LGBTQ people feeling compelled to move to a different state

[+ tassojunior]

On 9/1/2023 at 11:33 AM, Charlie said:

The other side of the story is the way some places became more desirable for gays in the first place. The classic case was San Francisco. Many closeted gays in the military during World War II spent time in SF before being shipped off to the Pacific war, and experienced more social freedom there; when the war was over, they decided to return to SF rather than to the small towns in the Mid-west and the South where they had been raised. The influx of gays made California more liberal, and their exodus from their original homes made the states they left behind more conservative.

In the 68-72 period, during a different war, I was responsible for my share of the debauchery that went on multi-story 24/7 at the Embarcadero Y, the Ritch Street baths and the Folsom street backrooms. For law school I had to leave and it degenerated under Feinstein into the most boring city of boring people imaginable. Gay clone bougies are just as boring as straight ones (not that anyone admits to being "straight" anymore.) DC degenerated likewise when they tore down the gay strip club /bathhouse area and replaced it with more bougie housing and a stadium. The NYC bougies who've moved into my DC neighborhood at 2 million a pop recently (paid for cash by mommy and daddy), smile at us quaint gays a lot and patronize us and Blacks like children.. The amazing thing is now the gay ones identify more with their social class than as being gay (not that gay isn't still fashionable). But that privileged socio-economic class is the most boringly bland imaginable and ruin cities they take over. 

[+ tassojunior]

On 9/1/2023 at 9:29 PM, TonyDown said:

I would consider leaving where I live now because it is crowded and expensive.  However the state laws where I come from have become very anti LGBTQ.

Am I hijacking the thread (hope not) to ask what are some affordable cities that are relatively safe for LGBTQ people?

There are gay neighborhoods in many cities besides the biggest urban areas. The cost of housing there is much less than those biggest urban centers, and in spite of the fact that the inhabitants of those big cities consider them the centers of western civilization, daily life in many of the lesser cities is more enjoyable, less expensive, and safer. I've been hearing great things about how great gay life is, how good looking and friendly locals are, and enjoyable Oklahoma City is. Salt Lake City has been that way for a while. Not sure about Boise but that's where Californians are fleeing to generally for better living. I know a gay neighborhood and a gay bar in Birmingham that is wonderful. Wilton Manors may be the largest gay city in America and Tampa Bay/Sarasota has a lot of gay areas. 

You want to have a balance of enjoyable life and enjoyable gay life and that often pops up in unexpected places. 

[Guest]

4 hours ago, tassojunior said:

... Wilton Manors may be the largest gay city in America...

Wow. I looked up places in WM on Zillow and I was surprised that it seems to be just as affordable as Austin, and, you're right, it's quite gay. I suspect the summers are even more brutal than Austin's, though. I think you'd want to be pretty sure whatever place you bought was built under modern codes, able to withstand hurricanes. Just as here in LA, you want to make sure your property was built after 1976 building codes which required better earthquake protection. 

[caramelsub]

6 hours ago, Unicorn said:

Wow. I looked up places in WM on Zillow and I was surprised that it seems to be just as affordable as Austin, and, you're right, it's quite gay. I suspect the summers are even more brutal than Austin's, though. I think you'd want to be pretty sure whatever place you bought was built under modern codes, able to withstand hurricanes. Just as here in LA, you want to make sure your property was built after 1976 building codes which required better earthquake protection. 

I wouldn’t call Wilton Manors or Fort Lauderdale affordable at least not for renting. Plus it’s in Florida, which has a lot of anti lgbt legislations being made by the current governor. Same with Austin being in Texas and their current governor, very anti-trans.
My question is can a city in a non lgbt friendly state be lgbt friendly? Atlanta is very gay friendly, not terribly expensive but rents are rising. However I don’t know how Georgia is as a whole state regarding lgbt advancement.

Edited September 4, 2023 by caramelsub

[soloyo215]

My two cents:

The "just go, happens all the time" attitude about the issue doesn't take into consideration a few things: many of use love the land where we grew up, have other ties with communities, loved ones, and/or have a good career. To just up and leave, especially if you have a family and an established career, is not as easy as "just go".

Furthermore, conservative people are jut wrong in their discriminatory practices and actions, especially when legal protections are in place. Leaving makes them win, and they should not win because their beliefs and actions are just cruel and wrong.

Chosoing to move for comfort and for better opportunities for the LGBT is very different that being forced out from a community that you have been part of due to political pressure, or for making you feel threatened. And as things progress, they are supposed to get better not worse, so there should be less of having to leave, not the increase that we are seeing. "Happens all the time" just enables and excuses the hate.

[marylander1940]

On 9/1/2023 at 11:23 AM, caramelsub said:

I just hate how the lgbtq friendly cities tend to be extremely expensive. 

I don't know about "extremely expensive"  but certainly more expensive than other places.

Smaller towns tend to be cheaper the payment prefer to move to the bigger cities in the area. For example many people from the Dakotas move to Minneapolis.

[marylander1940]

On 9/2/2023 at 9:59 PM, BSR said:

The pediatric cardiologist didn't do anything, but conversely it sounds like the state or community didn't do anything to him either.  He simply didn't like the politics.

When he became politically active, his high profile triggered "hate mail."  Mind you, every political activist is subjected to hate.  Every conservative I follow on social media gets death threats on a daily basis.  As for the messages he got pleading for him to find Jesus, pffft, I can't believe he let that get to him.  Just buy a shredder and giggle as you feed in one "fires of Hell" letter after the other.

You don't have to move to Chelsea or West Hollywood to find a gay-friendly spot.  I grew up in Kansas City, which trust me, was not the least bit gay-friendly in the 70s & 80s (very few places were).  But I've since met plenty of gays currently living in KC who just love it -- big gay community, such nice friendly people, both gay & straight -- with a cost of living that pretty much everyone can afford, even cheaper than Austin TX!

No cult of victimhood statement?

I am disappointed!

[+ Charlie]

On 9/1/2023 at 8:33 AM, Charlie said:

The other side of the story is the way some places became more desirable for gays in the first place. The classic case was San Francisco. Many closeted gays in the military during World War II spent time in SF before being shipped off to the Pacific war, and experienced more social freedom there; when the war was over, they decided to return to SF rather than to the small towns in the Mid-west and the South where they had been raised. The influx of gays made California more liberal, and their exodus from their original homes made the states they left behind more conservative.

BTW, during the Vietnam War, my uncle left his wife and children at home in Michigan when he left for Saigon to work for the US government. His wife decided to move the family to Hawaii to be closer to my uncle. However, in Saigon my uncle fell in love with a young Vietnamese woman. When the war ended, did he go back to Michigan, or to his family in Hawaii? Of course not: he and his Vietnamese girlfriend moved to--where else?--San Francisco.

[+ Charlie]

8 hours ago, Unicorn said:

Wow. I looked up places in WM on Zillow and I was surprised that it seems to be just as affordable as Austin, and, you're right, it's quite gay. I suspect the summers are even more brutal than Austin's, though. I think you'd want to be pretty sure whatever place you bought was built under modern codes, able to withstand hurricanes. Just as here in LA, you want to make sure your property was built after 1976 building codes which required better earthquake protection. 

When we were looking for places to retire, we toured Wilton Manors with a gay realtor. What gave us pause was that every house we looked at had hurricane shutters.

[Rudynate]

4 minutes ago, Charlie said:

When we were looking for places to retire, we toured Wilton Manors with a gay realtor. What gave us pause was that every house we looked at had hurricane shutters.

A provider I got together with told me I simple had to visit there - that it was the Palm Springs of the Southeast.

[+ Charlie]

Just now, Rudynate said:

A provider I got together with told me I simple had to visit there - that it was the Palm Springs of the Southeast.

Ironically, we just had the first hurricane in Palm Springs--and no one was prepared for the damage.

[Rudynate]

Just now, Charlie said:

Ironically, we just had the first hurricane in Palm Springs--and no one was prepared for the damage.

True - who would have thought.

 

 

[Rudynate]

14 minutes ago, Charlie said:

BTW, during the Vietnam War, my uncle left his wife and children at home in Michigan when he left for Saigon to work for the US government. His wife decided to move the family to Hawaii to be closer to my uncle. However, in Saigon my uncle fell in love with a young Vietnamese woman. When the war ended, did he go back to Michigan, or to his family in Hawaii? Of course not: he and his Vietnamese girlfriend moved to--where else?--San Francisco.

Oscar Wilde - It's an odd thing, but anyone who disappears is said to be seen in San Francisco.  It must be a delightful city and possess all the attractions of the next world.

[EZEtoGRU]

OK folks.  Let's get back on topic:  LGBT people feeling compelled to move to a different state.  

[Rudynate]

1 minute ago, EZEtoGRU said:

OK folks.  Let's get back on topic:  LGBT people feeling compelled to move to a different state.  

The NAACP has issued a travel advisory for people of color and LGBTQ people.  If that didn't make you think about leaving Florida, I don't know what would. 

[+ Charlie]

I grew up in a small town in NJ. I knew I was gay when I was in high school, and my best friend there came out to me just before we graduated. We knew of only one classmate who might have been gay. More than six decades later, many of our classmates still live in our hometown or in neighboring towns. The three of us left as soon as we graduated and never returned to NJ. We all moved to large cities where it was easy to be part of an active gay community.

Of course, the world has changed since we were young and gay--it would have been virtually impossible to be openly gay in almost any small town in America in those days, when persecution of gays was not only socially acceptable but actually legal. The pressure that gays feel in socially and politically conservative areas now is more subtle, but can still feel just as threatening, especially where legal changes with unknown consequences are proposed. There still are parts of this country where I would not consider living, solely because of my sexual orientation.

 

[NJF]

“Hotlanta” is the black gay Mecca or hoe central depending on how you want to look at it 😂 

[TonyDown]

2 hours ago, EZEtoGRU said:

OK folks.  Let's get back on topic:  LGBT people feeling compelled to move to a different state.  

Thank you!

I understand places like Oklahoma City, Des Moines and Dallas have strong gay communities.  But I would feel too vulnerable living under those legal jurisdictions. 

I appreciate the protections that exist in California. But to get away from the expense and crowds of California,

states such as Minnesota and Illinois sound reasonable.   

A friend recently moved to the Saugutuk-Douglas gay friendly area of Michigan.  That is as far east as I would consider.

[marylander1940]

3 hours ago, EZEtoGRU said:

OK folks.  Let's get back on topic:  LGBT people feeling compelled to move to a different state.  

Back to subject:

Feeling rejection, or simply being forced to be in the closet in a small town is a great motivation but it takes money to move to another city and start a new life. College usually is the way for most to do it.

I'm not saying all big cities are likely to be more gay friendly but that has been the case historically. There's some anonymity in living in a bigger city.

As they say in Spanish: "pueblo chico infierno grande" (small town big hell).

[Guest]

4 hours ago, Charlie said:

When we were looking for places to retire, we toured Wilton Manors with a gay realtor. What gave us pause was that every house we looked at had hurricane shutters.

Well, Palm Springs and Wilton Manors are certainly two very gay-friendly locales with pleasant winters and brutal summers. If moving to PS, one should take care that one's house is built to withstand strong earthquakes. In WM, one has hurricanes to worry about, so they should be built to withstand that, and look for less flood-prone areas, if that's possible. Hurricanes may be more frequent, but the advantage is that they come with plenty of warning, so there's time to batten down the hatches and drive away. Whose fault would it be if an earthquake hits PS? 😉

Edited September 4, 2023 by Unicorn

[+ Charlie]

Since the San Andreas is in our backyard, we do have earthquake insurance.

[BSR]

16 hours ago, Rudynate said:

The NAACP has issued a travel advisory for people of color and LGBTQ people.  If that didn't make you think about leaving Florida, I don't know what would. 

Ho hum, politics as usual.  No matter how loudly professional victims screech, the rest of the world just ignores them. 

Actions speak louder than words.  Any documentation of gays & blacks leaving Florida en masse?   No, of course not, because these warnings are all just empty rhetoric.

Edited September 5, 2023 by BSR
Reworded

[+ Vegas_Millennial]

On 9/3/2023 at 2:20 PM, NJF said:

I guess the reason is gays have more disposable incomes 

True.  The two biggest factors to earning/keeping wealth are:

1.  Not getting divorced.

2.  Not having children.

Both 1 and 2 were not easily available to gay men for a long time.

[seattlebottom]

6 hours ago, BSR said:

Ho hum, politics as usual.  No matter how loudly professional victims screech, the rest of the world just ignores them. 

Actions speak louder than words.  Any documentation of gays & blacks leaving Florida en masse?   No, of course not, because these warnings are all just empty rhetoric.

It's a travel warning not an evacuation order.  Reading comprehension is a thing 😉.

[+ Vegas_Millennial]

On 9/4/2023 at 8:50 AM, EZEtoGRU said:

OK folks.  Let's get back on topic:  LGBT people feeling compelled to move to a different state.  

Back in 2003, I was compelled to leave the state of California to Nevada.  In about four years, I will leave the state of Nevada and am considering Florida or Tennessee.

As a Gay man, then somewhat libertarian Nevada at the turn of the century suited me and my job prospects well.  Now there are more and more regulations and taxes in Nevada, so I'm looking to move to Florida or Tennessee.  I currently enjoy spending my holidays in both of those sates.