A series of unfortunate events

[Reluctant Daddy]

First, I would like to say that I am extremely grateful for all of the advice, guidance and support I've received from many of you in this forum. It has been helpful, and appreciated more than I can express. I now find myself in a very distressing situation and really need some thoughts on what to do and where to go from here. I truly agonized over posting this for fear of being eaten alive in a public forum, but I have absolutely no other outlet to discuss this particular problem. My posts are now under a new screen name since I discovered Google links back to posts on this forum

 

I've been in a relationship with a man for the past 36 years, married for the past 6. There was a very healthy and active sex life until 7 years ago. It stopped dead, with all discussions ending with, "we're too old..." and the tongue in cheek suggestion of "go find a boy to play with." For 6 of those years, I resisted the hookup sites and apps. It didn't feel right getting into a relationship of any sort with someone I might find on them. I have used them to chat with people about movies, music and photography, but drew the line at that. Last year I discovered hiring. In my mind hiring didn't present a problem or, at least to me, constitute cheating - there are ground rules and the relationship doesn't progress beyond them when hiring.

 

Last month I took the plunge and booked a weekend with someone. Two weeks prior, I went through STI testing and received the results (negative) through my online patient portal. Little did I know that the HMO would also mail the results to my home. As bad luck would have it, they were intercepted. Based on that there was an inspection of my "weekend away" suitcase, where several well hidden items (condoms, douche, etc.) were discovered. Nothing was mentioned until a few nights ago when it all came to a boil. He believes I spent the weekend with someone I met on Grindr. He would be absolutely livid if he knew the truth about my companion.

 

I've been asked to leave, relinquish ownership of my dogs, and there's a promise of a very acrimonious divorce which will leave me with very little at the end. The thought of having to start a brand new life at my age is absolutely terrifying.

 

I believe I have 2 to 3 choices. One is to try to make amends and live a life devoid of sex. One is to make amends and continue to hire on the extreme down low. The last is to walk away and try my best to make a new life - under this choice, my ability to hire, among other things, would most likely be negatively impacted. There is another choice, but it involves a bridge and the icy Hudson - I haven't quite hit that point yet.

 

I'd appreciate any thoughts, advice, words of wisdom, anything really. Please spare me any negative comments or public flaying. It's embarrassing enough for me to post this, and it wouldn't be helpful and would only make me feel worse than I already do.

 

Thanks, and Happy Holidays

[escortrod]

I'm sorry to read about your situation. It certainly sounds upsetting, and scary.

 

Before everybody pitches in with their advice, which I am sure will be useful, I will say that I think the best first step is to try to get into relationship counselling, if your partner is willing to participate. This situation is too complex to 'solve' in these forums, and no matter how you decide to proceed having your partner engaged and diffusing some of his anger will both be important.

 

I hope this works out well for you both.

[slightly]

As you have highlighted trying to make amends as your first 2 choices, I'm going to assume that your priority is maintaining this relationship. Escortrod's advice to first broach the subject of the both of you seeing a relationship counsellor first is sound. It could support the first (and maybe even the second) choice as it should help to identify where the barriers for miscommunication has happened within your relationship, and possibly help to facilitate dialogue as to your respective needs for intimacy. Having this sort of discourse is best mediated, as your husband is processing a lot of anger and distrust.

 

I hope it all works out in the end.

[+ saminseattle]

I think you should apologize to your partner about not being open and honest with him about your extra-curricular affairs. But I don’t think you should apologize for having them. IMHO, celibacy is not a reasonable demand to make in a relationship; honesty is.

 

After you have apologized and given him some time and space, he will hopefully back down on the threats and instead become open to a more constructive dialogue. If he insists on divorce, I would not assume it will all be on his terms, at least not without speaking to a family law attorney in your state.

[+ ursalex]

Even if your goal is to save your relationship, you should absolutely talk to a divorce lawyer to learn your rights. Frankly, the grounds for divorce, even adultery, rarely have anything to do with the financial disposition. You need to know the laws of your state, and it may temper his position if he learns that he can't really take everything from you. And his refusal to have sex may give you a lot of legal ammunition if you need it.

Having spent 40 years practicing family law, I can tell you that same-sex breakups are just as messy as opposite-sex divorces. So know your rights while you are trying to save the relationship.

[+ Funguy]

In addition to the very good posts above, a subject needs to be raised: Why does he not want to have sex with you when you spent 29 years having sex? Does he have a medical condition which interferes? Does he have ED and not want to talk about it? Does he just have no libido? Is he embarrassed to talk about it? After 36 years together you should be able to hold him in your arms and talk about anything.

 

An honest and frank discussion of what has led up to this should be included in your discussion of the actual incident and what to do to repair the relationship. Think about why you love him and why you got married. "We're too old..." does not answer the question. How old is your husband? You, by your profile, are only 57 years young. Too young to not enjoy it. "Manopause" is real and can strike young or "old".

[+ WmClarke]

I think, as others have mentioned, that couples counseling would be very helpful.

 

 

There is another choice, but it involves a bridge and the icy Hudson - I haven't quite hit that point yet.

 

This is very serious. Please get some counseling just for yourself.

 

 

We are here for you.

 

 

Wishing you a happy resolution.

[+ Eric Hassan]

I'm so sorry to hear about this situation. It sounds like it's incredibly rough. I'm glad that you felt you were able to turn to us.

 

I, too, am supportive of you and your husband going to marriage counseling - if that's something he is willing to take on with you. Either way, it sounds like it might be helpful for you even if he doesn't wish to attend.

 

It sounds like clear communication may have helped this situation not get escalated. It also seems like there isn't a clear and open space for that. I hope you can find that.

 

Please let us know if there is anything we can do to support. And though we don't know each other, I welcome you to reach out to me if you need a shoulder to lean on.

[jjkrkwood]

The first thing you must consider is IF you are able to salvage the relationship, would you be able to sustain it in the condition it was in, sexless ? Or does your salvaging it come with conditions for "change" or flexibility ? Once you are clear on your goals, you can move forward. But with any relationship, communication is always the means to the end.

 

I was in a 22 year relationship before my partner passed, but for several reasons after initially being monogamous, ours became an open relationship, which we sustained until his death.

Of course, BOTH parties were in agreement, and clear on what OPEN meant.

 

There is never one answer on how to handle things. It is all dependent on what works for the 2 people affected. Even if the outcome is "unconventional", if it works for you, you have won the lottery.

 

I think your only misstep here was taking your husbands comment "go find a boy" seriously. Perhaps when the comment was made it required a more open discussion of what it REALLY meant. But there is no fault in your wanting sex in your marriage. As we age, relationships become more about intimacy than sex, so you need to evaluate your REAL needs.

 

I personally am not a big proponent of PAID mediation, but I have nothing against therapy if it works for your needs and budget. But I think the same results can be achieved between the parties IF they are open and honest with each other, and willing to abide by the decisions they make.

 

Hoping the Holidays bring you resolution and Peace.

 

JJ / Grandma

[nate_sf]

I'm so sorry to hear all about this. I know how awful it feels to have a major blowout with a loved one.

 

Besides the suggestions to get counseling, I'm wondering whether it would help or further hurt things if your husband knew your weekend companion was an arranged escort companion, rather than a fling or affair through Grindr? Since an escort is booked for a purpose and in theory should be less threatening to a relationship than an affair, some people feel it is preferable. An escort is not likely to try to break up your marriage, whereas someone you're having a fling or affair just might if they get too close. You hire an escort to scratch an itch, and in your situation that itch had not been scratched for seven years.

 

On the other hand, he might be more angry knowing you spent money on an escort. Or he may reflexively dislike the idea of hiring an escort; although here on the Forum we think of escorts positively, not everyone does especially if it's not something they've done a lot of thinking about.

 

As others have said, it's worth apologizing for having not told the truth, but at that point it's time to talk about why the sex stopped seven ago and what the status of the marriage has been from seven years ago until this episode. Before your husband tries to throw you out, it's only fair that he tell you why you stopped having sex together - seriously. "We're too old" won't do. Has he lost his libido? Has something else been bugging him that he hasn't told you about? Has he been having sex with someone else so he's not horny when he's with you (you never know)? It sounds like he is deflecting blame on you, but he owes you an explanation too.

 

Whatever you do, please don't do anything drastic even if you were only suggesting that in jest. You will get through this, and there are lots of supportive folks here to help. I know of other Forum members helping each other through major domestic dramas, and it's one of the best things this place has to offer.

[+ glennnn]

Guilt is a killer. I have a huge load myself after coming out to my wife after 44 years of marriage and steadily declining sexual activity. We are still together and, although horribly hurt, she is very understanding and generous with me. Lucky me! But i feel overwhelming guilt that I kept my true sexuality from her for so many years, although I never was with another sex partner in all of those years. I just became asexual except for masturbation after she and I stopped having sex about 12 years ago. This fact helps me to assuage my shame and regret as we start family counseling.

 

My message to you is that not all of the guilt is yours. Your husband ended your physical relationship, apparently unilaterally. Some of the responsibility for the current situation is his. Follow the great advice above, but lay the guilt aside. All you did was fill your human needs for intimacy after years of none at home. Try to get over the blame and focus on the future. Yours in brotherhood!

[+ sniper]

My advice is don't leave the marital home. That's giving him all the leverage. He can go if he wants to. Also as stated above don't assume you will be left with nothing. I mean, he could burn through all the assets by dragging out the divorce, but that hurts him as much as you. And if they're your dogs they're your dogs.

 

I am not a lawyer, but a friend got divorced recently and he had to play alimony based on the length of the relationship, not just the marriage, because they comingled finances and insurance for several years before tying the knot, so don't assume if, for example, he was the breadwinner that all the money is his.

 

Honestly, I'm not sure this guy sounds like someone I'd WANT to be married to, given he seems to present you with a list of demands and your choice is simply to acquiesce. But don't just do whatever he says without standing up for yourself, that's kind of what led you here.

 

If he's determined to end the relationship over this, there's not much you can do. But at that point you need to think about what's best for YOU, not HIM.

[liubit]

Sorry to hear about your situation, @Reluctant Daddy. You have received great advice here. Let me share my experience.

I'm wondering whether it would help or further hurt things if your husband knew your weekend companion was an arranged escort companion, rather than a fling or affair through Grindr? Since an escort is booked for a purpose and in theory should be less threatening to a relationship than an affair, some people feel it is preferable. An escort is not likely to try to break up your marriage, whereas someone you're having a fling or affair just might if they get too close. You hire an escort to scratch an itch, and in your situation that itch had not been scratched for seven years.

Very good points. I have been in a relationship myself for 15 years now. Although I am 10 years older than my partner, my sexual appetite is a lot bigger than his, and I do mean a lot. We still have sex occasionally --and it is always magnificent when it happens--, but not nearly as often as I would like, and he actually encourages me to satisfy my hunger somewhere else. The most important rule is that my flings happen ONLY with an escort, precisely for the reasons mentioned by @nate_sf above. Non-commercial hook ups are strictly off limits. Believe me, I take him up on his offer, and I am a frequent hirer. My sweetheart also does it every blue moon or so, and we are both happy campers.

 

I sincerely hope that your situation takes a turn for the better.

Edited December 10, 2016 by liubit

[+ sync]

I wish I had something useful to contribute, but I've never had to deal with your circumstances. You mention in your post that it was a "few nights ago" that the confrontation occurred. That is very recent, perhaps with a little more time tensions will wane to the point that constructive dialog can begin. The one piece of advice I would like to offer is to not mention your hiring an escort. Should things deteriorate to divorce proceedings, the hiring of an escort may be more harmful to your case than an extra-marital "fling."

 

I hope that sometime soon we will be able to read a post with news that is more uplifting about your situation.

[jawjateck]

Very sorry to hear about your suffering. Given your description of the situation, I don't see any further downside. Fight for you. Maybe that means fighting FOR him; you will rightly decide that, but above all, fight FOR you!

[+ purplekow]

Put me in the group supporting professional assistance.

 

I think trying to see this from your husband's point of view may be helpful. The two of you have stopped having physical contact for years. From your statement, he seems to have told you that the two of you were "too old". Perhaps he was looking for reassurance that this was not the case. Perhaps he wanted you to convince him that you were not too old. Perhaps he needed to hear that the fire of your love still burned and that you wanted and needed physical contact with him. Perhaps he was feeling insecure and unattractive. And then years past. You both fell into a rut. Perhaps he started to truly believe that you both were "too old". The lack of sexual contact made him feel as though you two while no longer sexual beings were still partners who would grow old together, loving each other chastely but loving each other. Now he discovers that you have opted to have sex with someone else. That may have confirmed to him that you did not find him attractive. It may have confirmed to him that indeed he was too old for you. He may have needed reassurance and seduction and what he got was a husband who slipped away one weekend and fucked who knows who for who knows how long. He may be humiliated and depressed and forsaken and unloved and certainly angry. Angry with you for confirming his worst fears about himself and angry at himself for not being the man he needed to be for you.

 

Clearly this is all speculation on my part, but you know him. Think of him. What is it he wants from you. An apology? A reassurance? A seduction? A long hug and some time of intimacy? He may not know, but after 36 years, you should know what he needs. Give it to him. Show him that you understand and that you are sorry it had to come to such a dramatic point before you realized that you both needed to give more. Forgive him for his anger and his threats. He will then be able to forgive you for confirming his worst fears about himself and his marriage. Then perhaps you both can move forward with a better understanding and a clearer idea of the kind of relationship you both need. Be prepared, it may not be a marriage. Do all this but you both will need to do more and you both need a guide to help steer you through this.

[Rudynate]

The thing that struck me is his going through your bags, opening your mail, etc. That signified a fundamental lack of communication that made him feel entitled to invade your privacy. My partner and I are married, we've been together for nearly 25 years. In spite of that, neither of us would ever look at the other's checkbook, cellphone, dresser drawers, closets, billfold, pockets, bags, etc. We are deeply respectful of each other's privacy. If either want's to know something, we just ask.

 

I agree, some counseling is in order, with an eye to establishing a new level of communication between the two of you.

[+ purplekow]

The thing that struck me is his going through your bags, opening your mail, etc. That signified a fundamental lack of communication that made him feel entitled to invade your privacy. My partner and I are married, we've been together for nearly 25 years. In spite of that, neither of us would ever look at the other's checkbook, cellphone, dresser drawers, closets, billfold, pockets, bags, etc. We are deeply respectful of each other's privacy. If either want's to know something, we just ask.

 

I agree, some counseling is in order, with an eye to establishing a new level of communication between the two of you.

 

In reading the first post, it is not clear to me that there was definitely an invasion of privacy. Privacy standards differ in different relationships and even differ from partner to partner in the same relationship. It is not clear that the mail was inappropriately opened, The description of the tour through the luggage did not say whether the bags were inspected surreptitiously or with both partners present.

When my wife was alive, I never opened her mail as I was not that curious but she frequently opened my mail and either took care of what needed to be done or told me that something needed to be handled. Her opening of my mail would not have been an invasion of privacy, just the standard for our relationships. I do not recall having a discussion which set those ground rules but after many years together, the rules kind of make themselves.

[Rudynate]

In reading the first post, it is not clear to me that there was definitely an invasion of privacy. Privacy standards differ in different relationships and even differ from partner to partner in the same relationship. It is not clear that the mail was inappropriately opened, The description of the tour through the luggage did not say whether the bags were inspected surreptitiously or with both partners present.

When my wife was alive, I never opened her mail as I was not that curious but she frequently opened my mail and either took care of what needed to be done or told me that something needed to be handled. Her opening of my mail would not have been an invasion of privacy, just the standard for our relationships. I do not recall having a discussion which set those ground rules but after many years together, the rules kind of make themselves.

 

Occasionally, if a piece of mail looks important, one asks the other if it is OK to open it.

[jjkrkwood]

Relationships are all about what the parties are willing to accept or not in terms of boundaries, privacy, intimacy, finances, etc. These are things only the 2 parties involved can work on and make a plan for. While our experiences in similar situations can give insight or perspective, they may have absolutely no relevance to these 2 people. But perhaps they can draw from it and incorporate it into their own situation? One size DOES NOT fit all.

[jjkrkwood]

Maybe he was mad you didnt share the escort with him

Hire one over, use him together, and blow off some steam

if he's an awesome escort, then ur hubby will know how good we can be

Soon later maybe ur hubby will start hiring escorts behind ur back hehe

 

 

I honestly dont think this was about the escort. It was about perceived deception and betrayal, and perhaps a feeling of rejection on the spouses part. I hope the 2 can work it out if the OP lays his soul bare and explains to the spouse the reasons for his actions. People make missteps and hopefully their is forgiveness in BOTH their hearts. While sex is important, this is about much, much more. Both need to think long and hard about moving forward ALONE, what that would mean and what they would be giving up. The loss would be so much greater than the deed.

[Reluctant Daddy]

Thanks to all for your suggestions, comments, and and especially your non-judgment.

 

After some discussion, counseling is not on the table for the 2 of us - we don't discuss our problems with strangers. Would counseling for 1 really be effective?

I can't let him know that it was an escort I hired vs a Grindr hookup. The fact that I spent a substantial amount of cash for a dalliance would be a death knell.

Apparently, the marriage certificate is some sort of mystical Bristol Palinesque chastity agreement - despite the fact that our previous life involved thirds and groups.

Privacy wasn't really breached. We share common bank and charge accounts and the mailing from my HMO was most likely mistaken as an invoice. The suitcase inspection was no doubt to confirm his fears that I was traveling for an encounter. This was the first time I've ever traveled alone and out of the blue. It was bound to raise suspicion.

I've tried, repeatedly, over the years to engage him - only to be rebuffed, for reasons unknown.

 

I guess my fatal mistake was to hire for a weekend. Had this been a 1 or 2 hour local hire, it could have easily been covered as a trip to the gym/movies/mall.

 

Pending any further discussion, my life will be lived either as a neutered dog, or hiring on the DL (most likely giving $50 BJ's to local meth addicts, since escorts rarely visit here).

 

I have a hell of a lot of thinking and soul searching to do on this.

 

Thank you all again.

[kewtex]

I'd appreciate any thoughts, advice, words of wisdom, anything really.

 

The thoughts, advice, and words of wisdom you seek have been with you all along: “And the day came when the risk to remain tight in a bud was more painful than the risk it took to blossom.” (Anaïs Nin).

[liubit]

Good luck, @Reluctant Daddy. I hope that whatever you decide works for you.

[+ WmClarke]

After some discussion, counseling is not on the table for the 2 of us - we don't discuss our problems with strangers. Would counseling for 1 really be effective?

A counselor is not "a stranger." A counselor is a carefully selected (by both of you) trained professional. You may have to try a few counselors to find the right one for you.

 

And counseling for 1 can be very effective. It may help you deal with whatever decisions you have to make, by giving you some clarity or perspective you didn't have before.

 

And don't blow methheads!

 

At any rate, I wish the best for you. Good luck!