Paying Not To Tell

[+ Avalon]

Paying for sex is illegal. But taking a page from the Trump playbook what if after the client and escort have sex the client hands the escort the money and says "I'm not paying you for sex. I'm paying not to tell anyone that we had sex.". Would that work?

[+ Tarte Gogo]

Paying for sex is illegal. But taking a page from the Trump playbook what if after the client and escort have sex the client hands the escort the money and says "I'm not paying you for sex. I'm paying not to tell anyone that we had sex.". Would that work?

Very nice. I think it might if the Trump case as stated by Giuliani is accepted and Trump doesn’t get into trouble for paying her.

We could even draft a standard contract that would be based on this premise. And use it every single time! Then this business is suddenly legal!

[+ Travis69]

Probably make the escort, if dishonest, feel like he could blackmail the client. Never give someone information they might be able to use against you.

[+ Tarte Gogo]

Probably make the escort, if dishonest, feel like he could blackmail the client. Never give someone information they might be able to use against you.

Why would the escort change what he is doing right now? If he is dishonest, he can be dishonest right now! I don’t understand what you are saying.

[+ purplekow]

That is not quite the situation that trump is putting forth. He is saying that they did not have sex but that he paid her not to say they had sex which would have had a negative effect on his marriage. In otherwords: Don't Fuck Don't Tell.

Edited May 5, 2018 by purplekow

[+ Travis69]

Why would the escort change what he is doing right now? If he is dishonest, he can be dishonest right now! I don’t understand what you are saying.

Making a big issue of "please keep this quiet, don't tell a sole" just gives them ammunition if they want it. I am single, out and have people to my place. They see me as someone definitely not blackmailable. If I went to them, talked about my wife, high security job they would have ammunition against me.

[+ Tarte Gogo]

That is not quite the situation that trump if putting forth. He is saying that they did not have sex but that he paid her not to say they had sex which would have had a negative effect on his marriage. In otherwords: Don't Fuck Don't Tell.

Ah, he still denies to have had sex with her, I forgot about that.

Well, it could still work for us, no?

[+ Tarte Gogo]

If I went to them, talked about my wife, high security job they would have ammunition against me.

Then don’t tell them that.

 

I don’t think you understand what Avalon is proposing. He is just saying that we both , the client and the escort, claim that the money is for keeping quiet, because it is apparently not illegal to pay someone to keep quiet about sex.

We all know why we are paying escorts. Don’t you?

[+ Travis69]

Then don’t tell them that.

 

I don’t think you understand what Avalon is proposing. He is just saying that we both , the client and the escort, claim that the money is for keeping quiet, because it is apparently not illegal to pay someone to keep quiet about sex.

We all know why we are paying escorts. Don’t you?

I do understand what he is saying. Yes, I know why we are paying escorts. The escorts I know would crack up if I suggested such a thing.

[+ StLouisOct]

Paying for sex is illegal. But taking a page from the Trump playbook what if after the client and escort have sex the client hands the escort the money and says "I'm not paying you for sex. I'm paying not to tell anyone that we had sex.". Would that work?

Assuming the sex was illegal in your jurisdiction (i.e prostitution) a contract not to tell about that illegal act would probably be unenforceable. In Mr. Trump’s case, I don’t believe it’s ever been alleged that he paid for sex with the lucious Stormy.

[+ Avalon]

Assuming the sex was illegal in your jurisdiction (i.e prostitution) a contract not to tell about that illegal act would probably be unenforceable. In Mr. Trump’s case, I don’t believe it’s ever been alleged that he paid for sex with the lucious Stormy.

 

But sex itself is never illegal between two consenting adults.

[+ StLouisOct]

But sex itself is never illegal between two consenting adults.

Of course it is if it’s two consenting adults who are exchanging money for sex. That’s prostitution.

[+ Avalon]

Of course it is if it’s two consenting adults who are exchanging money for sex. That’s prostitution.

 

Right. Escorting aside my scenario is different; it's paying someone, it could be anyone not to tell and not for sex. Let's say a man is cheating on his spouse. A hotel service staff service person sees the two coming out of the room, one is well-known in the community. He hands the staff person money implying requesting silence. No words are spoken.

Edited May 5, 2018 by Avalon

[+ StLouisOct]

Right. Escorting aside my scenario is different; it's paying someone, it could be anyone not to tell and not for sex. Let's say a man is cheating on his spouse. A hotel service staff service person sees the two coming out of the room, one is well-known in the community. He hands the staff person money implying requesting silence. No words are spoken.

Not the scenario you started with.

[+ Avalon]

Not the scenario you started with.

 

Right! But my point is that it is not illegal to pay someone not tell something.

[instudiocity]

Hell, the standard line has always been, “You don’t pay a hooker to cum, you pay a hooker to leave!”

[+ quoththeraven]

Right! But my point is that it is not illegal to pay someone not tell something.

I'm not so sure. Looks like extortion to me, except the person's offering to pay it voluntarily.

[+ Tarte Gogo]

I'm not so sure. Looks like extortion to me, except the person's offering to pay it voluntarily.

Yeah, that would the be the agreement! We sign a contract where, I, as a hookup person #1, agree completely voluntarily to pay my hookup person #2 at the end of a session of sex, not to tell anyone about what just happened.

 

And frankly, it is already an implicit part of what is happening: If you are an escort and the client doesn’t pay (“sorry, no, that was just a hookup, I am not giving you any money”), wouldn’t you feel your obligation for discretion simply doesn’t apply? So we are already paying for discretion as part of the service.

 

So let’s say just the right words that make it the only reason for any payment. Then it is legal unless the police can prove otherwise.

Edited May 5, 2018 by Tarte Gogo

[+ Tarte Gogo]

I do understand what he is saying. Yes, I know why we are paying escorts. The escorts I know would crack up if I suggested such a thing.

But they don’t crack up when you agree to pay them “for their time only”?

It is just as silly. Yet that is the only way they legally advertise, if you are in the US.

[Rudynate]

Assuming the sex was illegal in your jurisdiction (i.e prostitution) a contract not to tell about that illegal act would probably be unenforceable. In Mr. Trump’s case, I don’t believe it’s ever been alleged that he paid for sex with the lucious Stormy.

 

 

That's the whole point though. Unpaid sex between consenting adults isn't illegal. Avalon is proposing that you create a (perhaps) credible fiction that the payment is to keep quiet about a perfectly legal sex act.

 

I think if the payment occurred too close in time to the act, such as immediately after, it would be difficult to establish convincingly that the payment was hush money rather than payment for the act. Especially if it was found that either of the parties had entered into other such agreements.

 

It's a variant of the disclaimers saying that you are paying for time rather than sex.

[+ Avalon]

Hell, the standard line has always been, “You don’t pay a hooker to cum, you pay a hooker to leave!”

 

LOL

 

Another old joke - Do you know how to make hookers moan? Don't pay them.

[+ quoththeraven]

Yeah, that would the be the agreement! We sign a contract where, I, as a hookup person #1, agree completely voluntarily to pay my hookup person #2 at the end of a session of sex, not to tell anyone about what just happened.

 

And frankly, it is already an implicit part of what is happening: If you are an escort and the client doesn’t pay (“sorry, no, that was just a hookup, I am not giving you any money”), wouldn’t you feel your obligation for discretion simply doesn’t apply? So we are already paying for discretion as part of the service.

 

So let’s say just the right words that make it the only reason for any payment. Then it is legal unless the police can prove otherwise.

I would rather address the underlying issue than come up with more and more elaborate and tortured scenarios for escaping putative liability.

 

Besides, a contract to alter an arguably illegal transaction into a legal one is no more enforceable than the initial understanding was.

[+ BenjaminNicholas]

Again, if a cop wants to arrest you, they will find a way to arrest you. Probable cause is a very powerful thing.

 

You can put a disclaimer/asterisk on anything you want: It's not going to save you from being read your Miranda rights. You best bet if you are putting yourself in risky situations is to have the number of a good attorney on speed dial.

 

Momma's Logic always applies: Make good choices and try to decrease your risk if at all possible.

[+ purplekow]

Right! But my point is that it is not illegal to pay someone not tell something.

Actually it can be illegal to pay someone not to tell something. Witness tampering for example. Abetting a crime. Obstruction of justice.

[+ Avalon]

Actually it can be illegal to pay someone not to tell something. Witness tampering for example. Abetting a crime. Obstruction of justice.

 

Thanks for the clarification.