Lotus-eater

Constantly checking cell phone and not changing linen between clients.  Masseurs and Escorts alike should turn their phones off when they arrive.

PSA to clients: please keep in mind this is the most common reason your masseurs do not text you back “immediately”. You can’t have it both ways. Immediate responses 100% of the time AND their full, uninterrupted attention during the session? Usually it’s one or the other. Unless you happen to luck out on your timing, and it’s exactly that: luck.
I’m careful not to detract any attention from my client to my phone during their session. The good masseurs are focused on you for the whole session.
Have grace when inquiring and it takes a while to get a response. It’s not uncommon, for example, for me to have a two hour client appointment, plus time after (still not texting other clients) to wrap up, accept payment, walk the client out, chit chat, etc. There’s no clear agreed-upon standard regarding an acceptable amount of time to return texts. For me, it’s up to 2-3 hours, most often I respond much sooner than that and obviously within minutes if I’m otherwise free. Response times have been discussed on several other forums at length. Same with hours to contact your provider. Here’s one related thread on that topic:
 

The up sell really annoys me.

That has not been my experience. As someone who has hired more professional masseurs than non-professional, I have experienced most of these problems with both. I believe mastering how to deal with people, and provide good service are learned skills. Only the very basics can be taught via formal instruction, and your answer to another post better illuminates the bigger issue.
ROD HAGEN:  Oddly, often the guys who charge WAY above average aren't digging the job. And many of us who do love the work, charge average or below and always have. -  3/27/24, in forum 'Discount for in shape, good-looking and younger clients?'
No matter what job you do, you always perform the work better when you don't hate the work. I just don't envision, that typically, anyone whose sole thought process is waking up and thinking, "fuck! Rent is due. I guess I am going to have to stroke some guy today to pay the bills, " has the motivation to do the job well.
 

I counter this. We are looking for professionals who can do sensual therapy. It's hard to find - but lovely when you do.

There is no universal answer. It varies with every masseur.
I recommend asking for exactly what you want and see what the masseur says.
General inquiries like “what does your massage include?” puts the burden on the masseur to name everything under the sun -sexual or otherwise- that he will or will not include. It’s exhausting answering this question over and over and over. The client knows full well what they want. They just aren’t willing to ask for it and it wastes our time to respond to such general questions.

Here are a few examples of more specific questions to ask:
“Do you include a happy ending?”
”Do you allow mutual touch?”
”Do you offer body to body massage?”
FYI happy ending means a hand job only unless you specifically discuss other details. He may not offer more, and if he does, be clear on any uncharges for the extra service. Some may charge their full escort rate depending on your needs and expectations. All good things to know before booking.

When I visited last fall he didn't mention anything about culling clients, though my massage was non-erotic. He was culled from my list (competent but not great massage), so I don't know if he did the same to me. Dog was allowed in the room, which I dislike.

https://www.masseurfinder.com/massage-therapists/24123/
This is Edras, my favorite massage therapist, hands down, of anyone I’ve ever seen in my life to date. He does excellent therapeutic work. He used to be in San Diego and was my regular. He’s in La Habra (LA metro) now.
He’s one of the nicest, sweetest, kindest, most dedicated, attentive, hard working, and reasonably priced therapists. I miss seeing him in San Diego. La Habra is kind of out of the way, even for LA folks, but I want to give an unsolicited shout out to him. He’s definitely worth a long drive from another area of LA or from other cities in CA just to see him.
This shouldn’t matter, and it doesn’t, but for most of you I know it does. He used to be heavier. Always thought he was damn sexy, with a bearish build, hairy, and naturally very masculine. Looking at his updated profile pics, he’s built up quite a fit body. Even sexier now in all the superficial ways even though his real sex appeal is his good nature and generous spirit. Highly recommend!
Note, he’s therapeutic only. Do please respect his boundaries. These are not erotic massage or sex work rates he’s charging. Seriously though, one of the best massages ever!
Also he’s mentioned on this older thread:
 

he is dream worthy.  like another one in LA, he is outcall only.  makes it difficult for me to book if i can't go to them.

Or people could stop denying the biological reality of sex. At least Rowling puts magic in fiction books.

People conflate the cost of living with inflation. EV's are more expensive to repair just like luxury cars are more expensive to repair, so higher insurance rates are a downstream effect of more people buying costlier cars rather than inflation per se. But it does increase the cost of living.

People conflate the cost of living with inflation. EV's are more expensive to repair just like luxury cars are more expensive to repair, so higher insurance rates are a downstream effect of more people buying costlier cars rather than inflation per se. But it does increase the cost of living.

Or people could stop denying the biological reality of sex. At least Rowling puts magic in fiction books.

People conflate the cost of living with inflation. EV's are more expensive to repair just like luxury cars are more expensive to repair, so higher insurance rates are a downstream effect of more people buying costlier cars rather than inflation per se. But it does increase the cost of living.

People conflate the cost of living with inflation. EV's are more expensive to repair just like luxury cars are more expensive to repair, so higher insurance rates are a downstream effect of more people buying costlier cars rather than inflation per se. But it does increase the cost of living.

It's not in the right direction anymore.  The CPI and today's PPI show inflation accelerating.   Prices keep going up and up.

Or people could stop denying the biological reality of sex. At least Rowling puts magic in fiction books.

It is a gym. It is not a bathhouse. if you fool around in the steam room or sauna you’re going to get thrown out and probably banned.

Sorry for the cold shower on your hot fantasy, guys. I’m just trying to inject some realism into this discussion so you can develop appropriate expectations and also delight in the unexpected when it happens. Value your providers and pay them accordingly.
Please keep in mind we are not cum machines. I completely understand the client fantasy of a massage scenario morphing into a porn set. That scenario assumes your appointment is the only thing on your masseur’s agenda for the day. However, it’s just that: a fantasy.
I can’t deliver cum for a massage fee for every client that darkens my door. Some days that means I would have to get hard and ejaculate six times back to back. Never mind the fact that I may have a legit escort client I have to perform for on that same day. I just can’t do it consistently and still maintain quality or sufficiently pace myself.
If you want your masseur to cum as part of your massage session, please ask for it and pay his escort rate, or at the very least, tip very generously when you fail to discuss an appropriate fee prior to starting the session and he does it for you anyway. If your guy is already way overcharging for massage (like, $200+/hr), it’s safe to assume these services are already baked into the cost and I wouldn’t worry about it.
$160/hr or less I would assume nothing more than massage, and enjoy the possibility of some extras if he does them. Happy endings are very common and normal, but not guaranteed. Do not expect full service, oral, or your masseur to cum for you. Some guys might do these things for their regular massage fee, but please respect masseurs with boundaries around what they will do for their standard massage fee. Boundaries vary. Clients are not entitled to anything they didn’t already discuss with their masseur.
I want my clients to understand the value of each of the services they hire and pay accordingly. Massage (even erotic massage) is NOT discount sex work. Blowing loads all over clients with no discussion of rates beforehand is, in my mind, asking the client to expect discount escort services.
We can debate at length about what is and isn’t sex work and many other threads already hash it out. IMHO, having to deliver cum - in one way or another - is well within the sex work category. Others can charge whatever they want for it. If your guy can consistently cum for you for a massage fee, enjoy the discount service, but please do not place the same expectations on other masseurs.
I can do six massages a day. I can’t possibly take six escort clients a day. So I charge higher for escort service and lower for massage. Scarcity over a given time period is among the many reasons I charge the way I do.

To me ...when I am PAYING a masseur, I want a massage and maybe a Happy ending for ME.
The issue of the other fellow ejaculating anywhere seems more ESCORT oriented than MASSAGE 🤔

Our pronouns are majestic plural. We are not amused by they/them.

This is both stupid and insane.

Darwinism at work.

Yeah, I second this.
Plus, it's annoying as fuck on a site designed for non-paid hookups to constantly sift through messages with GEN in them.
It's bad enough that Grindr now has a ton of women on the grid.

You can only really be responsible for your own health.
Regardless of what he tells you, proceed as if he (and everyone else) has every STD imaginable.
Dumb, but honest advice.