Would you judge someone for not paying back a debt years ago?

[+ FreshFluff]

I recently ran into a fellow I'll call Alex.

 

I later learned that during our college days, Alex borrowed several hundred dollars from my close friend Stacy and never paid her back. Stacy took out a cash advance on her credit card in order to give Alex the money. She said Alex was a handsome guy who wanted to fit in but didn't have the cash to do so.

 

Of course, you shouldn't lend people money that you can't afford to lose. But Stacy is an unusually kind and altruistic person who would give you the shirt off her back. I wonder how many people Alex must have asked until he found the one soft touch who would do it. It took Stacy over a year to pay down that credit card debt.

 

Would you judge someone for something he did over a decade ago when he was a young adult? After all, Alex is no billionaire, but he did well for himself in the first decade after graduation He could easily have contacted Stacy but didn't. Is there a point where you forgive something like that, or do people not change? The question is academic for me as I barely know Alex, but I wonder how you all would see it.

[rvwnsd]

As much as I'd like to say I would not judge Alex, the fact is I would.

[Guy Fawkes]

No.

[MscleLovr]

Yes. As you say Alex has done well for himself, his failure to repay a loan shows a lack of integrity. I would not expect Alex to change.

 

FWIW I've loaned and given money to friends in the past; I've noticed that good friends always repaid me without any prompting.

[+ purplekow]

My brother in law asked to borrow money from me to pay off credit card debt and I offered him more than the amount for which he asked. He said his credit card company had agreed to take a partial payment his debt and to consider it paid in full or they would give him a percentage off if he paid less than the full amount based on a fee schedule. He wanted to pay less than the full amount. The full amount was not gigantic, $723 dollar to pay off a debt of slightly more than $1000. I gave him the $723. He assured me he was getting a tax return and he would pay me back. He did not. He did not contact me for more than a year and when he did, he called to ask me to co-sign a car loan. I told him I would if he paid me back the $723 interest free.

He never called back for the co-signature.

This man is my late wife's much younger brother, 17 years my junior. It has been 10 years and on the rare occasions we are in the same place, I say hello and good bye. We had a quite close relationship prior to this.

A leopard does not change its spots. People may change but more usually, they just get better at hiding who they are and better at presenting who they want us to believe they are.

 

So, while I try not to judge people, I will not be lending money to my brother in law nor would I lend money to Alex. If, I was feeling particularly emboldened, I might say to Alex. You know, Stacy? Isn't she the sweetest person there is. I remember vividly how she struggled to pay off the credit card debt which resulted from her lending you money back in the day and never a complaint from her. I'll bet she was relieved when you finally paid her back.

Or less coyly, hey Alex, return the money you defrauded from Stacy.

[+ sync]

She said Alex was a handsome guy who wanted to fit in but didn't have the cash to do so.

 

Unless I were a person with extraordinary personal wealth, a borrower wanting funds to "fit in" would never qualify as a valid candidate for me to be a money lender. Hopefully, your friend Stacy has "hardened" since her college days with some basic refusal skills.

 

To your question of whether or not to judge the person...I would. I wouldn't dwell on it, however, because users most often honestly don't remember their individual "hits" because it's their natural life-style to just take.

 

I used to be a Stacy. If I come off as bitter about it, it's only because I'm bitter about it.

[+ José Soplanucas]

People change. I know I have. I would not judge him, I would pay attention to signs that would tell me whether or not he is the same guy.

[+ WilliamM]

The problem with loans is that once you give the money the other person has control. Years ago I lent a good friend $500 (when that amount was worth more than now). He decided to pay back by paying our future restaurant bills. I did not agree, but it took a while for me to say anything. I suppose over the years he did pay me back.

 

Recently he asked for another loan to buy a truck --- $900. He 'forgot' my negative response to a previous loan request a few years ago.

 

The long answer is I do not loan money anymore; it's a gift...not a $900 gift though!.

[+ HornyRetiree]

I learned decades ago to never loan money! If someone needs help and I am able, I GIVE them the funds and only ask that they pay it forward x2 over their lifetime -- can be in numerous helping gifts or one big one -- just have the total be 2x what I gifted.

[Moondance]

...I do not loan money anymore; it's a gift...

I think this is a wise approach. If you want to, and can afford to, offer the money as a gift. Enjoy a few moments of feeling good about being able to help a friend or family member ... and then forget about it.

[TruthBTold]

If he had borrowed the money and then paid it back (even if it was well after he agreed to) I would acknowledge that the incident took place but that he had redeemed his reputation. However, as he has not ever paid it back, I would, of course, judge him as being someone who cheats good-hearted people out of money. And if others asked about such a thing about him I would have no hesitation of being honest with them that he did it.

[BaronArtz]

Yes.

[LaffingBear]

The problem with loans is that once you give the money the other person has control.

This perspective is why I would neither borrow nor lend money to someone.

 

If I lent someone money, I would not feel any control, but it might add an element of judgement to our relationship. My head and heart say "Hey, I lent the money with good intentions, its really none of my business how they spend, or how they manage their money while owing me."

 

Yet, I fear my gut would be judgmental. Maybe resentful. "You owe me money, but you're taking a lavish vacation, or buying $200 athletic shoes, or, or, or."

 

I dont believe those thoughts are justified. Lending money should be selfless, and does not convey permission to project my values or assessments on the borrower. But I dont think I could live up to that.

 

I could, and have, just given money to people - gifted. But I had no expectation of repayment. Its a different dynamic.

Would you judge someone for something he did over a decade ago...

 

If someone owed ME money from long ago, would it matter? Probably, yes.

 

If someone owed money to someone else I know from long ago, would it matter? Not really any of my business, so I'd like to think the answer is no. However, experience tells me that someone who abandons a debt probably has other honor and commitment issues - so the long-abandoned debt is probably just one indicator of a personality incompatible with mine.

[Larstrup]

Don't ever borrow money from Kathy Griffin.

[bigvalboy]

Yes. As you say Alex has done well for himself, his failure to repay a loan shows a lack of integrity. I would not expect Alex to change.

 

+1

It speaks to his character. Not being able to repay a loan is one thing, failure to repay when you can, is an entirely different matter.

[sincitymix]

I loan money with the expectation that i will NOT get it back. Never loan what you can not afford to loose.

[+ oldNbusted]

Define "judge"? I mean, I guess the answer is yes because I would not loan that person any more money, if that's a form of judging. But would I shame and shun that person? No. I wouldn't seek them out, but I wouldn't be mean about it, that would reflect more on me than them.

 

Having said that, I freely help out friends if they need it, one in particular, who was there for me at a really dire time in my life and freely shared what little he had. He's a somewhat trusting person and will never have a lot of money due to limited earning potential, and every five years or so, gets into a bit of a jam and he never asks but I've gladly helped him out with a little money and realistically expect to continue to do so, if needed. I"m grateful for the chance to help him in such a small way when he helped me so much.

 

I should say that when I was in my early 20s, I did loan a couple of people money that I could afford to at that time, but when I had a major medical event and needed money, they where nowhere to be found. I remembered that later when I saw this scene in A Bronx Tale.

 

[+ FreshFluff]

So the strangest part is what he borrowed it for. It was either to buy a bed or to pay down a credit card he had used to buy a bed. Our dorm rooms all came with a twin bed and mattress for each student. Couples slept on them with no problem.

 

FWIW, he's a pedigreed professional at a top firm in his field.

 

Unless I were a person with extraordinary personal wealth, a borrower wanting funds to "fit in" would never qualify as a valid candidate for me to be a money lender. Hopefully, your friend Stacy has "hardened" since her college days with some basic refusal skills.

 

Stacy has learned. But she would still do anything to help her real friends.

 

If he had borrowed the money and then paid it back (even if it was well after he agreed to) I would acknowledge that the incident took place but that he had redeemed his reputation. However, as he has not ever paid it back, I would, of course, judge him as being someone who cheats good-hearted people out of money. And if others asked about such a thing about him I would have no hesitation of being honest with them that he did it.

 

This is exactly the issue. Even if he had acknowledged it and paid back part of the loan, I'd give him the benefit of the doubt. But he dodged the entire thing, knowing Stacy wouldn't call him on it.

 

It's hard to square this with the sweet, handsome, buttoned-up professional I spoke to.

[+ purplekow]

So the strangest part is what he borrowed it for. It was either to buy a bed or to pay down a credit card he had used to buy a bed. Our dorm rooms all came with a twin bed and mattress for each student. Couples slept on them with no problem.

 

FWIW, he's a pedigreed professional at a top firm in his field.

 

 

 

Stacy has learned. But she would still do anything to help her real friends.

 

 

 

This is exactly the issue. Even if he had acknowledged it and paid back part of the loan, I'd give him the benefit of the doubt. But he dodged the entire thing, knowing Stacy wouldn't call him on it.

 

It's hard to square this with the sweet, handsome, buttoned-up professional I spoke to.

 

There is another side to this story. Perhaps Stacy did get something for her money and considered it a good deal.

[+ José Soplanucas]

So the strangest part is what he borrowed it for. It was either to buy a bed or to pay down a credit card he had used to buy a bed. Our dorm rooms all came with a twin bed and mattress for each student. Couples slept on them with no problem.

 

FWIW, he's a pedigreed professional at a top firm in his field.

 

 

 

Stacy has learned. But she would still do anything to help her real friends.

 

 

 

This is exactly the issue. Even if he had acknowledged it and paid back part of the loan, I'd give him the benefit of the doubt. But he dodged the entire thing, knowing Stacy wouldn't call him on it.

 

It's hard to square this with the sweet, handsome, buttoned-up professional I spoke to.

 

Has anyone reminded him of the debt? Has anyone had a conversation with him about it? If the answer is yes, I agree with you. If the answer is no, you are assuming too much. What if he just forgot? As a person with very bad memory, it may happen to me.

[+ bashful]

Has anyone reminded him of the debt? Has anyone had a conversation with him about it? If the answer is yes, I agree with you. If the answer is no, you are assuming too much. What if he just forgot? As a person with very bad memory, it may happen to me.

 

Good point.

 

As far as needing money to "fit in". I had a roommate in college one semester who was VGL, 7 other siblings raised by a single mother, there on scholarships and a work-study program. He was comfortable with who he was, and with any group of people. Sorry I lost touch with him over the years.

[YoungAD]

I recently ran into a fellow I'll call Alex.

 

I later learned that during our college days, Alex borrowed several hundred dollars from my close friend Stacy and never paid her back. Stacy took out a cash advance on her credit card in order to give Alex the money. She said Alex was a handsome guy who wanted to fit in but didn't have the cash to do so.

 

Of course, you shouldn't lend people money that you can't afford to lose. But Stacy is an unusually kind and altruistic person who would give you the shirt off her back. I wonder how many people Alex must have asked until he found the one soft touch who would do it. It took Stacy over a year to pay down that credit card debt.

 

Would you judge someone for something he did over a decade ago when he was a young adult? After all, Alex is no billionaire, but he did well for himself in the first decade after graduation He could easily have contacted Stacy but didn't. Is there a point where you forgive something like that, or do people not change? The question is academic for me as I barely know Alex, but I wonder how you all would see it.

 

There are many ways to answer your question, but I will settle for this one.

 

I am not sure why you would waste your time and effort to worry about someone else's debt (who you barely know) that is over a decade old. Unless you are planning to loan the man money yourself, or your friend asked for your assistance in recovering the money, or you considered cultivating a relationship with him or some other similar person, it is not your business.

[+ FreshFluff]

There is another side to this story. Perhaps Stacy did get something for her money and considered it a good deal.

 

I've known Stacy for a long time. Trust me: She got nothing out of it and would have done it for anyone. It's well known among our circle that Stacy is just crazy selfless. Her parents and are the same way, and the apple didn't fall far from the tree.

 

Has anyone reminded him of the debt? Has anyone had a conversation with him about it? If the answer is yes, I agree with you. If the answer is no, you are assuming too much. What if he just forgot? As a person with very bad memory, it may happen to me.

 

I doubt she talked to him about it. She wasn't on campus much during our senior year, so it would have been easy to avoid her.

 

I'm sure that if she reminded him today, he would pay up immediately, if only for the sake of his reputation. But she's not the confrontational type, and it would take a pretty aggressive person to collect on a debt that old.

[+ FreshFluff]

I am not sure why you would waste your time and effort to worry about someone else's debt (who you barely know) that is over a decade old. Unless you are planning to loan the man money yourself, or your friend asked for your assistance in recovering the money, or you considered cultivating a relationship with him or some other similar person, it is not your business.

 

I was considering cultivating a casual friendship with him. The debt itself is trivial now. If/when I talk to the guy again, though, I would never mention it to him. But the idea that someone would take advantage of a kind person like Stacy pisses me off a little.

 

Wouldn't you feel the same way if it were your friend?

 

Edit: Latbear has a good point below.

[+ José Soplanucas]

I've known Stacy for a long time. Trust me: She got nothing out of it and would have done it for anyone. It's well known among our circle that Stacy is just crazy selfless. Her parents and are the same way, and the apple didn't fall far from the tree.

 

 

 

I doubt she talked to him about it. She wasn't on campus much during our senior year, so it would have been easy to avoid her.

 

I'm sure that if she reminded him today, he would pay up immediately, if only for the sake of his reputation. But she's not the confrontational type, and it would take a pretty aggressive person to collect on a debt that old.

 

So he was already not much on campus before she lent the money. However, you are assuming that after the loan, he started avoiding her. Consciously. Yes, he should have paid his debt sooner, but your friend should have reminded him of it as soon as she felt that it was time to get her money back. If you lend money to friends informally, specially small amounts (you said hundreds), without a payment plan with deadlines, you should friendly remind your friend about it. Or let the time pass and the misunderstands and assumptions pile up.