Die Meistersinger von Nürnberg?...a question for the opera queens

[+ nycman]

Ok, I have an unexpected opportunity to see Wagner's "Die Meistersinger von Nürnberg" next year at La Scala.

 

I'm not a big opera fan....but hey...it's La Scala...and I've never been to Milan...so why not?

 

but THEN....I saw the running time of 5 hours 30 minutes....and I began to get suicidal at just the thought of it.

 

So gentlemen of the operatic persuasion, what say ye?

 

"Go for it! You ignorant slut...it's a once in a lifetime opportunity to hear an amazing opera in the world's most famous opera house?"

 

Or...

 

"Are you kidding? You ignorant slut...it's a long and boring piece of Germanic crap that you're going to hate, regardless of how chic the setting."

 

For the record, I am NOT a huge opera fan. In small doses I enjoy it....but I don't love it.

[hornytwells]

I Am a huge opera fan, but could not be persuaded to sit through 5 hours of Wagner.......

[AdamSmith]

Wagner's music is a lot better than it sounds, as Mark Twain quipped.

 

Another way to put that is that the Wagner performances I've enjoyed (all on PBS, never in person) were those where I already knew the piece well from repeated listenings to a recording over some time. He can be somewhat impenetrable on a first hearing.

[+ WilliamM]

My first question is where is the seat? Some of the seats at La Scala have terrible views.

 

I like recordings of "Die Meistersinger.," but have not seen it live. When I knew I was seeing a Wagner opera at the Met, I listened to the recording many times first. My first Wagner opera was "Parsifal" and all that work really paid off.

 

A few weeks ago, I saw Verdi"s "Aida" at the Met. I have listened to the opera on records/CDs, but not for many years. I was so disengaged, I fell asleep four times at an afternoon performance. Just a friendly warning.

[hornytwells]

My comment was "slightly" tongue in cheek, but my honest opinion is that if you are not a major opera fan already, a 5 hour Wagner may not be the best introduction..... my advice is to have a look online at either video excerpts or audio clips and see if it grabs you??

[body2body]

Die Meistersinger is Wagner's only comedy. La Scala offers translations on the seat backs in the stalls in English and Italian, but a Wagner comedy is not like a Rossini or Donizetti comedy which are broader and funnier. You might want to look at some of the excerpts on YouTube ( I think they have the complete 1984 Bayreuth Festival production) to see if it is something you would like. Personally, I would find five hours of Wagner daunting for a first Operatic experience. I don't know how long you will be in Milan, but you might check the theater's schedule to see if there are any performances of the La Scala Orchestra, or the very fine Ballet company.

[+ WilliamM]

Die Meistersinger is Wagner's only comedy. La Scala offers translations on the seat backs in the stalls in English and Italian, but a Wagner comedy is not like a Rossini or Donizetti comedy which are broader and funnier. You might want to look at some of the excerpts on YouTube ( I think they have the complete 1984 Bayreuth Festival production) to see if it is something you would like. Personally, I would find five hours of Wagner daunting for a first Operatic experience. I don't know how long you will be in Milan, but you might check the theater's schedule to see if there are any performances of the La Scala Orchestra, or the very fine Ballet company.

 

Perhaps for the first time I disagree. I get much more from listening to the opera over and over, sometimes as background music while I am doing something else. Then I might be prepared to watch the opera or parts of the opera on YouTube.

[sydneyboy]

I have very fond memories of Opera Australia's 1988 production of ''the Mastersingers'' at the Sydney Opera House. It was a gift from the (then) Western German government to Australia for our bi centennial celebrations. The production by Michael Hampe was lavish in the extreme and ultra traditional (blessed relief!). I distinctly remember the audience applauding the scenery at the beginning of each act. The excellent cast was of international quality conducted by Sir Charles Mackerras. I doubt if we will ever see the likes of it again.

This is not an opera for someone new to opera. Leaving aside Mark Twain's famous jibe it illustrates another criticism of Wagner (by non Wagnerians) that his operas have glorious moments but very long half hours. 'The first Act in particular is written in a rather ''conversational'' style but I defy anyone not to be deeply moved by the last Act particularly in that 1988 production in Sydney.

[bostonman]

Just keep in mind that the 5:30 running time includes 2 intermissions. It's not like you're stuck in your seat for over 5 hours.

[+ WilliamM]

Ok, I have an unexpected opportunity to see Wagner's "Die Meistersinger von Nürnberg" next year at La Scala.

 

Tickets to La Scala are very difficult. Has someone offered you a ticket? If so, I suggest you take advantage of the offer. You may never have the chance again.

[+ purplekow]

I have no opinion about the opera. The circumstance of the evening would be a large factor in my decision to attend or not.

If you are given two tickets and are not accompanying a host, then by all means, go and bring along the escort of your choice. You might enjoy the opera or you might enjoy the men's room and an exit after the first act. (Presumably the second act will be back at the hotel.)

 

If you are going as someone's guest, you are obligated to return after the first act but if you are going alone or you are to bring a guest, then get the experience of being there and the joy of leaving.

 

Many years ago, I was a guest at a the Metropolitan Opera for a Noh performance. I enjoyed the first act mostly for the new experience of it. The music was alright , the set and costumes were interesting and the storyline was easy enough to follow. The second and the third acts were notable for how comfortable the seats seemed. As I was a guest, I did my best to stay awake, I am pretty sure I did not succeed. If I had the same choice now, I would decline.

[+ WilliamM]

In the 1980s, I went from Zurich to Venice by train, one stop was Milan. Milan is not a particularly interesting city, but you are 3-4 hours away by train from Venice or Zurich (in different directions).

 

@purplekow, La Scala is one of best known opera houses in the world. This is once in a lifetime opportunity. He can hire an escort in Milan another night.

[whipped guy]

The only Wagener opera that I have seen live were two performances of Die Walküre at the MET. The first time was in the old Von Karajan inspired production with minimalist sets. The second time in the 1980's production with detailed and ever changing reslistic sets. Both times there was audible snoring in the long second act and especially during Woton's long narrative where he explains everything that has transpired so far to Brunhilde.

 

If given the opportunity I would love to see an opera at La Scala. I did visit the theatre museum which gives you a view of the theatre from a box, but was not there during opera season. However, I doubt that I would jump at the opportunity if the opera were Die Meistersinger which I personally do not like... I don't even like the prelude. Perhaps if it were one of the Ring operas which do contain some of the most beautiful and exciting operatic moments ever penned. Still, with my weak bladder I might not even survive one of those.

 

However, to see an opera at La Scala I would at least give it some thought... and consideration... and a bit of diliberation weighing the pros and cons.... prior to making my final decision...

 

Incidentally, unlike others when I know that I will be seeing something I don't listen to it for at least six months prior to the performance. I like things to be fresh. Plus, if one gets attached to a particular interpretation it can make one not appreciate a different approach. Unfortunately in so many things today many people are set in their ways and refuse to see things in a different light. There is plenty room for many different interpretations. That's one reason why my favorite period is the Bel Canto. No two performances are ever alike as regards embellishments, cuts, substitute arias, and the gods know what else can be thrown into the mix. It's always an adventure!

[Bargara Leatherboy]

Not a political fan of Wagner, it is too entrenched in Nazism for me. But:

 

Most complex music written. Google Leif motif.

 

Very dramatic staging and lush multilayered music I would say do it!!!

 

Read the plot, listen to the music.

 

Opera is about knowledge and familiarity.

 

Enjoy.

[mike carey]

I hadn't thought through the opera versus the experience. I have been to theatrical performances because I wanted to see the opera or play and I have been to a few because I wanted to go to that theatre. I went to see Борис Годунов at the Большой театр (Boris Godunov at the Bolshoi) simply because I wanted to see a performance there, likewise Antony and Cleopatra at Stratford. If you want bragging rights for having been to the opera at La Scala go to it, if you can listen to it in advance and enjoy it, all the better. If you don't care about checking off the experience, work out whether you like the opera and decide accordingly. I would go.

[+ WilliamM]

Google Leif motif.

 

Nobel Prize winning German authors use literary Leif motif, most well-known: Thomas Mann's "The Magic Mountain."

[+ WilliamM]

hadn't thought through the opera versus the experience. I have been to theatrical performances because I wanted to see the opera or play and I have been to a few because I wanted to go to that theatre. I went to see Борис Годунов at the Большой театр (Boris Godunov at the Bolshoi) simply because I wanted to see a performance there, likewise Antony and Cleopatra at Stratford. If you want bragging rights for having been to the opera at La Scala go to it, if you can listen to it in advance and enjoy it, all the better. If you don't care about checking off the experience, work out whether you like the opera and decide accordingly. I would go.

 

I have seen several operas at the Sydney Opera House, including Berg's "Lulu" in 1994. Since then, I have tied to see operas in every city I visit. Lost count of the operas I have seen in Paris. Could not find operas in Japan, the former Yugoslavia or during the summer in Sweden. I have never seen an opera in London because I last visited on November 11, 2001.

[+ purplekow]

In the 1980s, I went from Zurich to Venice by train, one stop was Milan. Milan is not a particularly interesting city, but you are 3-4 hours away by train from Venice or Zurich (in different directions).

 

@purplekow, La Scala is one of best known opera houses in the world. This is once in a lifetime opportunity. He can hire an escort in Milan another night.

I was suggesting he go to the opera with an escort not hire an escort instead. I realize that LaScala is an event unto itself, however, five hours is a bit much to take in just for the idea of being there. The escort was to entertain him in another manner while he was there, if the idea of going was intriguing but the actual going was more about being at LaScala and less about the opera performance itself. Thanks for indicating that in the future, my posts should be clearer.

[+ Charlie]

The first live opera I ever went to was Meistersinger at the old Met on 39th Street when I was a teenager. My mother's cousin had had matinee subscription seats since the 1920s and didn't want to schlep into the city from New Jersey for a performance that would probably end after her dinner time, so my mother and I went. I was studying German at the time, so I got an LP recording of the opera and listened to it with the libretto, so I would be sure to understand what was going on; as it worked out, I would have been lost without that, because I found I could barely understand what the singers were saying on stage. The seats in the old Family Circle were very uncomfortable, and it got pretty tedious as the hours rolled on, but we stuck it out. I have been to another live performance of it only once since then, many years later when I could afford decent seats. I love Wagner, and have sat through equally long performances of Parsifal (which some people find unbearably slow) with no problem, but there is not much in Meistersinger that I love--full disclosure: there aren't many comic operas that I care about, and the comedy in this one is not particularly amusing.

 

However, it is La Scala you are talking about. I have toured the house, but have never seen a performance there, and if given tickets, I would probably take them no matter what the opera. You don't have to stay for more than one act, after all. Just have a drink at the bar during the first intermission, and then slip quietly away.

[+ WilliamM]

I was suggesting he go to the opera with an escort not hire an escort instead. I realize that LaScala is an event unto itself, however, five hours is a bit much to take in just for the idea of being there. The escort was to entertain him in another manner while he was there, if the idea of going was intriguing but the actual going was more about being at LaScala and less about the opera performance itself. Thanks for indicating that in the future, my posts should be clearer.

 

PK, I understood. I have seen two operas with a close friend. One was "Manon" with Natalie Dessay and Jonas Kaufmann. Both times he left after the first act. and waited for me outside. "Manon" is not a long opera, and the two stars are opera royalty. It worked only because he is a close friend.

 

What happens if the OP likes the opera and wants to stay or the other way around? Milan is a large industrial and fashion city; it's worth a visit of several days. With a bit of effort, OP can find a fashion model who also escorts. So my question: why does everything have to happen in one night?

 

Let me say again that I have been to Milan.

[+ sync]

Die Meistersinger was my first live Wagner opera experience. "Friends" who had a subscription to the Met "gifted" me with their tickets; after the 5-6 hour experience I understood their "generosity." Overall, I did enjoy the opera, and while I wouldn't do it again, I'm glad I had the opportunity and took advantage of it.

[bostonman]

I'm a musician, both in vocation and avocation. But I've also always been a theatre person - and when I started getting interested in opera (and musicals) as a preteen, I realized that I wanted to work with music that involved singers and actors (my piano teacher was first and foremost a chamber music devotee, and really wanted me to catch that fire instead, but I didn't). And as much as technology over the last century has afforded us unlimited access to be able to listen to opera, I've always advocated that the best way to experience an opera is to see it onstage.

 

But I confess - I've never seen a Wagner opera in an opera house. And as much as I acknowledge his stunning musical (and dramatic) genius, I find that my attention span is better suited to listening and following in the score - taking in the music by being able to see it on the page, and imagining in my mind's eye what the setting might look like. I have seen Wagner operas on video, but then, I can get up and pause things and get a drink, or tune out for a moment, or watch it in chunks over time, instead of having that one chance to see it in the moment. Again, technology has made it possible to see opera in ways that composers such as Wagner would never have dreamed of - and indeed, sometimes I do prefer that to the original intentions. (I debated about whether I was going to see the Met's new Tristan this season in its HD moviecast, or wait for it to come out on the Met On Demand site for me to view at my leisure. As much as I love seeing the HD's in the movie theatre, I went with the 2nd option this time.)

 

And again, as a musical geek, it's actually really fun to follow a Wagner opera with score in hand, seeing how his musical mind worked. It's not the only way to experience Wagner, and some would say I'm missing out by not seeing his works in a theatre as intended - but, to quote Ira Gershwin, they'll just have to "Lohengrin and bear it."

[whipped guy]

And again, as a musical geek, it's actually really fun to follow a Wagner opera with score in hand, seeing how his musical mind worked. It's not the only way to experience Wagner, and some would say I'm missing out by not seeing his works in a theatre as intended - but, to quote Ira Gershwin, they'll just have to "Lohengrin and bear it."

I think that's why I only really like (well let's say tolerate) Wagner's Ring because I did follow much of it with the score when in college . Additionally, someone fortuitously had marked the scores in the library with notations of the various leitmotifs. It was obvious that Wagner had a plan worked out well in advance as when one sees an idea that first appears in Die Walküre suddenly blossom into the gorgeous melody that concludes the cycle, which not only occurs many hours and two operas later, but was composed many years later to boot!

[gallahadesquire]

My only experience at The Met was seeing Birgit Nielsen in Tristan und Isolde. I had come down from Boston that day, and fell asleep in the first act ... for about 45 minutes. The last thing I remembered was two people standing on the bow of a ship singing at each other. The next thing I remembered was two people standing on the bow of a ship singing at each other.

 

I took a friend to his first (and possibly only) orchestral experience, when the Boston Symphony was performing Messiaen's Turangalila Symphony. I loved it, but I don't think it's the kind of thing to cut your teeth on.

 

I think the idea of maybe running through it a few times to see if you can stand the music is a good idea. I'm pretty experienced in music; never been to La Scala; and would probably jump at a chance such as yours. But that would be me.

[gallahadesquire]

I can't stop myself: It's Leit Motif, not Leif Motif.