pay cut...

[+ sniper]

I think people at the bottom will suffer significantly because unemployment insurance is measly and limited, even with the booster.

 

of the money that was appropriated by Congress 83% is going to 43,000 individuals earning OVER $1,000,000

Unemployed people at the bottom...and even up to around the median...will actually be taking home more on unemployment. Unemployment is typically something like half to 2/3 of pay, and then with $600/week added to that, it's a raise for anyone earning $50something thousand or less. It's the people at that payscale who still have jobs that are getting shafted. Working harder, subject to risk of exposure, and no extra pay(though some places have given temporary boosts to workers, by no means have all done so.)

[+ sam.fitzpatrick]

Much, if not most, of the money is going to franchisees which eventually benefits the parent company. McDonalds, Hilton, etc.

 

I think that is a stretch that while in the long-term is probably true - the franchisor does benefit from the franchisee remaining in operation; most franchisees are small businesses owning one, sometimes two locations. For many, it takes several years before they recoup their initial investments and even then do not have a reserve to sustain the business through the a long shut down like we're currently experiencing.

 

How places like Shake Shake, the LA Lakers etc qualify is a mystery since they clearly have more than 500 employees.

 

Most professional sports teams actually have fewer than 500 employees, and the NBA is probably closer to 250.

[+ tassojunior]

I think that is a stretch that while in the long-term is probably true - the franchisor does benefit from the franchisee remaining in operation; most franchisees are small businesses owning one, sometimes two locations. For many, it takes several years before they recoup their initial investments and even then do not have a reserve to sustain the business through the a long shut down like we're currently experiencing.

 

 

 

Most professional sports teams actually have fewer than 500 employees, and the NBA is probably closer to 250.

 

 

I think they should have mandated a waiver from franchise fees, both set and %, for a number of months as part of the relief package. The franchiser is being greatly benefited by the government helping to keep it's franchisees in business and the relief is not meant to benefit large national corporation franchisers. Marriott and McDonald's can weather the storm by just issuing more stock.

[+ bigjoey]

There is a joke that McDonald’s is really a real estate company that sells hamburgers. They own much of the sites where their franchise locations are located.

 

If the government mandated that McDonald’s reduce its fees to franchises, why not demand that other companies reduce the prices of merchandise or services they sell? To real estate companies that get PPP, why not demand they reduce rents? If this was to happen, you would have the government setting prices throughout the whole economy.

 

SIDE NOTE:

McDonald's is giving first responders and healthcare workers free 'Thank You meals'

McDonald's is doing its part to ensure that the frontline workers across America are not going to go hungry amid this pandemic. Participating McDonald's locations are giving first responders and healthcare workers a free "Thank You meal."

Read in CNN Business: https://apple.news/AUGVd9W-CR7CFpoQRXEAS4Q

[+ PapaTony]

Unemployed people at the bottom...and even up to around the median...will actually be taking home more on unemployment. Unemployment is typically something like half to 2/3 of pay, and then with $600/week added to that, it's a raise for anyone earning $50something thousand or less. It's the people at that payscale who still have jobs that are getting shafted. Working harder, subject to risk of exposure, and no extra pay(though some places have given temporary boosts to workers, by no means have all done so.)

 

I don’t know which state you live in but your numbers have no basis in reality in California.

I was furloughed in mid-March. I earned a low six figure salary. My UI benefit is $450 per week, significantly less than my usual net pay AND its taxable. Even with the $600 boost I’m under water.

 

AND, one has to earn over $46,500 annually to be eligible for the top tier UI of $450. Benefits decrease as a ratio to earnings below $46,500.

 

So don’t throw your right-wing “they make more on unemployment” bullshit talking point at me.

[+ sniper]

(450+600)×52=54600. Which is more than $46,500. Median full-time wages in the US were about 48k in 2019. I was talking about people at the bottom half of the income distribution, not people in high COL areas. I never said nobody was hurting or there weren't gaps. Nor did I say we shouldn't be doing this.

[MikeBiDude]

it's a raise for anyone earning $50something thousand or less.

I earned a low six figure salary

Well in @sniper defense and to his point he clearly stated those earning under $50k, and you clearly state you earn over.

 

I employ entry level workers at minimum wage and above (in SoCal). I’m having trouble recruiting employees because right now for the majority of this pool they are getting paid more on unemployment and stimulus than they would get working.

 

I’m rewarding my current loyal and hard working employees with bonuses based on their hours worked to thank them for their extra effort during this pandemic.

[+ DERRIK]

I expect some industries will recover faster than others. i hope to fly to Tokyo in December. I expect to stay in a hotel before year end. I suspect I will be going to the movies at sometime. Some industries will have a steeper climb like the car business.

 

In 2019 - nineteen million cars were manufactured globally. In 2008 when we had the auto bailout - eight million were manufactured. I doubt congress will be jumping up and down for another car bailout. Car companies are heavily leveraged - thus this sector / suppliers / employees will have a rough period.

[+ PapaTony]

Well in @sniper defense and to his point he clearly stated those earning under $50k, and you clearly state you earn over.

 

I employ entry level workers at minimum wage and above (in SoCal). I’m having trouble recruiting employees because right now for the majority of this pool they are getting paid more on unemployment and stimulus than they would get working.

 

I’m rewarding my current loyal and hard working employees with bonuses based on their hours worked to thank them for their extra effort during this pandemic.

I’m curious: what type of essential service do you provide that requires workers now?

[+ Pensant]

I expect some industries will recover faster than others. i hope to fly to Tokyo in December. I expect to stay in a hotel before year end. I suspect I will be going to the movies at sometime. Some industries will have a steeper climb like the car business.

 

In 2019 - nineteen million cars were manufactured globally. In 2008 when we had the auto bailout - eight million were manufactured. I doubt congress will be jumping up and down for another car bailout. Car companies are heavily leveraged - thus this sector / suppliers / employees will have a rough period.

There should be some extraordinary deals on high-end used cars this summer.

[MikeBiDude]

I’m curious: what type of essential service do you provide that requires workers now?

Food service

[+ Charlie]

I expect some industries will recover faster than others. i hope to fly to Tokyo in December. I expect to stay in a hotel before year end. I suspect I will be going to the movies at sometime. Some industries will have a steeper climb like the car business.

 

In 2019 - nineteen million cars were manufactured globally. In 2008 when we had the auto bailout - eight million were manufactured. I doubt congress will be jumping up and down for another car bailout. Car companies are heavily leveraged - thus this sector / suppliers / employees will have a rough period.

The big increase in global car manufacturing between 2008 and 2019 is partly due to the big increase in manufacturing and sales in China during that period, not in American car makers, so I am sure you are right about no incentive for another bailout from Congress. The sales numbers in the US for all cars from all manufacturers this year and next will probably decline noticeably because private owners are using their cars so much less that they will need fewer replacements, and at the same time many owners will have less money to replace their less-used cars. Will fleet owners, especially car rental companies, reconsider their routine replacements after a few years of cars that have had little use? I bought a new car in December, and I am already getting lots of come-ons from the dealer for servicing, although I have only put 1000 miles on the vehicle.

[+ bigjoey]

Well in @sniper defense and to his point he clearly stated those earning under $50k, and you clearly state you earn over.

 

I employ entry level workers at minimum wage and above (in SoCal). I’m having trouble recruiting employees because right now for the majority of this pool they are getting paid more on unemployment and stimulus than they would get working.

 

I’m rewarding my current loyal and hard working employees with bonuses based on their hours worked to thank them for their extra effort during this pandemic.

 

You are not alone:

https://www.forbes.com/sites/jackkelly/2020/04/28/furloughed-workers-dont-want-to-return-to-their-jobs-as-theyre-earning-more-money-with-unemployment/

[+ bashful]

The big increase in global car manufacturing between 2008 and 2019 is partly due to the big increase in manufacturing and sales in China during that period, not in American car makers, so I am sure you are right about no incentive for another bailout from Congress. The sales numbers in the US for all cars from all manufacturers this year and next will probably decline noticeably because private owners are using their cars so much less that they will need fewer replacements, and at the same time many owners will have less money to replace their less-used cars. Will fleet owners, especially car rental companies, reconsider their routine replacements after a few years of cars that have had little use? I bought a new car in December, and I am already getting lots of come-ons from the dealer for servicing, although I have only put 1000 miles on the vehicle.

 

Saw a teaser either in the paper, or on the internet, can’t remember where, and didn’t read the article. The teaser said something about car dealers have stopped accepting lease returns unless you buy or lease another car because they have no place to put the car.

[+ Reisr30]

We learned we are all taking paycuts too. It’s a bummer but I’m thankful I have a job.

[+ tassojunior]

Will fleet owners, especially car rental companies, reconsider their routine replacements after a few years of cars that have had little use?

Saw today where Hertz has notified it's car fleet financiers they won't be getting paid for a while and Hertz is considering bankruptcy.

[BSR]

I am sorry for the posters who have taken pay cuts, but I'm glad to see they are keeping a positive attitude about it, that is, being grateful for still having a job, albeit at reduced pay.

 

While waiting in line for a prescription this week, the woman in front of me (despite the marked-off 6-foot distancing) struck up conversation. She told me that she had been working for 5-1/2 months at a job when she got laid off. Unfortunately, you need to work 6 months to qualify for unemployment in Nevada. Ouch! I responded, "Oh my God, that is so heartbreaking." She just said, "Yeah" and turned around.

[samhexum]

[+ Pensant]

Saw a teaser either in the paper, or on the internet, can’t remember where, and didn’t read the article. The teaser said something about car dealers have stopped accepting lease returns unless you buy or lease another car because they have no place to put the car.

I’m looking forward to negotiating on a low mileage pre-owned car in June. They’ll be selling below cost since they’ll need the cash. Of course, I’ll have a tough time selling my 2015 model, but I can always gift it.

[maninsoma]

I don’t know which state you live in but your numbers have no basis in reality in California.

I was furloughed in mid-March. I earned a low six figure salary. My UI benefit is $450 per week, significantly less than my usual net pay AND its taxable. Even with the $600 boost I’m under water.

 

AND, one has to earn over $46,500 annually to be eligible for the top tier UI of $450. Benefits decrease as a ratio to earnings below $46,500.

 

So don’t throw your right-wing “they make more on unemployment” bullshit talking point at me.

 

The problem is that national tax laws in the United States never take in account the relative cost of living. Someone living in San Francisco making $99,000/year, the cutoff at which he received no stimulus check, is relatively poor given the cost of housing here when compared to most areas of the country. When a 1-bedroom apartment rents for more than $3,000/month, even the added $600 in unemployment benefits for those here who lost a job means that those people will struggle to pay rent and other expenses with the extra money and will no way be able to afford expenses if they are still unemployed after the extra stimulus money runs dry. Of course some people here have sweet rent deals due to rent control and others have mortgages that they can still afford, but the sad reality is that $54K in San Francisco doesn't go very far whereas in a lot of areas of the country that's more than enough to cover rent and other basic expenses. I sent an email to Nancy Pelosi about this and, of course, received no response. I wouldn't advocate for doing something that would be inherently unfair such as giving more to people who live in one area versus another, but I think the federal government could have created this pool of money going to states to enhance existing unemployment benefits such that the extra amount given to each person was based on the newly unemployed's person previous salary versus this one-size-fits-all situation where we have some people getting more money remaining unemployed and others who, despite the added benefits, are getting less than half their previous salary.

 

I feel fortunate that I am still working. I already found out that I am not getting the raise I was scheduled to receive in July, and I won't be surprised to learn soon that my pay is being cut in exchange for getting more time off since that's what happened during the last recession and the current economic situation is more dire.

[+ PapaTony]

The problem is that national tax laws in the United States never take in account the relative cost of living. Someone living in San Francisco making $99,000/year, the cutoff at which he received no stimulus check, is relatively poor given the cost of housing here when compared to most areas of the country. When a 1-bedroom apartment rents for more than $3,000/month, even the added $600 in unemployment benefits for those here who lost a job means that those people will struggle to pay rent and other expenses with the extra money and will no way be able to afford expenses if they are still unemployed after the extra stimulus money runs dry. Of course some people here have sweet rent deals due to rent control and others have mortgages that they can still afford, but the sad reality is that $54K in San Francisco doesn't go very far whereas in a lot of areas of the country that's more than enough to cover rent and other basic expenses. I sent an email to Nancy Pelosi about this and, of course, received no response. I wouldn't advocate for doing something that would be inherently unfair such as giving more to people who live in one area versus another, but I think the federal government could have created this pool of money going to states to enhance existing unemployment benefits such that the extra amount given to each person was based on the newly unemployed's person previous salary versus this one-size-fits-all situation where we have some people getting more money remaining unemployed and others who, despite the added benefits, are getting less than half their previous salary.

 

I feel fortunate that I am still working. I already found out that I am not getting the raise I was scheduled to receive in July, and I won't be surprised to learn soon that my pay is being cut in exchange for getting more time off since that's what happened during the last recession and the current economic situation is more dire.

Thank you for bringing up the COL disparities; a very real factor in this argument.

 

as for Speaker Pelosi and fed relief: the house did include lots of money for the states but Trump fired the IG that was to oversee the funding and it is trumps treasury department that is playing games with disbursements. I wrote in another posting how RED states are receiving funds, relative to infection rates, at obnoxiously higher percentages than blue states.

[MikeBiDude]

wow. Right after 23 dealing with franchises, 24 extends PPP to many company-owned locations too....

Answer: Under the CARES Act, any single business entity that is assigned a NAICS code beginning with 72 (including hotels and restaurants) and that employs not more than 500 employees per physical location is eligible to receive a PPP loan.

Twist to the “free” PPP monies. IRS might not allow regular deductions on payroll/rents funded by PPP funds. This could provide costly.

https://www.forbes.com/sites/robertwood/2020/04/30/irs-denies-tax-deductions-for-wages-rent-paid-with-forgivable-ppp-loans/#3b22df591c15

 

and

 

https://www.foxbusiness.com/personal-finance/coronavirus-loan-recipients-ineligible-tax-deductions

 

And I wouldn’t think you can “reserve” any PPP funds for future taxes, because the PPP funds have to be properly distributed to payroll/rent etc. within 8 weeks of receiving funds, or no forgiveness. Catch 22?

[+ bigjoey]

Twist to the “free” PPP monies. IRS might not allow regular deductions on payroll/rents funded by PPP funds. This could provide costly.

https://www.forbes.com/sites/robertwood/2020/04/30/irs-denies-tax-deductions-for-wages-rent-paid-with-forgivable-ppp-loans/#3b22df591c15

 

and

 

https://www.foxbusiness.com/personal-finance/coronavirus-loan-recipients-ineligible-tax-deductions

 

And I wouldn’t think you can “reserve” any PPP funds for future taxes, because the PPP funds have to be properly distributed to payroll/rent etc. within 8 weeks of receiving funds, or no forgiveness. Catch 22?

 

If you are not declaring the PPP money as taxable income, then not being able to take a deduction makes sense. It does not hurt a company.

 

Also, non-profits are getting PPP monies so it makes no difference to them.

[+ tassojunior]

Also, non-profits are getting PPP monies so it makes no difference to them.

 

I think there are a lot of non-profit companies right now. (maybe not 501's)

[MikeBiDude]

PPP disbursements seems to be regular and more free flowing right now with various companies I consult with. 5 entities funded over the weekend via CA Bank of America/SBA.

 

SBA shut off big asset banks for a few hours last week, only letting smaller institutions send applications and requests to the SBA.