The Epidemic of Gay Loneliness

[Maxl]

Totally touched by LivingLA's article and many relies.

 

I especially like the following words:

......and wake up every day thankful for all the blessings in my life. I consider this forum one of those blessings. Y'all teach me something nearly every time. Thank you.

 

Thank you.

[+ WilliamM]

What did the teacher say if you don't mind my asking?

 

Good questions. I do not remember the exact words, something like "I know some will disagree [with his nice comment about me]."

 

We spent a lot of time in home room as well all classes together in the 8th grade. So I remember that school year better than most other years.

[Maxl]

Do you think that being an escort sometimes adds to your loneliness? I'm not dissing being an escort though.

Your question makes me have another one: doesn't straight people have loneliness issue?

Almost all people are more socially connected and embedded but, at the same time, the relationships may be more superficial than ever.

Loneliness is everwhere, but with different 'characteristics'.

[LivingnLA]

Kind of a rant, but can't currently sleep and a little teary eyed :(Im really anxious about seeing my dad tomorrow. Its quite unfortunate that many of us gays have not just issues with society but from our own family. I know its difficult and hurtful for their parents to find out their son or daughter is gay but please still love them even if you don't agree, as you not being there for them will cause them to look for love wherever they can find it, even from bad individuals. My mom was always nosy, negative all the time, and asking me questions about my sexuality all the time growing up, while my father was pretty much nonexistent and didnt say a word, we never bonded, we didnt ever do father and son things together. For a while I thought that way was better than my moms way but both are extremes and both terrible. I kind of isolated myself from family events as I didnt want to embarrass my family, as thats what I felt I was to them. Its really sad I don't communicate with either of my family, we just text one another on special events like holidays and birthdays, my dad and mom live in the dominican republic and visit once or twice a year. My dad has a gay brother whom I saw they never spoke to one another growing up, so for him to get a gay son, I guess I just want them to be proud of me, I have never said the words Im gay, but I know they know, don't know ill ever tell them I'm gay as even though they know, I know if I say those words i can't turn back. So yes its very sad how I'm always anxious whenever I see my father, as a son should never have to feel embarrassed or ashamed to be alive on this earth for who he can't help be. I think what most gay men need is someone trusting in their life to love them, and thats what I needed growing up, I want to ultimately find that one special soulmate in my life who doesn't just look at me like a piece of meat, someone who will stay me through the hard times and be that person I needed when I was younger when I was at my lowest and just wanted to end it all.

 

Thank you for sharing, [uSER=12155]@Dominiking[/uSER]. I'm sorry your parents have reacted the way they have because you seem like a good guy. I've only ever interacted with you on the forum, but if you were my son, I would be proud of you. You seem courageous, thoughtful, kind, and generous. Everything a father should want in a son.

[LivingnLA]

Your question makes me have another one: doesn't straight people have loneliness issue?

Almost all people are more socially connected and embedded but, at the same time, the relationships may be more superficial than ever.

Loneliness is everwhere, but with different 'characteristics'.

 

Yes, but as the stats in the article seem to point out, being a gay man and lonely is far more likely to result in suicide, self-destructive behavior, or both.

[+ WmClarke]

Kind of a rant, but can't currently sleep and a little teary eyed :(Im really anxious about seeing my dad tomorrow. Its quite unfortunate that many of us gays have not just issues with society but from our own family. I know its difficult and hurtful for their parents to find out their son or daughter is gay but please still love them even if you don't agree, as you not being there for them will cause them to look for love wherever they can find it, even from bad individuals. My mom was always nosy, negative all the time, and asking me questions about my sexuality all the time growing up, while my father was pretty much nonexistent and didnt say a word, we never bonded, we didnt ever do father and son things together. For a while I thought that way was better than my moms way but both are extremes and both terrible. I kind of isolated myself from family events as I didnt want to embarrass my family, as thats what I felt I was to them. Its really sad I don't communicate with either of my family, we just text one another on special events like holidays and birthdays, my dad and mom live in the dominican republic and visit once or twice a year. My dad has a gay brother whom I saw they never spoke to one another growing up, so for him to get a gay son, I guess I just want them to be proud of me, I have never said the words Im gay, but I know they know, don't know ill ever tell them I'm gay as even though they know, I know if I say those words i can't turn back. So yes its very sad how I'm always anxious whenever I see my father, as a son should never have to feel embarrassed or ashamed to be alive on this earth for who he can't help be. I think what most gay men need is someone trusting in their life to love them, and thats what I needed growing up, I want to ultimately find that one special soulmate in my life who doesn't just look at me like a piece of meat, someone who will stay me through the hard times and be that person I needed when I was younger when I was at my lowest and just wanted to end it all.

I hope your meeting with your dad goes well!

[BallerBoy]

This was exactly my reaction. Legal equality is great, but I suspect that it will take a generation (or two) before same-sex sexual orientation, with its many flavors and manifestations, is truly integrated into western society and fully accepted. Until then, gay people and those who don't match gender norms will have to fight a certain amount of psychological headwind.

Agreed. It may take several more generations for gay men to fully find our place in society and most importantly, among ourselves.

[Jose305]

I think also the gay world is mostly not friendly towards each other and not all inclusive. There is tremendous discrimination based on age, looks, race, social status and wealth. This type of discrimination excludes many. Those many, in turn, may suffer from loneliness, depression and other mental health issues.

[Kenny]

Thanks y'all for continuing to share. I find small bits of commonality and truth in many posts. They resonant with me and some of my life experiences.

 

The more I read and learn, the more I realize I was very lucky. Yes, I have my scars and my flaws, but generally, my formative years were pretty safe. I played football and swam competitively. I wasn't part of the popular crowd in high school but I wasn't an outcast either. I was a jock but also academically near the top. I'll never forget the first time I became aware that I was checking out a guy. It was my sophomore year in high school, he was our team captain and his Summer workouts had really paid off. He was very defined. He caught me looking, smirked and said, "nice right?" I laughed and said something about his workouts and asked for advice. We tag teamed a few girls after games that season, but never "crossed swords."

 

I really appreciate what @jvanchicago posted because it reminded me of something I'd forgotten. When I was finishing my first degree, I had a very lucrative offer to work in Silicon Valley. They flew me out and tried to impress. After the first day of interviews, I went to gay bar--my first ever--and was repulsed by the aggressive cruising and depressed by the handful of rejections. Day 2 of interviews included a real estate tour. I wish I'd bought property in San Francisco back then. After that, I was determined to try a bathhouse. My first and only experience in a gay bathhouse. Again, I was generally turned off until a much older man, around 50, approached me. He was friendly, open, and kind. He was the first man I ever kissed. It was a surreal experience for me but it cemented in my mind that the gay life wasn't for me. I turned down the offer, got married to my college sweetheart, had kids, and wake up every day thankful for all the blessings in my life. I consider this forum one of those blessings. Y'all teach me something nearly every time. Thank you.

Interesting story. Thanks for it. Do you consider yourself to be bisexual? There's a pretty wide range of sexuality, and I think bisexuality is a lot more common than we often assume.

[Kenny]

Kind of a rant, but can't currently sleep and a little teary eyed :(Im really anxious about seeing my dad tomorrow. Its quite unfortunate that many of us gays have not just issues with society but from our own family. I know its difficult and hurtful for their parents to find out their son or daughter is gay but please still love them even if you don't agree, as you not being there for them will cause them to look for love wherever they can find it, even from bad individuals. My mom was always nosy, negative all the time, and asking me questions about my sexuality all the time growing up, while my father was pretty much nonexistent and didnt say a word, we never bonded, we didnt ever do father and son things together. For a while I thought that way was better than my moms way but both are extremes and both terrible. I kind of isolated myself from family events as I didnt want to embarrass my family, as thats what I felt I was to them. Its really sad I don't communicate with either of my family, we just text one another on special events like holidays and birthdays, my dad and mom live in the dominican republic and visit once or twice a year. My dad has a gay brother whom I saw they never spoke to one another growing up, so for him to get a gay son, I guess I just want them to be proud of me, I have never said the words Im gay, but I know they know, don't know ill ever tell them I'm gay as even though they know, I know if I say those words i can't turn back. So yes its very sad how I'm always anxious whenever I see my father, as a son should never have to feel embarrassed or ashamed to be alive on this earth for who he can't help be. I think what most gay men need is someone trusting in their life to love them, and thats what I needed growing up, I want to ultimately find that one special soulmate in my life who doesn't just look at me like a piece of meat, someone who will stay me through the hard times and be that person I needed when I was younger when I was at my lowest and just wanted to end it all.

Your parents' cruelty is shocking and sad. What awful lives they must be living. That you are making your way through it is impressive.

[pubic_assistance]

I chose to marry and have kids, so, can't feel lonely in a full house.....but I do have several gay friends, and I have spent plenty of years around gay men, observing and dipping my toe in the water from time to time. Most of my own gay friends, integrate into mainstream society, go out with other people, joke around and openly discuss their life and loves. THEN: I know of gay men, who ONLY hang around gay bars, and ONLY share their life with other gay friends. Those types, typically get sucked into an emotional prison of, attending the club, doing drugs, ending up at a sex club or party ( while doing more drugs)...then home alone to crash and trying to recover before Monday morning. It's little wonder after a few years, why you wouldn't be suicidal. Even when I hire a professional for an erotic massage, I make a point of choosing someone who takes the time, to know my name, is both interested in knowing somethings about me, and is sharing a little bit about their own life. If you organize your entire week around anonymous sex, drugs and empty "party" friends, then you ARE going to be alone, even in a room full of people. It's all a matter of the choices we make in life. The depression of rejection by your family, because of your chosen lifestyle often leads to many other choices that bring momentary thrills at the cost of more depression, and a never ending cycle of loneliness.

[Rudynate]

The gay men I know are not lonely. They are very social and outgoing and most are in serious relationships or are married (a few are engaged). I am not one of them. For my social ineptitude I blame my chronic shyness, social anxiety, major depression, and what my psychiatrist calls a "personality disorder NOS". I think a lot of us suffer from anxiety and depressive disorders, for various reasons. If we didn't have some *ahem* ... issue.. then would we really be hiring escorts for our companionship needs?

 

 

There are many reasons for hiring escorts, and most hire by choice. Even those who feel that they "have to" hire, are doing it out of choice. They just see hiring as being the most appealing in a perceived limited range of choices.

[pubic_assistance]

There are many reasons for hiring escorts, and most hire by choice. Even those who feel that they "have to" hire, are doing it out of choice. They just see hiring as being the most appealing in a perceived limited range of choices.

Agreed. Let us not forget those of us who are bisexual and the escort/masseur profession allows us some ability to enjoy the company of a handsome man, in privacy without jumping into a same-sex relationship with both feet.

[Kenny]

Agreed. Let us not forget those of us who are bisexual and the escort/masseur profession allows us some ability to enjoy the company of a handsome man, in privacy without jumping into a same-sex relationship with both feet.

As Alfred Kinsey described his sexuality scale in 1948:

 

"Males do not represent two discrete populations, heterosexual and homosexual. The world is not to be divided into sheep and goats. It is a fundamental of taxonomy that nature rarely deals with discrete categories... The living world is a continuum in each and every one of its aspects. While emphasizing the continuity of the gradations between exclusively heterosexual and exclusively homosexual histories, it has seemed desirable to develop some sort of classification which could be based on the relative amounts of heterosexual and homosexual experience or response in each history […] An individual may be assigned a position on this scale, for each period in his life. […] A seven-point scale comes nearer to showing the many gradations that actually exist."

[Rudynate]

As Alfred Kinsey described his sexuality scale in 1948:

 

"Males do not represent two discrete populations, heterosexual and homosexual. The world is not to be divided into sheep and goats. It is a fundamental of taxonomy that nature rarely deals with discrete categories... The living world is a continuum in each and every one of its aspects. While emphasizing the continuity of the gradations between exclusively heterosexual and exclusively homosexual histories, it has seemed desirable to develop some sort of classification which could be based on the relative amounts of heterosexual and homosexual experience or response in each history […] An individual may be assigned a position on this scale, for each period in his life. […] A seven-point scale comes nearer to showing the many gradations that actually exist."

 

 

I have a fascination with bi men and used to chase them as a younger man. Even now, I have a persistent fantasy of having a mad affair with a bi tattoo artist.

[pubic_assistance]

As Alfred Kinsey described his sexuality scale in 1948:

 

"Males do not represent two discrete populations, heterosexual and homosexual. The world is not to be divided into sheep and goats. It is a fundamental of taxonomy that nature rarely deals with discrete categories... The living world is a continuum in each and every one of its aspects. While emphasizing the continuity of the gradations between exclusively heterosexual and exclusively homosexual histories, it has seemed desirable to develop some sort of classification which could be based on the relative amounts of heterosexual and homosexual experience or response in each history […] An individual may be assigned a position on this scale, for each period in his life. […] A seven-point scale comes nearer to showing the many gradations that actually exist."

Thank you ! I've had many sexual encounters over the years, with men who were married, or are now married etc. to women, and live their lives strictly as heterosexual men ( perhaps the occasional tryst)...but "mostly straight" seems to be the norm. more than people realize.

[Kippy]

And it is from the last several points in this thread that descriptive phrase "St8 acting and appearing" comes from. This is the phrase which often when just mentioned throws a certain crowd of gay people into a tailspin-- yet is entirely accurate, descriptive, appreciated and completely understood by many of us!

 

Kipp

[P Gren]

And it is from the last several points in this thread that descriptive phrase "St8 acting and appearing" comes from. This is the phrase which often when just mentioned throws a certain crowd of gay people into a tailspin-- yet is entirely accurate, descriptive, appreciated and completely understood by many of us!

 

Kipp

'straight acting' , fitting into a hetero-normative role (maybe closeted and maybe not), often gets confused and gets wrongly used to describe 'masculine.' An obvious backhanded comment on some in our community that says there is something wrong with effeminate guys ("it's just a personal preference I don't like effeminate guys") ignoring how that can feed into homophobia and self-hatred both on the LGBT community and within it. "As long as we don't look gay its okay." Hopefully guys look and consider our own biases and can recognize this and challenge ourselves to do better.

[Guest]

Do you think that being an escort sometimes adds to your loneliness? I'm not dissing being an escort though.

 

wow i can't believe i missed this

ill answer if u still care :oops:

 

honestly sometimes, as I feel like escorting is number one priority as it pays for my bills/rent so I always feel my life has to take second as I can get a text/call anytime and drop everything what I'm doing to meet someone, and if you tell that client, sorry I can't meet now, I'm busy, they will just find someone else lol. So I just drop everything as I know most clients will move on to the next if you try to reschedule with them

I also don't do hookups/date because I escort so thats adds to it. On the other hand, I love what I do, i get to meet many different peoples so its always exciting, and its so flattering that people find me attractive to pay me to spend some companionship time with me, so in a sense Im never lonely as I spend a lot of time with some great gentlemen

[+ Charlie]

The article is excellent, but there are too many issues in it to reply to without hogging the post, so I will just mention a couple of things.

 

One of the most important points in the article is the centrality of minority stress. There is no society anywhere in which gay men are not a minority, and always will be. Racial and religious minorities always have the sense that there is a society somewhere in which they not a minority, and they can retreat to it--or fantasize about retreating to it--to relieve their stress. From the moment we realize we are gay, we know we will ALWAYS be outliers, defending our right to be full members of the larger society. We know that toleration and acceptance by the larger society is always conditional, and can be revoked suddenly and through no fault of our own. The options most gay men use to reduce the stress are to try extra hard to adapt to whatever we believe will insure our acceptance, which includes becoming the mirror image of those who might exclude us, or to flaunt our difference with a "fuck you!" flamboyance. Both approaches, of course, generally increase the stress instead. Just being ourselves, whatever that may be, is the best choice, but it is not as easy as it sounds, especially if our natural inclinations cause members of the larger society to perceive us as "different" in a negative way. Many men gravitate to the "gay community" because it is like that society in which they expect to be part of the majority, only to find that being themselves exposes them to new reasons for being rejected (unless they are gorgeous physical specimens, or have some hyper-masculine asset, like a huge cock). The stress of being a minority, especially a traditionally despised minority, can be alleviated, but it cannot be eliminated.

 

The other point that struck me was the importance of our formative experience. Despite the assumption that the family has the most influence on our psychological development, recent research has indicated that our childhood peers may be just as important. If we are accepted, just as we are, by our peers when we are growing up, we are more likely to be comfortable with who we are as adults. When I look back at my childhood, I realize that I had some behaviors and interests that were odd for a boy (e.g., I would rather dance than play team sports, and I liked to decorate my toys). I grew up in a small town where I had the same core group of friends from elementary school through high school, and although I was rather quiet, I never had any sense of being excluded from my peers. Although I realized at an early age that I was attracted to boys, I always had a girl friend in high school, and participated in all the usual teenage activities. Perhaps I had an instinctive sense of what was acceptable male behavior and what was not, but I never consciously said or did things that seemed unnatural for me. Some of my classmates certainly came to understand, as the years passed after high school, that I was gay, but they have never behaved any differently towards me, and I am still friendly with a number of them now that we are all in our 70s. I think the feeling I had that I was an integral member of my family and my peer group did a lot to help me through the coming out process as a young adult in a society that was openly homophobic in those days.

 

But I certainly engaged in neurotic sexual behavior, constantly seeking something in sex that I couldn't pinpoint. I rarely had sex with anyone more than a couple of times before my interest in him faded. I don't have an addictive personality--I used all kinds of recreational drugs, as well as alcohol and tobacco, without ever developing any need for them--yet my pursuit of sex had an addictive quality. I had sex with literally hundreds of men, of all kinds, and it became a kind of game to see what I could score. I'm still not sure what I was looking for, but I finally realized that there were more satisfying activities. Sex was never an important part of my emotional relationships, where I was searching for psychologically compatible partners rather than someone who fit a physical ideal. When I began hiring escorts, it was for me basically a business arrangement, in which I didn't have to concern myself with the sex partner's emotional needs. (All right, that sounds brusque: in fact, I hired lots of men for whom I developed a brief affection, and a couple whom I comforted as they sobbed in my arms, but that was not what I was seeking when I hired.)

 

The one thing I have never felt, at any time in my life, was lonely. Even when I was physically alone, I always felt connected to my world. I feel sorry for those who feel genuinely lonely.

[+ WmClarke]

"John Pachankis, a stress researcher at Yale, says the real damage gets done in the five or so years between realizing your sexuality and starting to tell other people."

 

Five? Or, you know, 37 years between for some of us.