Rentmen made newer and tougher rules for advertising providers

[Guest]

7 minutes ago, BOZO T CLOWN said:

Rentmen has legitimate reasons to limit X-rated photos (dick pics) to Premium members only. The escort has the option to remove the x-rated photos if he wants. If not, it will only be available to Premium members. It is no "gimmic" (sic). It is no money grab. It is how Rentmen chooses to operate its business.

As for whether or not Rentmen is in compliance with German/Dutch law, Bozo is a circus performer, not a legal expert. However, it is hard to believe that a business charging customers $$ to view x-rated pics is illegal.  It's time to man-up. if you don't like these rules, then build a better mousetrap.

BoZo

   Valid argument 👌🏽
No one likes anything taken away but only one person has mentioned this... to some providers, myself included, might have a slight bias to take a "premium client" on RM a bit more serious. 

Edited October 6, 2023 by Vin_Marco

[+ BOZO T CLOWN]

6 hours ago, coriolis888 said:

You are a bright guy and usually see all facts fairly. 

However, I think you may have missed something in the below quote by you. 

(QUOTED FROM BOZO)  "Rentmen.com is a private company. It is in business to make $$$. It is not a charity. Rentmen can charge whatever it wants, and the consumer has the option to pay or not."

What you are ignoring (in your above quoted analysis) is the fact that paying providers to rentmen are furnishing rentmen with graphic photos that are intended by providers as advertisement photos.   

Some of those photos are professional photos that cost the provider money.

 Rentmen is not buying the photos from the provider nor paying for the photos.   

The provider photos are for advertising by the provider.  The provider pays rentment to place an ad that includes those photos.    

The photos that rentmen receives from paying providers for advertisements, are now used as a tool for rentment to charge rentmen clients $240 annually without compensating or getting permission from the providers.   

In other words, rentmen is using the providers' advertisement photos without permission to make extra money from rentmen clients ($240 annually).  

Although prostitution is legal in Germany and Holland, I am not sure charging clients for access to those photos is legal without an agreement from the provider and/or a payment to the provider.  Providers should find out if the maneuver of charging a third party for their photos and not getting compensated is legal.  

Rentmen appears to be using a gimmic (getting free photos from clients then selling access to those photos only to clients willing to pay $240. annually to see those photos.

A good German lawyer might find that business transaction unfair or not legal.  

 

 

The first sentence of your post is quite perceptive of you. Though Bozo prefers "always" to "usually"

However, the rest of your post is simply an escort's entitlement rant.

Rentmen operates a business. They can change the rules under which they operate at any time for any reason. No explanation needs to be provided. Much like any hotel chain or airline changes its rules for its members.
If an escort/masseur doesn't like the rules, that's too bad. Bozo doesn't like having to pay for high speed WiFi in my hotel room or pay to check my luggage at an airport (all previously free benefits). If you don't like Rentmen's rules, find a different sandbox to play in. Or build your own sandbox.  Just stop the whining. 

Rentmen has legitimate reasons to limit X-rated photos (dick pics) to Premium members only. The escort has the option to remove the x-rated photos if he wants. If not, it will only be available to Premium members. It is no "gimmic" (sic). It is no money grab. It is how Rentmen chooses to operate its business.

As for whether or not Rentmen is in compliance with German/Dutch law, Bozo is a circus performer, not a legal expert. However, it is hard to believe that a business charging customers $$ to view x-rated pics is illegal.  It's time to man-up. if you don't like these rules, then build a better mousetrap.

BoZo

Edited October 6, 2023 by BOZO T CLOWN

[+ DrownedBoy]

16 hours ago, José Soplanucas said:

You have probably never fought for anything. You cannot quite just because you failed once, or twice, or many times. Look at any significant gain any minority has achieved. How long did it take? How many defeats became lessons? 

I started working advocacy in my college gay group. Several mentors died with HIV.

You do not make assumptions about my past. Period. Don't do it again. 

[MikeBiDude]

Am I the only one here who thinks this is all a "tempest in a teapot"?
Things change, we adapt.
Personal note: I don't need full frontal pics to engage in a conversation with a provider.

[+ BenjaminNicholas]

Just now, MikeBiDude said:

Am I the only one here who thinks this is all a "tempest in a teapot"?
Things change, we adapt.
Peronal note: I don't need full frontal pics to engage in a conversation with a provider.

Fuck yes, I agree with you.

This change is being picked apart like a high-level UN assembly.

It happened.  It's done.  Adapt or die.

[SirBillybob]

3 hours ago, Vin_Marco said:

No one likes anything taken away but only one person has mentioned this... to some providers, myself included, might have a slight bias to take a "premium client" on RM a bit more serious. 

That tracks somewhat like CAPTCHA identification. If they can see and ✅ for themselves the x-rated pics in the image grid it authenticates their user potential as non-robots open to transmitting affluenza. 

[Guest]

9 minutes ago, SirBillybob said:

That tracks somewhat like CAPTCHA identification. If they can see and ✅ for themselves the x-rated pics in the image grid it authenticates their user potential as non-robots open to transmitting affluenza. 

Oh it's much more simple than that. We simply click on said clients profile, and if we see this, we know they're at least pretty serious about their pleasures.

This is the view from the peep 👀 hole on our side of the door 🚪 :

Edited October 6, 2023 by Vin_Marco

[Guest]

1 hour ago, MikeBiDude said:

Am I the only one here who thinks this is all a "tempest in a teapot"?
Things change, we adapt.
Peronal note: I don't need full frontal pics to engage in a conversation with a provider.

💯 

[Guest]

1 hour ago, BenjaminNicholas said:

Fuck yes, I agree with you.

This change is being picked apart like a high-level UN assembly.

It happened.  It's done.  Adapt or die.

Tire kickers and pic collectors will be moaning the most about this 😜

[SirBillybob]

24 minutes ago, Vin_Marco said:

Oh it's much more simple than that. We simply click on said clients profile, and if we see this, we know they're at least pretty serious about their pleasures.

This is the view from the peep 👀 hole on our side of the door 🚪 :

Aah, right, not to confuse Man Premium League with Premier League.

I also just realized the platform has the courtesy of not overtly labelling non-GOLD and non-PREMIUM, and that GOLD providers are listed first chronologically. 

Edited October 6, 2023 by SirBillybob

[Guest]

9 minutes ago, SirBillybob said:

Aah, right, not to confuse Man Premium League with Premier League.

I also just realized the platform has the courtesy of not overtly labelling non-GOLD and non-PREMIUM, and that GOLD providers are listed first chronologically. 

Semi subtle. Not quite as humble as removing the "turbo" off your 911 Carrera lol. Those that know, know 😜

[Guest]

1 hour ago, Vin_Marco said:

Oh it's much more simple than that. We simply click on said clients profile, and if we see this, we know they're at least pretty serious about their pleasures.

This is the view from the peep 👀 hole on our side of the door 🚪 :

I'm still trying to figure out who it is that makes me rent men of the day periodically,  pity the last time someone did it my ad was hidden and I wasn't seeing new people at the time. 🧐 🤷🏽‍♂️ 

[SirBillybob]

There is a method for Rentmen members to be spared 40% of the membership fees for any duration purchased. It’s irrelevant to me but simple to figure out. 

Edited October 6, 2023 by SirBillybob

[+ José Soplanucas]

6 hours ago, DrownedBoy said:

I started working advocacy in my college gay group. Several mentors died with HIV.

You do not make assumptions about my past. Period. Don't do it again. 

LOL. And you think you can control that? You are adorable. Without making any assumptions about your R&C skills, I wrote "you have probably". I think that asserting a possibility is not making an assumption.

Living through the HIV pandemic was a tough experience for all of us. If you did advocate for health services and support for the victims, you know how tough it was and how many times our efforts were defeated before we made any gains. If you had learned the lesson, Rentboy should be just a step back in the fight for decriminalization and normalization of sex work. 

 

[Decatur Guy]

Kind of a side topic to all of this but to follow up on what Vin Marco mentioned about premium clients being taken a bit more seriously:

I'm glad to read that some providers recognize that, because I don't think most providers pay any attention to that or to our profiles on there. To the point I'm not sure most of them are aware of the option of reading up on the potential client. The main thing they seem to notice is whether I've looked at an ad or not. I'll sometimes get "thanks for visiting my ad" notices, which I assume are automatic.

But very few providers have seemed to read my profile or see the reviews I've left. It's a good resource many seem to skip out on, especially for providers who don't want "endless texting." I've been treated with skepticism when my profile indicates otherwise.

Edited October 6, 2023 by Decatur Guy

[seattlebottom]

I clicked on the message icon on RM to read a message someone left me but it goes to a blank page.  Anyone know if we have to pay to read messages now?

[+ BOZO T CLOWN]

8 hours ago, coriolis888 said:

This post is directed to those who expressed fatigue at reading about the issue of what rentmen has done to their advertisers (providers) and to the rentmen clients who are referred to by rentmen as "premium clients" (who are charged $240.00 annually to hold the category of "premium client"), to view graphic photos and write reviews about their experience with any provider they hire via rentment.  

Here are my final comments about the matter.  

If rentmen were based in the U.S. (which it is not) it would be illegal (without an agreement authoring it) to misuse the graphic photos entrusted to them to post to an advertisement of a provider of gain additional funds.  

As we know, rentmen is charging providers to advertise on their site but are not compensating the provider for use of the graphic photos that rentmen is using as a basis to charge rentmen "premium clients" $240.00 anually. 

In the United States, where I practice, what rentmen is doing is referred to, among other things as "unjust enrichment".  

Rentmen is making money on graphic photos that were entrusted to them to include in a provider's advertising account on rentmen.  additionally, rentmen is using the graphic photos to justify an annual fee to "premium clients".

In fairness, the extra money rentmen is making from the "premium" members (for seeing the graphic photos) should be shared with the providers who furnished graphic photos for rentment to use to earn the additional revenue.   There is no sharing taking place according to my sources.  

What rentmen has done and plans to continue to do would be a violation of a variety of laws in most states in the United States.  I think the subject matter (graphic photos) has a lot to do with little to no protest of misuse of the photos.  

I do not know the equivalent or similar laws in Germany or Holland regarding this violation or even if there is a similar law in those countries, although I suspect there is.  I do not pracatice law in Germany or Holland and do not know their laws.   Forum members who are based in Europe or specifically Germany or Holland might want to consult an attorney there for guidance about their possible recourse. 

In most states in the U.S., using photos (without permission of the party in the photo) to create a separate income source for the company (premium clients) without compensating the people in the graphic photos or having an agreement to compensate the person likely would be subject to civil litigation in the U.S.

The use of those same photos as a basis to charge "premium members" a $240 annual fee, without compensating the provider of the photos, would be a basis for litigation in the U.S. without question. 

If the providers of the photos were paid a fee and/or had an agreement for the use of their photos that generate a $240 unrelated fee to rentmen from an unknown number of clients, it could be subject of litigation if Germany and/or Holland have such laws.   Despite prostitution being legal in Germany and Holland, I believe there likely are laws that would force rentmen to share the income from the "premium clients".

Providers furnish rentmen with graphic photos for the purposes of advertising for clients.  There is nothing wrong with that under German law or in Holland and in many other places, including the U.S.

Where the unjust enrichment falls into place is that rentmen uses the same graphic photos used in an advertisement paid for by the provider but later used by rentmen to generate $240 annually from clients to have access to those graphic photos.    

Based on my talking with providers who advertise on rentmen, none have given rentmen permission to use their graphic photos to make money from "selling access" to the graphic photos via the "premium client" category.  

At a minimum, rentmen should pay the provider for use of the graphic photos or reduce their monthly charge for advertising by the provider.  

In short, the type of situation described above, if committed in certain states in the U.S. would be a basis for litigation.  Like I previously wrote, it could also be a basis for litigation in Germany or Holland and I suspect that it is.  

Forum members located or based in Europe might want to consult an attorney about this matter.  

Thanks to all who participated with information relative to their experiences with rentmen.     

 

 

 

A short and simple response to the above Provider Entitlement rant:

There is no unjust enrichment. There is no money grab.
Rentmen sets the rules. If you or any other provider doesn't like the rules, then LEAVE. Find another venue to advertise.
Your continual whining and complaining is not changing any minds.

BoZo

 

[+ José Soplanucas]

I think I do agree with @MikeBiDude, when he feels we are overreacting here. But I also agree with @coriolis888 and the sex workers that feel like Rentmen is taking advantage of its monopolistic position. The clients should go somewhere else, as @BOZO T CLOWNstates. 

Unfortunately, they do not have anywhere to go because, again, RM is a de facto monopoly. Some monopolies in other industries were so strong that they had to be broken into smaller companies, because their power would not allow competition to develop. We are following Capitalism rules, and these rules have taught us that in cases like this the fight will be hard and long, if anyone is fighting and not just venting. 

Meanwhile, the service the website is providing seems to be excellent, even compared to similar websites in other countries. The company established a monopoly by sweeping the competition with better service. Paying 240 annually does not seem to be too much for clients who pay 300 per one hour. I am unsure of the prices for the advertising escorts, but I would assume the company offers a scale with affordable options for everyone. You do not even need to pay the annual fee, but a monthly option.

[+ DrownedBoy]

19 hours ago, José Soplanucas said:

LOL. And you think you can control that? You are adorable. Without making any assumptions about your R&C skills, I wrote "you have probably". I think that asserting a possibility is not making an assumption.

Living through the HIV pandemic was a tough experience for all of us. If you did advocate for health services and support for the victims, you know how tough it was and how many times our efforts were defeated before we made any gains. If you had learned the lesson, Rentboy should be just a step back in the fight for decriminalization and normalization of sex work. 

 

Go to hell.

[coriolis888]

5 hours ago, BOZO T CLOWN said:

 

There is no unjust enrichment. There is no money grab.

Your continual whining and complaining is not changing any minds.

BoZo

 

You do not work in law.  Therefore, your statement is incorrect and borders on being hillarious.  

I always thought that your prior posts were controversial but well constructed and made sense. 

However, your lack of understanding of the simple phrase "unjust enrichment" tells me a lot about you.  

Edited October 7, 2023 by coriolis888

[rvwnsd]

A couple things:

1. As a premium RM member, I can see the same pics I saw prior to the changes RM made. To me, there have been no changes. 
2. On a routine and regular basis, the mods have to edit posts containing RM links because a preview of the provider's ad displays an explicit pic (such as an erection) in the public forum. Ergo, the pics are still visible. 

As @BOZO T CLOWN stated, RM is a business, and like any other business they need to pay salaries, hosting fees, server costs, ISP fees, and utilities plus all the other expenses a business incurs. I don't remember when RM last raised their prices, but it has been years. When a business keeps prices flat for an extended time, any price increase will be steep. 

If RM customers don't like RM, then pool resources, hire UI/UX architects, business analysts, project managers, scrum masters, product owners, database and web developers, legal counsel, photo and ad verifiers, privacy administrators, compliance specialists, accounting and bookkeeping staff, fraud prevention specialists, and the other support staff required to maintain a web site, secure a domain name, acquire server space (don't forget to have development, test, troubleshooting, and production environments to avoid production issues. Users will complain if you have them!), incorporate the business overseas, secure a payment processor, obtain banking relationships, develop the website, test it, and deploy.

It's really that cheap and easy!

OK, it ISN'T cheap and easy. On the low end, based on my own experience leading software projects for the last 31 years, it would probably be a $4 - $5 million, multi-year project to develop a service that contains a bare minimum of the features members have said they want. $19.99/month ($9.99/month or $99/year for long-term members) is starting to sound like a bargain.

[SirBillybob]

On 10/1/2023 at 10:51 AM, LA90046 said:

Calls to mind when OF decided to ban “sexually explicit” content -- and reversed course within days.

The thing about Rentmen’s current Terms of Use is that sexually explicit content is prohibited across all components of the platform outside of members’ negotiations among themselves vis-a-vis the optional Private Gallery section. If this is actually a new overall regulatory update, perhaps reflecting that Rentmen wishes more distance, notwithstanding the consideration of profit margins raised by others here, then I would not advise that an Escort renew a costly GOLD subscription without determining whether the Terms of Use have actually been substantially revised along the image content dimension compared to before times. I don’t have a Time Machine to assess Terms of Use alterations.

If they have been rewritten, or if their application will formally align with the clearly worded content restrictions, there may be more prospective changes as far as content allowance within Premium and Video Gallery image categories. Otherwise, I might see the recent changes as merely a tightening up of the positioning of pornographic, erotic, explicit, prurient, what have you, content according to their fundamental position of plausible deniability in terms of advocating commercial sex work (aka compensated time), and the advertising content typically associated with promoting same.

In sum, are the recent changes punctuated as opposed to a preliminary step in a sequence? Will the status quo of ‘looking the other way’ from a contradiction between stated rules and actual content be upheld? Might there be more to come beyond first-line image content adjustment that is non-volitional from the point of view of many subscribers? Be mindful that payment equals Terms of Use acceptance.

I realize that a bait-and-switch would be suicide for Rentmen unless there is a way to salvage the content that members desire, and Private Galleries may always ensure content preservation in that the platform offers a direct conduit between members. The fly in the ointment is not knowing if Rentmen, based in Europe, is feeling under pressure to revise its framework. This cannot be divorced from the very recent (mid-Sept) complex and controversial European Parliament vote, perhaps more symbolic than binding at this juncture, in which sex work was deemed exploitive and not legitimately valid as a profession, this vote yet falling short of fully endorsing the Nordic abolitionist model. 

[Jarrod_Uncut]

On 10/4/2023 at 1:24 PM, coriolis888 said:

It has only been a few days since the major changes to the site. 

I think it is too early to know or see any effect on fewer advertisers or providers closing their account. 

Where else can the providers place their ads?  Rentmen is too big to ignore and they have the lion's share of the escort market advertising.  

Megapersonals

Adam4Adam

Mint Boys

RentMasseur 

though most of those aren’t  great in terms of catching gay escort clients, one can still finesse it if done properly. Even on RentMasseur, I don’t claim to be a “masseur” (so I’m not showing up with a table to your hotel, it’s not that kinda party), I’m a “relaxation consultant”. But, one needs to at least know some fundamental massage techniques to be consistent with it.

Otherwise: I’m not too pressed about the changes. If someone feels they can’t get clients unless they show their dick and butthole: they probably need to look within and figure out what they can do otherwise. It’s not required, believe me. Don’t sell yourself short feeling you have to show the goods for free, to attract a client.
 

Men biologically like a bit of mystery. I know gay men are wired a little differently (actually it’s women who are wired differently, that make straight men willing to wait 3 dates, or 90 days/after marriage to have sex lol).

However, people should be willing to pay or at the very least, be a vetted client to see nude pics. Too many people are spoiled getting to look at free porn, free dick pics, etc. idk if RentM change had much to do with that, and I even notice flaccid “artistic nudes” are still being allowed. 
 

I worked with a nude Calendar company and they had a rule: your dick can’t be hard because that falls under pornography, and it will disqualify our fundraising mission (or something to that effect). 
 

So yeah: it is what it is. Personally I like the new change, it inspired me to go thru my 3,500 pics and replace some great professional photos that I haven’t posted in awhile lol. They aren’t nude, but just “sexy”. However, I still need to see us profiting from nude pic views. The work is only half done…

Edited October 8, 2023 by Jarrod_Uncut

[kyleham]

Just my two cents. I feel it's another example of corporate greed. Yes, they can charge whatever they like BUT they are not sharing their increase profits with the providers. Thus, they are making $$$ off providers explicit content  I do not hire often but when I do I like to see a little more. I am very into oral and like to see what I am getting for my $$$. If I choose to bottom I don't want to be surprised by it being small/large. I am paying and want  what I want. If I am topping I want to see a nice bubble butt. That's what I ask for private pics. I do not hire enough to spend $19.95 a month. Even porn sites only charge $9.95 as well as many OF  providers.

This is only my opinion

[+ José Soplanucas]

I recognize monopoly disadvantages, but I do not understand why people think Rentmen should share profits with the escorts. They are just advertisers. Escorts are as much clients of the website as we are. Rentmen is not OF. The images providers publish are advertisements, not content on sale. If you are an escort and think RM is taking advantage of your nude photos, save them for your OnlyFans.