Simon Suraci

Agree. Recently had a wonderful experience with Jayden, highly recommend. Must. Book. Ahead! And it’s totally worth it. Be patient. Heads up he is moving this summer. He plans to live out of state and spend part of the year in Mexico. Good for him. See him while he’s still in north Dallas while you still can! Not my top guy in Dallas because I have very high standards for massage quality, but he’s up way up there. He gives a great balance of quality therapy, looks, friendliness, and level of interaction. Goes the whole time, clear directions. Sexy voice (and body omg!). Looks just like his photos but friendlier in person. Great smile. 35 yo this year. You will love him.

Now this is a case of the delusional client. Henry Cavill would never be bought for such a paltry sum! He’s so hot. Loved him in Tudors.

Those gym shorts tho….! I wear the same kind almost every day, also typically freeballing. Except mine have those little jersey style perforations in the fabric for more airflow. And I wear them in cool colors, or neutrals like white, black, or gray. Red is really unflattering on my pale skin. Works for this guy though. Love them. I digress…this is so off topic…

Excellent point. I agree. What a nightmare some guy presuming it’s ok to stay at your place after a hookup and then continuing to pressure you to allow him to stay. The whole under the trampoline suggestion sounds pretty desperate. Sounds like he may be living on the streets and this is how he is surviving at the moment. So strange. It’s like he wants you to make his personal crisis your problem. I guess it’s equally difficult to get them there as it is to get them to go. Escorts just want your patronage. The rest of society wants something else, whether that be your body, or a place to stay or something else. Most normal people would leave after activities have ended, especially after you ask them to go, and you explicitly tell them no. Not him! Frustrating. Hot boy though. Hope that booty was worth the midnight hassle. Value the pros. As much as hiring can be frustrating at times for various reasons, it offers real value. This is one of those points of value.

Anyone charging $1k/hr is either delusional, inexperienced, unprofessional, completely broke, desperate, all of the above….or….totally worth it and going to give you the most professional treatment you can expect from any provider you’ve ever contacted both in text and in person. Even still, that’s very steep. He’s not worth your time. This guy’s a clown. I agree with @BuffaloKyle it would have helped to close the conversation with the briefest explanation thanking him (you did) and saying you have decided not to hire. I think you reasonably did close the convo, without being so explicit about it. That should suffice, but the extra level of closure helps. It was the provider’s choice to initiate follow up contact with you the next day. That tells me he wants your business, but he’s treating you like you are wasting his time. It’s like he’s saying “please, grovel at my feet because I have a party trick of cumming three times without a refractory period.” Oh please, kid, get a grip and get a life. Some will take him up on his offer, but that pool of people is very, very small. He can charge 1k for one client, or something between $250-$500+ and have a hundred clients for every one who is willing to hire him at 1k. That’s his choice. Let him live with it, learn, and then either exit the industry, or get realistic with his business.

We are human beings. This is not an easy job, even though we make it look that way. We have bad days at times. You never know what is going on in a person’s life in a given moment. Maybe this was a bad day for him for some reason. He honored your appointment and he made an effort. The professional he was, he declined payment because he did not deliver on your mutual agreements and expectations. That’s fair. Uncommon, but fair. Kudos to you both for behaving so well toward one another. If the chemistry was such that he couldn’t do this with you at all, maybe it’s for the best. If he was just having an off day, I certainly think it would be worth trying again. Suggestion: ask him if, when, and under what circumstances would be best to reschedule. Maybe he’s better in the morning when testosterone is at the peak? I know I am. Or maybe he was too ambitious scheduling too soon after the last client. Not your problem, I acknowledge, but still, gives him a chance to redeem himself under better circumstances.

Phone convos are great, especially after first establishing contact via text. However, I don’t accept phone calls as the initial communication, or at any hour of the day or night at the drop of a hat. If I happen to be available and in a private space, and the person is already a known contact in my phone, I’ll take the call. The other 99% of the time I ignore until the client asks via text to schedule a call. If I answered every random client and spam call, I would spend all day doing nothing but unpaid talking, with no time left over to actually work on clients. I haven’t done one yet, but this forum has inspired me to create an intro video for my ads. I’ve never liked my “gay” voice due to my internalized homophobia. It’s not very strong, but it’s there, probably much more evident to me than to others. For many years I was highly critical of my own voice and hated hearing it played back, but have since learned to accept myself and love my voice. Anyone who doesn’t like me because of my voice can take a hike. That’s not the kind of person I want to be around anyway. So, maybe the video will be a natural filter, to attract more clients who like me for me and weed out the toxic masculinity minded types. I like that. Stay tuned for the video, it will be a while after the dust settles on my move back to CA…I need a fresh photos update too, should be in the next few months.

Reporting back. I’m happy to confirm that both guys charge the same rate. One husband is white, one husband is black. I already know the white husband and have worked with him before. I brought him in for my client who wanted to hire three guys for a group play session. Selecting him had nothing to do with my client’s preferences for a certain look, age, body type or race. It’s really just who I suggested based on existing relationships and a level of trust going with someone I know. The third guy is also white, but again same reasons for suggesting him. No particular client preferences (or my own, for that matter) for certain races. The client trusted my recommendations and had a spectacular time. We rocked his world. He has since hired all three of us again and really enjoyed himself. The client has also hired the other two guys individually for massage, but I’m still his go-to guy for his regular massages, and the occasional bdsm session. The white provider husband says that his clients who are interested in hiring two providers typically aren’t interested in hiring his black provider husband, specifically because of his race. Some are direct about it, some others are much less direct about why. It’s a shame. They’re both stunning IMO. Seems like you would get a better experience hiring two married-to-one-another-men who are both working in the industry and have great existing chemistry with one another. All to say, yes, implicit and explicit bias are still quite prevalent in the hiring world, but I am glad to confirm their rates are the same, as they should be, all other things being equal as they are in this case.

Almost the same conversation as this one:

If the OP @lseactuary90 has so little trouble hooking up with so many attractive men on apps and whatnot, I don’t understand why he even wants/needs to hire. Hiring facilitates a client’s path to access experiences with the people he wants, doing the things he wants, when he wants. These benefits have value no matter how conventionally attractive the client may be. Hiring is for everyone. However, if his aim is simply to bag a hot guy, that’s apparently easy enough for him without the transaction. Understandably, most of those won’t be mind-blowing experiences. I don’t see the point. If his goal is to make it faster and more convenient to have sex with men he’s interested in, then great. Hiring can absolutely fulfill that function. If his goal is to feel genuine love, I think the hiring route is futile. A client can have a great connection with a provider without it having to be something akin to love, but it takes effort and trying things, and seeing different people. Most of that feeling of wanting to call a man back stems from what happens outside of the bedroom. Not how hot he looks, or how good his body feels in an engaging sexual moment together. While those are nice and certainly make for a better experience, I believe that outside the bedroom concept applies to a hiring relationship and to personal relationships. For personal relationships, that’s chemistry which can lead to love. For hiring relationships, it’s chemistry on its own - liking someone for who they are and how they are, and for how they are to you. It can’t be love when the relationship is transactional. If the OP is looking for a feeling akin to love, or something leading to love, I believe that’s best to pursue in his own personal life. Not to say a provider has never fallen in love with a client, but that’s literally what we do: offer some form of performative intimacy that isn’t actually love, and can never be because provider livelihoods depend precisely on it NOT being genuine love. A man can be the best sex you’ve ever had, but if you feel nothing for him, the whole thing is moot. I suggest sticking to the dating or hookup apps, or meeting IRL. Nobody here can create the chemistry you seek through a recommendation. A client must find it himself, either in his own personal life, or through hiring different guys he’s interested in seeing. If the OP wants information on certain providers, it takes research and effort to put together a short list, as others have outlined. Once he has a short list, the forums here are great places to ask for more information about each specific one. Either way, personal or hiring, it takes work. Work to meet halfway to connect with someone, to have compassion, empathy, genuine interest in getting to know them, and find common interests and common ground as human beings and to celebrate those things. These matter, even if it’s a brief encounter. The looks and the sex are just a huge bonus. Maybe for some, the looks and the sex are a “starting point”. All of the above elevate sex and the overall experience to the level I believe the OP is looking for. Even if a client does the work of identifying the people he feels he might have the best connections with, the connection doesn’t always manifest. In that case, the only thing to do is keep trying with someone new until things click. When you know, you know, and it feels right.

I mostly agree. Good guy, and had an enjoyable experience once, but he’s sorely lacking in the pressure department. I would see him if you’re in the mood for a sensual, soft type of experience and some extras, but NOT if you need therapeutic / deep tissue work.

@Jarrod_Uncut, Welcome back! The last round of posts were pretty brutal. I don’t blame you for taking a break from the forums. Here’s my two cents on the above. I don’t expect you to agree with me, or to change your mind or approach. I don’t think I’m ‘right’ either, just different. I’m learning more and more that clients require quite a bit of handholding. The average COM member is not one of them. Gold stars to the clients who read the ad and tick all the boxes for themselves, but they are the minority, something less than half of all inquiries I receive. I believe the extra effort pays off in the end, drudgery though it may be. Not every client is going to work out, and I’ve found peace accepting that and moving on, while continuing to handhold the next one regardless of whether they work out either. Many of my clients have commented on how appreciative they were that I spent the extra time and effort to earn their trust and business. I agree it’s annoying that clients can’t be bothered to read the ad, but I’ve accepted that handholding is a necessary part of my strategy. That is, if my strategy aim is to have more clients overall. I can certainly spend less time and effort only accepting the clients who are with the program from the get-go, but my strategy is to balance quantity of clients with heavier investment in each of them. Your strategy I might consider to be lower upfront investment, but fewer (and perhaps better, easier) clients to deal with. This is where I think our approaches differ; being willing to meet the client where they are, figuratively speaking. Responding that the client is lazy (which is entirely true, btw) is off-putting. I wouldn’t want to hire someone that spoke to me that way. It’s rude. I’m not here to defend bad client behavior or tell you how to run your business, but I do want to point out how different approaches might yield different results. Knowing how you are, unsolicited suggestions won’t change anything about how you operate. That’s fine, and it’s not my aim. I still think the conversation is useful to have, if not for you and me, for the other members reading. Maybe you’re not willing to deal with clients who don’t read the ad. That’s fine. I get it. I don’t enjoy spending extra time typing out all the info (or copying-pasting), but I know doing this has gained me a great many clients I wouldn’t otherwise have. Many of them are regulars, so the upfront investment pays off over time. For me, it’s worth it. Maybe for you, it’s not. In either of our cases, a rude comment won’t do us any favors. That invites clients to lash back out at us, which leads us to the client calling you a hooker…that was uncalled for. A different approach, one I believe is closer to yours, might be to only deal with the clients who get it, and dismiss the remainder. Honestly, I think that’s a valid approach. You waste so much less of your time and energy that way. As long as you’re happy with the number and types of clients you have, go for it. You can’t complain about having too few clients though. The point is to have better, but fewer clients. Why not? Nothing wrong with being choosy about who you engage with, regardless of how rude or polite your responses are. It’s just a different strategy. Rudeness, however, I believe gets us nowhere, no matter what your strategy. I’m not perfect. Occasionally I lash out with a sassy or mean comment too. I regret when I do, and usually relent. This one below from today is me feeling pissy because I hate missing out on work. Clients like this require me to be immediately available to respond to a text, otherwise I don’t get the job. When I’m working at the time they text, I can’t possibly respond right away…and it’s not my fault; it’s poor client planning and zero client patience. I can’t control the fact that the client is only willing to book “whoever responds first” in less than an hour. (i.e. multiple provider requests = time waster client). That’s bullshit, but I’ll table that for another topic. Here’s the text with the client, whom I’ve seen before: Who else loves DARK MODE ❤️ ?

I just had a conversation with a prospective client over the phone today. He wants to book me for a weekend in his city a few months from now. I have family there and was already considering a work trip in his city, so I plan to coordinate around that knowing it won’t be a total loss should anything not work out, and a big plus if all does work out. I mentioned my “sleeping habits” and not-so-great sides of myself, emphasizing my value is in my waking hours. He didn’t care. I communicated expectations for having an hour or two to myself per day for working out and taking a break. Travel costs are to be reimbursed. All good there. We covered all of his wants and needs and preferences too. All good there. He still wants to book me for the whole weekend. I think the key is being upfront and open in your communication. Phone conversations help. Sometimes clients want you for you, no matter the hassle or cost. It’s worth taking risks, as @big-n-tallmentioned.

@KennFYou know where to find me! I’ll haunt your dreams long after.

I’m one of the few who offer 1/2 hr service. However, it’s just for massage, and not a full body massage, at that. And I charge a slight premium for it. It’s usually just my leg and lower body routine (most popular), or neck and shoulders, or specifics per client request. I’m with you guys on the overnight situation. I don’t do very well sharing a bed with anyone, not even my partner. Cuddling is fine, but when it’s time to sleep, I prefer having plenty of my own space, ideally in a separate room. This is why I discourage clients hiring me for overnights, but I will do it for the right fee if they absolutely must have that experience…of me snoring, and being grouchy in my sleep, tossing and turning, hogging the blanket, being too hot, and morning breath and seeing me in a sleep mask, etc. Ugh. My value is in my waking hours. Unless you want to keep me up all night. Then I will really have a peachy and lively attitude for you to enjoy by 5am! I’ve thought about calling these a BDSM session because it’s basically torture for the client 😂

Coming at this from a masseur perspective. I offer discounts or run temporary specials for massage and spa services. Things like: Day of the week discount Referral discounts Active duty military, student/youth, airline workers, first responders, etc %off for couples massages for a limited time, etc Book 4 spa services, get one of them free, or similar ….among many others Masseur Finder encourages these kinds of specials and discounts and rewards listing rank when you list them, so I keep it as consistent as possible across platforms, or when people ask for deals. Rarely do clients take advantage of my standing referral discount. That’s my best one for them and the most costly to me. It’s 50% off the referring client’s next massage, and 50% off the referral client’s first massage. That’s essentially giving away a whole massage. BUT it’s valuable to me in the long term because the referrals often become regular clients, and they tend to be better clients in general. In the short term, both the referral and referring clients both tend to tip generously anyways because they’re so happy to get such a deep discount, so it offsets the initial loss quite a bit. Win-win-win! Added benefit: buzz. The referral client and referring client speak positively about my work with one another, which reinforces both of their loyalty, and encourages them to refer others or speak positively about me to others. They feel invested in my success and also in the benefit of other people enjoying my work. They feel they have given something valuable to their friends, acquaintances, and loved ones, and feel good about it. I love referrals. Too bad so few take advantage, but when they do, it pays off. For traditional provider services (not massage or spa), I don’t discount. Not at all. Clients ask and pressure me. Or worse, they want the world for a massage price. Not happening. I say no and move on. I don’t want those clients. You can’t commodify this type of work. For it to be worth my time and effort, I set my fees accordingly. Also, most of my business is massage anyway. I don’t rely exclusively on the other work for my livelihood, it’s just another service I do for clients that want to hire me under equitable rates for it. Currently I’m at $300/hr and $500/ two hours. $1000 for up to five hours (not overnight). Don’t quote me two years later. That’s what it is now. Longer periods are negotiable, but I rarely do them. The $1k rate is more of a traditional escort service that usually includes event attendance, meals, drinks, or entertainment, etc. in addition to whatever happens privately.

@AZN_NYC, in this biz the scenario you described happens ALL THE TIME. It’s particularly puzzling that you had two good prior encounters and then the client was so inconsiderate the third time. Knowing his double booking behavior, however, frankly I am unsurprised. This happens at times, even with good repeat clients, although less frequently than with first time clients. It’s like they treat us like garbage and expect us to be available on call, hot, fresh, and ready in 20 mins in the same way you order a pizza. Those clients can go to hell. I have no patience for it. I agree with @Jamie21’s approach, I handle a lot of it the same way he does. When they do this, you can: 1) Refuse to see them again. Politely decline their requests. Explain -only if they insist on why- that they failed to meet their commitment last time, and failed to communicate, and that you won’t see them anymore. You don’t need to explain how much it put you out, how it cost you other bookings, frustration, wasted your time, travel costs, etc. I feel all the same things you do, TRUST. But clients don’t give a shit about you, especially this guy, and others like him. He cares about himself only. He’s an asshole. Don’t tolerate working for assholes anymore. Save your breath too, because he will continue his bad behavior no matter what you say. Cut your losses and move on. Eventually you will develop a thicker skin to better weather situations like these. They will happen again. It’s unavoidable in this industry. 2) Or…require a sizeable deposit for that client next time, like 50%. Explain, if they insist, that they failed to meet their commitment last time, and failed to communicate, and that you will only see them if they send a deposit. Many clients freak out and refuse to book when you require a deposit, and for good reason. Deposits are discussed ad nauseum in other threads so I won’t get into it that much here. Since you both have had successful meetings in the past, he should have every confidence that you will follow through on your commitment, not be a scammer, and not have the usual common concerns with sending deposits. If he refuses, there’s your answer. He’s clearly not serious enough to demonstrate in any meaningful way that he will fulfill his commitment to meet, or at the very least, communicate. He’s also not sorry he stood you up before either. If he was, this is his opportunity to make good. He will likely refuse and move on to the next guy he can mistreat and waste his time instead. That’s a client you don’t want, no matter how many successful past appointments you’ve had. Cut the cord. Force his hand so you can confidently move on and mentally refocus on the right clients and opportunities, and not let him continue to drain you emotionally. Here on COM for the most part you get good clients who are more considerate and communicative than the average client. I’m sure nobody here in this forum is raising their hand saying “I’m the asshole!” and defending the types of bad behavior you described. Those clients are *usually* elsewhere, in the wild. This forum is an oasis of civilization. Out there, it’s pretty bleak. Work on that thick skin. I’m continuing to work on mine.

Glen (BodyLogic) is a personal friend of mine. We’ve traded a few times. He’s certified and works in San Francisco and Dallas. He’s a flight attendant, living in both cities. In the past he’s worked at places like Massage Envy. Before Covid he owned a corporate massage business with Andrew Eric. Haven’t seen Andrew Eric, have no experience positive or negative. Glen gives a decent massage. He has many strong opinions if you get to talking with him. PM me if you have any specific questions.

I wholeheartedly recommend Dann. Very good massage. He offers esthetician services as well, like waxing. I went for massage enjoyed his work. We chat at the gym from time to time. He’s sexy, and such a nice guy.

Yes, to be fair, I agree with these positives. To be fair, I only saw Tim briefly. He ended the massage 5-10 mins into the session due to a family emergency. He didn’t charge me, which I felt was appropriate. Still, I can tell right away, even after a few mins whether someone is talented. The massage trajectory was a resounding….meh. Still, better than Mason of course. Tim is a great looking guy in person.

Mine: Freschatta Prizone My partner’s: Callison Vane I’ve considered: Nika Xena Twist (Aussies may appreciate that one more…) Irma Gird Una Vail-Bull Freesia Asshoff

@wolverine26tx Oh yeah, the wallet in back pocket conversation! Thanks for jogging my memory. My shorts have no pockets, so I keep my wallet in my murse 😆 Same feelings as @Lohengrin1979. This is one of the few times I regret not cutting it short and leaving. I hope for Mason’s sake and every unsuspecting client’s sake that he pursues other employment. This gig is clearly not working for him.

https://www.masseurfinder.com/massage-therapists/45255/ He’s back advertising after a long absence. I tried him in August 2021. One of the worst masseur experiences ever. Figured he was gone for good because how could he survive when offering such bad service? I assumed the problem resolved itself without the need to report. Since he’s back, I want to warn others in Dallas or visiting. Also curious if anyone had a positive experience with him. It was NOT A MASSAGE. He started using a theragun and I asked him to use his hands and arms instead. He insisted and complained that his arms get tired and his fingers are sore from texting all day. Barely even put his hands on my body. I was not trying to touch him at all, and he encouraged me to do so, saying mutual touch is part of it. I said no thanks, I’m good. He placed my hand on his body and complained that my hands were too cold. Tried not to go there but he forced the issue and made it seem like I was putting him out. He was in and out of the massage room at points doing who knows what. I booked two hours, and it was the worst $200 I have ever spent. It was a total of 30 mins on the table. The rest of the time he was taking me in his shower for a body scrub, or laying me on his bed to cuddle, or talking a really long time before we started. By talking I mean him talking AT me, standing there rambling for a good 15-20 mins before we even started, on topics I showed no interest in. I did not book or ask for the bed or shower services, but he insisted we do them, even after I expressed a desire to do the massage instead. After a long while, with my body tense and stiff, I told him I was uncomfortable with the bed situation and wanted to get back to the massage. Begrudgingly, he brought me back to the table for more theragun nonsense and brief moments of barely touching my body. In the shower (again he insisted) he went on an on about his teenage traumas working on a railroad or some other blue collar job and made comments about how his penis is very sensitive from an injury years ago and that it hurts when people touch it (weird?). Again, I was making no advances and showed no interest in mutual touch. I could care less about his penis, and him talking on and on about it made me uncomfortable. I can see how he would appeal to a lot of men who just want some company and like his look, and want to listen to him ramble about himself. The cuddle thing probably appeals to many. I just have a hard time squaring the fact that I didn’t book those services. I offer cuddle therapy and body scrubs myself so I get it, but I don’t force my clients to do alternate services when they only booked massage. So strange. My theory is that he has no massage skills to begin with, or that he has overworked himself and can’t deliver because of it. Mason is one of the guys on MasseurFinder who keeps on top of the listings by religiously updating his photos and doing all the criteria MF requires to keep your listing at the top. Another one doing this is Tim. He has no skill either (aside, had a bad experience with him too), but he’s attractive and that’s probably what helps him skate by, just like Mason. I don’t feel the need to stay on top of the listings since I stay plenty busy. It’s a lot of effort to be consistent enough to stay on top.

@Tygerscent I’m never put off by others traveling through or fearful of competition in my market. I feel no need to raise or lower rates. I get enough clients to keep me busy working. Let the other guys get the business from clients to whom they most appeal. I can’t be them, but they also can’t be me. The people who want to see me want me specifically. I’m not the hottest or youngest, most muscular, or whatever other quality you want to apply, but I have my own unique appeal that others can’t offer. Surprise, surprise, some of those qualities aren’t based on looks either, although I acknowledge looks matter quite a lot. In that sense providers are not a commodity. As long as you don’t charge extremely high or extremely low rates, clients choose you because of your particular appeal to them. That’s not to say nobody compares rates and that rates do not affect hiring decisions. BUT if rates are relatively close in a given market, it doesn’t influence the client that much because his priority is a good experience, not a slightly cheaper one. A great experience for the going rate = perfect contentment. A great experience for a lower than average price = bonus, elation! A bad experience at a lower than average price = regret. A bad experience at a higher than average price = resentment. A client looking for a bargain is not a client I want anyway. I value quality matches over quantity. Let the other guy have the bargain business. I feel empowered saying no and not feeling like I have to undercut to make my living. The sweet spot is confidently saying no to a minority of inquiries. If you say yes to everyone all the time, you’re doing something wrong. When you’re having to say no to most everyone, it’s also a sign you’re doing something wrong with your business model.

Clients ask me the same types of questions at times. Sometimes I answer truthfully, sometimes with whatever they want to hear, depending on what they’re asking for and what they’re currently hiring me for. Sometimes what they want is fantasy and that includes some air of illusion about me, what I do or don’t do outside my time with them. Well told stories are part of the entertainment they want, whether true or fabricated. With good, trustworthy, regular clients I am completely transparent. However, I never divulge remotely identifying client information. That’s sacred. Maintaining client privacy is very important to me. If only I can share the drag names of people I’ve worked on because the names are so funny…but I won’t because it goes against my privacy policy.