Fat Gay Men Aren’t Welcomed (At Pride)

[+ Reisr30]

This is kind of an impossible article to respond to. When a woman says she was sexually assaulted, I believe the complaint should be taken seriously and investigated with due diligence. And, privately, I reserve the right to either believe her or not. And whatever I, or anyone else, believe, shouldn't impact on the seriousness of how the accusation is dealt with. Saying that, this is not my experience of Pride at all. And everyone has their own experience. And fat shaming can be awful, fat can get equated with gross and dirty.

 

Did the gay community emerge from the emotional bonding or men, or did it emerge from the sexual attraction? Either or both. Depending on who you are and what you're looking for. Is sexual appeal going to be on display at Pride? Yes.

 

I'm curious, when I read a piece like this, if this guy finds himself attractive and would date someone of his own characteristics. My impression, and yes this will be a generalization, is that men (gay and non-gay both) want to date someone a bit younger and in better shape than they are. I wonder if this guy is any different.

 

I'm 5'11" and 170, and always think I'm 5-10lbs overweight, which I know is a very "first world problem."

 

I'm 5'10" and 166 and also think I am a bit overweight which is nuts when I think about it. I think we all have our insecurities and I always wish I could be more self-assured. At the end of the day you need to be happy and comfortable with who you are which from personal experience is easier said than done...

[marylander1940]

"I’ve been contemplating skipping Pride for several years because I felt either invisible among the throngs or the center of the wrong type of attention."

 

We all know that Pride brings out every type of body yet he only mentions the young muscular guys. He's only looking for guys in much better shape and younger. Otherwise why would you even bitch about it and threaten to boycott it.

 

I've always believed in the saying if you can't beat em... Join em. So get your fat ass to the gym ya winy bitch. That or start doing Tina like it's going out of style.

 

You...

 

[JayCeeKy]

I'm sorry you feel isolated and humiliated at Pride events. You may find this book interesting: "Fat Gay Men: Girth, Mirth, and the Politics of Stigma."

 

"Therefore, with Pride Month upon us, it’s my belief that the road to accepting those groups that continue to be marginalized within the gay community—people of size as well as transgender folks, people with disabilities, and/or racial-ethnic minorities—must involve more than simply tolerating these groups. It requires all of us to embrace a wider range of diversity unremarkably, and without fuss. Fat activists put it best when they say, “We’re here, we’re sphere, get used to it!” -- Jason Whitesel, author of Fat Gay Men: Girth, Mirth, and the Politics of Stigma

 

[xyz48B]

The article, while true, is a little catty. I understand, but know there will always be some kind of discrimination as long as there are differences in the world, no matter what those differences are. It’s not okay and I don’t condone it but if it bothered the writer that much speak up right then and there. They had the gall to call you out you have every right to tell them to shut the f*** up. If they can dish it they better be ready to take it.

The issue is that many who are continually on the receiving end of being beaten down feel helpless to stick up for themselves. Instead of expecting the sidelined to wrangle their way in, perhaps we should consciously make the circle broader.

[xyz48B]

I find I am not attracted to me.

That is true for some. Opposites attract, they say.

[xyz48B]

Yes I agree If I see a beautiful woman or man and they come off as arrogant or mean they are no longer attractive to me.

It’s amazing just how ugly a hot guy can become when you realize they’re an asshole...

[xyz48B]

I've always believed in the saying if you can't beat em... Join em. So get your fat ass to the gym ya winy bitch. That or start doing Tina like it's going out of style.

Thanks...if I had a dollar for every time someone made other people’s myopic intolerance into my problem to fix by going to the gym, I could get six tummy tucks and ass implants…

 

The same logic could be applied to sexuality in general. Don’t like how the homophobic straight majority treats us? Put your gay dick in some pussy ya fairy...That or become a monk.

[xyz48B]

I don’t have a desire to go to pride. From what I’ve heard, pride is like the school yard in middle school. No thank you. But I do have a desire to call out those shouting “Accept us!” and yet they don’t accept folks they’ve determined aren’t worthy of their acceptance because of something that’s a big part of who they are. Gay men respect three things: looks, money, and connections to power. If you’re going to be accepted, the trifecta is best. Looks will help a lot, money overcomes looks, and influence can get the money to buy the looks – for you and your sugar baby.

[RealAvalon]

Gay men respect three things: looks, money, and connections to power. If you’re going to be accepted, the trifecta is best. Looks will help a lot, money overcomes looks, and influence can get the money to buy the looks – for you and your sugar baby.

We've all got our own individual experiences, yours and mine sound very different.

 

I'm involved in a lot of different gay sports and social clubs, which might be different from how you experience "gay life.' Just a lot of normal guys, living normal lives. To me, what you describe sounds more like an experience from Grindr, not real life.

Edited June 29, 2020 by RealAvalon

[xyz48B]

We've all got our own individual experiences

I’ve actually thought about writing a book...in all seriousness.

[+ E.T.Bass]

There is something flawed with people that choose to fat shame. We've all figured that out.

 

In the book Going Down in LaLa Land Andy Zeffer rakes over the coals the mean, bitchy awful queens that roam WEHO. Fortunately there are still plenty of decent, pleasant folks around, right?

 

My friend R. is obese. He is a prince of a guy, very smart and fun. We are often out and about with friends (until COVID) .

Even though a little younger than me, I worry that one day I'll reach retirement age and he won't be around anymore. But worrying, just like giving advice, doesn't help.

 

Carpe diem.

[Monarchy79]

Its funny that every time I think of a pride event, I get a visual of that Aaron Schock group photo of his “squad” on Instagram:

 

A bunch of vapid, spray-tanned, overly gelled, anal bleached, self-proclaimed “A-list” bitches, who reek of bud light, Acqua di Gio Cologne, and penis breath, with bad outfits and bad attitudes.

 

 

Hell, I wouldn’t want to feel “included”, with people like that.

[xyz48B]

Even though a little younger than me, I worry that one day I'll reach retirement age and he won't be around anymore.

My doctor has insisted weight is just a number among many, and not the most important measure of health. Apart from my weight (which is much higher than is outwardly considered “normal”), my stats are that of any other healthy person. My doctor monitors me and she says there’s no reason to be upset about my weight and size if my is doing okay according to all other diagnostics.

 

It’s that sort of thing that makes me, and others like me, bristle at the notion that we’re unattractive because we send a subliminal message of being unhealthy. Just like every muscle jock isn’t a dolt or every twink an airheaded space cadet, not every fat* person is unhealthy.

 

*I use the term “fat” quite openly to describe myself in this way because it’s true. It fat. If I were short, I’d say that. Same for left-handed. I’m fat and that as such is neither negative or positive. It’s how society has decided to socialize us, fat and not-fat people alike, around fatness.

[xyz48B]

Hell, I wouldn’t want to feel “included”, with people like that.

Perhaps the woke crowd is right – some in the gay community have achieved a status of privilege that is rather mainstream. Put another way, what purpose does pride serve if it’s no longer about standing up for inclusivity in the face if exclusion? Who is included, after all? Much like “All Lives Matter” doesn’t really mean “all,” it seems more and more that “acceptance” in the gay community is less and less about everyone and more and more about a narrowly defined, perceived ideal.

 

Once heard about whiteness as the paradigmatic ideal for humanity. Many things went into being “white” – of course skin color, but also wealth, employment, relationship status, intelligence, etc. So while you may have white skin, if you're a poor single man living in Appalachia in a rundown shake, you’re really not the picture of structural whiteness, even if you possess more privilege over against a black woman raising a family in center city Philly. Part of the ideal white human is cisgendered heteronormative masculinity. Could the “queer” side of that be what we’re dealing with here? Is there an ideal “gay man,” and fatness (along with other factors) simply don’t jive with it? Worth pondering...

[RealAvalon]

*I use the term “fat” quite openly to describe myself in this way because it’s true. It fat. If I were short, I’d say that. Same for left-handed. I’m fat and that as such is neither negative or positive. It’s how society has decided to socialize us, fat and not-fat people alike, around fatness.

That's the same as discrimination against "feminine" men

[RealAvalon]

Once heard about whiteness as the paradigmatic ideal for humanity. Many things went into being “white” – of course skin color, but also wealth, employment, relationship status, intelligence, etc. So while you may have white skin, if you're a poor single man living in Appalachia in a rundown shake, you’re really not the picture of structural whiteness, even if you possess more privilege over against a black woman raising a family in center city Philly. Part of the ideal white human is cisgendered heteronormative masculinity. Could the “queer” side of that be what we’re dealing with here? Is there an ideal “gay man,” and fatness (along with other factors) simply don’t jive with it? Worth pondering...

You're describing different economic classes.

 

You're making a broad generalization. Your experience is one of many, and has very little in common with mine.

Edited June 29, 2020 by RealAvalon

[+ Coolwave35]

If it makes you feel better, money not sex appeal is the real source of power in the gay community. You can look like Danny DeVito and still get any of those instagays to sleep with you if you have enough of it.

 

yup

[RealAvalon]

If it makes you feel better, money not sex appeal is the real source of power in the gay community. You can look like Danny DeVito and still get any of those instagays to sleep with you if you have enough of it.

Are you talking gay relationships, or are you talking about fucking?

[muscmtl]

There s worse, having a normal pick which is now is a gay disability. Try to go on Scruff/Grindr not being able to answer yes to Hung? Big? Huge?

[+ Hoover42]

But worrying, just like giving advice, doesn't help.

For me, worrying helps as long as it inspires me to devise a plan to address the issue. Once I have a plan, additional worrying just makes me miserable.

[xyz48B]

You're describing different economic classes.

 

You're making a broad generalization. Your experience is one of many, and has very little in common with mine.

I intended to point out that the idea of an “ideal X” elusive to everyone, by means of a different yet similar example. I go on to ask if the same might be say for the ideal gay man. The point wasn’t to say “this is how it is for (some) gay men,” but rather, “this is the gay dream life socialized into gay men by their culture.”

 

Many gay men have bought into the notion that “everyone is accepted,” when it’s simply not true. Unless you’re “gay enough,” you’re not accepted. That’s what this is about – people crying “accept me!” who themselves make clear distinctions about other people’s worth.

 

I wasn’t attempting to describe your experience. I’m not sure how you got that from what I wrote

[+ nycman]

I don’t think the author of that article really understands the concept of “Pride”.

If you’re focusing on the Muscle Marys.....then that’s all you’re going to see.

True Pride is about so much more than that. Every Pride I’ve ever attended,

has been an eye opening experience about the diversity and strength of

our community. Yes there are some stunningly beautiful self centered

young men (and I may have once even been one of them), but they have

never been the heart and soul of Pride, and they never will be.

 

In the words of Mother RuPaul, “if you can’t love yourself......”

[thickornotatall]

I'm a lot fatter than that anonymous writer and while I've had the occasional experience with a mean girl, never anything "relentless" like he describes which makes me doubt the story. Like is he leaving out that he grabbed their crotch or something?

Why doubt someone's sad story? Does it make you feel better? When you wrote" grabbed their crotch or something" shows me that you too are mean and not empathetic. Why put your guilt on him?

[xyz48B]

I grew up in the middle of nowhere. The only gay man I knew was my uncle who was “different” according to the family. My grandmother always insisted, lovingly but nonetheless insisted, that if my uncle had just gotten married and had had kids, he would’ve been fine. The only gay people who seemed accepted where I grew up were lesbians who hung with the guys and worked for the DOT – “butch lesbians,” you might call them, for lack of a better term.

 

Every year, when pride came around, the pictures that were shown in the newspaper (if at all in the local conservative rag) or on national TV, focused on the “glamorous” gays – the ones who fit the picture of the young Adonis. You didn’t see pictures of bears or normal folks at pride. You saw the young and nubile waving rainbow flags and dancing and having a good time together.

 

The subliminal message was clear. Gay guys are young. Gay guys are partiers. Gay guys exude energetic, desirable masculine-but-yet-not-too-masculine sexuality. So to say that pride has been about exhibiting the diversity of the gay community is only partly true. If you go to pride, yes. But if the message as one by circumstances looking in from the outside was that gays are a certain type, then it’s understandable that people might form imbedded notions about what makes them fit in or not. Also – let’s not forget the all-too ubiquitous response from someone to the announcement, like my own, at my coming out – “But you don’t act gay.” Where in the world would people get that notion if they didn’t get a message about what it means to be gay that wasn’t particularly narrow? Such a response can’t be borne out of a message that does in fact convey diversity within the community…

 

So forgive me for pushing back against the notion that the gay community isn’t portrayed as monolithic and doesn’t, complicity, embrace that stereotypical monolith to a (large) degree.

[RealAvalon]

You didn’t see pictures of bears or normal folks at pride. You saw the young and nubile waving rainbow flags and dancing and having a good time together.

 

I wasn’t attempting to describe your experience. I’m not sure how you got that from what I wrote

You didn't? Here all the focus is the "dykes on bikes" that start the parade. Then its the drag queens and bears and the "unusual" people out of the mainstream, which also includes the water soaked muscles boys. All are "freaks" in a fun carnivalesque sort of way. There's the contingent of elderly nudists that always get some TV time.

 

The generalization of your experience onto others.

Edited June 29, 2020 by RealAvalon