When do I become a creepy stalker?

[+ APPLE1]

Do you always get responses from a prospective provider? How many times do inquire before giving up, or assuming they aren't interested, and label you as a weird stalker? Does it vary for local vs visiting providers?

Edited March 23, 2023 by APPLE1
Punctuation

[Simon Suraci]

Trying to hire a provider for services they advertise by contacting them is perfectly normal. Following up or asking again is also normal, especially if they haven’t got back to you from the first time you reached out.

If they haven’t got back to you by the second or third time you reached out, it’s safe to say move on. It’s good business for a provider to respond within a reasonable timeframe, even if it’s only to say, “sorry I am booked up for the day you requested, but here are the next times I am available”, something like that.

No response past a reasonable timeframe might indicate they are already overwhelmed with business and don’t need/want yours. Or they’re poor communicators, or flaky, or any number of things you probably don’t want in a provider anyways. It’s a bad sign. If they can’t do you the courtesy of responding, you probably shouldn’t hire them. Keep in mind sometimes it can take hours or the next morning for a provider to respond. Days without a response is unacceptable.

Here are some scenarios that a provider might choose not respond to: Demanding dick/ass/nude pics, especially if the provider is not an escort, or if all of these are posted publicly online. Writing impatient or angry remarks in all caps because the provider was working and did not immediately respond to a text within minutes. Rude or disrespectful comments, racist/sexist and similar remarks. Incomprehensible texts. Texts that seem like someone is drunk/high (it has to be pretty bad for that to shine through over a text). Texts in a language the provider doesn’t speak. Texts asking the same questions over and over, that the provider has already answered. Unreasonable requests, for example: asking a provider to travel hundreds of miles away within a few hours, for a 1-hr appointment, with no previously planned travel arrangements. If you’re communicating something that’s a big red flag to the provider, that may be the reason.

Any of the above merit some response, even if it’s a brief statement saying the provider can’t/won’t see the client. A lot of providers just don’t have the patience or emotional willpower to do this, however. Not a good excuse, but it happens.

Some known clients are blacklisted for being violent, not paying, or for other legitimate reasons. Sometimes it’s best for a provider to not to engage at all with someone they know is problematic based off the lists or other intel telling them the client is bad.

If you’re being normal and reasonable and the provider is not responding, it’s their loss. You’re paying, so that’s lost business for them, and an opportunity for the client to seek out a more reliable, responsive provider who wants their business and is willing and able to work hard to get it.

‘Stalker’ may not be the best operative word for what I think you mean. When I hear stalker, I think someone is going out of their way to invade my personal space, find out where I live, where I work (i.e. at a day job), research and track down my family, unearth sensitive personal information, threaten me, follow my movements in public, harass me, and so on. Same goes for harassing over text, or being aggressive, not respecting ‘no’ for an answer, demanding things, trying to contact me after being blocked on multiple platforms, and similar obsessive behaviors.

If you’ve reached out multiple times with no response, and you’re not ticking any of the red flag boxes, you’re definitely not a stalker, but I would seriously consider hiring another provider. Professionalism and respect are the minimum a client should expect in a good provider.

[Guest]

3 hours is enough time to wait for a response. This allows for the possibility he's with a customer or at the movies or a long meal. This is especially true if you call around 10 AM, when the escort is unlikely to be doing any of those things. After 3 hours, move to the next one on your list. Most people can be expected to at least be able to request a bathroom break every 3 hours. How often in life is one in a situation in which one cannot at least excuse oneself for a moment--enough time for a text---during any 3-hour period? Not answering after 3 hours says something about the provider: unprofessionalism most likely, perhaps even rudeness. Most businesses spend a lot on advertising. The least a provider can do is provide a brief, polite response--even if it's to say he's not available. 

[+ nycman]

1 hour ago, Unicorn said:

3 hours is enough time to wait for a response.

I agree. I used to have a "24-hour" rule, but I quickly learned 
if I don’t get a response within the hour, the likelihood of 
getting a response decays exponentially each passing hour. 

My 24 hour rule left me alone in a hotel room way too many
times. Even if they did respond after the 3 hour mark, those
individuals would often flake. 

So, 3 hours it is. 

[Jamie21]

You can call it at 3 hours. I’d disagree though. Sometimes if I’m travelling I’m not able to respond for > 3hrs. Or as in a recent example …a text “r u available now?” at 2am. I was asleep. Responded 7 hours later at 9am when I woke. I wasn’t available at 2am anyway so I guess he was looking for an immediate response. I don’t do last minute 2am appointments. So whilst a slow response might imply he’s not organised or interested it doesn’t necessarily mean that. 

 

[BtmBearDad]

I have to disagree with @Unicorn’s 3 hour rule. There are plenty of legitimate reasons a provider may not be able to reply within a 3 hour window. If he has a “normal” job, things may be crazy, and he can’t reply. Maybe he’s a student, and he’s in a lab, a lecture, or sitting an exam. He could be traveling. If he’s engaged in this hobby, how many posts have been made about providers using their phone during a session, and being dragged for it? 

I don’t think there’s any “rule” to follow - each hobbyist needs to determine that for themselves. If you’re looking for “right now” or today, that window is smaller than if you’re going to be in X city next Tuesday looking for company. 

[+ sync]

Legitimate persistence does not dub you as a creepy or weird stalker.

It is the provider's responsibility to advise you if he is not interested in your patronage. 

[Simon Suraci]

I avoid establishing a hard line rule of # of hours to be considered a reasonable period of time. It varies, with something reasonable falling between 2-hrs and 24 hrs. Your provider could be on a flight with no reception when you text. Or sleeping during the night, or at their day job if they have one. They could be in a remote place with little to no reception for a time. Who knows. Most providers in most normal situations will get back to you within a few hours or less if they are going to respond at all.

If a client wants to meet a particular provider, I highly recommend booking ahead a few days, or at least 24 hrs in advance. That puts you in a priority position so others have to book around your appointment or otherwise be out of luck because you planned ahead.

If the client has a very limited window of availability, such as only a few hours after meetings while on a business trip in the provider’s city, then I recommend booking a week or more ahead, at least a few days. It’s unlikely the provider will be available during that particular limited window on short notice that same day/night.

If your first choice provider does not respond within a reasonable time, you can safely assume it’s unlikely to work and move on to contacting alternate ones. If your schedule is more flexible on day/time and you’re both in the same city for a period of time, it may be worth trying again. If they don’t respond at all, bad sign, move on.

If you’re wanting company from any number of providers and you don’t particularly care which one exactly you are going to see, by all means, feel free to contact multiple for that same day/night, same hour / “right now” and see who responds. Some of them may be available on short notice and some won’t.

Keep in mind when texting a provider same day or short notice, you’re asking in so many words if the provider is available to respond to your text at that very moment (or within that reasonable period of time after your text) AND available to fulfill your appointment time request which may only be a couple hours after that. In total, you might be asking for the provider to be “available”in some sense for half a day, from start to finish from the time you first text to the time to get ready, time for either of you to travel, to the time the appointment actually ends. Plus travel time after the appointment ends, if applicable. That’s a lot to ask of a provider on short notice. Sometimes you luck out and it works out just that easy. Oftentimes not. Which is why I recommend booking ahead, at least 24 hrs. More is better whenever possible.

Planning ahead buys you a much better chance of getting exactly what you want with who you want, when you want. If your provider doesn’t respond within a day, you have the extra time to request alternates.

 

[Guest]

5 hours ago, BtmBearDad said:

I have to disagree with @Unicorn’s 3 hour rule. There are plenty of legitimate reasons a provider may not be able to reply within a 3 hour window. If he has a “normal” job, things may be crazy, and he can’t reply. Maybe he’s a student, and he’s in a lab, a lecture, or sitting an exam. He could be traveling. If he’s engaged in this hobby, how many posts have been made about providers using their phone during a session, and being dragged for it? 

I don’t think there’s any “rule” to follow - each hobbyist needs to determine that for themselves. If you’re looking for “right now” or today, that window is smaller than if you’re going to be in X city next Tuesday looking for company. 

Well, one can certainly come up with legitimate reasons why someone truly can't answer a text for 3 hours, but almost all of the ones I can think of are both rare and also mean the escort wouldn't be available anyway. Yes, trans-continental or trans-oceanic travel would last more than 3 hours (particularly if you texted him shortly after his plane's take-off), but in that case the escort is probably not going to be available. And, yes, if the escort got involved in a horrific traffic accident and was laid up in a hospital, he might not be able to text you, either--but, again, he wouldn't be available in that case, either.

Not a single one of the other "excuses" you mentioned would result in someone being unable to call over a 3 hour period. Lectures almost never last over 3 hours, and when they do, they come with breaks. I still go to conferences regularly and there are always breaks every 2 to 2.5 hours (3 hours is the max and unusual). While there are  handful of exams a person might have to take during his entire life which are more than 3 hours long, they also all come with breaks, generally every 2 hours, and never over 3 hours (and how often to escorts need to take those?). And certainly being in a lab doesn't mean you're unable to text or go to the bathroom for 3 hours--ever. Even if the escort is engaged in a long-term hire, there really is no situation in which there are 3 continuous hours in which he can't at least excuse himself for a few minutes. (Well, I suppose if the client took the escort camping into some woods where there was no cellular service, but, once again, that would mean the escort won't be available for a long time)

Trust me on this. Listen to the voice of experience from someone who's hired for decades. If you wait for more than 3 hours, you're almost certainly dealing with someone who's a flake in one way or another. The only other possibility is that he's truly unavailable (in a hospital, on a long-haul flight, etc.). If you don't move on after 3 hours, you're wasting your time and could find yourself alone with blue balls. 😉

[TonyDown]

I feel you!  Apparently this is a common scenario.

There is a provider very close by.  He definitely meets what I want.  But his communication has been slim to none.  This has happened to me with a couple others.  Sometimes it bothers me.  

I suppose if one doesn't want to appear like a stalker you could admit that,  not wanting to be bothersome, just making sure he saw your texts. 

That said, isn't it justifiable to move on rather than commit to someone not able to maintain good communication with you?  

I don't have any certain rules.  I just get a sense when it's no longer worth trying.

Edited March 23, 2023 by TonyDown
sp.

[BtmBearDad]

36 minutes ago, Unicorn said:

Well, one can certainly come up with legitimate reasons why someone truly can't answer a text for 3 hours, but almost all of the ones I can think of are both rare and also mean the escort wouldn't be available anyway. Yes, trans-continental or trans-oceanic travel would last more than 3 hours (particularly if you texted him shortly after his plane's take-off), but in that case the escort is probably not going to be available. And, yes, if the escort got involved in a horrific traffic accident and was laid up in a hospital, he might not be able to text you, either--but, again, he wouldn't be available in that case, either.

Not a single one of the other "excuses" you mentioned would result in someone being unable to call over a 3 hour period. Lectures almost never last over 3 hours, and when they do, they come with breaks. I still go to conferences regularly and there are always breaks every 2 to 2.5 hours (3 hours is the max and unusual). While there are  handful of exams a person might have to take during his entire life which are more than 3 hours long, they also all come with breaks, generally every 2 hours, and never over 3 hours (and how often to escorts need to take those?). And certainly being in a lab doesn't mean you're unable to text or go to the bathroom for 3 hours--ever. Even if the escort is engaged in a long-term hire, there really is no situation in which there are 3 continuous hours in which he can't at least excuse himself for a few minutes. (Well, I suppose if the client took the escort camping into some woods where there was no cellular service, but, once again, that would mean the escort won't be available for a long time)

Trust me on this. Listen to the voice of experience from someone who's hired for decades. If you wait for more than 3 hours, you're almost certainly dealing with someone who's a flake in one way or another. The only other possibility is that he's truly unavailable (in a hospital, on a long-haul flight, etc.). If you don't move on after 3 hours, you're wasting your time and could find yourself alone with blue balls. 😉

You’re entitlement, and inability to see beyond your own myopic view of real life is ridiculous - and not limited to this topic. 

This isn’t about flakes, which are an entirely different category all together. This is about well regarded, well reviewed providers who often aren’t able to drop everything to reply to a potential client’s text ASAP. The lump them all together is a disservice to the latter cohort. 

What you term “excuses” are in fact real life scenarios. If I’m in the office, chances are I’m not responding to any text. If I’m working remotely, there’s a better chance I’ll answer, but if things are busy/crazy, probably not. If I’m out to dinner, my phone is off - IMO it’s the height of bad manners to be on your phone when in company. Most of my friends and I have a “no phone” rule for dinner parties we host - again it’s just bad manners to be on your phone rather than engaging. In all these scenarios, that would be more than 3 hours before I’d respond to a text.

As far as studies go, there is a provider that while he no longer advertises, maintains availability to former regulars, but when he did advertise he was in graduate school, and his ad made it quite clear hours/days of availability as well as the fact one should not expect an immediate reply. Yet, as he often bemoaned, when he did reply (and yes, sometimes after more that 3 hours - quelle horreur!) there were always some hobbyists who would make a snarky, often degrading comment on the delay in reply. 

I can only imagine the vitriol you’d spew if a provider while engaged with you “took a break” to start texting with potential future clients. 

As I said, each hobbyist needs to determine their own window to wait on a reply. To say that the 3 hour rule is the standard isn’t the case. Of course, if you’re looking for “right now” or today, that’s different - but in this hobby, as with all things in life, you always start with Plan A, but you make sure you have a Plan B, C, etc. ready just in case. 

[Guest]

1 hour ago, BtmBearDad said:

... What you term “excuses” are in fact real life scenarios. If I’m in the office, chances are I’m not responding to any text. If I’m working remotely, there’s a better chance I’ll answer, but if things are busy/crazy, probably not. If I’m out to dinner, my phone is off...

I can only imagine the vitriol you’d spew if a provider while engaged with you “took a break” to start texting with potential future clients. 

As I said, each hobbyist needs to determine their own window to wait on a reply. To say that the 3 hour rule is the standard isn’t the case. Of course, if you’re looking for “right now” or today, that’s different - but in this hobby, as with all things in life, you always start with Plan A, but you make sure you have a Plan B, C, etc. ready just in case. 

Again, none of your scenarios holds water. No one is suggesting people should interrupt a dinner, but meals don't last over 3 hours. Period. Nor does sex. And no employer will tell an employee he can't go take a piss after 3 hours. I have hired men for long hires, and if you think I ever got upset over his answering a text, you're simply factually wrong. Wrong, wrong, wrong. Yes, if he had answered a text in the middle of the meal or in the middle of sex (though none have), I would have asked him to hold off until we were done, absent a family emergency. We're not talking 3+ hours though. And I'm not a "hobbyist." I'm a paying customer. 

The OP asked the question of what to do when someone he wants to hire doesn't answer his texts to him. Having been at this for many years, I will say from experience that if he doesn't answer after 3 hours, it's a mistake to keep waiting. It's never happened to me, but yes, you could get a text after 5 hours which said "Sorry I was on a flight from NYC to LA (or Toronto to Vancouver, or Sydney to Perth)," in which case you might respond "I found someone else for this time, but maybe next time."

This is what happened the last 3 times an escort took over 3 hours to respond to a text. In two instances, the escort never responded ever. The third responded 34 hours later with "Hey!" (no hint of an apology or even acknowledgement of a tardy response). None of those 3 had their ads up 2 weeks later, and they were clearly not serious about this line of work. The reality is that if you don't get a response within 3 hours, odds are at least 95% there's no point in waiting longer. 

(And, of course, when I say 3 hours, I mean waking hours. Obviously if you text someone at 1 AM, you can at best hope for a response when the provider awakens. Texting someone at 1 AM is usually pretty rude in an of itself anyway, which I think most people understand.)

 

Edited March 23, 2023 by Unicorn

[+ DrownedBoy]

If a provider is marked "Available," they'll be lucky if I give them 30 minutes. Otherwise I text someone else. Chicago has 200+ providers.

If someone is offline, I usually give a day.

[+ APPLE1]

 @Unicorn and @BtmBearDad I can appreciate what you are both saying. I am sure, most of us, if we texted a dinner invite for Sat night to a friend, have friends that:

1) would respond an hour later with an explanation about why it took them an hour to respond, and within the next hour have time, place, and all the other details sorted out = folks who relish in and appreciate that a text allows virtual receipt anywhere, any time, and a nearly immediate response; and 

2) would respond the following day and it might take us texts back and forth until Sat morning to establish a specific time to meet = folks who relish in and appreciate receipt virtually anywhere, and a response when it is convenient.

While certainly the scenario is different, the fact that different people hold different views on how soon a response is dictated.

Personally, I may be dating myself here, and I guess it would be a point in favor of @BtmBearDad but sometimes I really miss answering machines. You never got crappy messages about things you had to deal with in the middle of the day. You got those when your day was done, you were home and relaxed, and you could respond at your leisure!

Edited March 23, 2023 by APPLE1

[Guest]

39 minutes ago, APPLE1 said:

...

While certainly the scenario is different, the fact that different people hold different views on how soon a response is dictated...

As you said, the scenario is certainly different. More often than not, I will not text people social invitations, but rather e-mail them, since I realize that my friend needs to take the time to look at his calendar, and so on. When I do text friends, I will know from experience who are the ones who might take a long time to respond (I can think of one or two now in particular). The escort/client relationship is very different, in my view. It's part of the escort's job to answer texts, just as it is the job of almost any business to have customer service and respond to customer inquiries. If I invite someone for dinner, I'm not paying for his presence. He's free to say yes or even wait for a "bigger name" to invite him somewhere, until I need to know. When I e-mail a dinner invitation, especially with those who are difficult to pin down, I might add "please respond by Wednesday" or something along those lines. 

When I was in the workforce, not so long ago, I don't think either my bosses or my patients would have cared if I have "different views on how soon to respond." I'm sure that any employees who showed lackadaisical proclivities at work would get counseling. Of course, escorts are their own bosses. However, a blasé attitude towards clients probably portrays a poor work attitude. 

Edited March 23, 2023 by Unicorn

[Jamie21]

4 hours ago, Unicorn said:

Trust me on this. Listen to the voice of experience from someone who's hired for decades. If you wait for more than 3 hours, you're almost certainly dealing with someone who's a flake in one way or another.

I’m always surprised how people who’ve not worked as a provider seem to know exactly how it all works! It’s rather like all the amateur epidemiologists that suddenly appeared on Twitter during the pandemic, who swore they knew better than any expert who had studied it 😂.

I find it amusing when people with no experience of doing sex work themselves try to tell me how I should run my business! Other sex workers never offer such advice because they know that it’s such a personal business (it’s impossible to do it without being authentic to yourself).  They only give advice if asked. 

I’d say a 3 hour delay in responding is only one possible indicator that they’re flaky. You’re closing off opportunities if you go by just that one sign. Look also for other signs of flakiness…. casual language in how he responds (when he eventually does), an amateurish advert, lots of ‘ask me’ on services, few reviews, poor pics etc. If there’s a few signs then you have a good chance he’s flaky.

 

 

 

[+ azdr0710]

three-hour deadline to respond seems veeeery tight.......hell, I'm ok with 12-24 hours.......soooooo many legit reasons that one can't reply in less than three hours......  

[BuffaloKyle]

It depends as well when you are trying to book a session for. If it's same day, which I never try to do, I'd want a reply back within an hour or two. If it's for the next day I would like to get a response by that night. Anything farther out than that same kind of time frame applies. Like to see a response by the time I go to bed or wake up the next morning. 

[Guest]

20 minutes ago, BuffaloKyle said:

It depends as well when you are trying to book a session for. If it's same day, which I never try to do, I'd want a reply back within an hour or two. If it's for the next day I would like to get a response by that night. Anything farther out than that same kind of time frame applies. Like to see a response by the time I go to bed or wake up the next morning. 

I have some honest questions about which I genuinely curious. (1) If you're trying to make an appointment for the next day, and you don't get a response by the time you go to bed, then what? (2) Have you truly not had a response by an escort in over 3 hours, then had a positive experience with said escort?

[BuffaloKyle]

27 minutes ago, Unicorn said:

I have some honest questions about which I genuinely curious. (1) If you're trying to make an appointment for the next day, and you don't get a response by the time you go to bed, then what? (2) Have you truly not had a response by an escort in over 3 hours, then had a positive experience with said escort?

For your first question it depends on if you're at home hiring or traveling and hiring. If you're at home trying to hire and you run out of time to make a plan with someone which has happened to me quite often I just shrug my shoulders and wait till next time. But if I'm travelling somewhere I like to reach out to providers a week before I plan to arrive so I can make sure I have plenty of time to lock someone in. And yes I've had plenty of positive experiences with guys who have taken awhile to respond. I always try to only go for guys as well that come verified and recommended via the forum so taking a bit to respond doesn't deter me.

[Luv2play]

I am amused at this exchange on the question of how quickly a provider should respond to an enquiry about their services. Since I never (almost) have tried to set something up on the same day or even the next day or two, I patiently wait for responses. Of course in my initial text, I always point out the date is for a time in the next week or two.

I imagine I come across as a dream client, which I am.😊

[Guest]

4 hours ago, BuffaloKyle said:

For your first question it depends on if you're at home hiring or traveling and hiring. If you're at home trying to hire and you run out of time to make a plan with someone which has happened to me quite often I just shrug my shoulders and wait till next time. But if I'm travelling somewhere I like to reach out to providers a week before I plan to arrive so I can make sure I have plenty of time to lock someone in. And yes I've had plenty of positive experiences with guys who have taken awhile to respond. I always try to only go for guys as well that come verified and recommended via the forum so taking a bit to respond doesn't deter me.

I guess I believe you, but count me as very surprised. Not my experience. It sounds as if you missed out on opportunities due to flakiness, though. It seems as if the OP has either moved on or waited and waited, though. 

[BuffaloKyle]

1 hour ago, Maximus69 said:

Yall are being very generous on here with this 3 hour timeframe... because for me it seems like if I don't respond back to a client within 10 minutes he's lost interest lol🤪

More likely that client was just a gameplayer then. Or someone who is looking for a same day session and is hitting up multiple guys and the first one to respond back wins lol.

[Guest]

8 hours ago, Maximus69 said:

Yall are being very generous on here with this 3 hour timeframe... because for me it seems like if I don't respond back to a client within 10 minutes he's lost interest lol🤪

Well, here's a man who understands customer service. I do think 3 hours is reasonable, since there are real reasons a person could be tied up for a couple of hours, although if I pick a time of around 10 AM, those reasons will be rare (not going to be at a movie, or a long meal, for example). I was thinking in the shower this morning about BK's waiting over 3 hours, to remember the last time I allowed that. I was going to a conference in Chicago, so I texted an escort I was really interested in. I think he answered several hours later, and we set up an appointment for 4 days later. I texted him the day before to remind him (once I was in Chicago). He actually hadn't remembered or written down his commitment, but said he'd be available (that should've been my 2nd warning). I texted him a couple of hours before the appointment again, and he then asked if he could do it the next day instead. I declined, of course. Lesson learned.

This episode also reminded me of when I was in practice and needed to call a specialist on call. Like all health care systems, specialists had to take turns taking call for emergencies, and I worked for that system for well over a quarter of a century. Over the years, I would learn to dread seeing certain physicians on the list for the half-day, because I knew they would take forever to respond. These were situations in which patients had acute medical problems, were waiting in the examination room, and I needed to get information, hopefully before sending the patient home or to the hospital. I couldn't reasonably ask patients/family to wait for over an hour, so if there was no response, I had to either send the patient, possibly by ambulance, to a hospital, or send them home and hope the staff would be able to contact the patient later for further instructions. 

You might think that the reasons for the non-response would be somewhat legitimate, like being in the middle of a procedure, but it virtually never was. Even if a surgeon is in the operating room, however, there is a circulating nurse who is supposed to answer the surgeon's pages, and that's what happened with responsible surgeons (most of them, obviously). Even if he was operating, the responsible surgeon would say "Tell the patient I'll see him at my clinic in Shelbyville this afternoon, and call my receptionist to let them know. Make sure he has a copy of his X-rays" (or whatever the instructions were). Sometimes there would be some improvement if I sent the specialist an e-mail, letting them know the burden their non-response resulted for the patient, myself, and the other staff (often having to spend quite a bit of time tracking down the patient). Sometimes that didn't work and I'd have to contact the department chair.

The point is that their behavior usually represented a pattern--one of unprofessionalism. As a sticker I once saw on an employee at Target or some such store said: "Customers are not an interruption of my work. They are my work." And, fortunately, these chronic non-responders were in the minority. 

\

[DWnyc]

My favorites are the ones who don’t reply within a reasonable time or suddenly ghost you in the middle of back and forth … and then out of the blue suddenly start bombarding you with replies and immediately Move to “are you actually serious about meeting? Let me know asap!”

Opportunity cost is what the economists call it, I believe.