HPV transmissability - celibacy awaits?!

[Moox]

Hello friends. Last week I had a tiny lesion on the penile skin frozen off. The nurse says it was a wart (though I am wondering if it was a skin tag, I have a tendency for those and they appear in warm areas). I asked her when I can be sexually active again and she said as soon as the wart is gone. But I go to lots of parties and condoms are not that effective against it, I don't think. I am aware that a fair few men at the parties are in other relationships, with all genders. The odd one or two are married to females and not out at all in daily life. I hate the thought of passing it on and wrecking a relationship. How long do I have to wait? Or is that it, game over? The thought of that depresses me greatly. Life is a bit rough and the occasional, once a month or so, partying is the only thing I look forward to.

 

Any advice would gratefully received.

[+ FrankR]

5 minutes ago, Moox said:

Hello friends. Last week I had a tiny lesion on the penile skin frozen off. The nurse says it was a wart (though I am wondering if it was a skin tag, I have a tendency for those and they appear in warm areas). I asked her when I can be sexually active again and she said as soon as the wart is gone. But I go to lots of parties and condoms are not that effective against it, I don't think. I am aware that a fair few men at the parties are in other relationships, with all genders. The odd one or two are married to females and not out at all in daily life. I hate the thought of passing it on and wrecking a relationship. How long do I have to wait? Or is that it, game over? The thought of that depresses me greatly. Life is a bit rough and the occasional, once a month or so, partying is the only thing I look forward to.

 

Any advice would gratefully received.

This seems like the kind of question you want to ask of a medical professional. Most health insurance plans offer a phone line you can call with this type of question - you dont have to go see a doctor. On internet forums you will find lots of opinions, but they are worth what you paid for them.  

[Moox]

Ah I should have added, I am in the UK, apologies. Clinic will not book me back in as they say the treatment has been performed. 

[+ BenjaminNicholas]

For anyone reading this who's not the op, get the HPV vax.  Avoid these issues.

OP: A ton of info about HPV is available online.  Read up on this yourself.  It's not difficult.

Take responsibility for your health and protect others when you're dealing with an outbreak.

[+ Vegas_Millennial]

12 hours ago, Moox said:

Ah I should have added, I am in the UK, apologies. Clinic will not book me back in as they say the treatment has been performed. 

That is good information for us in other countries to bear in mind: a single-payer system has its drawbacks.  In this case, it's the lack of availability for personalized doctor consultation regarding safer sex and preventing the spread of disease.

Edited April 24 by Vegas_Millennial
Incorrect use of "it's" and "its"

[mike carey]

3 hours ago, Vegas_Millennial said:

That's good information for us in other countries to bear in mind, that single-payer systems have it's drawbacks.  In this case, its the lack of availability for personalized doctor consultation regarding safer sex and preventing the spread of disease.

It may not be as clear-cut as that. A consultation for a specific condition is different to one for sexual health advice, although ideally they would be with the same primary care provider. In Canberra, there is a sexual health clinic that offers advice, testing, vaccinations and related prescriptions. It's run by the territory department of health and is free at the point of service delivery. My last appointment they offered advice on mpox and HPV vaccination (the latter would be at a cost to me) and PrEP on demand.

Now, back to the topic of the thread.

[+ nycman]

12 hours ago, Moox said:

Ah I should have added, I am in the UK, apologies. Clinic will not book me back in as they say the treatment has been performed. 

Viva socialized medicine!

You get what you pay for. A "nurse" tells you, "you have a wart on your dick".

Sure, it was free, but was it good "healthcare"?

Even the worst free clinic in America provides better care than this. 

And yes, even the UK has places where you can pay to get good healthcare….so pay. 

 

 

[+ APPLE1]

What the nurse didn't say, is likely more important than what she did say. She DID NOT say "as soon as the wart is gone, you can't spread HPV to others."

Like many surface contact viruses, you're contagious until your body is rid of the virus(es) . While it varies greatly by the specific strain(s) of HPV virus(es) you have. The clinic likely didn't test to determine which strain(s) you have. They took, and you should take, some comfort in the fact that the strain(s) produced warts.  Most, of the strains that cause warts, don't cause cancers.

In general, 2-3 years of abstinence, and most immune systems clear the HPV viruses from the body. At that point, you'd likely have little worry of exposing others to HPV, at least until you come in contact again with someone else who has a virus (notice I DID NOT say, someone else who has warts).

If it's possible for you, I will certainly echo what others said: get the vaccination! Besides abstinence, it the best way to protect yourself, and certainly the only way that allows you to go forward with confidence thst your likely aren't spreading HPV to others.

[+ Tygerscent]

Human papillomavirus and cancer

WWW.WHO.INT

---

WHO fact sheet on human papilloma virus and cancer, including overview, scope of the problem, symptoms, treatment, prevention...

STD Facts - Human papillomavirus (HPV)

WWW.CDC.GOV

---

HPV - What is genital HPV infection? How common is it? How does HPV cause genital warts and cancer?

These have relatively current and decent information~    
 One thing to be aware of is that most adults over age 26 have already been exposed to one or several variations of HPV and may be exposed to more through their lifetime. The vaccines cover you for several types but, not all. Even after being vaccinated, you may be exposed to different variations of human papilloma virus. Sometimes venereal warts will exhibit with small white bumps but, they can also be very, very small and almost un noticeable. The virus tends to favor tender, moist, warm tissues and may be most noticeable around the rim of the glands penis or the tissue of the anus but, it can occur in other places too. 
 My understanding is that if you are an adult, the vaccinations are more for cancer preventative~ Personally, I got mine years ago for the cancer prevention benefits but, also for the added benefits of avoiding venereal warts. You can go online, do a basic search and then click on “images” to see what various forms they take. Human papilloma, virus warts take on many different shapes and sizes. They can sometimes be preceded by itching~

[Moox]

8 hours ago, APPLE1 said:

What the nurse didn't say, is likely more important than what she did say. She DID NOT say "as soon as the wart is gone, you can't spread HPV to others."

Like many surface contact viruses, you're contagious until your body is rid of the virus(es) . While it varies greatly by the specific strain(s) of HPV virus(es) you have. The clinic likely didn't test to determine which strain(s) you have. They took, and you should take, some comfort in the fact that the strain(s) produced warts.  Most, of the strains that cause warts, don't cause cancers.

In general, 2-3 years of abstinence, and most immune systems clear the HPV viruses from the body. At that point, you'd likely have little worry of exposing others to HPV, at least until you come in contact again with someone else who has a virus (notice I DID NOT say, someone else who has warts).

If it's possible for you, I will certainly echo what others said: get the vaccination! Besides abstinence, it the best way to protect yourself, and certainly the only way that allows you to go forward with confidence thst your likely aren't spreading HPV to others.

She said exactly that. I asked when I can be active again, as I don't want to transmit. "As soon as it's gone, you'll be fine."

I asked for vaccination but I am outside the age range for which it is given.

As for do some research, that is the problem. It is all so conflicting. Yesterday I read both that 2.9% of men will contract HPV causing genital warts AND that the vast majority of people who are sexually active will get a form of it. Some sites say it is highly contagious, others that only 10% are contagious.

 

2-3 years?? Crikey. I am still not entirely convinced it was one, is it worth paying for a private HPV test?

[+ Vegas_Millennial]

7 hours ago, Moox said:

I asked for vaccination but I am outside the age range for which it is given.

Are you able to pay out of pocket for the vaccine?  Sometimes vaccines or medicine can be made available to everyone, but insurance or the government will only pay to administer it to a subset of the popular most at risk.  Also, look into clinics that target sex workers and their clients, and be frank and tell them you have sex with lots of different people and ask if that qualifies you for a higher risk group which can get the vaccine.

[SirBillybob]

I think that the chance of free HPV vaccination access in UK is slim to none if you are age 46 or older. If not immunosuppressed you would receive the two-dose Gardasil-9 vaccination according to national guidelines. However, each dose costs about 182 pounds and the second dose is administered 6 to 24 months later, so after ponying up the initial charge you have ample time (up to 2 years) to save up for the second dose if money is scarce.

In fact, do ensure that you don’t receive the second dose before at least 6 months has elapsed because getting the second dose too early (example 5 months later) apparently negates the legitimacy of the first dose, then relegating the second dose to prime dose status such that you could end up paying for three doses because a third dose would be considered the boost dose. Immunocompromised adults receive three doses by the 6-month point and I imagine less experienced surgeries may mess up the regimen by providing your second dose too soon compared to those that are immunosuppressed. 

In the UK some eligible subgroups are considered adequately vaccinated with a single dose. If this determination extends eventually, sooner than later, to immunocompetent gay/bi men age 25-45 that have sex with men, then men age 46 and older can probably extend this cost-sparing guidance to their own regimen because vaccination of older age groups is off-label and generally follows the closest logical adjacent recommendations. 

Edited April 24 by SirBillybob

[Monarchy79]

On 4/23/2024 at 9:39 AM, Moox said:

Hello friends. Last week I had a tiny lesion on the penile skin frozen off. The nurse says it was a wart (though I am wondering if it was a skin tag, I have a tendency for those and they appear in warm areas). I asked her when I can be sexually active again and she said as soon as the wart is gone. But I go to lots of parties and condoms are not that effective against it, I don't think. I am aware that a fair few men at the parties are in other relationships, with all genders. The odd one or two are married to females and not out at all in daily life. I hate the thought of passing it on and wrecking a relationship. How long do I have to wait? Or is that it, game over? The thought of that depresses me greatly. Life is a bit rough and the occasional, once a month or so, partying is the only thing I look forward to.

 

Any advice would gratefully received.

Are you vaccinated for HPV? If not, you should. 
 

and add to that:

1.) Meningitis, 

2.) Pneumonia

3.) Monkeypox (if you haven’t already, just in case) 

3.) PrEP

and have some doxycycline available too.

 

since you’re very social, might as well be protected…. And condoms don’t hurt either .

#endcondomshaming

 

[+ APPLE1]

Seems like between yourself, and the response here, you have all the pertinent answers.

1) Knowing the HPV strain you have likely doesn't help with your health or with determining any abstinence period you choose. So why waste the time and money.

2) After you clear HPV, with no vaccination, you're at the same level of health risk for reinfection.

3) Choosing the local clinic that specializes in sexuality transmitted infections is always your best bet for knowledge, off-label treatment, and acceptance of any patient's desire to pursue added care or testing. Even in a in a third party payment system, not every provider is willing to pursue issues like a specialty clinic may.

4) At least find out the fee from your local specialty clinic. If it's unaffordable, I would reach out to THT. They may have a lower cost clinic, a subsidy program, or at the very least, a list of providers who do it off-label.

https://www.tht.org.uk/

 

Edited April 25 by APPLE1
Clarity

[Moox]

Thanks all, it is frustrating that trying to do the right thing gets nowhere with strict NHS/NICE guidelines. The 45 age limit is arbitrary - and the increase in STDs in 40-70yr olds in the UK shows it is also wrongly assuming that people in this age group are not very active. Added to that, people in our age group will not have had it as routine at school.

Looks like I had better start saving to get it privately...And get used to 2 years celibacy. 😞

Thanks all for your help and comments.

[+ sniper]

When they say condoms aren't that effective against HPV, they mean you can get warts in places the condom doesn't cover. If your wart was on an area that a condom would cover, it absolutely will help and you are negligent not to be using one.

[Moox]

On 4/28/2024 at 12:40 AM, sniper said:

When they say condoms aren't that effective against HPV, they mean you can get warts in places the condom doesn't cover. If your wart was on an area that a condom would cover, it absolutely will help and you are negligent not to be using one.

Of course I do!

[Moox]

Had a call off the clinic, same old. Outside the age range, we can't vaccinate. The NHS can be a joke. If someone asks for PrEP and explain they get it, despite it being more expensive.

[SirBillybob]

3 hours ago, Moox said:

Had a call off the clinic, same old. Outside the age range, we can't vaccinate. The NHS can be a joke. If someone asks for PrEP and explain they get it, despite it being more expensive.

Disappointing. Yes it does appear after all that UK is stricter in its off-label licensing flexibility. In Canada, there is provision for risk that is equivalent to that of GBMSM under age 46, and that equivalency applies to any man’s age. In Quebec, if not nationwide, male seniors can book Gardasil9 online with a pharmacy and pharmacists are authorized to administer without a physician’s prescription; of course paying out of pocket.

In UK it appears that risk equivalency assessment is discretionary for certain subgroups, eg sex workers, but still capped at age 45. At first glance, the guidance language seems more flexible because it stratifies according to NHS covered cost. I thought the implication was age leeway for those willing to pay.

That said, I am not entirely convinced that nobody older has accessed it and all I can recommend is to investigate MSM-user-friendly sexual health programs (I remain unclear as to the status of the clinic you refer to) to discover how much legal professional liability a clinician undertakes for providing vaccination that is deemed harmless for older age cohorts but simply less impactful on HPV population incidence. 

WHO has not taken a stance on HPV vaccination for older folks. This may be partly due to emphasis on capturing young groups worldwide and ensuring adequate supply when there have been, in fact, shortages historically. 

Edited 13 hours ago by SirBillybob

[+ BenjaminNicholas]

But can you simply pay for the vax out of pocket?

Sure, it's a cost, but perhaps a smart one to shoulder, even out of the age range.