knows what his rate is in different areas and doesn’t want to give the impression he is a certain rate across the whole country. The better ones maintain a constant rate regardless.

[+ DynamicUno]

34 minutes ago, SouthOfTheBorder said:

this issue can largely be avoided by posting hourly rates on the various platforms designed for providers.  If a provider makes the choice to use social networking sites that prohibit provider ads, then don’t be surprised by the troublesome “clients” that come through on those platforms
 
not posting rates on RM, masseurfinder, etc is my pet peeve because it forces me to ask the question - and with recent price increases in major cities, it does make a difference in my decisions: $300 is a yes, $500 is a no.  I’m not a rate negotiator, but it seems like smart advertising to state clearly if rates are non-negotiable or if the provider is open to some sort of discount situation such as multiple hours, military, etc   

I feel like small subset of providers avoid posting hourly rates in the hope of engaging the client and then persuading/guilting them into a meeting.

why not just post the rates and make it clear ? I’d also suggest making it clear if the provider can host and a general description of the environment (downtown luxury hotel, etc).  The idea is to answer basic potential client questions and thus, avoid texting provider.  

That would be ideal.  Unfortunately, due to SESTA/FOSTA laws passed in the US, RentMen disabled the ability to post rates for US based providers.  Some have posted rates obliquely, but I'm not sure how RM treats attempt to circumvent their limits.

Edited April 21, 2023 by DynamicUno

[DWnyc]

Even if a rate is posted it shouldn’t be unexpected that a potential client asks and it’s not always the case they haven’t gone through available info.

Maybe it differs by geography and type of provider, but anecdotally, I would say without what is called haggling, and my own style is never negotiate in this field just take it or leave it, at least a third of the time I end up paying a different rate because something comes up in the back and forth before confirming and sometimes it’s actually higher. Annoying for the provider for me to ask rate or my having crossed a red line in doing so? It’s not a red line for every provider, so if it is for you, move on. I’ve had providers tell me they knew I was serious as I started with that question rather than what might trigger a warning for sexting etc. 

Lastly, is it really the end of the world if a potential client hasn’t read the available material including the rate piece? Could be all sorts of reasons: wasn’t aware of it, read part of it but missed the price part or wanted clarification etc. Or wonders if that’s the rate today. I don’t think I’ve ever reached out to a provider knowing a rate (I’m in the US) but I can see myself wondering, particularly on a website or something that maybe poorly designed, full of typos, bad grammar etc whether the rate is correct or out of date (or consistent, in that the provider honors what is there in writing … on many things they do not). I saw a provider site the other day that had reference to his upcoming travel dated 2020 … so 3 years later I might be wondering is the rate there still what it is today?

It’s not like the client is applying for a job with the provider or entrance into w college and this is a test of their ability to follow instructions. 

[Jarrod_Uncut]

4 hours ago, RadioRob said:

If you simply expect people to make an offer, wouldn’t you just later be mad when you spend your time with lowball offers? 

I would set my price and as soon as they say too expensive, just move on. Having them make an offer first just sets you up for the lowball offers out the gate as it’s now haggling. 

No, that wouldn’t quite be what I would expect. It’s not an invitation to lowball offers. You catch get the point.
 

What I’m saying is: Instead of coming to me asking me to do this, this, and that and then ask what I charge, if that person already KNOWS, what they can afford...then they need to also include that. Either in the first or second message.

Theres nothing wrong with that. It’s not haggling. That then gives me the opportunity to accept or decline. I’ll be less offended by someone tactfully saying what they can afford: not TELLING ME what they can give me, ASKING me and then adding that WITH what they are looking for. There’s a difference.

And then to add, “it’s too expensive, out of my league, etc.” that’s just unnecessary commentary. By saying too expensive, a person is saying I don’t know my worth, and I don’t know what I should charge. It’s basically gaslighting me into thinking: maybe I need to lower my rates. Maybe I am too expensive. 
 

In reality it’s just bad etiquette on their part. And then when I responded back: how much are you looking to afford? He doesn’t even reply back. So he has no idea what he wants.
 

1 hour ago, SouthOfTheBorder said:

this issue can largely be avoided by posting hourly rates on the various platforms designed for providers.  If a provider makes the choice to use social networking sites that prohibit provider ads, then don’t be surprised by the troublesome “clients” that come through on those platforms
 
not posting rates on RM, masseurfinder, etc is my pet peeve because it forces me to ask the question - and with recent price increases in major cities, it does make a difference in my decisions: $300 is a yes, $500 is a no.  I’m not a rate negotiator, but it seems like smart advertising to state clearly if rates are non-negotiable or if the provider is open to some sort of discount situation such as multiple hours, military, etc   

I feel like small subset of providers avoid posting hourly rates in the hope of engaging the client and then persuading/guilting them into a meeting.

why not just post the rates and make it clear ? I’d also suggest making it clear if the provider can host and a general description of the environment (downtown luxury hotel, etc).  The idea is to answer basic potential client questions and thus, avoid unnecessary interaction w the provider.  

 

I hope you read my original post well 🤔 

The site was RentMasseur. It shows rates on RentMasseur. My ad also has a link to my website with a full crafted menu of rates and my deposit info. It’s right in front of his fucking face. So to ASK ME, and then TELL ME I’m too expensive, is blatantly bullshitting because the info is right in front of his face. You don’t have to look far to find it. If you can find “contact me, email me” clear at the bottom of page, find that I’m visiting a city and TELL ME that you KNOW I’m visiting a city…surely that person is smart enough to see my rates and read my ad where I have a clickable link to my website, directly to my pricing list. 
 

So, no excuses there.

 

Edited April 21, 2023 by Jarrod_Uncut

[Jarrod_Uncut]

2 hours ago, Simon Suraci said:

I agree. I assume the same when providers don’t post rates, like they want the client to engage and then be more likely to book if they are already in a conversation, even if the rate is too high.

There’s nothing wrong with the client asking and saying sorry, I can’t afford it and you both move on. Clients ask questions all the time about stuff clearly posted to the ad. It’s just people being dumb, not reading it. That’s what people do. It’s just part of the biz. Politely respond and move on. Not everyone can afford you.

A few possibilities:

Providers may set rates differently for each client, both for good reasons and bad ones, usually bad.

Providers offer multiple rates for different levels of service and duration. For example, a BDSM session is X, vanilla full service is Y, oral only is Z. Massage or combination massage/escort is another rate. Maybe topping has a different rate than bottoming or vers play. Overnights and weekends may have their own rates. In that case the provider needs to know what the client wants before he can appropriately quote the rate or total fee.

Rate fluctuation based on travel city. Someone in San Francisco may be more likely to pay a higher rate than someone in Kansas City. Sometimes a provider feels this out, sometimes he knows what his rate is in different areas and doesn’t want to give the impression he is a certain rate across the whole country. The better ones maintain a constant rate regardless.

Right, but there’s a difference between: I can’t afford it, and “you’re too expensive FOR ME”. Well who said my life and finances relied on what he thinks about my prices? Words are everything.
 

I just came back from 2 months tour. I mostly charged the same from Denver to Arizona to San Diego. However, I do find in the Midwest, South and Florida…seems like rate and deposit resistant is a bit higher than in other areas. 
 

However, I will also say I am moving away from the “cheaper area=charge less, more expensive area =charge more”.

Hell, in Kansas City they have Ocean prime downtown that charges $20-$40 for a glass of wine, they have sporting events charging thousands of dollars, and there’s huge homes in various communities. I’m going to charge the same here, as I did in San Diego last month. And I’ll charge the same in Washington DC as I would in Minneapolis. Being an escort still costs me the same regardless. 

People who talk about, “guys around here charge XXX” are delusional and have no concept of the individuality and independence that sex work affords. 

Edited April 21, 2023 by Jarrod_Uncut

[IamAdamRose]

Yup!!!! Anything lower than $250…. Clients should not even ask for any kind of penetration services… IMO…. 

[DWnyc]

1 hour ago, Jarrod_Uncut said:

By saying too expensive, a person is saying I don’t know my worth, and I don’t know what I should charge. It’s basically gaslighting me into thinking: maybe I need to lower my rates. Maybe I am too expensive. 

 

Surely anyone can say whatever they want to you … but it shouldn’t affect you if you’re comfortable with your position and have the data and experience to back it up. 

One or two or three … clients telling you you’re too expensive shouldn't be a problem if you have at least as many examples where clients have paid what you’re asking and have validation that the market tolerates that. He can say you’re fat, ugly and stupid … but that doesn’t make it true  

Even if his only goal was to mess with you … why not just walk away and move on? 

[DWnyc]

4 hours ago, SouthOfTheBorder said:

I’m not a rate negotiator, but it seems like smart advertising to state clearly if rates are non-negotiable or if the provider is open to some sort of discount situation such as multiple hours, military, etc   

Agreed in principle with your post (remembering RM can’t list rates in the US) but I also have to say if I see “rates are non-negotiable” in this context, I’m unlikely to believe it, just given how much I’ve seen providers try to negotiate with me when I haven’t event tried myself. 

It suggests to me that I actually leave things on the table because I don’t negotiate in this context. Im talking of providers as a whole group and not anyone specific.

”And that’s my final word on the subject …” (until the next time).

[Boink]

9 hours ago, Jarrod_Uncut said:

#1 If you KNOW you have a budget, don’t ask what an escort/masseur charges. Save the guessing games and make an offer.

#2 My rate is in my ad OR website. Repeating it is extra work=fee

#3 I know my worth. Don’t gaslight me.

 

If the provider has a set rate, wouldn't #1 ('Make an offer') be the very definition of what you're trying to avoid? (i.e 'gaslighting'?) That doesn't sound like 'saving the guessing games'; it's creating one.

Also, is it really that much 'extra work' to just state your rates, even if it's in your ad or website? You expect a fee for that??

Edited April 21, 2023 by Boink
punctuation

[Jamie21]

Sometimes clients are a bit naive about rates, so the price comes as a surprise and then they say they can’t afford it. It’s just part of the business, I don’t mind them saying ‘sorry it’s more than I can / want to pay’ as long as they ask the price question early in the conversation. It’s very irritating when you agree a time / date and services etc and he asks ‘how much?’. I’ve assumed he’s read my website and has decided the price is fine…why get so far as to setting a time and the content etc only to decide you can’t afford it? 

 

[DWnyc]

4 hours ago, Jarrod_Uncut said:

. And then when I responded back: how much are you looking to afford? He doesn’t even reply back. So he has no idea what he wants.

 

No response doesn’t necessarily mean he doesn’t know what he wants. 

So when you asked him “how much are you looking to afford” doesn’t that imply you’re open to a price reduction / negotiation? Unless you were looking for a debate with him on why he’s wrong …? 

[Jarrod_Uncut]

2 hours ago, DWnyc said:

Surely anyone can say whatever they want to you … but it shouldn’t affect you if you’re comfortable with your position and have the data and experience to back it up. 

One or two or three … clients telling you you’re too expensive shouldn't be a problem if you have at least as many examples where clients have paid what you’re asking and have validation that the market tolerates that. He can say you’re fat, ugly and stupid … but that doesn’t make it true  

Even if his only goal was to mess with you … why not just walk away and move on? 

I agree with everything up until…

Walk away and move on? This isn’t an art crawl. If someone has all the info at their sight and still comes around disrespectful, they deserve to get whatever reaction. This has been discussed on the forum as well, about other providers popping off on those who play the naive role. 
 

I have more respect for someone who says, “I’m broke, I don’t make enough to afford you”, than to say I’m overpriced. Overpriced what? The same price hikes that has hit everyone else with regular jobs, has no spared escorts who have to PAY…. PAY TO ADVERTISE AND WORK.

For example, a guy who seen me first at my regular rate…I reached out to see if he wanted to rebook. He admitted he had an unexpected tax bill and couldn’t meet. I offered him my return client promotion, and he came and seen me. 

Edited April 21, 2023 by Jarrod_Uncut

[Jarrod_Uncut]

31 minutes ago, DWnyc said:

No response doesn’t necessarily mean he doesn’t know what he wants. 

So when you asked him “how much are you looking to afford” doesn’t that imply you’re open to a price reduction / negotiation? Unless you were looking for a debate with him on why he’s wrong …? 

Not necessarily. I’d be curious about how much he thinks a service would be, just like he’s curious how much I charge. 

If he says something lower than what I want to accept, I won’t be insulted. I’ll either be open to agree or know that he’s not someone I want to see.

But hitting someone up at random and hoping they say something that fits a budget, is not conducive. Wasting your time, and my time, and giving me double work because I spend hours crafting my rates and to still ask despite it being up…

I should have just ignored him from day 1 because it already sounds sketchy. That was my mistake. 

Edited April 21, 2023 by Jarrod_Uncut

[jeezifonly]

[+ nycman]

[RadioRob]

This is just me, but as the person buying a service...  I don't play the "how much am I willing to pay" game.  If the service/person can't tell me what they see as their value, I don't see it as my job to figure it out for them.  It would be one thing if they had their rates published and I ignored it...  but it's entirely different if it's not listed on the ad and I can't get a straight answer when I ask.

I'm either going to ignore the request to make an offer or I'm going to intentionally give a low number.  I already personally have moved on at this point even if I've proposed that low rate, but if it's accepted hey I'll re-engage.  If not, I've already got a couple other messages out.   But in either case... that service/person has lost from me.  

[jeezifonly]

Clients like me waste the provider’s time with exchange re: duration, start time and location - if those don’t work for me, I don’t need the rate because time parameters are fixed for me. I will say “thx I will try with more notice next time” and just contact another provider.

We’re a waste of your time, J.
All of us. We LIVE to torture SW’s by responding to ads. 😉

[MikeBiDude]

I guess I don’t understand @Jarrod_Uncut:

1) client describes himself, and requests info

2) you send him link to your website, he checks it out 

3) after viewing your site…he determines you are not in his price range/budget

What’s the issue here? The “too expensive” comment?  Why should a client disclose his budget range in an exploratory message?

[DWnyc]

1 hour ago, Jarrod_Uncut said:

Not necessarily. I’d be curious about how much he thinks a service would be, just like he’s curious how much I charge. 

If he says something lower than what I want to accept, I won’t be insulted. I’ll either be open to agree or know that he’s not someone I want to see.

But hitting someone up at random and hoping they say something that fits a budget, is not conducive. Wasting your time, and my time, and giving me double work because I spend hours crafting my rates and to still ask despite it being up…

I should have just ignored him from day 1 because it already sounds sketchy. That was my mistake. 

All I take away from your asking him, how much he can afford, and what I presume most people would take away, is that your rates aren’t actually sacrosanct.

And if you offer discounts as you’ve said elsewhere, or if you say you were willing to hear him out to see if his counter offer was lower than something you’d be willing to accept (implies you would actually accept something lower price than your published rate) why shouldn’t someone try to have a conversation about price?