my dilemma

[manforme]

Hello,

 

 First I request there be no negative feedback. My dilemma is that I am an old 'baby boomer' who has never lived as a gay man. I married years ago and raised a family. I am not willing to give up my family. What I want is to find friend(s) in similar situations. When I say friends, I mean that. Not sex, but just conversation about our shared situation. I live in Delco, PA. I have tried to find groups and 'chat' rooms for this, but no luck. Is there anyone out there reading this who is living in the area (outside Philadelphia)? Some of the younger men do not seem to understand that us older guys have a completely different life and grew up in a very different time. I am actually expecting some negative feedback, but I will ignore that. Thanks in advance.

[BuffaloKyle]

Do you have a local pride center by you? Being close to Philadelphia there hopefully is. That would be the very best place to reach out to and find some community groups for you to participate in. I know for instance the pride center by me they do a weekly meetup at a coffee house to hang out.

Edited September 26, 2023 by BuffaloKyle

[+ BobPS]

I lived in the Philadelphia vicinity for many, many years. Go to Giovanni’s Room in Philadelphia. It is a  bookstore specializing in gay, lesbian literature.I think it’s the oldest one in the country. It is not a porn shop. The staff very helpful and knowledgeable and should be able to give you some ideas as to where to go to meet people like yourself.  Their website is:     queerbooks.com

Edited September 26, 2023 by BobPS
Typo

[marylander1940]

21 minutes ago, manforme said:

Hello,

 

 First I request there be no negative feedback. My dilemma is that I am an old 'baby boomer' who has never lived as a gay man. I married years ago and raised a family. I am not willing to give up my family. What I want is to find friend(s) in similar situations. When I say friends, I mean that. Not sex, but just conversation about our shared situation. I live in Delco, PA. I have tried to find groups and 'chat' rooms for this, but no luck. Is there anyone out there reading this who is living in the area (outside Philadelphia)? Some of the younger men do not seem to understand that us older guys have a completely different life and grew up in a very different time. I am actually expecting some negative feedback, but I will ignore that. Thanks in advance.

You'll have more choices in a bigger city like Philadelphia. 

Have you thought about volunteering as a way to help others while making gay friends? 

What You Can Do to Support the Mental Health of LGBTQIA+ Loved Ones | St. Luke’s Penn Foundation

WWW.PENNFOUNDATION.ORG

---

Get the most up-to-date advice and information about mental health, substance use, intellectual disability needs, the benefits of counseling and other employee...

 

OUR Way's OUR Space

WWW.MAZZONICENTER.ORG

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OUR Way Programming will return on Wednesday June 7thOUR Space is a drop-in support space by OUR Way for everyone identifying along the transgender sp

 

[soloyo215]

45 minutes ago, manforme said:

Hello,

 

 First I request there be no negative feedback. My dilemma is that I am an old 'baby boomer' who has never lived as a gay man. I married years ago and raised a family. I am not willing to give up my family. What I want is to find friend(s) in similar situations. When I say friends, I mean that. Not sex, but just conversation about our shared situation. I live in Delco, PA. I have tried to find groups and 'chat' rooms for this, but no luck. Is there anyone out there reading this who is living in the area (outside Philadelphia)? Some of the younger men do not seem to understand that us older guys have a completely different life and grew up in a very different time. I am actually expecting some negative feedback, but I will ignore that. Thanks in advance.

Unfortunately things have changed with the newer generation. I do remember there been groups for people exactly like you, gay men in heterosexual marriages. They were support groups, but they also have social venues. And of course, they were not hookups nor sexual in nature.

I found the psychotherapy network web page that might have information on it:

The Gay Man in the Straight Marriage

WWW.PSYCHOTHERAPYNETWORKER.ORG

---

Rob rushed into his first session with me, gym bag on one shoulder, briefcase on the other, 10 minutes late and out of breath. He set his bags down, gently put his...

And the National Library of Medicine has a study:

Gay men from heterosexual marriages: attitudes, behaviors, childhood experiences, and reasons for marriage - PubMed

PUBMED.NCBI.NLM.NIH.GOV

---

In the current study, the attitudes, behaviors and experiences of 26 gay or bisexual men who were married to a woman are examined. Data are provided on...

Not specifically for men who are in your situation, but Philadelphia has the LGBT Elder Initiative, which can provide resources for your particular situation:

Seniors — William Way Community Center

WWW.WAYGAY.ORG

I think your approach to ignoring negativity is great, but it might depend on what you consider negative. Sometimes there are things that are not attacks, just things we don't like hearing.

Best wishes.

[Act25]

Sent you a PM.

[+ Charlie]

I know of at least two active members of this forum whose story is similar to yours. One of the now-deceased members here was a good friend of mine who didn't become actively gay until he was a grandfather; he managed to maintain his close relationships with his wife, grown children and other family members, so I know it can be done, even though it is not necessarily easy. He also managed to integrate some of his close gay friends with his straight family--his daughter and I shared his power of attorney for his health directives. He admitted to me that there were days when he wished he could still be the "normal" husband and father that he once was, yet he realized that he was who he was, and it was a relief to be that whole person. I hope that others here who share your kind of history will contact you.

I also lived for many years in Philadelphia, so I agree with Marylander's suggestion that you get to know the local organizations. The Mazzoni Center is named for Peter Mazzoni, a friend of mine who was active in AIDS organizations in the 1980s, and who died of AIDS. You may also want to check out the William Way Community Center for possible contacts. I have been gone from PA for 20 years, so I don't have any up-to-date information.

[+ augustus]

A gay oriented organization in Philly is the best way to start this journey.  It's a slow process and you will probably have problems with some of your family members.  This is a gradual process.  Do not rush this process.  Good luck!

[manforme]

4 hours ago, BobPS said:

I lived in the Philadelphia vicinity for many, many years. Go to Giovanni’s Room in Philadelphia. It is a  bookstore specializing in gay, lesbian literature.I think it’s the oldest one in the country. It is not a porn shop. The staff very helpful and knowledgeable and should be able to give you some ideas as to where to go to meet people like yourself.  Their website is:     queerbooks.com

yes. I know that place from whenI worked in Center city. I have not gone in to the city in over 3 years.

 

[CuriousByNature]

May I ask, is this a newer realization for you, or have you known/suspected that you were gay for much of your life?   In either case, I wish you well on this journey.

[jeezifonly]

If you’re resourceful enough to have found your way here, you’re also resourceful enough to find within your reach, the social connections you want . 💜

[+ jessmapex]

I am gen x and in my younger days i used to have negative opinion of gay men who got married to women. When i came out in the 90s to my parents, my own father suggested that I should marry a woman for stability and to follow the societal norms and play with men on the side. The twenty-something me soundly rejected that idea.

Now i think i am more mature and understand breadth and depth of human sexuality and the choices people make to survive. No negativity from me. I hope you find some friends in your area.

[manforme]

On 9/26/2023 at 12:55 PM, Charlie said:

I know of at least two active members of this forum whose story is similar to yours. One of the now-deceased members here was a good friend of mine who didn't become actively gay until he was a grandfather; he managed to maintain his close relationships with his wife, grown children and other family members, so I know it can be done, even though it is not necessarily easy. He also managed to integrate some of his close gay friends with his straight family--his daughter and I shared his power of attorney for his health directives. He admitted to me that there were days when he wished he could still be the "normal" husband and father that he once was, yet he realized that he was who he was, and it was a relief to be that whole person. I hope that others here who share your kind of history will contact you.

I also lived for many years in Philadelphia, so I agree with Marylander's suggestion that you get to know the local organizations. The Mazzoni Center is named for Peter Mazzoni, a friend of mine who was active in AIDS organizations in the 1980s, and who died of AIDS. You may also want to check out the William Way Community Center for possible contacts. I have been gone from PA for 20 years, so I don't have any up-to-date information.

 

On 9/26/2023 at 1:56 PM, CuriousByNature said:

May I ask, is this a newer realization for you, or have you known/suspected that you were gay for much of your life?   In either case, I wish you well on this journey.

most of my life, but I married in hopes that it would 'fix' me. I do love my wife.

 

 

[manforme]

On 9/26/2023 at 6:39 PM, jessmapex said:

I am gen x and in my younger days i used to have negative opinion of gay men who got married to women. When i came out in the 90s to my parents, my own father suggested that I should marry a woman for stability and to follow the societal norms and play with men on the side. The twenty-something me soundly rejected that idea.

Now i think i am more mature and understand breadth and depth of human sexuality and the choices people make to survive. No negativity from me. I hope you find some friends in your area.

thank you

 

[+ Coolwave35]

There’s a gay mountain upstate New York full of guys like you. It’s a real sense of community. I’d recommend going to anything. It’s all wonderful and inclusive. I’m a supporter and attendee and I’ve never been disappointed. 
 

Easton Mountain

WWW.EASTONMOUNTAIN.ORG

---

Easton Mountain is a community, sanctuary and retreat center dedicated to providing opportunities for community building...

 

[Guest]

On 9/26/2023 at 6:14 AM, manforme said:

Hello,

 

 First I request there be no negative feedback. My dilemma is that I am an old 'baby boomer' who has never lived as a gay man. I married years ago and raised a family. I am not willing to give up my family. What I want is to find friend(s) in similar situations....

As a baby boomer who chose another path, I don't suppose I can fully understand what you've been through. I don't understand, for example, why finding gay friends would represent "giving up" on you family. After all you've sacrificed, you don't feel you deserve some time for yourself? I knew the recently-deceased member @Charlie mentioned rather well. He was actually from a generation before yours, the Silent Generation. He didn't come out until his 60s, but he was a shining example of someone who made up for lost time. He did a lot more than make friends. Not that you have to follow in his footsteps, but he loved showing a huge photo book of all the men he'd hired--enough to make many men jealous. I suspect you might be interested in following in his footsteps, since you're here. It's too bad you hadn't written just several months ago, because he'd definitely been where you've been and his advice would probably have settled better with you. 

I just hope that after all of the sacrifices you've made for your family, that you can't look after yourself for whatever time you have left. Obviously, you can't expect your wife and family to be understanding overnight, but hopefully they can come around eventually. Life is not a dress rehearsal. He didn't start until his 60s, but his last 20 years or so were the best in that late member's life. I hope you can learn from his example. 

[+ Charlie]

10 hours ago, Unicorn said:

As a baby boomer who chose another path, I don't suppose I can fully understand what you've been through. I don't understand, for example, why finding gay friends would represent "giving up" on you family. After all you've sacrificed, you don't feel you deserve some time for yourself? I knew the recently-deceased member @Charlie mentioned rather well. He was actually from a generation before yours, the Silent Generation. He didn't come out until his 60s, but he was a shining example of someone who made up for lost time. He did a lot more than make friends. Not that you have to follow in his footsteps, but he loved showing a huge photo book of all the men he'd hired--enough to make many men jealous. I suspect you might be interested in following in his footsteps, since you're here. It's too bad you hadn't written just several months ago, because he'd definitely been where you've been and his advice would probably have settled better with you. 

I just hope that after all of the sacrifices you've made for your family, that you can't look after yourself for whatever time you have left. Obviously, you can't expect your wife and family to be understanding overnight, but hopefully they can come around eventually. Life is not a dress rehearsal. He didn't start until his 60s, but his last 20 years or so were the best in that late member's life. I hope you can learn from his example. 

Just to clarify Unicorn's comments, the recently deceased member of this site that he is referencing, whom I also knew but not well, is not the same person I was describing in my post, who died fifteen years ago.

[Guest]

3 hours ago, Charlie said:

Just to clarify Unicorn's comments, the recently deceased member of this site that he is referencing, whom I also knew but not well, is not the same person I was describing in my post, who died fifteen years ago.

Sorry to have jumped to conclusions about this other person who came out late in life despite having led a closeted life and bringing up a family, and who ended up doing well. That's good news for @manforme, though, as this represents another testimonial from someone who found happiness late in life with similar circumstances. If he died 15 years ago, he may have even been from the Greatest Generation, not just the Silent Generation, of which the late member was a member. So the OP has heard from multiple stories regarding men who did quite well following decades-long closeted lives, after having come out. Again, one cannot expect the wife and children to be understanding immediately. Hopefully, though, if there's true love, they will eventually be supportive. 

[+ Charlie]

The late forum member whom I described stumbled upon the old Hooboy site while looking for sex, but joined the forum in hopes of finding gay men his own age who might understand his history, which I think is the OP's motivation as well.

[wsc]

5 hours ago, Charlie said:

Just to clarify Unicorn's comments, the recently deceased member of this site that he is referencing, whom I also knew but not well, is not the same person I was describing in my post, who died fifteen years ago.

I am delighted to know that, like Mr. Twain, reports of your death were greatly exaggerated. Or, if more like the story of Jesus, welcome back!

[rvwnsd]

Welcome to the Company of Men. I'm glad you found us.

The Delaware County website has a page of LGBT+ resources. Some are located in Philadelphia, but by the looks of it, Delaware County isn't very far from Philadelphia, so perhaps they are doable for you. You mentioned not having been to Philadelphia in years, so maybe now is a good time to venture into the city.

On 9/26/2023 at 6:14 AM, manforme said:

...I am not willing to give up my family. What I want is to find friend(s) in similar situations. When I say friends, I mean that. Not sex, but just conversation...

When I came out in the mid-1990's at age 32 (older Gen-X here) I was concerned about losing family and friends. I lost no one. Granted, my situation was different than yours (never married, no kids) but the fact is being gay doesn't mean you lose people. Several of the older (70+) men in the coming out group I co-facilitated had the same concern and, frankly, it just didn't happen. There is hope!

The older gentlemen in our group would recommend two organizations to our older first-time members.  One is Prime Timers Worldwide, a social group that has local chapters in many cities. It looks like the Northern New Jersey chapter is the one closest to you. The other is an advocacy and resource group called SAGE. If I was recommending a group to try first, it would be SAGE. At first glance, it might look like you would not benefit from their services, but I think they could help point you in the direction of what you are looking for.

EDIT: The gents in our group would quickly mention to the younger guys that they were welcome, also. A couple of the twenty-somethings joined them and found it very enlightening.

Lastly, I couldn't help but notice you started and ended your first post with commentary about negative feedback:

On 9/26/2023 at 6:14 AM, manforme said:

...First I request there be no negative feedback. ... I am actually expecting some negative feedback, but I will ignore that. Thanks in advance.

First, let's call negative feedback what it is: rude, hurtful, vindictive, and mean behavior. Those who engage in that are jerks. Don't even bother with them - they won't listen to what you said and will be hurtful anyway. 

Second, and this is from personal experience, when you lead with negativity, negativity has a habit of finding you. I spent a pretty good chunk of my life doing that and I was miserable. Once I let go of that (and it wasn't easy) I was much happier and became more open to other people.

Hang in there! There is hope. This forum right here is a good place to be. We have people (yes, we have a few women who are members) of all backgrounds. Generally speaking, folks are helpful and supportive. When they aren't, other members will keep them in check. 

I look forward to your continued participation in the forum.

[TectonicThrust]

@manforme Check out GAMMA. There’s a tab for meetings under the menu link on the left. There’s a weekly meeting that takes place in Philly. (Also one in NYC.) Meetings may be on zoom these days. That should put you in touch with other local men in your situation and you may find the support group to be a great resource for you in other ways. 

GAMMA - GAMMA Home: GAMMA A support group for gay, bisexual or questioning men who are or were married, or otherwise involved with a woman

WWW.GAMMASUPPORT.ORG

---

Introduction to GAMMA

 

[pubic_assistance]

On 9/26/2023 at 9:14 AM, manforme said:

What I want is to find friend(s) in similar situations.

Firstly, there are many people in your situation.

Secondly, I think the above recommendations pointing you to "gay" groups is misguided. It's often the gays who are most critical of men who marry women yet have same-sex attraction. I would recommend you focus more on bisexual support groups. Although you may not identify as bi, you will find far more people with similar experiences as yourself, than you will dealing with gay men. 

I have a childhood friend in Chester PA who recently decided to live as a gay man after being married for decades and raising two boys. He's quite happy and seems to have found a circle of friends who support him.  The Philly suburbs definitely lean conservative so obviously discretion is the key to finding a balance between family and an active gay lifestyle. As I told my friend, step out of the closet, don't jump out with a dress and high heels.

Here is a web page that some of my other bisexual friends have used to find support and friends in their community.

Bisexual Resource Center

BIRESOURCE.ORG

Also feel free to Private Message me.

My wife and I are both bisexual and are raising two teenagers.

[marylander1940]

41 minutes ago, pubic_assistance said:

Firstly, there are many people in your situation.

Secondly, I think the above recommendations pointing you to "gay" groups is misguided. It's often the gays who are most critical of men who marry women yet have same-sex attraction. I would recommend you focus more on bisexual support groups. Although you may not identify as bi, you will find far more people with similar experiences as yourself, than you will dealing with gay men. 

I have a childhood friend in Chester PA who recently decided to live as a gay man after being married for decades and raising two boys. He's quite happy and seems to have found a circle of friends who support him.  The Philly suburbs definitely lean conservative so obviously discretion is the key to finding a balance between family and an active gay lifestyle. As I told my friend, step out of the closet, don't jump out with a dress and high heels.

Here is a web page that some of my other bisexual friends have used to find support and friends in their community.

Bisexual Resource Center

BIRESOURCE.ORG

Also feel free to Private Message me.

My wife and I are both bisexual and are raising two teenagers.

This post is beyond judgmental and full of stereotypes, it's also unsurprising quite self righteous!

Can you please stop saying "the gays"?  

[pubic_assistance]

50 minutes ago, marylander1940 said:

This post is beyond judgmental and full of stereotypes.

It's full of MY experience and my perspective.

Sorry if it makes you uncomfortable.

I also refuse to use the new umbrella term: "queer" ..so that's not happening.