Anyone investing in this Crypto?

[MscleLovr]

16 hours ago, jtwalker said:

When you transfer your digital assets to a hardware wallet, you remove them from the exchange to mitigate these risks.  When it comes time to sell, you can transfer the assets back to an exchange to make a withdrawal.

And, of course, there’s a fee to pay for each transfer to/from the exchange. The cheapest I’ve seen is a charge of 0.75% of the value (usually as calculated in US$).

[jtwalker]

2 minutes ago, MscleLovr said:

And, of course, there’s a fee to pay for each transfer to/from the exchange. The cheapest I’ve seen is a charge of 0.75% of the value (usually as calculated in US$).

I'd happily pay 1.5% to make even 15%.  FTX.US has fees around .3%  https://help.ftx.us/hc/en-us/articles/360043579273-Fees

[CalTec]

On 7/2/2022 at 8:43 PM, jtwalker said:

I am currently investing in crypto.  It has been around since 2009, has a huge following, and has a very positive track record.  Bitcoin is up around 70% over the past 3 years even with the recent crash.  It swings wild, but if you don't panic there is real money to be made here.

I got out after the last crash and noticed a trend.  When Bitcoin crashes, it tends to drop by 75-80%, then it tends to come back at 4x its previous high.  Right now, it has fallen approximately 72% from its last high.  I primarily invest in Bitcoin and Etherium and I use a hardware wallet to stay away from the exchange volatility.  I see it as a 2-5 year play and I'm investing slowly over time.

Investing 101 is buy low and sell high.  Real Estate is high right now (it won't stay there), Stocks are just starting their downward trend IMHO, Crypto is much closer to a potential bottom and buy point.  Can't predict the exact bottom, but that is where dollar-cost averaging comes in, and when it peaks again it won't matter that much if I bought at the true bottom.

This guy "cryptos" 😉

@jtwalker I agree with your overall observation, but this bear is a bit different with fundamentals unlike any bear in the past. War, economy, unsustainable lending practices, etc.  Also protocols that don't ship well audited code that becomes susceptible to hacks/exploits (a few $B in 2021 I believe, doesn't help new user adoption). A bit different but I see too many institutional dollars at play to forecast a disaster scenario.  Peter Schiff would think differently, however! 😆

Yes, CeFi is a bit of a gamble.  I ejected from the Hindenburg disaster that was Celsius months ago.  Currently enjoying sustainable yield with Nexo, however that in itself is a bit of a gamble, even with Antoni and his partner Kalin doing AMA's and real-time Armanio audits, etc etc.

Out of all the failing projects, I think Nexo will come out on top and with bank licenses, overcollateralization, the audits as mentioned it seems like the least risk among CeFi.  Have you any experience with lend/borrow platforms in the past?
And HW's are a must, love the piece of mind they give 👍

[jtwalker]

35 minutes ago, Calix_V2 said:

This guy "cryptos" 😉

@jtwalker I agree with your overall observation, but this bear is a bit different with fundamentals unlike any bear in the past. War, economy, unsustainable lending practices, etc.  Also protocols that don't ship well audited code that becomes susceptible to hacks/exploits (a few $B in 2021 I believe, doesn't help new user adoption). A bit different but I see too many institutional dollars at play to forecast a disaster scenario.  Peter Schiff would think differently, however! 😆

Yes, CeFi is a bit of a gamble.  I ejected from the Hindenburg disaster that was Celsius months ago.  Currently enjoying sustainable yield with Nexo, however that in itself is a bit of a gamble, even with Antoni and his partner Kalin doing AMA's and real-time Armanio audits, etc etc.

Out of all the failing projects, I think Nexo will come out on top and with bank licenses, overcollateralization, the audits as mentioned it seems like the least risk among CeFi.  Have you any experience with lend/borrow platforms in the past?
And HW's are a must, love the piece of mind they give 👍

Given the state of the market and the world, I’ve pulled back to top 20 market cap coins and I’m looking at it as a long term investment.  Dollar cost averaging and patience are my play at the moment with about 80% split between BTC and ETH.

The riskier side of my profile is in DOGE because Elon Musk always seems to get his way and some others.  This only makes up about 20% of my portfolio, and I’ve decided to give it up to 5 years; though, I don’t think it’ll take that long.

No doubt some institutional players are trying to drive the market, but I believe they will eventually want to run it back up for the big wins.  Given that folks like Elon can drive a 20%+ swing with a tweet, I suspect their is some sexy power that the haves will continue to manipulate and I’m hoping to ride the coat tails.

[Guest]

I know I’ve made my skeptical views clear, but the words of a non-skeptic are particularly insightful here underscoring my view:

12 hours ago, jtwalker said:

No doubt some institutional players are trying to drive the market, but I believe they will eventually want to run it back up for the big wins.  Given that folks like Elon can drive a 20%+ swing with a tweet, I suspect their is some sexy power that the haves will continue to manipulate and I’m hoping to ride the coat tails.

I wish you well in your bets…maybe hope is a strategy  

[KateNickolson]

Unlike almost any cryptocurrency, XRP is very fast, the confirmation in the network occurs literally in 4 seconds, while, for example in bitcoin this time takes from 20 minutes to several days, depending on the set commission for the transfer.
The price range of this cryptocurrency during this period may interest some traders. I recommend reading this article https://www.thecoinrepublic.com/2022/06/28/xrp-price-prediction-ripple-to-replace-us-dollar/. Because the value of the coin is expected to rise roughly twice in 2023, from $0.4 to $0.9. While the average price rate is expected to be around $0.75. If cooperation with financial institutions bears the expected fruits, the cryptocurrency could surpass its last record and achieve new victories. On the other hand 

[Luv2play]

 This thread has gone silent since early August. I only follow the news about crypto currencies in the regular press such as the NYT but even so I gather the fortunes of many crypto investors are in the trash can.

I read today that the OntarioTeachers Pension Fund, which had dipped its toe into crypto, has lost $95 million, which shows how conventional and cautious institutional investors have been sideswipped by the crash in bitcoins et al.

Last year when I read about how many small investors were getting sucked into the crypto frenzy, I was reminded about Joe Kennedy, JFK's father, who said in 1929 that when the elevator boys on Wall Street were talking about investing in the stock market, it was time to bail. He did and saved the Kennedy family fortune.

 

 

[Guest]

20 hours ago, Luv2play said:

 Last year when I read about how many small investors were getting sucked into the crypto frenzy, I was reminded about Joe Kennedy, JFK's father, who said in 1929 that when the elevator boys on Wall Street were talking about investing in the stock market, it was time to bail. He did and saved the Kennedy family fortune.

I guess you weren’t paying attention a few months ago when the simple explanation was offered:

On 6/14/2022 at 3:21 PM, Calix_V2 said:

This really is a young man's game. 

Wow!   I could’ve had a V8! 😉

Everything in life has pros and cons…but in the last six months, as least three cons have been added to crypto’s ledger:

• BTC is down 30%, other markets aren’t. 
• crypto is not as transparent as some libertarians and criminals expected, and
• crypto requires as much electricity as the country of Argentina.

Gee, I hope someone pays the electric bill 🤔

Edited November 25, 2022 by BnaC

[pubic_assistance]

Crypto was always a pyramid scheme.

It functions almost like a religion. Don't try to look for facts .  "Just believe".

[Guest]

Interestingly, I was considering a donation to wikipedia.   In reviewing their financials (they don't need my money...), I found the KPMG audit for the Wikimedia Foundation, the operator of wikipedia.

In addressing treatment of donated cryptocurrency in Footnote 1(l), it's interesting to see that crypto is classified as a NON-Financial Asset...and not lumped in with Cash and Investments.

Hmmm..."cryptoCURRENCY" that isn't "cash"...it doesn't even rise to the ambiguous classification of "Other Investments."   

So, I researched it some more and learned that GAAP treatment of cryptocurrency is as an INTANGIBLE ASSET....in other words, it's value classifies with what is commonly referred to as "airball" in leveraged finance - the price paid in excess of the underlying value of the asset acquired.

I think that's meaningful for folks who consider crypto an "investment"...Or, it could just be that  Wiki's Board, KPMG, and the FASB are made up of old farts like me who don't understand that "this really is a young man's game" for geniuses like Sam Bankman-Fried to run with...

Caveat Emptor

 

[KeepItReal]

20 minutes ago, BnaC said:

Interestingly, I was considering a donation to wikipedia.   In reviewing their financials (they don't need my money...), I found the KPMG audit for the Wikimedia Foundation, the operator of wikipedia.

In addressing treatment of donated cryptocurrency in Footnote 1(l), it's interesting to see that crypto is classified as a NON-Financial Asset...and not lumped in with Cash and Investments.

Hmmm..."cryptoCURRENCY" that isn't "cash"...it doesn't even rise to the ambiguous classification of "Other Investments."   

So, I researched it some more and learned that GAAP treatment of cryptocurrency is as an INTANGIBLE ASSET....in other words, it's value classifies with what is commonly referred to as "airball" in leveraged finance - the price paid in excess of the underlying value of the asset acquired.

I think that's meaningful for folks who consider crypto an "investment"...Or, it could just be that  Wiki's Board, KPMG, and the FASB are made up of old farts like me who don't understand that "this really is a young man's game" for geniuses like Sam Bankman-Fried to run with...

Caveat Emptor

 

Yes, under GAAP, crypto is not considered a cash equivalent, nor is it a financial instrument. There is a rare exception for stablecoin that may give you the right to an underlying currency - in which case it can be a financial instrument.  In general it is treated as an intangible asset and is carried at purchase price on the books, with impairment account rules in play when the market value drops below the purchase price. You can only recognize a profit in your P&L when you sell - fair value accounting is not allowed.  It can get complicated and the IRS is paying particular attention to it, so always consult with a good CPA before you get significantly invested. 

[Guest]

27 minutes ago, KeepItReal said:

Yes, under GAAP, crypto is not considered a cash equivalent, nor is it a financial instrument. There is a rare exception for stablecoin that may give you the right to an underlying currency - in which case it can be a financial instrument.  In general it is treated as an intangible asset and is carried at purchase price on the books, with impairment account rules in play when the market value drops below the purchase price. You can only recognize a profit in your P&L when you sell - fair value accounting is not allowed.  It can get complicated and the IRS is paying particular attention to it, so always consult with a good CPA before you get significantly invested. 

Thank you for that insight!   Stablecoin, while crypto, IS in fact secured by a contractual claim against the fiat currency and tangible commodities pledged as reserve against that claim, right?   In other words, in the “crypto space,” it’s a bird of another feather, right?  As a result, it has investment attributes, right?

Edited December 3, 2022 by BnaC

[+ glutes]

A 6.5% risk free return has not been available for decades. Nothing close. Anyone who thought there could possibly be a 6.5% riskless (or even low risk) return in 2022 conjures an old saying - "a fool and his money." I feel sorry for them, but yet I'm not sympathetic. Some people took their life savings into a casino and bet it all. Jeez.

We need financial literacy mandated classes in U.S. high schools before everyone is ultimately swindled out of everything they have. The fact that people are millions "investing" in so called cryptocurrencies tells us that we have a woefully inadequate financially educated populace. Using real money to buy fake money has got to be the most obvious con in history. And yet here we are

[Guest]

3 hours ago, glutes said:

A 6.5% risk free return has not been available for decades. Nothing close...

Series I Savings Bonds

 

6.89%

For savings bonds issued November 1, 2022 to April 30, 2023.

[Guest]

On 12/5/2022 at 10:59 PM, glutes said:

The fact that people are millions "investing" in so called cryptocurrencies tells us that we have a woefully inadequate financially educated populace.

Not just that, but buying lottery tickets too

[Guest]

On 12/10/2022 at 1:56 PM, arnemgreeves said:

Do people actually use crypto as a currency???

As far as I know, only in parts of El Salvador.

[Guest]

[marylander1940]

On 12/2/2022 at 12:31 PM, pubic_assistance said:

Crypto was always a pyramid scheme.

It functions almost like a religion. Don't try to look for facts .  "Just believe".

 

Agreed!

[marylander1940]

On 12/3/2022 at 11:54 AM, Guest said:

Interestingly, I was considering a donation to wikipedia.   In reviewing their financials (they don't need my money...), I found the KPMG audit for the Wikimedia Foundation, the operator of wikipedia.

In addressing treatment of donated cryptocurrency in Footnote 1(l), it's interesting to see that crypto is classified as a NON-Financial Asset...and not lumped in with Cash and Investments.

Hmmm..."cryptoCURRENCY" that isn't "cash"...it doesn't even rise to the ambiguous classification of "Other Investments."   

So, I researched it some more and learned that GAAP treatment of cryptocurrency is as an INTANGIBLE ASSET....in other words, it's value classifies with what is commonly referred to as "airball" in leveraged finance - the price paid in excess of the underlying value of the asset acquired.

I think that's meaningful for folks who consider crypto an "investment"...Or, it could just be that  Wiki's Board, KPMG, and the FASB are made up of old farts like me who don't understand that "this really is a young man's game" for geniuses like Sam Bankman-Fried to run with...

Caveat Emptor

 

Sam Bankman-Fried to be sentenced for multibillion-dollar crypto fraud – live | Sam Bankman-Fried | The Guardian

WWW.THEGUARDIAN.COM

---

Former CEO of now bankrupt FTX cryptocurrency exchange faces more than 100 years in prison if given maximum penalty

[TonyDown]

The late Charlie Munger called it rat poison.

Some of the younger technicians at work have plowed a chunk of their assets into crypto and  associated gimmicks.  They  encourage others to consider buying.  

Me? No!  I don't see it ending well.

 

Edited April 6, 2024 by TonyDown

[Guest]

On 12/6/2022 at 3:10 AM, Guest said:

Series I Savings Bonds

 

6.89%

For savings bonds issued November 1, 2022 to April 30, 2023.

Any return 15% and less when dealing with fiat currencies is not good and definitely does not outpace inflation. Those thinking 15% or less returns in fiat currency are barely outpacing inflation but are still net losers when investment management fees + taxes are also factored in. I like the Chapwood Index for a better inflation gauge:

Home - Chapwood Index

CHAPWOODINDEX.COM

---

The Real Cost of Living Increase Index It exposes why middle-class Americans — salaried workers who are given routine...

 

[Guest]

On 7/2/2022 at 8:43 PM, jtwalker said:

I am currently investing in crypto.  It has been around since 2009, has a huge following, and has a very positive track record.  Bitcoin is up around 70% over the past 3 years even with the recent crash.  It swings wild, but if you don't panic there is real money to be made here.

I got out after the last crash and noticed a trend.  When Bitcoin crashes, it tends to drop by 75-80%, then it tends to come back at 4x its previous high.  Right now, it has fallen approximately 72% from its last high.  I primarily invest in Bitcoin and Etherium and I use a hardware wallet to stay away from the exchange volatility.  I see it as a 2-5 year play and I'm investing slowly over time.

Investing 101 is buy low and sell high.  Real Estate is high right now (it won't stay there), Stocks are just starting their downward trend IMHO, Crypto is much closer to a potential bottom and buy point.  Can't predict the exact bottom, but that is where dollar-cost averaging comes in, and when it peaks again it won't matter that much if I bought at the true bottom.

Good observation on the Bitcoin bull bear cycles. Here’s a chart showing it clearly:

BITCOIN The Golden 51%-49% Ratio! 600 days of Bull Market left! for BITSTAMP:BTCUSD by TradingShot

WWW.TRADINGVIEW.COM

---

This is a really simple Bitcoin study on which I calculate the remaining days of the current Bull Cycle we are in based on the...

 

[Guest]

My take on etherium versus bitcoin..

 

Bitcoin: absolute fixed supply

Ether: unlimited supply

Bitcoin: unchanging

Ether: unstable

Bitcoin: Austrian

Ether: Keynesian

Bitcoin: network never goes down

Ether: always has issues

Bitcoin: decentralized tied to nature through proof of work

Ether: centralized tied to central planners through money printing

Bitcoin: no central point of failure

Ether: Ethereum Foundation, no decentralized mining operations, highly centralized

Bitcoin: all coins in circulation have been mined

Ether: 70% were issued up front

Bitcoin: defationary making all things cheaper over time

Ether: inflationary though they claim deflationary through burning, but ever changing regardless making its value proposition questionable

Bitcoin: a global monetary system outside of central planners

Ether: a system constantly altered by central planners

Bitcoin: a perfect engineered store of value

Ether: a ****coin akin to its predecessor, the US Dollar

Bitcoin: does not create coins from nothing to fund foundation

Ether: creates coins from nothing to fund their foundation, lawyers, media, the same way .gov funds its agencies

Bitcoin: in a class of its own

Ether: a ****coin that provided the platform for the creation of most all ****coins that have been used to commit theft from people all over the world

Bitcoin: an asset without an issuer, or commodity

Ether: a centralized software company that refuses to register as a security as it would require them to disclose risk to their investors

 

Bitcoin is a fixed supply global asset recognized by the SEC as a commodity and the worlds largest asset managers as a viable investment through SEC approved ETF's. I can use the bitcoin network to send value globally, instantly, for virtually free.

Ethereum is a centralized ****coin company that makes money through ignoring the law and supporting the creation of other ****coins that are then used to separate investors from their money. Ethereum issues the asset therefore is a security.

You may not like bitcoin but NEVER conflate it with the ****coins, including Ether. Bitcoin is perfect engineered money, Ether is a central planners wet dream.

[Guest]

I’m waiting with bated breath to see how people will pay off their debts once central bank digital currencies (programmable money issued by central banks) or Synthetic central bank digital currencies (programmable money issued by commercial banks) are rolled out to the general public - though the synthetic instance seems more likely in the USA before 2030 at this point…

Summary of David Roger Webb’s new book The Great Taking:

[jtwalker]

15 hours ago, EarlDiesel_XL said:

Good observation on the Bitcoin bull bear cycles. Here’s a chart showing it clearly:

BITCOIN The Golden 51%-49% Ratio! 600 days of Bull Market left! for BITSTAMP:BTCUSD by TradingShot

WWW.TRADINGVIEW.COM

---

This is a really simple Bitcoin study on which I calculate the remaining days of the current Bull Cycle we are in based on the...

 

I love that chart!  Thanks!