How do you overcome an addiction to sex?

Rudynate · March 9, 2023

21 minutes ago, DERRIK said:

from step one - "powerless and unmanageable"

does one do an activitiy that make his life powerless and unmanageable?

if I drink and wreck my car several times - get arrested several times - injure others - is my life unmanageable

if I look at porn at night - stay up late - oversleep next morning - late for work repeatedly --powerless and unmanageable?

if I buy lottery tickets every day and fail to pay my rent cause I am broke -- powerless and unmanageable?

if I smoke pot and end up failing to go to work repeatedly -- powerless and unmanageable

most men can drink, porn, whore, bet, smoke and NOT make their lives powerless and unmanageable

And there are those who can't. They are powerless, to one degree or another, over one of those behaviors you mentioned, and therefore, their lives have become unmanageable, to one degree or another.

Danny-Darko · March 9, 2023

I came across this article over a year ago and saved the link. Some may agree with it and others may not. Food for thought none the less.

"Why We Need To Stop Calling It Porn Addiction"
10 reasons why making people believe they are addicted to porn is actually much more dangerous than watching a lot of porn.

Link below:

Lustery POV - Why We Need To Stop Calling It Porn Addiction

keefer · March 9, 2023

3 hours ago, DERRIK said:

most men can drink, porn, whore, bet, smoke

Good summary of my planned hobbies when I retire in 2024

March 9, 2023

4 hours ago, Rudynate said:

I'm persnickety about the use of the term "addiction." I think "addiction" should be reserved for situations involving substances. Situations that are purely behavioral, to me, are compulsions.

You're free to start your own language, but, as noted previously: "Addiction is repeated involvement with a substance or activity, despite the substantial harm it now causes, because that involvement was (and may continue to be) pleasurable and/or valuable." Realistically speaking, watching porn cannot constitute an addiction because it cannot cause "substantial harm," unless the harm comes from the partner objecting to it, which is really the partner's problem regarding an activity which does not imply unfaithfulness. Hiring escorts might cause substantial harm (financial, health, romantic), so that could result in true addiction. Other activities, such as gambling, can also lead to substantial harm, and also constitute addiction. Yes, the behavior is compulsive, but it's more than merely compulsive if it results in substantial harm.

March 9, 2023

44 minutes ago, keefer said:

"most men can drink, porn, whore, bet, smoke"

Good summary of my planned hobbies when I retire in 2024

I wish there were a way to post both clapping and laughing emojis for the same post.

Rudynate · March 9, 2023

3 hours ago, Unicorn said:

You're free to start your own language, but, as noted previously: "Addiction is repeated involvement with a substance or activity, despite the substantial harm it now causes, because that involvement was (and may continue to be) pleasurable and/or valuable." Realistically speaking, watching porn cannot constitute an addiction because it cannot cause "substantial harm," unless the harm comes from the partner objecting to it, which is really the partner's problem regarding an activity which does not imply unfaithfulness. Hiring escorts might cause substantial harm (financial, health, romantic), so that could result in true addiction. Other activities, such as gambling, can also lead to substantial harm, and also constitute addiction. Yes, the behavior is compulsive, but it's more than merely compulsive if it results in substantial harm.

I actually didin't invent mine - it is from the early 20th century.

Yours is from MentalHelp.net - it doesn't purport to have a scientific basis, but I would still consider it a persuasive although not a prescriptive source.

The DSM - far more persuasive - defines addiction as a "substance use disorder." So you see, I didn't invent anything.

My definition of addiction came from the AA Big Book - "a mental obsession coupled with a physical compulsion."

Edited March 9, 2023 by Rudynate
typo

Rudynate · March 9, 2023

3 hours ago, Unicorn said:

You're free to start your own language, but, as noted previously: "Addiction is repeated involvement with a substance or activity, despite the substantial harm it now causes, because that involvement was (and may continue to be) pleasurable and/or valuable." Realistically speaking, watching porn cannot constitute an addiction because it cannot cause "substantial harm," unless the harm comes from the partner objecting to it, which is really the partner's problem regarding an activity which does not imply unfaithfulness. Hiring escorts might cause substantial harm (financial, health, romantic), so that could result in true addiction. Other activities, such as gambling, can also lead to substantial harm, and also constitute addiction. Yes, the behavior is compulsive, but it's more than merely compulsive if it results in substantial harm.

You have a narrow a view of "harm." Many incels started the road to becoming an incel by watching lots of porn. Some guys become so warped that watching porn and beating off is the only way they can orgasm. In a practical sense they are incapable of having sex with a live person. I would say being incapable of having sex with your partner constitutes harm - they could lose the relationship, or seriously damage it. I could imagine a techie working from home who gets so compulsive about porn that he loses his job. That's not harm?

March 10, 2023

2 hours ago, Rudynate said:

You have a narrow a view of "harm." Many incels started the road to becoming an incel by watching lots of porn. Some guys become so warped that watching porn and beating off is the only way they can orgasm. In a practical sense they are incapable of having sex with a live person. I would say being incapable of having sex with your partner constitutes harm - they could lose the relationship, or seriously damage it. I could imagine a techie working from home who gets so compulsive about porn that he loses his job. That's not harm?

Who said that I said losing a job isn't substantial harm? Obviously, losing a job would constitute substantial harm. I'd estimate that it's pretty unusual, however, for someone to be so obsessed with porn that he loses his job or his ability to have sex. True porn addiction is probably possible, but the term is overused to describe those who just enjoy it a lot.

Rudynate · March 10, 2023

2 hours ago, Unicorn said:

Who said that I said losing a job isn't substantial harm? Obviously, losing a job would constitute substantial harm. I'd estimate that it's pretty unusual, however, for someone to be so obsessed with porn that he loses his job or his ability to have sex. True porn addiction is probably possible, but the term is overused to describe those who just enjoy it a lot.

"watching porn cannot constitute an addiction because it cannot cause "substantial harm," unless the harm comes from the partner objecting to it, which is really the partner's problem regarding an activity which does not imply unfaithfulness."

your words, not mine

March 10, 2023

4 minutes ago, Rudynate said:

"watching porn cannot constitute an addiction because it cannot cause "substantial harm," unless the harm comes from the partner objecting to it, which is really the partner's problem regarding an activity which does not imply unfaithfulness."

your words, not mine

Touche. That being said, have you ever heard of someone watching so much porn that he couldn't do his work? (I'm not talking about someone who gets fired for watching porn on company computers/time, which is a separate issue) Hard to imagine. I've also never heard of someone who literally couldn't have sex with a human because he watches so much porn. Again, men have refractory periods and cannot realistically watch porn to the exclusion of all other activities. So, similar to what I said in a prior post. I don't believe there are people who watch so much porn that they can't bathe or eat. I also really don't believe anyone can watch so much porn that he can't hold down a job or have sex with people. Presumably, sex is more pleasurable than porn. The reason I enjoy porn is that it's less expensive. less risky, and more convenient than actually having sex with those people. So, you're right. I should have said "...because it cannot reasonably cause...".

Rudynate · March 10, 2023

1 minute ago, Unicorn said:

Touche. That being said, have you ever heard of someone watching so much porn that he couldn't do his work? (I'm not talking about someone who gets fired for watching porn on company computers/time, which is a separate issue) Hard to imagine. I've also never heard of someone who literally couldn't have sex with a human because he watches so much porn. Again, men have refractory periods and cannot realistically watch porn to the exclusion of all other activities. So, similar to what I said in a prior post. I don't believe there are people who watch so much porn that they can't bathe or eat. I also really don't believe anyone can watch so much porn that he can't hold down a job or have sex with people. Presumably, sex is more pleasurable than porn. The reason I enjoy porn is that it's less expensive. less risky, and more convenient than actually having sex with those people. So, you're right. I should have said "...because it cannot reasonably cause...".

Let me say here, that I don't believe there is such a thing as being addicted to porn. As I pointed out above, when a problem is strictly behavioral, it is a compulsion not an addiction. I have had hookups with guys that I thought might be compulsive about porn. You go over to their place and they can't pull their eyes away from the display on their laptop for longer than a brief look at their partner. Nobody that I know well is compulsive about porn. I enjoy watching porn myself, and it is pure enjoyment for me - no compulsiveness at all.

I'm willing to be convinced that porn "addiction" is largely an internet phenomenon, since the internet is where it generally is discussed. If it exists, I don't think that porn is the problem. The problem lies with the people who can't seem to moderate their behavior - but that is the nature of compulsion.

March 10, 2023

15 minutes ago, Rudynate said:

Let me say here, that I don't believe there is such a thing as being addicted to porn. As I pointed out above, when a problem is strictly behavioral, it is a compulsion not an addiction. I have had hookups with guys that I thought might be compulsive about porn. You go over to their place and they can't pull their eyes away from the display on their laptop for longer than a brief look at their partner. Nobody that I know well is compulsive about porn. I enjoy watching porn myself, and it is pure enjoyment for me - no compulsiveness at all.

I'm willing to be convinced that porn "addiction" is largely an internet phenomenon, since the internet is where it generally is discussed. If it exists, I don't think that porn is the problem. The problem lies with the people who can't seem to moderate their behavior - but that is the nature of compulsion.

I do agree with you that people who spend a lot of time watching porn have an obsession, not an addiction. Where I disagree with you is why. Most professional associations would say that a behavior can become an addiction, because it can lead to substantial harm, which I don't reasonably see as possible with porn. Gambling is the prototypic example of a behavioral addiction, because it has led many to financial ruin. When sexual behaviors involve real people, they can also lead to substantial harm, like those creeps Weinstein and Cosby, and worse yet that asshole who was taking girls and women to some private island (I don't even want to remember his name).

Rudynate · March 10, 2023

22 hours ago, Danny-Darko said:

I came across this article over a year ago and saved the link. Some may agree with it and others may not. Food for thought none the less.

"Why We Need To Stop Calling It Porn Addiction"
10 reasons why making people believe they are addicted to porn is actually much more dangerous than watching a lot of porn.

Link below:

Lustery POV - Why We Need To Stop Calling It Porn Addiction

That is a great article - it identifies everything that is wrong with the idea of porn addiction and I love that the writer points out the general trivialization of the concept of addiction. Whenever I speak the word "addiction" it is because what I am talking about is substance abuse. Ever since it entered the language, I have hated that expression "positive addiction."

pubic_assistance · March 11, 2023

The difference between addiction and compulsion are often argued.

Marijuana is another example. Smoking weed constantly is more often an example of compulsive desire to be high than a chemical addiction to THC.

kingsley88 · March 11, 2023

I watched a youtube interview of Austin Wolf and he publicly stated he has an addition to sex.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AUINxz_PlwU&t=1s

pubic_assistance · March 11, 2023

54 minutes ago, kingsley88 said:

I watched a youtube interview of Austin Wolf and he publicly stated he has an addition to sex.

Yet he has managed two successive long-term relationships and he says there are "rules" and boundaries that he respects...so doesn't sound like an out of control addict.

Seems more like he's just got a strong sex drive and lots of opportunity to "scratch that itch".

March 12, 2023

8 hours ago, pubic_assistance said:

...Marijuana is another example. Smoking weed constantly is more often an example of compulsive desire to be high than a chemical addiction to THC.

I certainly agree with your last post. In the above post, I think you're confusing addiction with dependence. Dependence refers to having withdrawal symptoms or other such unpleasantness happen when you stop a substance. Although there is some correlation between dependence and addiction, of course, one can definitely be dependent on a substance without being addicted to it. The classic example one gets taught in lectures on the subject is the diabetic who's dependent on insulin.