Kansas City vs St. Louis

[Steven_Draker]

I'm putting a new city on my itinerary and I'm pondering between St. Louis and Kansas City. I've never been to either one.

 

Any pro's or con's? Recommendations and suggestions welcomed.

 

Steven ~

[Guest Spanker01]

St. Louis

 

I live in St. Louis, which has only a few local boys who escort. That said, my guess would be that your phone would ring off the hook once we knew you were visiting. St. Louis, is fairly gay friendly, and the people are nice overall. Best times to visit, in my opinion, would be in the Spring, or around this time. Summers can be very hot and humid, and Winters just the opposite.

 

Spanker

[gcursor]

my choice

 

Detroit

 

I'm putting a new city on my itinerary and I'm pondering between St. Louis and Kansas City. I've never been to either one.

 

Any pro's or con's? Recommendations and suggestions welcomed.

 

Steven ~[/color]

[+ Topseed]

As for St. Louis: the town can be dead as a door nail, so if you're expecting a vibrant urban scene, look elsewhere. I would expect you would attract a fair number of married guys. You may also wonder why there are so few escorts there -- it's a closed loop socially, and everyone knows each other's business. If you do go, stay at the Chase Park Plaza in the Central West End -- there is a fine gym in the basement, a walkable neighborhood, and decent restaurants nearby -- or look for other hotels in the neighborhood. Downtown St. Louis is a ghost town after dark excepting when the sports teams are playing.

[Electra 225]

Dearest Steven: I like both towns, but they are a bit quiet and somewhat conservative. It may take some well thought and deliberate marketing to make an initial visit to either city worthwhile on the first visit or two (but business can be built up in both towns). I echo the comments about the Chase Park Plaza and the Central West End/Maryland Plaza area in St. Louis and there are many nice attractions in the immediate area (the park, the zoo, the Arch, downtown, etc.). I'm not up on the restaurants and clubs, so others will have to clue you in there. Regarding Kansas City (both Missouri and Kansas): nice towns with great architecture and food. Again, they are quiet and it will take a bit to drum up business, but business is to be had there. One idea: the Savoy Hotel (on 12th) is an old, but restored, Beaux Arts hotel with great rooms (very Victorian/Edwardian) and a great dining room (every meal there is fabulous and a real treat--excellent food and service and very, very traditional with white linens, good china, etc. and a nice wine cellar--the breakfasts are not to be missed, either). The Savoy is not expensive and a great landmark that you and your clients would find to be interesting and fun. Country Club Plaza is wonderful for cafes and shops and all sorts of (mostly straight) music and club events. Great museums in Kansas City (both sides of the river). The comments about weather are correct: fall and spring are great, winters are cold and damp and some snow--but great for indoor activities (wink). The summers, especially in St. Louis, are hot and humid--but compared to Houston are much less brutal--and Kansas City is a bit less hot and humid. Have great fun and good luck!!! Hugs--

[+ bigjoey]

Kansas City is a great city BUT the Savoy hotel is downtown where your visitors will have to pay for parking and as it is not busy, visitors will be noticed by the hotel staff. Instead, I suggest one of the hotels by the Plaza: easy to get to as it is very central, busy so guests can come and go un-noticed, lots of restaurants; most chains are there and "deals" can be had; also, some extended stay hotels there that have weekly rates that are reasonable. From the Plaza, you can walk to Museums (if you have the time). Second choice would be Crown Center which has a few hotels and is centrally located.

 

Very short on locally grown escorts.

[jackboy48]

With your love of fine art, I would think it would have to be Kansas City, and the Nelson-Atkins Art Museum, and it's huge sculpture garden. The Country Club Plaza area is quite unique, mostly in the Spanish Style, easy to walk about with good shopping and restaurants. The city also has many of Wright's "prairie style" homes and churches, and then there is the infamous Liberty Park. The bar scene is surprisingly active, and I think you're much more likely to find men who can afford your services. I am also a big fan of that casual farmboy/cowboy look, and let's not forget the barbecue!

 

St Louis became the bane of my existence during the years I thought I could be a business traveler. It was hard to navigate, the major chain hotels always seemed to be at the low end of their brand, and even recommended restaurants were mediocre. The "Arch" never really grabbed me, and I always felt the nightlife was "sad." I did like the zoo.

 

It turned out that I could never get the hang of traveling for business, which was a big surprise as I love being "on the road" in my off time.

[trilingual]

If you decide on Kansas City I would echo staying at one of the busy Plaza hotels. For the most part Kansas City is very spread out and a car is necessary to get around its far-flung reaches, but from the Plaza hotels you can walk to shops and numerous restaurants. You can also walk to the Nelson-Atkins and the Kemper Museum of Contemporary Art, both of which have good restaurants of their own. If you don't want to drive you can take a MAX express bus from the Plaza to the Crown Center area (Liberty Memorial, WWI Museum, Union Station) and on down to the Crossroads District (art galleries, restaurants, the brilliant new Kauffman Center for the Performing Arts) and Downtown.

 

If you don't mind driving, K.C. is easy to navigate as it's laid out on a grid pattern (like L.A.). Unlike L.A., traffic is very minimal and parking is easy. With a car it's easy to get to the airport, to shopping and the Nerman Museum of Contemporary Art in suburban Johnson County (KS) or to the very interesting Truman Library and Museum in Independence.

 

Also, if you stay on the Plaza you will be close to Westport (a few blocks north) which has lots of restaurants and a very nice gay hangout, Bistro 303 (at 303 Westport Rd.) -- it has a very European feel and attracts a somewhat older, affluent crowd. Café Trio is a very popular gay-owned restaurant on Main Street by the Plaza that also has a busy bar scene you might like.

 

Let us know what you decide!

[Diverdan]

St Louis has a lot to offer you with the Art Museum, the Cathedral Basiclia, the Missouri Botanical Garden with its world famous Japanese Gardenand other spots as well. Some of my japanese friends think the Japenese Garden it is as good as anything in Japan. I agree that the Chase Park Plaze in the Central West End would be a great place for you to stay, and with some advance notice here and elsewhere, I suspect you could be as busy as you want. The History Museum, the old Cathedral, the old Court House where the Dredd Scott case was tried may also have some interest for you in terms of histroy and architecture, and of course, there is the ARCH. If you have any interest in US Histroy, the museum at the confluence of the Mississippi and Missouri, where Lewis and Clark started their expedition to explore the "Lousiana Purchase" is another not to be missed place. If you'd like some futher suggestions, send me a PM. I don't think you would be busy for a month on your first visit, but I am sure with enough advance notice, you would be busy for most of a week the first time around.

[Steven_Draker]

Thank you all for the very useful and detailed information.

 

It looks like I'll be visiting Kansas City this year and St. Louis will be next (gotta see the Arch someday). I'll keep you posted with dates as we get closer to the time.

 

My best, Steven ~

[+ deej]

St. Louis will be next (gotta see the Arch someday).

 

Just between you and me (don't tell nobody, k?), the Arch is a little over-rated.

 

Note also that any regular traveler who often has connecting flights in St. Louis knows that it's DELAY CITY during the summer. There are routine severe weather fronts passing over the city (and airport). Just last year, a tornado passed through the airport with little or no warning.

 

KC has better BBQ too. (That should start a religious war!) :-)

[+ azdr0710]

 

the Arch is a little over-rated.

 

 

but the Western expansion museum under the Arch is very, very good.....

[Diverdan]

Actually, Deej, the absolutely best bar-b-q ribs in the entire country is in a small neighborhood in Chicago. The Gale Street Inn on Milwaukee Avenue is a typical neighborhood bar and restaurant. If you didn't know it was there, you would probably drive right by. It is about half way between 0'Hare and downtown. I go there every time I get to Chicago for a full slab of finger licking, fall off the bone baby back pork ribs that have a sweet and tangy sauce grilled right into the meat so no extra slathering of sauce is needed. I have tried most of the B-B-Q places in St Louis and Kansas City as well as most cities in Texas, but none can compare to Gale Street. Plus the drinks there are hearty and inexpensive, and they will serve food at the bar while you are watching your favorite game too.

DD

[Steven_Draker]

Actually, Deej, the absolutely best bar-b-q ribs in the entire country is in a small neighborhood in Chicago.

 

Oh, really ...? I was always taught that the best BBQ is in Memphis. What gives?

[+ deej]

Oh, really ...? I was always taught that the best BBQ is in Memphis. What gives?

 

I did say it would start a religious war.

 

Here's the rule: every place in America that serves BBQ swears that IT is the best BBQ anywhere.

[+ deej]

Actually, Deej, the absolutely best bar-b-q ribs in the entire country is in a small neighborhood in Chicago. The Gale Street Inn on Milwaukee Avenue is a typical neighborhood bar and restaurant.

 

Been there, and to a couple dozen others scattered around the city. Chicagoans are not shy about eating meat, and it's generally done the right way.

 

When he did the Tonight Show from Rosemont a few years ago, Jay Leno did a bit comparing Chicago cuisine with L.A. cuisine. As an example of L.A. cuisine, he showed a large plate with two pieces of asparagus, two shrimps, and a little blob of rice. The Chicago example: a huge platter piled high with BBQ ribs.

[KMEM]

Oh, really ...? I was always taught that the best BBQ is in Memphis. What gives?[/color]

 

Of course, you are correct. Those others are johnny come latelies. However, we welcome anyone who truly enjoys BBQ and we offer it here in MEM as ribs, shoulder and even beef.

 

If you have not had BBQ Memphis style, then you have to wait until you do before you dare to compare any others.

 

Best regards,

KMEM

[Electra 225]

I've travelled all over the U.S. There is no BEST BBQ. I've found that each state or locality has their special way of doing BBQ and I tend to like it all. I think that Gentlemen's Quarterly did a road trip based on BBQ a while back and they came to the same conclusion: it is all good!!

[seeker630]

I've travelled all over the U.S. There is no BEST BBQ. I've found that each state or locality has their special way of doing BBQ and I tend to like it all. I think that Gentlemen's Quarterly did a road trip based on BBQ a while back and they came to the same conclusion: it is all good!!

 

I agree - it's a matter of individual taste. I tend to like sweeter and spicier sauces myself and prefer sauces to dry rub. In North Carolina, BBQ is chopped or pulled pork, and Eastern vs Western styles are hotly debated.

 

But I have eclectic tastes!

[Diverdan]

KEM... been there done that, but for other B-B-Q, whether it is shoulder, beef, pulled pork, chicken or anything other than ribs, there is a "red barn" just off of I 35 in Temple, Texas that is the " best" in those departments. The name of the place is Clem Makesks (sic?) . I haven't been there in several years, so assume it is still there. But as others have posted, "BEST" is ultimately in the eye and taste buds of the individual person. We all have different receptors for saltiness, bitterness, sweetness, etc. and so what may be "best" for one may turn out to be disgusting to others. However, I have yet to meet anyone who did not LOVE Gale Street or Clem's culinary products. Memphis has a particular taste that does not do anything for me, but it may be great for someone else. Even in Memphis, there are at least five or six places that serve B-B-Q that is quite distinct from their competitors. The same is true in KC. So Steven, you will just have to try these two places on your next travels and let me know what your taste buds tell you. Three cheers for B-B-Q... one of the best ways to savor good MEAT... but there is other MEAT to savor too, as posters to this Forum only know too well. LOL

[Mocha]

I think Florida is under-rated in the BBQ match. I mean, you can literally grill outdoors year round. Matter of fact, it's best in the winter when it cools down.

 

Forget beef and pork. It's BBQ alligator, frog legs, Mahi, Grouper....Yummy.

 

http://www.examiner.com/images/blog/replicate/EXID22955/images/resized_Grilled_Frog_Legs__Flickr_by_kshilcutt.jpg

 

(leave the froggies alone people)

[Steven_Draker]

Folks, airfare and accommodation are now secured. I'll be arriving in Kansas City on Saturday, Nov. 12th and

staying in the Country Club Plaza as per your recommendation. Looking forward to my first trip to KC.

 

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/8/89/Kansas_City_Montage.jpg

[Steven_Draker]

I just completed my second trip to Kansas City; my first one last November turned out to be too short to enjoy everything the city has to offer.

 

The Nelson-Atkins Museum of Art is a gem. The new "modern" wing partly spoils the beauty of the original building (and I love modern!) The collections are impressive and half day wasn't enough to visit everything of interest: European Art, American Art, American Indian, Asian, Ancient (Egyptian). The Kirkwood Hall is spectacular. Rodin's statue "The Thinker" has a strategical place in front of the main building. I'll post pictures when I find the time. This is probably one of the most impressive and complete museums I've visited in the USA. The museum alone and the world-class Country Club Plaza are worth paying a visit to Kansas City.

 

Like.

[Decatur Guy]

I'll have to add KC to my wish list.

[Poolboy21409]

Steven's presence in a city would make even the worst ones palatable. I was there about three years ago for a 4 day meeting and struck out totally on an extracurricular fun.