Sao Paulo for newbies include Espaco Lagoa sauna and HotHouse, Danger

[solacesoul]

13 hours ago, SouthOfTheBorder said:

Most seem to object to the layout of Lagoa - it’s vertical, like a smaller version of Termas BCN.  However, Lagoa is fairly new (maybe 2 years old max) and it’s in a safe part of SP with very easy access to major hotels.  The number of working guys varies by time/date just like all the others. Lagoa does seem built more for business than compared to more socializing at 117 & Pointe

117 & Pointe are both old facilities, albeit traditional Brazilian saunas with garotos.  I’m not a fan of 117 just because I don’t like going to Gloria.  Pointe is really central in Copacabana with easy access, but the neighborhood can be dangerous day & night.

The saunas are more what you make of them vs what some expect to be served.  For me, it’s really more about safety and there is no question the area around Lagoa is far safer than Pointe & 117 in Rio. Not even close. 

Safety (or rather, perceptions of it) is always such a thorny topic. But I would always recommend a new traveler, an older (elderly) traveler, a disabled or not-in-shape traveler, or a traveler who doesn’t look like he “fits in” to the demographic of these neighborhoods, to take an Uber or a taxi to and from any of these saunas. Once you can walk to and from the Metro stations confidently and with an air that you know exactly where you are, then maybe try the Metro. 

[+ tassojunior]

11 hours ago, Lucky said:

117 tonight was fabulous. Quite crowded.

Was the wait for a room long? 

[SouthOfTheBorder]

22 minutes ago, tassojunior said:

Was the wait for a room long? 

the wait must have been acceptable, otherwise the manager would have been summoned !  

[menaughty]

I really like Lagoa. It has great selection of men.

of course! 117 and 202 has even better but Lagoa is not too far behind IMO.

the thing with me is that i find 117 and 202 so dirty and old whereas Lagoa is much cleaner than those two and a lot more modern.

just because of that i choose Sao Paulo over Rio for a sexcation. 

[+ Lucky]

There was no wait when I wanted a.room.

[Alfstoria]

5 hours ago, menaughty said:

I really like Lagoa. It has great selection of men.

of course! 117 and 202 has even better but Lagoa is not too far behind IMO.

the thing with me is that i find 117 and 202 so dirty and old whereas Lagoa is much cleaner than those two and a lot more modern.

just because of that i choose Sao Paulo over Rio for a sexcation. 

I am already scheduling my November Brazil trip. For my birthday:) 

so I want to check both cities  

I was wondering if you guys recommend SP first and then Rio or Rio and the SP? 
it looks like those two cities are pretty close, any advice for a newbie’s first Rio/ SP trip

my birthdays used to be at Montreal, then Barcelona/Zurich,  but, I am canceling my Bcn birthday trip for Brazil I am curious about 117 and 202  

[coriolis888]

56 minutes ago, Alfstoria said:

I am already scheduling my November Brazil trip. For my birthday:) 

so I want to check both cities  

I was wondering if you guys recommend SP first and then Rio or Rio and the SP? 
it looks like those two cities are pretty close, any advice for a newbie’s first Rio/ SP trip

my birthdays used to be at Montreal, then Barcelona/Zurich,  but, I am canceling my Bcn birthday trip for Brazil I am curious about 117 and 202  

Your decision will be based on how much you want to see Rio.  You recently got to know Sao Paulo.  

As you know, there are direct flights into Rio or Sao Paulo from the U.S.  

I personally prefer to spend more time in Sao Paulo than in Rio because there is so much more to do in Sao Paulo and the city is safer than Rio.  Rio has a large beach and two popular saunas and a higher crime rate than does Sao Paulo.     

Sauna wise, in Rio, you have:

Clube 117 which is a fun place and never disappointed me in the many years and times I visited there. 

Clube 202 can be a fun and busy place and easy to meet garotos.  However, the owner, Junior, likes LOUD

music which, when he is there, turns up the music loud which makes it difficult to have a conversation with the garotos or anyone else while in the sauna.  His sauna is located in Copacabana, right near a favela which makes it easier for street crime to come down the hill and bother people on the street near the sauna then quickly escape back up the hill.

There is also one smaller sauna in Rio that I never saw but supposedly has very young thin garotos.  I do not recall the name of the sauna.  

So, given the above and if it were I and the first time in Brazil, I would book Rio for a few days then proceed to Sao Paulo for the remainder of my vacation.  Of course, this is what I would do.  

When you travel between Rio and SP, while in Brazil, there is no need to go to the far out international airports.  There is a smaller downtown airport in both Rio and SP. - Congonas and Santos Dumont airports. 

It is only about an hour flight between the downtown two city airports.    

Edited August 30, 2023 by coriolis888

[Alfstoria]

1 hour ago, coriolis888 said:

Your decision will be based on how much you want to see Rio.  You recently got to know Sao Paulo.  

As you know, there are direct flights into Rio or Sao Paulo from the U.S.  

I personally prefer to spend more time in Sao Paulo than in Rio because there is so much more to do in Sao Paulo and the city is safer than Rio.  Rio has a large beach and two popular saunas and a higher crime rate than does Sao Paulo.     

Sauna wise, in Rio, you have:

Clube 117 which is a fun place and never disappointed me in the many years and times I visited there. 

Clube 202 can be a fun and busy place and easy to meet garotos.  However, the owner, Junior, likes LOUD

music which, when he is there, turns up the music loud which makes it difficult to have a conversation with the garotos or anyone else while in the sauna.  His sauna is located in Copacabana, right near a favela which makes it easier for street crime to come down the hill and bother people on the street near the sauna then quickly escape back up the hill.

There is also one smaller sauna in Rio that I never saw but supposedly has very young thin garotos.  I do not recall the name of the sauna.  

So, given the above and if it were I and the first time in Brazil, I would book Rio for a few days then proceed to Sao Paulo for the remainder of my vacation.  Of course, this is what I would do.  

When you travel between Rio and SP, while in Brazil, there is no need to go to the far out international airports.  There is a smaller downtown airport in both Rio and SP. - Congonas and Santos Dumont airports. 

It is only about an hour flight between the downtown two city airports.    

Thanks @coriolis888   Very helpful. 

I like what I read. Starting with Rio and then heading to São Paulo sounds great. I'd like to find that other sauna you mentioned; perhaps they have some Top Twinks… 

A favela next to a GP bathhouse sounds interesting 🧐 lol.
I like beaches, but I bet Rio's beaches can get crowded, especially in the city, and since I already have some regulars in São Paulo that make me feel awesome, first Rio and  I'll save my current birthday for São Paulo and celebrate it with my boys.

I haven't canceled Barcelona yet, so I'll do the math and weigh my options to see which city comes out on top. I've already been to Bcn in April and to SP in August, so let's see.

I have had plans for Prague and some Eastern Europe sexcations, but I prefer  my birthday in a place and with a company that already know.

I still remember my first, now a tradition, birthdays with an escort it was with Malik in Montreal . It was so much fun back in the day when Malik used to be called Justin.  I still can’t believe the I had 3 birthdays in Malik’s arms   He didn’t even drink at that time ; and look at him now. Life is full of surprises 

 

Edited August 30, 2023 by Alfstoria

[coriolis888]

4 minutes ago, Alfstoria said:

 

a favela next to a GP bathhouse sound interesting 🧐 lol   I like beaches but I bet Rio have crowded ones and more if city boy  and I already have some regulars in SP that made feel awesome  so maybe I will leave my actual birthday for São Paulo and have it with my boys  

 

 

I confused you.  The favela is up a street about one-half block before you reach Sauna 202.  

As you walk down Rua Siqueira Campus on the way towards sauna 202, you pass a street with a steep hill going up.  It is that street that leads to the favela.  I do not remember the name of the street but it is the only street you pass.

[coriolis888]

18 minutes ago, Alfstoria said:

 

I'd like to find that other sauna you mentioned; perhaps they have some Top Twinks… 

 

 

New Meio Mundo reviews, photos - Centro - Rio de Janeiro - GayCities Rio de Janeiro

RIO.GAYCITIES.COM

---

Standard sauna for the guys. Reviews, photos and a map of New Meio Mundo in Centro in Rio de Janeiro

 

[+ José Soplanucas]

9 minutes ago, coriolis888 said:

I confused you.  The favela is up a street about one-half block before you reach Sauna 202.  

As you walk down Rua Siqueira Campus on the way towards sauna 202, you pass a street with a steep hill going up.  It is that street that leads to the favela.  I do not remember the name of the street but it is the only street you pass.

Once, I turned the wrong way and walked for about 15'/20' in that favela, at about 6 pm. Everyone was super nice and friendly.

[Alfstoria]

20 minutes ago, coriolis888 said:

I confused you.  The favela is up a street about one-half block before you reach Sauna 202.  

As you walk down Rua Siqueira Campus on the way towards sauna 202, you pass a street with a steep hill going up.  It is that street that leads to the favela.  I do not remember the name of the street but it is the only street you pass.

I imagined it was. But a favela next to an established sauna sounds wild, so I couldn’t help it 😝 

[coriolis888]

5 minutes ago, Alfstoria said:

I imagined it was. But a favela next to an established sauna sounds wild, so I couldn’t help it 😝 

I strongly recommend that you not visit that favela. 

Even though @José Soplanucas mentioned that he had inadvertently gone to the favela and found the people friendly, do not count on the same friendly experience if you go there.  

[solacesoul]

14 hours ago, José Soplanucas said:

Once, I turned the wrong way and walked for about 15'/20' in that favela, at about 6 pm. Everyone was super nice and friendly.

15 to 20 feet in? In all fairness, that’s less than the width of the first building. Certainly not enough to make a valid judgment about traveling alone as a stranger inside an unfamiliar anything, much less a favela.

[+ tassojunior]

21 hours ago, Alfstoria said:

I imagined it was. But a favela next to an established sauna sounds wild, so I couldn’t help it 😝 

It's past 202 and 202 has a series of iron fences gates and stairs with cameras watching the front where cabs pick up and drop off. Plus it's very close to the downtown/beach area of Copacabana. I always stay at the JW Marriott (full of American and EU biz types) which is just 4 or 5 blocks from 202 so it's too close to taxi and have never felt in danger on that walk. It's a very nice hotel beach area close to where Copacabana meets Ipanema.  Of course I've never gone the other direction from 202 and glad to know otherwise. OTOH, Way up in Gloria, around 117,  may not be a place for tourists to wander. A lot of rowdy drunks around local bars even though it's physically beautiful. But 117 is fantastic and worth a very long Uber ride. 

[+ Axiom2001]

23 hours ago, coriolis888 said:

I confused you.  The favela is up a street about one-half block before you reach Sauna 202.  

As you walk down Rua Siqueira Campus on the way towards sauna 202, you pass a street with a steep hill going up.  It is that street that leads to the favela.  I do not remember the name of the street but it is the only street you pass.

Be aware and just pass the street.  Only go into a favela with friends or with a small, intimate tour group.  

An acquaintance of mine who spends almost a month in Rio de Janeiro just returned from my favorite city (Rio).  While he was there, he posted on Facebook almost daily.  One day he posted photos of his private tour with an amigo or acquaintance.  What he posted seemed interesting, and if I manage to return to Rio sometime next year, I want to do as he did.  

When in Rio I stayed in a hotel  The Atlantico Copacabana Hotel, the hotel that accommodated many of us during the early 2000s and the one that is in walking distance to Pointe 202.  Its guest policy was supreme when it came to one's having company.  I think the policy was changed during the mid 2000s.  But, if you have an interest, check out the website as well as ask questions here.

[SouthOfTheBorder]

9 hours ago, solacesoul said:

Certainly not enough to make a valid judgment about traveling alone as a stranger inside an unfamiliar anything, much less a favela.

it’s actually doing damage - leading some to think entering a favela is no big deal. 

there are some here that just won’t acknowledge real facts on the ground (or multiple similar reviews from unconnected people in this forum), but rather spin a different Rio reality based on a couple isolated anecdotes. 

All the Brazilians I know have been mugged, robbed or worse.  The general attitude is that if it hasn’t happened yet, it definitely will.  Your number just hasn’t come up as they say. 

Rio is extraordinarily dangerous - especially in tourist zones. You can still go & have a great time and not be a crime victim.  Just requires a different level of vigilance.  If not, they will find you.  They look for stupid tourists because they are the easiest targets. And always leave town shortly after the crime.

[coriolis888]

2 hours ago, tassojunior said:

It has a series of iron fences gates and stairs with cameras watching the front where cabs pick up and drop off. 

Knowing Junior, (the owner of Sauna 202) do you really think the cameras work?  Or, (most likely) the cameras are there just to hopefully scare off muggers and give a false sense of security to those using Uber and cars.

Edited August 31, 2023 by coriolis888

[coriolis888]

On 8/30/2023 at 3:22 AM, solacesoul said:

Safety (or rather, perceptions of it) is always such a thorny topic. But I would always recommend a new traveler, an older (elderly) traveler, a disabled or not-in-shape traveler, or a traveler who doesn’t look like he “fits in” to the demographic of these neighborhoods, to take an Uber or a taxi to and from any of these saunas. Once you can walk to and from the Metro stations confidently and with an air that you know exactly where you are, then maybe try the Metro. 

I agree about the "maybe try the Metro" in the above post.  However, do not use most Metro buses in Brazil.  If you can read Portugese, check the internet news for reported robberies aboard buses.  You will see several reports of incidents of robberies on buses daily.   

A metro speeds along fast and many metro cars have local police riding along for safety. 

However, the buses do not have that added protection of police on board. 

For most vacationers to Brazil, do not chance taking a bus while Ubers are so much faster and safer and cheap.  

[+ tassojunior]

11 minutes ago, coriolis888 said:

Knowing Junior, (the owner of Sauna 202) do you really think the cameras work?  Or, (most likely) the cameras are there just to hopefully scare off muggers and give a false sense of security to those using Uber and cars.

of the few somewhat rough types I've run into at 202, Junior scares me the most. Probably why they tell you to leave valuables at the front desk....so Junior's not tempted. He's a "presence" But he keeps the working boys in line. . 

[solacesoul]

10 hours ago, tassojunior said:

of the few somewhat rough types I've run into at 202, Junior scares me the most.

Wow. You scare pretty easily. I don’t find anything remotely scary or intimidating about Junior. 

[solacesoul]

11 hours ago, SouthOfTheBorder said:

it’s actually doing damage - leading some to think entering a favela is no big deal. 

Agreed. 

 

11 hours ago, SouthOfTheBorder said:

there are some here that just won’t acknowledge real facts on the ground (or multiple similar reviews from unconnected people in this forum), but rather spin a different Rio reality based on a couple isolated anecdotes. 

It’s that “it hasn’t happened to me (yet), so it must not be true” mindset that is so dangerous, because it lulls you into a sense of complacency, when it’s important to remain vigilant. 

 

11 hours ago, SouthOfTheBorder said:

All the Brazilians I know have been mugged, robbed or worse.  The general attitude is that if it hasn’t happened yet, it definitely will.  Your number just hasn’t come up as they say. 

Yep. Every one I know as well has experienced at least a petty theft on the street or a mugging — no matter their size, gender or color.

Ask any attendant of last weekend’s Celebration of 100 years of The Copacabana Palace how that went. Over 500 arrests on the street and beach for theft and assault. 

12 hours ago, SouthOfTheBorder said:

Rio is extraordinarily dangerous - especially in tourist zones. You can still go & have a great time and not be a crime victim.  Just requires a different level of vigilance.  If not, they will find you.  They look for stupid tourists because they are the easiest targets. And always leave town shortly after the crime.

 

The areas around the beaches of Copacabana and Ipanema are especially target-rich environments for the ladrãozinhos, but ironically, the Zona Sul / South Zone neighborhoods are still the safest neighborhoods inside the city limits of Rio. A casual or unseasoned tourist would be foolish to stay outside of Zona Sul — unless they have a very specific reason and are staying with someone who knows what they’re doing and where they’re going. 

 

[solacesoul]

16 hours ago, coriolis888 said:

I agree about the "maybe try the Metro" in the above post.  However, do not use most Metro buses in Brazil.  If you can read Portugese, check the internet news for reported robberies aboard buses.  You will see several reports of incidents of robberies on buses daily.   

A metro speeds along fast and many metro cars have local police riding along for safety. 

However, the buses do not have that added protection of police on board. 

For most vacationers to Brazil, do not chance taking a bus while Ubers are so much faster and safer and cheap.  

Yep. 

Although this AP report is 8 years old, it could have been made yesterday!

Note: other Brazilian cities like Salvador have this bus problem, too.

 

[SouthOfTheBorder]

On 8/30/2023 at 6:16 PM, Alfstoria said:

But a favela next to an established sauna sounds wild, so I couldn’t help it

In Rio, favelas are very close to almost everything - it's not an unusual thing. They surround all the popular beaches.  The favelas are full of gangs, drug dealers, weapons, desperate people & immense poverty.

so when they see the rich foreign tourists wandering about & some of them very stupid - of course they're going to rob them 

[coriolis888]

21 hours ago, tassojunior said:

It's past 202 and 202 has a series of iron fences gates and stairs with cameras watching the front where cabs pick up and drop off. Plus it's very close to the downtown/beach area of Copacabana. I always stay at the JW Marriott (full of American and EU biz types) which is just 4 or 5 blocks from 202 so it's too close to taxi and have never felt in danger on that walk. It's a very nice hotel beach area close to where Copacabana meets Ipanema.  Of course I've never gone the other direction from 202 and glad to know otherwise. OTOH, Way up in Gloria, around 117,  may not be a place for tourists to wander. A lot of rowdy drunks around local bars even though it's physically beautiful. But 117 is fantastic and worth a very long Uber ride. 

Sorry, but for safety reasons of forum members who will visit Rio, I must make corrections to the above:

The street leading to the favela is NOT PAST sauna 202, walking from the beach to the sauna.  That uphill street leading to the favela is BEFORE you reach sauna 202 traveling from the beach area toward sauna 202.  

I make this correction because I do not want to read about a forum member(s) accidentally taking the wrong street that leads to an unfavorable event after entering a favela. 

Again, the described street that leads to a highly dangerous favela is before you reach sauna 202, not past that sauna (walking from Copacabana beach or area). 

Another correction I want to make is that the uphill street in question (that leads to the favela) is NOT near the  downtown beach area of Copacabana.  Sauna 202 and that uphill street (that leads to the favela) is about five or six blocks from the Copacabana beach but less than half a block from sauna 202.

Safety is critical to having a great vacation in Brazil.