carnalvore

I would agree with many of the sentiments that have been expressed:

- Remember that these guys are there to earn money. If they say yes to you in the bar, all that means is that they will go to your space - no guarantee of the quality of the interaction. Be discreet but also communicate clearly what you want and hope for.  They’ll probably tell you how much it’s going to cost.
- I’ve played the “massage” game plenty of times and sometimes I hit and sometimes I just get a suck massage. I’ve learned that I need to be honest with myself about how randy I want to get and whether I think this dancer is up for the play scenario that I envision. Again, money is key. There are very rare occasions (I luckily experienced one such occasion this weekend in Puerto Vallarta) where the dancer is genuinely also wanting to play and so it’s not about the money. It’s about the connection.  So be honest with yourself and your expectations.
- If you are in the least bit hesitant about your safety/security with a dancer, trust your gut. If you’re feeling sus, the dancer - if they’re good at their game - will sense that and your vibe will be ruined, regardless of whether you’re in the bar or in your own hotel room.  That being said, I would say the majority of the dancers at Johnsons FTL are going to be up front about whether they’ll meet you outside of the bar or not.  I’ve seen dancers tell one client one thing, and another client something different.  Remember, they have to trust their gut too about their own safety/security with a client.   
Good luck @billyinsf on enjoying yourself with the man of your desires!! We look forward to hearing how it goes for you!

Would you call a restaurant with a dress code unprofessional? You only see this as unprofessional because you're miffed you aren't being let in to the restaurant, not because the practice is actually unprofessional. We aren't owed service, even in this industry, and businesses have the right to refuse service to whomever. Just go to a different restaurant without a dress code. The ones that have been around longer than 18-24 years usually don't have one.

Ditto
this was such a predictable response 
congratulations, you are now the third person I’ve blocked.  Unfortunately, I think the other two were you by a different name. 

This was actually a pretty complicated question for me when I was setting up my profile, and it took a bit of trial and error to land where I ended up identifying: versatile/bottom.  
The truth of the matter is that I'm genuinely a case-by-case versatile guy.   I love both.  I do both as much as I can.   Left to my own devices, sexual position is determined by situation and chemistry, which means I usually end up topping.  But losing either from my life would be a genuine loss. 
The real complicating factor for me is that this isn't my full time job.  A very full week for me is four bookings.  So for me, I feel like it makes sense to be a bit more intentional in connecting with guys whose needs best align with my skill sets, more so perhaps than guys who are seeing clients daily.  And one of my favorite things - I might even say a skill of mine - is the versatile flip session.  Come to find out, there's a real population who thrives on that.  Similarly there's a population who leans one way or the other and wants to explore the other side too.  I still love a strict top and and a strict bottom always!  But it would be a big personal loss - not to mention a waste of some skills - for me to miss out on those vers flip guys.
Well, come to find out, the hiring population is so heavily slanted towards bottoms... (is this shocking news?) ... that listing as versatile is still the functional equivalent of listing as a top.  Meanwhile guys who are actually versatile or tops don't seem to find you without the word "bottom" in your profile.
Long story short,  I've settled into a somewhat inaccurate identifier as a way to navigate the reality of the landscape as it is.  And even with that, I'm still definitely topping more than I'm bottoming.  
Suffice to say, consider when you're looking at providers that their chosen position identifier might involve more nuance than you think.  Anything with the word "versatile" in it requires a conversation.  The broad demographic assumptions above are mostly true, but be careful applying those assumptions to individual providers!

"Bottom " means total bottom. 
"Vers/Bottom" means total bottom. 
"Vers" means total bottom. 
"Vers/Top" means total bottom who doesn't want to always go through the effort of cleaning out.
"Top" means top...unless the other person has a bigger dick and then he becomes a bottom.

And yet your first action after joining here is to leave a negative review? Welcome

I have an active thread on same day appointments, but my last response explains why it is not always productive: but it doesn’t mean I’m “upset” about it. However, some people ALWAYS expect a same day booking. Sometimes it’s the same ones as well. 
 
You’re coming from a place that is viewing the industry “like a Grindr profile”. It isn’t nor was it ever. Even when I first started around 2008, most all my best bookings were requested a day or 2 or longer ahead. I used to often run out for same day appointments, because I didn’t know better. I also used to accept guys asking for discounts, for same day appointments at that. Nowadays, I would never. It’s extra, not less. But having an attitude like, “sometimes I am, sometimes I’m not” isn’t going to put any value on it.
 
As for for deposits for incalls: being that I have to spend extra money to host sessions, typically in a hotel set up (I stopped offering bookings from home couple years ago) I do need a deposit for that. If they don’t show, I’m out of the money for it. 
 
Many people outside the industry think, “just do outcalls”. But they don’t understand that a large percentage of clients aren’t going to book a room solely for the purpose of a session. I just spent some time up north, and I had to host 4 clients, reserving accommodations each time. Many of them would rather send me a deposit (one even dropped the deposit off to me in cash…) than to book a hotel room for our time. 
 
It’s not over complicating by any means, it’s just years of experience has showed me what works, and what is stupid and foolish as all fuck. And couple years ago I booked a Sheraton Hotel for 2 different clients, SAME DAY NOTICE without a deposit: THEY BOTH flaked out on the same day. One even mocked me, saying: “I didn’t tell you to book a hotel room”. He tried to rebook for an outcall later on and flaked again, I was like…you can send the cancellation fee or I’ll come and get it personally myself 😆 
 
Way too many idiots and time-wasters ESPECIALLY in the Midwest, but they’re everywhere. I won’t go back to working without a deposit whether it’s host/travel or a combination of the 2.

I sense you haven’t been on here long? 🫣
I agree with you on flaky clients. Many of the dilettante types are just getting off on the enquiry. Honestly the number of ‘hey are you free today / tomorrow etc’ to whom I respond but who then simply go quiet is astounding. What do they do?… Get bored? Lose their phone? Forget they asked?. Why ask me, get a reply and then ignore it? I’ll never understand that. Or the ones that message with ‘hey’ and then silence….what’s that about? Trying to see if I’m real? 
Same day requests are annoying if I can’t do them because it feels like income foregone but I’d rather they ask me because sometimes it works. This is a service business, you do need to be a bit flexible to clients requirements, within what’s reasonable for you. If you want the predictability of a 9 to 5 job….go and do a 9 to 5 job. I certainly wouldn’t do that! I love the variety of the job. 
I don’t see many scams, it’s mostly impossibly pretty females sending me direct messages on X. If only they looked at my X they’d see its full of gay porn. They’d get more chance of me falling for it if they send me some hot topless guy asking about a collab. That I’d probably reply to 😂

 

 

Reminiscent of price is right, I wanted to make a similar question posed by @Rudynate
 

 
But I feel this way about the industry at times. Namely the few things that really get to me are:
1) Same day appointments: I understand being horny and sometimes it can be helpful. But majority of the time, same day appointments do not work. How can 2 men who don’t know nothing about each others schedule, location or availability get in the same room? I understand if it’s a regular who is accustomed to each other’s time schedule, but so many new clients try to book a same day visits. I usually have to wrap up plans to attend.
Ironically, those same clients are rarely ever available same day themselves…when I initiate it. So it’s usually better to not do them at all.
 
2) Hotels: I just spent over $200 in the last couple days on a hotel…and although the money was set aside for it already, I haven’t quite earned it back. People often ask me to host, but the days I set aside to host, people don’t always show up. 
 
3) Dismissive/annoying men: similar to the same day request brigade, it almost seems every other day/week…there’s some prick waiting to push a button. If you’re strong willed and use templates/auto reply on rentmen messenger etc, it’s a bit easier. But overall, I hate how some random can find their way onto my phone and act like a total ass: and kill my vibe. And it’s not always Timewasters either. Sometimes it’s clients too. Check yourself and make sure your tone isn’t cock, condescending or belittling towards escorts. 
 
4) Dead Cities/States: I’ve seen many cities that used to be good 10-15 years ago, now aren’t hitting much. Having RentMen as a main male escort site is not conducive. And it’s so many guys per city advertising. Some cities, I’m hardly even getting hits from RentMen at all. Even the cities with less ads aren’t always guaranteed to be busy, and like I said in #2: a DECENT non-motel 6 hotel in many areas are $100 a night minimum. I can’t wait around for 3-4 days paying that amount with nothing confirmed. And that’s why I ask for…
5) Deposits: I rarely book without them. Some clients expect us to magically pull money out of thin air (aka our own accounts/pockets) for lodging, hotels, commute, and all that’s involved: with no money upfront. That’s unfair and just not sensible in my view. It’s one thing if a guy is just like “come over to my studio/home”, but even when I used to offer that 24/7, a good portion still wouldn’t show up as anticipated. 
 
6) Hookup apps: I feel they continue to ruin the industry. I don’t feel they compete with clients, but it’s created a culture where people are expecting bare minimum. People are willing to hook up for free and with no phone number, it’s become super trashy 🚮, and it’s unsafe. If someone harms you on a hookup app and you have no phone number, good luck being found. The fact people are doing this, is reckless at best. 
 
All that said, is it worth it? I’d say it can be…but some days it doesn’t always feel like it. 
 

Hi JB_Studio38/ Mocha/Jarrod_uncut (and all the other names you have had on this platform in the past- there have been many)
No. I, and my fellow client colleagues,  are not willing to be "on call" with money for you when escorting is not working out financially for you. Although I do NOT wish you or any other escort financial harm, we are not responsible for your solvency.  But to you and all escorts in the world: I'm hopeful you prosper.  You provide a wonderful service to the community.  
 
Ah, you are not satisfied with my advice? Allow me to elaborate.  You and I are both business men. Similar fields, albeit with a few differences. I'm a physician.  You are an escort.   We are both seek to ...heal our clients (or patients). As a physician I have high overhead costs in maintaining my office: support staff salaries, my office rent, my exorbitant malpractice premiums, to name a few, costs which rise yearly which is alarming & frustrating.  And just like you, before I take home one dollar, ALL my overhead MUST be paid first. Heck, I was hundreds of thousands of dollars in medical school debt before I even got paid to see my first patient! Yes, I genuinely understand your predicament.  I live it daily.  But when a business informs the client this is my fee, BUT then says, "oh, I also need a deposit", um, yah, no. Or the escort says, "Oh, I need you to pay my Uber". Also a big Nope. See, all of my overhead AND my own salary AND (this is the critical point I fear you dont understand) the cost of the lost revenue is wrapped up in the fee I charge for that office visit.  You think patients call, make an appointment to see me and don't show up? It happens DAILY. Every physician has no-shows. You think patients get a bill (after I provide them medical services) from me and always send a payment? Nope. I get patients who stiff me ALL.THE.TIME.  But that loss is factored IN to my fees.  That's Business.  I don't charge multiple fees.   I have protocols that attempt to minimize loss. For example:  two no-shows and my staff informs the patient they are discharged from the practice.  You think you are the only businessman who takes risks and experiences financial loss?  Think again.   I don't come to this platform and bitch & whine & come across as a lunatic because my patients stiff me.    Rather, I focus on my wonderful patients who stay, pay, and make it all worth while.
To all escorts: keep providing your excellent services. Stay professional.  Continue to hone your craft. Keep detailed reports of what's not working. For what's not working focus on strategies to minimize loss and maximize profit. You are an escort to make MONEY - there is nothing wrong with that! So am I.  But demanding fees (deposits or Ubers) will ultimately turn away good clients & make you seem unprofessional.   Good clients (like me) stay away from escorts like that. Including staying away from JB_Studio38/ Mocha/Jarrod_uncut. Asking for a fee makes you look sketchy.  Its a bad look. 
Love to all,
Josh
 
 

By the same token, if you've seen them before, they shouldn't be still requiring a deposit. It would reek of desperation or maybe a drug problem if they need cash that desperately. 

Right because, one can’t use an example of 1 person to tar the entire industry’s need for deposits. And as I’ve said before, on our side: things aren’t any different. We can spend $500 on hotels/travel multiple times throughout our “career” and not make it back. I just spent over $250 in a city I went where there was nothing but freebie seekers hitting me up. I could have hooked up with 3-4 guys but, non of them wanted to pay. 
 
Non of my regular clients were anywhere to be found, and only 1 new client ended up booking during the 2 days I stayed. Normally I would never do that, but because I was traveling long distance between areas, and knew people: I didn’t mind taking the risk. But normally I would never go on any trips without deposits. And now for “the popular opinion”: 

 
followed by:

 
I think the above ⬆️ ⬆️ could find its way here one day. But maybe on Saturn 🪐 
 

Providers: clients who won't send a deposit aren't serious and time wasters
Clients: providers who ask for deposits are likely scamming and not serious about their profession. 
Oh, what a tangled web we weave. I guess we'll both have to decide if we're desperate enough to break the cardinal rule of our 'side'.
I know I'm not. Maybe it's because I'm pretty open to conversation and showing I'm "real," or maybe because Im clear that I pay cash only, but I've never been asked for a deposit or that would be the end of the conversation. 

As much as Bozo sympathizes with the OP's tale of woe, it must bear repeating... NEVER, repeat, NEVER, repeat, NEVER give a deposit up front. There are enough stories of escorts and masseurs that scam, ghost, don't show up, and then block the client. How many times do you have to read or hear about all of the warnings?
There comes a time when we have to take responsibility for our actions. And Bozo is glad to see that the OP took accountability for his mistake.
Sending a deposit bears a risk. If you choose to ignore the risks, and still go ahead and send money in advance, don't complain that you got ripped off. It's akin to a cigarette smoker lamenting that he/she was diagnosed with cancer. 
Anytime a provider asks for money in advance, click your heels together and repeat three times, "No thanks, No thanks, No thanks...." And then move on to another provider in your area.
Caveat emptor.
BTC
🤡

Wow, I am minor league.

Wow, I am minor league.

Wow, I am minor league.

I've had 4 and 6 hands. It only really works if the guys have some kind of coordination or even choreography in who has their hands on you and where. Otherwise i can only imagine it'd be a messy massage experience. So i would echo the sentiment to specifically look for providers who specialize in it and have partners they work with regularly, if you're going to try it.

There are plenty of escorts between 35 - 50 years old currently advertising on Rentmen...
They just don't admit to it!
BTC
🤡

If the provider wants money up front never a tip.
If it's a legit massage with a professional i usually tip around $20 since they have to pay rent for the studio and do their own towels, etc, just like the person who cuts my hair.
Escorts I use to tip more regularly pre covid.    But since a lot of their rates have gone up big time, I usually don't now unless their rates are reasonable or they go over.    
I set my own rates as a professional and my bill rate is only $275 an hour and I claim the income and have people to pay and rent and overhead and we don't expect a tip.   We adjust our bill rates appropriately   

he is real and is very good.

I personally don't care about rates as a client. I am more focused on the interaction. Not that I am made of money but my thought process is the connection versus $$$. If one has to haggle about price or is too concerned about it, perhaps other forms of connection should be pursued. I respect and appreciate providers that are willing to provide me with what I need.  Just my perspective.

@azdr0710, absolutely correct!
There haven't been a lot of reviews of Lukas, either here, on the "Victor" thread, or on Rentmen. However, those clients who have actually spent time him have posted positive comments about their encounters.
It is very unfair for @Dataguy to post those comments without providing some detail. It is even more unfair given that Lukas aka @VictorMuscle28 is a member of this forum, and and should be provided with an opportunity to refute @Dataguy, whose opinion is clearly an outlier.
BTC
🤡

@marylander1940, you just need to stop being a shameless apologist for escorts. 

It means that Latinos and Blacks don't always like each other. Not limited to Chicago.
EDIT: And if you want to argue that, please do so in a different thread, because here's not the place.