Deposits should be required

[Erikshelly]

I just have always found it humorous that when you book a massage or hair appointment or most things that require an appointment, they usually have cancellation fees and probably don't experience the same level of abuse that we providers have gone through, not to say they arent abused by the general public, but it doesnt seem to translate for some reason. 
 

i definitely think its a have you actually worked in service before or not kinda line, have always had money or just new to it sorta thing. The difference usually have a respect for peoples time and I’ve certainly had many a client offer a deposit, some have paid up front in full. And then theres the creeps. 
 

granted i also agree that the majority on here are probably not the creeps so dont take it personally, unless it speaks to you so deeply. Also not to mean the ones not paying deposits are also creeps i get there are scammers on both sides hurts us both. But to be so adamant about is silly. 
 

 

http://(https://rent.men/ErikShelly)

Edited December 22, 2024 by Erikshelly

[Km411]

Agree; many service providers require deposits and/or cancellation fees; why should escorts be different? If you’re against it because of the paper trail, I get it. But otherwise I don’t think it should be a big deal. Of course, it’s not a smart business model if requiring cuts into your bookings. 

[+ KensingtonHomo]

1 hour ago, TallMuscl37 said:

Sir, by all due respect: based on the story you’ve described: You wasted your own damn time. You’re going around reaching out to strangers at the last minute (even if it’s the next day, it’s still last minute for some), but you could have first reached out to your reliable favorite instead. 

Or you could have accepted the booking when your regular contacted you, and offered the other a small cancellation fee as a courtesy. Why would you trade a reliable person for something speculative?

When you try to play the field and be slick, it can bite ya in the ass. Too many clients are probably doing the same. You’re definitely not entitled to a deposit though. Since you like to compare our industry to other industries: what freelance or small business you know, is paying deposits TO clients? Name one. And while you’re at it, name another business that is sending out paid product in the mail or via NEXT DAY DELIVERY without any form of payment to confirm beforehand?

If you can do that: I will give you $100 🤣 

 

I'm generally sympathetic to you but this comes as an intentional misreading of the situation. They agreed to a time and confirmed it. Then when Ali followed up, he was ghosted. In that situation, trying to find someone who is free is totally understandable. 

I suspect if he said he canceled that night when he realized his regular was available, you'd be mad about that. You seem to want to this provider paid for an appointment he didn't keep. That's wild. 

[Guest]

19 hours ago, Daniel84 said:

you mean, skipping town because they kept the government open... This month I traveled to San Francisco,  LA,  Palm Springs and now Washington DC. I have had 15 no shows. 

but to be honest, it’s their loss. I’ll make sure escorts and massures  know not to book them and I wish they have a happy life.

If you’re ever in my city I will book you and show up and send $25. 

[Erikshelly]

Really this is why we need a union if we all only took booking the paid deposits, those that say they will never pay a deposit will then have to. Just an idea 

 

of course it would never work but how cool would that be?

Edited December 22, 2024 by Erikshelly

[TallMuscl37]

1 hour ago, KensingtonHomo said:

I'm generally sympathetic to you but this comes as an intentional misreading of the situation. They agreed to a time and confirmed it. Then when Ali followed up, he was ghosted. In that situation, trying to find someone who is free is totally understandable. 

I suspect if he said he canceled that night when he realized his regular was available, you'd be mad about that. You seem to want to this provider paid for an appointment he didn't keep. That's wild. 

I didn’t misread the situation. I read exactly the situation he described. The reason why I worded it as I did, is because the ending of the post turned the deposit around to say he should be paid one. That’s when I was like, okay if you say it like that: let’s look at the big picture.
 

I’m not condoning the provider who flaked at all. I’m just saying, IF he knows his FAVORITE REGULAR provider reach out to him (and I don’t know the exact timing of it all, whether minutes or hours): he could have simply prioritized the regular and offered/suggested a cancellation courtesy. I’ve had clients do that before for other reasons. I would not be mad with that. 

OR even better: Told the regular “I would love to see you while you’re in town, but I may have some obligations that affect whether I can.” And then offer HIS REGULAR the cancellation fee IF the other guy came thru as planned. I know it sounds a bit more tactful than the average client thinks about but, it’s a way to preserve options while still maintaining integrity. And when you’re playing the field reaching out to multiple guys, that’s part of something to practice.

Even in regular hookups, and clients: I have to practice that same strategy myself sometimes. I’m not leaving anyone on the hook, but I’m also not just telling them no outright, because shit may change. Especially when dealing with flaky internet or app guys. 

Edited December 22, 2024 by TallMuscl37

[Daniel84]

1 hour ago, Coolwave35 said:

If you’re ever in my city I will book you and show up and send $25. 

Send me a pm where you are located. Would love to meet you 

[Trick]

I’ve been thinking that there should be an escrow type business to handle these financial transactions.  I’m stuck at figuring out how to prove a meeting took place or somebody flaked.

[TallMuscl37]

2 hours ago, Km411 said:

Agree; many service providers require deposits and/or cancellation fees; why should escorts be different? If you’re against it because of the paper trail, I get it. But otherwise I don’t think it should be a big deal. Of course, it’s not a smart business model if requiring cuts into your bookings. 

Any cutting into bookings, would likely be cut into anyway when the client flakes the day of. Occasionally I’ll come across potential clients from other platforms that aren’t dedicated advertising sites. I may offer to meet them without deposits to help facilitate the meeting. Most still end up having something “come up”, as shown below:

 

I was not even surprised, because we were initially supposed to been meeting last night. But it’s like, why you texting me at goddamn 8 a.m.? Annoying. I actually checked his message before 9 but: that’s what I have to start my day with, bad news?
 

Guys lately are just flaky across the board. This is why I advise myself and others grappling with reliability in the cities: explore the outer regions away from big cities or areas that don’t have as much accessible avenues to hooking up. Many of these larger/high COL cities are full of indecisive guys who are self important and playing the field. And not just talking San Francisco/Washington D.C. but even places like Denver, Phoenix, Nashville, etc just have flakes up the ass because so many ads. 

And referring back to the post about the masseur who flaked: again I don’t condone that and those types tend to be part of the problem. Deposit or no deposit; flaking on bookings on either side hurts the business. However, I don’t think providers should have to carry the burden of someone else who doesn’t keep their word. 
 

And I’ve said before: situations like @Ali Gator claimed, did not lose money from the other guy not showing up. On the other hand, advertisers have to risk losing a booking + hotel/travel expenses -+ potential clients. 3 TIMES the monetary loss a client may face. The comparison just isn’t the same.

Edited December 22, 2024 by TallMuscl37

[+ KensingtonHomo]

2 hours ago, TallMuscl37 said:

I’m not condoning the provider who flaked at all. I’m just saying, IF he knows his FAVORITE REGULAR provider reach out to him (and I don’t know the exact timing of it all, whether minutes or hours): he could have simply prioritized the regular and offered/suggested a cancellation courtesy. I’ve had clients do that before for other reasons. I would not be mad with that. 

OR even better: Told the regular “I would love to see you while you’re in town, but I may have some obligations that affect whether I can.” And then offer HIS REGULAR the cancellation fee IF the other guy came thru as planned. I know it sounds a bit more tactful than the average client thinks about but, it’s a way to preserve options while still maintaining integrity. And when you’re playing the field reaching out to multiple guys, that’s part of something to practice.

With all the time you're on here complaining about flakey clients, I'm stunned that you're literally advising people to dump someone they had an appointment with because their regular is available. And you're apparently talking to multiple guys in your personal life and ready to dropped most of them if one comes through. 

This mentality is exactly why clients think they can leave providers hanging. You have zero right to complain now. 

[Vin Marco]

3 minutes ago, KensingtonHomo said:

With all the time you're on here complaining about flakey clients, I'm stunned that you're literally advising people to dump someone they had an appointment with because their regular is available. And you're apparently talking to multiple guys in your personal life and ready to dropped most of them if one comes through. 

This mentality is exactly why clients think they can leave providers hanging. You have zero right to complain now. 

👏🏽👏🏽👏🏽👏🏽

 

 

[TallMuscl37]

2 hours ago, KensingtonHomo said:

With all the time you're on here complaining about flakey clients, I'm stunned that you're literally advising people to dump someone they had an appointment with because their regular is available. And you're apparently talking to multiple guys in your personal life and ready to dropped most of them if one comes through. 

This mentality is exactly why clients think they can leave providers hanging. You have zero right to complain now. 

Listen, ma’am or dude. If you choose to interpret it that way: without reading between lines of what the message was saying, that’s YOUR burden to carry. I’m simply offering an alternative solution. Clearly it didn’t work out to well in his end, because he got flaked on and then couldn’t get in touch with the favorite guy.

So stop with the bullshit, okay. Don’t try to dredge up comments that detract from the message. I wasn’t even talking to you anyway, so…why are you here arguing with me? 
 

I was offering a reasonable solution, when I really shouldn’t have done that considering he’s come at me sideways in the past. But I’m just giving suggestions on how to save face without losing opportunity.

And don’t come in here lying and saying I’ve dropped people in my personal life for someone else. You’re crossing the line, and that’s going to lose credibility real quick. I never said anything like that. I simply said I have occasionally BEEN FACED WITH having to choose between plans with a new person and plans with someone trusted. This includes but not limited to: friends who may want me to hangout versus a client who hits me up at the last minute. There’s a way to preserve both plans without leaving someone hanging. 

It’s called having a Plan B. He didn’t have a Plan B because he told the regular guy, “I’m not available, sorry”. When he should have said, “I may be available, but can I let you know by like  11 a.m. tomorrow if I’m free?” That way soon as the flake didn’t respond, he could have had a time deadline to get in touch with his regular guy by. Now he’s scrambling like an egg to find a new guy, at the last minute…who’s probably also going to flake on him.

And then he’s going to come on here and say HE should get a deposit. For what? What money on ads and hotel did he spend?

Edited December 23, 2024 by TallMuscl37

[TallMuscl37]

And I’ll just add one more thing: requesting a booking at noon for a traveling provider is bad juju off the bat. I can almost imagine, this provider decided he didn’t want to pay his hotel for an extra day to accommodate the 1 noon client, if he had more bookings elsewhere. Or had a bunch of flakes. He may have gone to the next city for another opportunities, versus the one that was scheduled. It’s shitty yes, but it’s the possibilities that can occur. I never accept a noon client when hosting unless he can provide a deposit, which I then can use to either pay for late checkout, or reserve an extra night all together if I feel the desire to use the room for an extra day also.
 

I often tell people and say in my ads: after 11 am to about 2:30 pm is a no zone for me if I’m in a hotel. Unless I’m booking it for more than 1 night, it’s usually too early to check in or too close to checkout time to host. I always suggest people meet before 10:30/11 or after 2:30/3 p.m. Hotels have gotten awful at giving late checkout. Minneapolis hotels charge if you’re a minute late after noon. Ever since Covid, many in the big cities are banging on doors rushing people out BEFORE checkout time. 

Edited December 23, 2024 by TallMuscl37

[Whippoorwill]

To Daniel 84 and other providers who get flaked on, I am so sorry. Unfortunately, our society seems to be coming apart at the seams. I first noticed it when I would hear from friends that there were no-shows at their wedding, when a friend (yes a friend) RSVP's Yes, a non-refundable meal costing hundreds of dollars was reserved, and the person was a no-show. Many high-end small bespoke restaurants here (San Francisco) require full payment in advance...the restaurants that are $400-$500 a person, with long waiting lists for a reservation. Doctors and dentists always call, sometimes more than once, to be sure you are coming to your appointment. Try and do something as simple as order a birthday cake with a name on it, and you have to pay 100% in advance. 

I recently booked a massage with a new provider to me, in a town we were both traveling to. I texted him on a Sunday 10 PM, asking for a Monday or Tuesday 10 AM 60-minute erotic massage appointment; he texted back confirming, including the price and street address and asked OK?; I immediately texted back confirmation for Monday morning. He acknowledged my confirmation right away. Early Monday morning he texted another confirmation, repeating the details, and requested I reconfirm. I did. He acknowledged. When I arrived I so texted; He texted back the room number. When we saw in person, after a warm greeting and sweet kiss, he said, "You've brought the cash, right." I confirmed. We both had a fantastic time (OK, maybe he's a great actor, I sure had a fantastic time). At one time I would have thought all the confirmations a bit much and maybe been insulted that he confirmed I'd brought the cash. But I wasn't, it made me a little sad, because it said to me that he'd been burned enough times he felt he had to do this. After the appointment, I texted him a personal thank-you for a great time. He responded warmly. 

Had he asked for a modest deposit ($25?) ahead of time I would have, because I had done my due diligence on him ahead of time. There were maybe six providers in town that I could have been hot to see. I read all their Rentmasseur self-descriptions and reviews several times, and I researched each one on COM. The comments on this site led me to nix every other provider as undependable or not as advertised. The one I selected had great reviews on everything but age-shaving. 

What I am saying Daniel is that it's not just you, it's not just gay men, it's not just your line of work, but a great many people think nothing of blowing off an obligation. Try not to take it personally, but do what you can do to lesson the impact...consider when the appointment is made (right now, or a day or two away), how the communication comes across (serious or I'm horny right now), respectful or not, and then confirm, confirm, confirm, and then maybe ask for a deposit if you still have reservations. Work at reading between the lines. Don't sound desperate. Say no or set stronger terms if your intuition tells you to. And then hope. 

[Daniel84]

11 minutes ago, Whippoorwill said:

To Daniel 84 and other providers who get flaked on, I am so sorry. Unfortunately, our society seems to be coming apart at the seams. I first noticed it when I would hear from friends that there were no-shows at their wedding, when a friend (yes a friend) RSVP's Yes, a non-refundable meal costing hundreds of dollars was reserved, and the person was a no-show. Many high-end small bespoke restaurants here (San Francisco) require full payment in advance...the restaurants that are $400-$500 a person, with long waiting lists for a reservation. Doctors and dentists always call, sometimes more than once, to be sure you are coming to your appointment. Try and do something as simple as order a birthday cake with a name on it, and you have to pay 100% in advance. 

I recently booked a massage with a new provider to me, in a town we were both traveling to. I texted him on a Sunday 10 PM, asking for a Monday or Tuesday 10 AM 60-minute erotic massage appointment; he texted back confirming, including the price and street address and asked OK?; I immediately texted back confirmation for Monday morning. He acknowledged my confirmation right away. Early Monday morning he texted another confirmation, repeating the details, and requested I reconfirm. I did. He acknowledged. When I arrived I so texted; He texted back the room number. When we saw in person, after a warm greeting and sweet kiss, he said, "You've brought the cash, right." I confirmed. We both had a fantastic time (OK, maybe he's a great actor, I sure had a fantastic time). At one time I would have thought all the confirmations a bit much and maybe been insulted that he confirmed I'd brought the cash. But I wasn't, it made me a little sad, because it said to me that he'd been burned enough times he felt he had to do this. After the appointment, I texted him a personal thank-you for a great time. He responded warmly. 

Had he asked for a modest deposit ($25?) ahead of time I would have, because I had done my due diligence on him ahead of time. There were maybe six providers in town that I could have been hot to see. I read all their Rentmasseur self-descriptions and reviews several times, and I researched each one on COM. The comments on this site led me to nix every other provider as undependable or not as advertised. The one I selected had great reviews on everything but age-shaving. 

What I am saying Daniel is that it's not just you, it's not just gay men, it's not just your line of work, but a great many people think nothing of blowing off an obligation. Try not to take it personally, but do what you can do to lesson the impact...consider when the appointment is made (right now, or a day or two away), how the communication comes across (serious or I'm horny right now), respectful or not, and then confirm, confirm, confirm, and then maybe ask for a deposit if you still have reservations. Work at reading between the lines. Don't sound desperate. Say no or set stronger terms if your intuition tells you to. And then hope. 

If you and I are ever in the same city. I would love to take you for a drink. You seem like a sweet guy and this post made my day. Thank for this 

[jeezifonly]

Securing a deposit for goods or services is a common and legitimate business practice. 
 

Business examined here is neither common nor legitimate, and the use of deposits has the double edge to it:

Possibility no 1: more first-time clients likely to follow thru, show and pay in full

Possibility no 2: fewer first-time clients willing to consider booking at all

It’s up to the provider how the 2 sides work on the balance sheet.
It’s up to the client to take first-time and repeat business where they like. 

[SirBillybob]

Yes, deposits where we want, without upsells.

[mike carey]

Let's confine our comments to addressing Daniel's situation and not revive any disagreements on other issues.

[TallMuscl37]

16 hours ago, Vin Marco said:

👏🏽👏🏽👏🏽👏🏽

 

 

Ha ha ha. That’s so funny. Not 👎🏾 

The other solution is, just blame the flaky escort and sit and let it happen again next time…. And allow others to continue to convey that RELIABLE escorts have to suffer the sins of those who have no business relation with us. 

Of course it’s easier for some people to naysay the escort, versus thinking critically to see the situation as it is. If I were an escort and it was a client in the situation: I would have always reached out to the regular FIRST anyway. Any time I go to a city, as often as I travel, I’m always touching base with the favorite or the most reliable. I’d still take new bookings but, it’s not like I’m going to turn down someone I know is reliable, in favor of a wild card 🃏 who might not show or follow thru at all. I’m always going to have a contingency plan.

The person you clapped your hands to, took things out of context by throwing in a completely different dynamic that had nothing to do with what I was suggesting. #1 Many of the flakes and cancellations I discuss, tend to be those who initiate. It’s not like I’m hitting them up. Therefore, they have a bigger duty to keep their word. And #2: why would someone even say that when this whole topic is referencing an epidemic of Timewasters? Geez, the attitude here, so Grinchy this time of year. Reminds me of the word “Dallitude”. 

But I can do quotes too:

Edited December 23, 2024 by TallMuscl37

[Venite]

One good thing here is that this fraught conversation shows just how hated deposits are by even the “company of men” clients. Just imagine how terribly received they are by the average person on RM.

 

Definitely see when they can be useful, and I certainly empathize with @Daniel84.
 

It just seems like a line of work that you will have to deal with flakers and occasional wastage of travel and money IMO. 

 

 

[TallMuscl37]

9 minutes ago, Venite said:

One good thing here is that this fraught conversation shows just how hated deposits are by even the “company of men” clients. Just imagine how terribly received they are by the average person on RM.

 

Definitely see when they can be useful, and I certainly empathize with @Daniel84.
 

It just seems like a line of work that you will have to deal with flakers and occasional wastage of travel and money IMO. 

 

 

That’s because some here tend to have a pack mentality. Deposits are not terribly received by the average person on RentMen. There is also no average client on RM either. And, if someone isn’t willing to send a deposit, they need to not be surfing 🏄🏾‍♂️ websites where guys have to pay upwards of $100 or more a month to list on, and sell services. It’s not a hookup app.
 

If someone is going to pay, they’re going to pay. If they’re BSing they’re going to BS. With or without. Deposits are a very small fraction of the bigger picture. 

[Venite]

10 minutes ago, TallMuscl37 said:

That’s because some here tend to have a pack mentality. Deposits are not terribly received by the average person on RentMen. There is also no average client on RM either. And, if someone isn’t willing to send a deposit, they need to not be surfing 🏄🏾‍♂️ websites where guys have to pay upwards of $100 or more a month to list on, and sell services. It’s not a hookup app.
 

If someone is going to pay, they’re going to pay. If they’re BSing they’re going to BS. With or without. Deposits are a very small fraction of the bigger picture. 

What I meant by average was “representative along certain dimensions”. 
 

I believe the “averages RM user, as @Cretus mentioned, is likelier to be flaky, or even themselves duplicitous (I have heard about constant scam calls too and freeloaders looking to trick you into a free sex phone talk).

I simply wouldn’t fault us for not willing to send a deposit when the population of clients itself *also* contains some duplicitous, anti-social (the psychological definition ), and criminal individuals. We don’t know who we are interacting with.
 

Maybe it’s frustrating to providers who *are* actually honest, but we can’t tell if you’re a deceitful person or not in the first interaction. 
combined with not wanting to leave paper trails, not wanting to have your money stolen by someone who you can’t verify is sufficient reason to not give deposits for most situations.

The market will eventually decide, and you can feel free to keep asking for deposits, just as many of us will feel free to say no. 

[Venite]

5 minutes ago, Venite said:

population of clients i

.I meant population of providers *also* contains untrustworthy people, not clients. lol newbies should be able to edit

[TallMuscl37]

9 minutes ago, Venite said:

I believe the “averages RM user, as mentioned, is likelier to be flaky, or even themselves duplicitous

 

and you can feel free to keep asking for deposits, just as many of us will feel free to say no. 

BINGO 🎰 You said it 👏🏽 the “average” RM browser is potentially a flake. That’s the #1 reason for the deposits to begin with. The answer answered itself lol.

And trust me, I will: I’ve learned too many times not to. If someone thinks we should cover the burden of expenses, they can send me their cash app or other app so I can request money when I need to pay $100 for a hotel plus put down $100 extra for “incidentals” for a client who hasn’t paid a deposit. That’ll have some putting money where their mouth is lol.

 

[Venite]

Just now, TallMuscl37 said:

BINGO 🎰 You said it 👏🏽 the “average” RM browser is potentially a flake. That’s the #1 reason for the deposits to begin with. The answer answered itself lol.

And trust me, I will: I’ve learned too many times not to. If someone thinks we should cover the burden of expenses, they can send me their cash app or other app so I can request money when I need to pay $100 for a hotel plus put down $100 extra for “incidentals” for a client who hasn’t paid a deposit. That’ll have some putting money where their mouth is lol.

 

Note that by “

 

11 minutes ago, Venite said:

likelier to be flaky, or even themselves duplicitous (

I meant that relative to Company of Men(CON) users, a randomly chosen member of the entire RM population is going to be likelier to be flaky/duplicitous than them.

 

This doesn’t equate to the statement “the average person is potentially a flake”.  It is just saying that a randomly chosen member of the entire RM population is likelier to be a flake/scammer than a COM member.

 

Yes, feel free to keep asking for deposits love.