Political Issues Forum Retired

[RadioRob]

Since I have taken over running the site nearly two years ago, the Political Issues forum has represented literally 90% of all of the issues that the moderators have had to deal with.  We have attempted to keep the forum civil and a place where people can have mature discussions about those topics.  This includes implementing tools to remind people about our rules, giving reminders and warnings, etc.  I did this because I felt having an area that people could have an open dialog might provide a venue where people could exchange ideas and learn from each other.  

This has not happened over the last two years.  Instead it has simply become a cesspool of topics that simply attacked other members and baited the other side.  The moderators have literally have had to spend HOURS each week dealing with the output and there is nothing else I can think of that will make people use the forum as it was intended.  As a result, the Political Issues discussion forum is now retired and has been hidden on this site.  

Our community guidelines will be updated to reflect that political discussion is no longer permitted on the site. 

[BuffaloKyle]

I didn't often post in the political forums but I'm sad to see them retired. It'll be weird when something major happens in the world but we won't be able to discuss it on here. I would have rather seen repeat violators given permanent bans from posting in that section and disabling new members from accessing the political section for a certain amount of time to dissuade someone from just making a new profile. But I know how burned out the mods must be so I'm fine with the decision.

[EZEtoGRU]

I think closing the politics forum is ultimately a good thing. Back in the summer when this possibility was being discussed, I expressed that I thought it should be shut down for a variety of reasons. I’m totally good with it. 

Edited February 14, 2023 by EZEtoGRU

[NJF]

I sincerely hope that the venom that was contained in the Political forum will not spill into other parts of the forum. Without its regular outlets, the danger of a spillover is real.

Edited February 14, 2023 by NJF

[Stormy]

As much as I was appalled by some of the posts in the Political Forum, I will miss it. 

Edited February 14, 2023 by Stormy

[+ Lucky]

I won't miss it. I think it is a wise decision.

[+ José Soplanucas]

I have mixed feelings. I think it was helpful to know who is who. Also, based on the time they spent there, the frequency of their posting, and the blatant bitterness, it looks like some poor lonely guys do not have another place to vent their grievances. 

Besides, I wonder how we will keep politics out of the conversations. The same homophobia and racism that a few posters bragged about, will show up when we discuss non-political issues. After all, (nonpartisan) politics is everywhere. 

[+ sync]

It was the hurling of epithets, expletives, and profanities that soured some of the postings for me, but they were not so plentiful as to tarnish the Politics Forum experience.

While there were instances of off-topic wanderings, guilty of that myself, many of the postings were spot-on informative, thought-provoking, and enlightening, which I shall miss.

[Lookin]

I'm sorry to see it go.  It was one of the few places where I could always find a variety of viewpoints.  But there were some divisive posters who somehow never got weeded out.

Very grateful to the mods for trying to make it work.  Daddy once asked me if I'd like to be a moderator, but I wouldn't have been very tolerant: Pin the rules, one-month block for the first violation, six months for the second and permanent for the third.  Low threshold and no discussion, just as children learn boundaries and socialization skills.  Or not.

If the mods ever feel like giving a streamlined, less stressful, approach a try, I'll hope the Forum may come out of retirement one day.

In the meantime, it's been a real pleasure to interact with so many fine folks over the years!  Thanks for the great discussions!  🤗

[Monarchy79]

The only problem with that is politics is going to rear its head in other forums (it’s happening now).

 

 

[+ Orin]

Mixed among the vitriol in the Politics forum were some posts that didn't center around politics, per se. The problem, though, was that nearly anything that even tangentially impinged on the realms poisoned by partisan rhetoric got sucked into the tornado. So I'm curious whether there's a way to craft a sub-venue here to host those sorts of discussion.

In an earlier age, 'salons' served that purpose. So I pose a question: are there aspects of that forum worth transplanting? What sorts of topics of interest to members, which are not political, don't have a place here now?

Edited February 15, 2023 by Orin

[+ Coolwave35]

Good riddance!  

[+ stevenkesslar]

Love ya @Lookin.  💗💗💗  And you are so right.  It has been a real pleasure.  And thanks for all the years of great discussions.  Although I imagine I'll see some of you over at gayguides.

Thank you @RadioRob first and foremost for everything you did to keep this entire website alive.  But also for the forum.  You have been a godsend.

I know you referenced the last few years, since that's your shelf life as someone running this place.  But I would like to add a few things from a historical perspective.  I've been active here about 20 years. For most of that I was intentionally quiet about potentially divisive political issues.  Since it's not good for escort business.  So it's not like the past two years is really anything new.

I knew Bill personally for most of that time, and got to know him pretty well when I was leading a fundraising drive for him and the site.  He told me "racism" was the issue he hated coming up most on the site.  And having a place to put that stuff was what the politics forum was for.  So in some ways it's always been where unwelcome things go to die - or not.  Several people have said it already, and it's true.  It's hard to split politics out of life.  Racism in escorting was an issue that kept coming up, for example - on the part of both providers and clients.  Before I was a loudmouth lib, I posted a ton about organizing for same sex marriage.  Which was a very unifying issue here, mostly.  And Bill and I were partners in crime in ranting and organizing against the Rentboy raid.  That's politics, specific to our community.  So you'll have to figure out what people can say, if anything, about same sex marriage or the politics of escorting.  Those may be the kinds of things @Orin mentioned that are near and dear to me, and many in this community.

Notwithstanding that politics is almost the oldest profession around, there was a marked change in tenor here about 2016, for obvious reasons.  I always found it amusing when Bill posted his Miss Manners/decorum logo.  And wanted us all to be polite.  Even as there was a massive and deepening culture war everywhere across America.  It was of course inevitably going to get in.  The Gays are very political.  And proudly so, when you think of everything our politics has won for us.  So I take this as very much a sign of the times.  And in many ways a positive one.  People are just getting sick of it.

I always told Bill, "Your website.  Your rules."   I think there is also something to be said for temperament.  Oz at his site always lets everything fly, because he mostly enjoys it and hates to set rules.  And it seems to work well at least in that forum.  The temperament here has always been different, for whatever reason.  My own view of this period is that the toxicity and poison has to be allowed to run its course.  Which it will, in its own time.  Like I said.  This is in some ways an encouraging sign.  But it was clearly very annoying to moderators here.  So now you get a well deserved break from the nonsense.  You deserve it.  Thanks again, guys!  I'll miss you.

[sydneyboy]

I’m sad. The discussion was often robust but isn’t political debate always robust? The contributors on both sides of the political divide were usually highly intelligent and committed. I for one will miss it greatly.

[sydneyboy]

Just now, sydneyboy said:

I’m sad. The discussion was often robust but isn’t political debate always robust? The contributors on both sides of the political divide were usually highly intelligent and committed. I for one will miss it greatly.

Should I add please reconsider.

[+ augustus]

How about a separate forum with a separate password needed so the moaners don't have to see it at all and make constant complaints?  Like an underground Fight Club.  What will I do without my learned pals like @BOZO T CLOWN @pubic_assistance @BSR @bigjoey etc.

[samhexum]

14 minutes ago, augustus said:

What will I do without my learned pals like @BOZO T CLOWN @pubic_assistance @BSR @bigjoey etc.

Have an ongoing group message amongst those who want to participate.  Seriously.  It'll be a bit of an echo chamber, but you'll enjoy communicating with like-minded folk.

[+ azdr0710]

gee, that should open up some bandwidth......

[+ augustus]

The members that like this shutdown are the ones who have been complaining because they were losing the argument.  

"Everyone is in favor of free speech. Hardly a day passes without its being extolled, but some people's idea of it is that they are free to say what they like, but if anyone else says anything back, that is an outrage"  Winston Churchill 

 

[+ augustus]

6 hours ago, José Soplanucas said:

based on the time they spent there, the frequency of their posting, and the blatant bitterness, it looks like some poor lonely guys do not have another place to vent their grievances. 

Listen to you.....lmao.

[+ nycman]

Although I rarely read or posted in the Political Forum, I am sad to see it go. I always thought of it as a place Daddy created to keep the puppies from pissing in the main sandbox. I also thought of it as a more "unregulated" space where people were allowed to be more free with their speech.

In fact, the entire concept of "moderators" in the political forum always seemed self defeating to me. I mean, if you wander into that forum, you kind of have to accept that your going to hear (and perhaps debate) things that you don’t like.

As gay men our very existence is political. As such, I am sad to see an arena for political free speech dismantled. Nonetheless, it is what it is. 

[Guest]

Very sad. I'd think there are less drastic alternatives. Even when I disagreed with posters, I still learned a lot from that forum. This is not the same website without that forum. I guess I'll have to look elsewhere. 

[+ augustus]

36 minutes ago, nycman said:

In fact, the entire concept of "moderators" in the political forum always seemed self defeating to me. I mean, if you wander into that forum, you kind of have to accept that your going to hear (and perhaps debate) things that you don’t like.

Exactly!  But the cabal of bedwetters lost their minds to an opposing view and wanted it shutdown. All they had to do was to avoid that forum like I avoid other forums.  A bunch of insecure cowards, THAT is what they are.  

Edited February 15, 2023 by augustus

[RadioRob]

And now that we’ve had a chance to get that off of our chests…. 

As per usual… some like the change, some don’t, and some don’t care.  And we’re already seeing some individuals trying to push buttons. 

I’m headed to bed now. Tomorrow (or later today in reality), if the snipping does not stop, there will be some folks who can enjoy a few days on timeout. 

Until then… love you all… sleep well… and good night.