Age Limit?

[JuniorNYC]

I was recently talking to an interested, potential client who asked me if I had an age limit. I don't like asking clients their age, and let them disclose if they choose. I don't mind older clients at all, but the client not because of insecurities of being much older, but because he's 17 years old. I did a little research, and in New York State the age of consent is 17. He was willing to show me ID proving he's 17, but I honestly don't think I can go through with it. Seventeen is much too young for me, plus the paranoid part of me can't help but think "entrapment!" - I'm wondering how other escorts would handle this.

[geminibear]

Stick with your gut

[+ purplekow]

I would say "Come Back When You Grow up"

[Brian Kevin]

I would say "Come Back When You Grow up"

 

I just cried. (laughing)

[JuniorNYC]

I would say "Come Back When You Grow up"

HAHA! Don't forget this gem:

[JuniorNYC]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_OZ8C3T4kPs

[+ Robster]

[Tigger]

I don't know if you care to hear from non escorts although we are the only ones who have replied. But I agree with you. Something similar has happened to me. Very occasionally but so occasionally as to be statistically null, an 18 or 19 year old has found me on a hook-up app and wanted to meet. Supporting they aren't just making fun of an older guy and actually want to meet, I've always told them no. And in one or two cases it's been difficult as the they have been very nice looking. Aside from the thought giving me the heebie-jeebies of being with someone that young, I sometimes work with adolescents from the ages of 16 to 21. I'm not a teacher. I'm more of a trainer. And none of the youngsters who have propositioned me have been people that I worked with. So there are no laws I'd be breaking as if an actual teacher or someone similar had a relationship with a student. But I decided that I shouldn't for several reasons. #1. Most kids this young don't appeal to me. #2 Even though it would be legal, it wouldn't be good career-wise to be known to like younger guys. Parents might feel uneasy about me.

 

So I've always told them to get back in touch with me once they are in college. Unfortunately none has.

[+ quoththeraven]

I know of no escort who sees clients younger than 18, and some prefer to place the limit at 21.

 

I can't speak for them, but here's some possible reasons why:

 

1. Optics - it looks bad.

2. 17 year olds are still minors under the control of their parents

3. Most important, as minors they can't enter into binding contracts on their own. Any contract with a minor is voidable at his or his parents' will.

4. Emotional maturity.

5. Do you really want to be with someone when if the encounter were filmed or photographed would be child pornography?

6. Ability to pay without anyone noticing $ disappearing.

7. Escorting at age less than 18 has more negative consequences and is considered evidence of trafficking (i.e., inability to consent). That stench lingers when the underage individual us on the other side of the transaction. If arrested, how would you explain yourself? How would it affect other escorts or escorting in general to see a headline that combined "male escort" with "underage client"?

 

These are cogent reasons to make it a policy not to see clients who are under 18 and to check their ID carefully. Age of consent that's less than 18 is only helpful for private, peer-to-peer non-transactional activities. And some use higher limits to ensure the decision to hire is a considered, mature one as well as for reasons of economic and social stability and to make sure no mature-looking teen with false ID gets through.

[mike carey]

I recently saw an escort ad setting a minimum age of 27 for clients. He did not specify a maximum age!

 

I agree with the points QTR raises, although here 16 is the age of consent and the cutoff for child pornography. (I'm sure as hell not googling to confirm the latter statement!)

[+ quoththeraven]

I recently saw an escort ad setting a minimum age of 27 for clients. He did not specify a maximum age!

 

I agree with the points QTR raises, although here 16 is the age of consent and the cutoff for child pornography. (I'm sure as hell not googling to confirm the latter statement!)

 

What's the age of majority?

 

Your legal system has the same English common law roots as ours, so it's likely contracts with minors are non-binding and can be disavowed, meaning it's legally okay to stiff the escort or otherwise evade payment. That the escort is out the money is a risk of dealing with a minor. The law says "too bad!"

[mike carey]

The age of majority here is 18.

Your legal system has the same English common law roots as ours, so it's likely contracts with minors are non-binding and can be disavowed, meaning it's legally okay to stiff the escort or otherwise evade payment. That the escort is out the money is a risk of dealing with a minor. The law says "too bad!"

I'm not a lawyer but I've had a quick look at some of the NSW law, and it seems that it's not cut and dried. It appears that some contracts by minors are enforceable. I doubt that a minor could have a meal in a restaurant and then claim that the implied contract was invalid, so an escort encounter would probably be the same. Here there would not be the distraction of the possible inherent illegality of the transaction.

[+ quoththeraven]

The age of majority here is 18.

 

I'm not a lawyer but I've had a quick look at some of the NSW law, and it seems that it's not cut and dried. It appears that some contracts by minors are enforceable. I doubt that a minor could have a meal in a restaurant and then claim that the implied contract was invalid, so an escort encounter would probably be the same. Here there would not be the distraction of the possible inherent illegality of the transaction.

 

That may be true here too - there's a concept of unjust enrichment, and it's been many years since I studied contracts (one of my least favorite classes, but a very important one) -- but the public policy behind it -- protecting a minor from his choices -- still applies.

[+ quoththeraven]

Another reason is that 18 is a completely safe age in the U.S., where the age of consent ranges from 16 to 18. 18 is the age of consent in close to half of the states, including such a relatively progressive state as California.

 

Most other Western countries use 16 as the age of consent. But a 16 year old still is probably not mature enough to make the decision to hire, let alone be a good client (i.e., able to take responsibility for his own decisions and reactions in the heat of the moment). There have also been comments made in this forum that young clients (early 20s) can be high maintenance, demanding clients.

[mike carey]

I couldn't agree more about the emotional maturity of younger guys, whether escorts or clients, although I suspect the gravity of the decision to escort would imply greater maturity to them over clients. By no means certain of course!

[BaronArtz]

3. Most important, as minors they can't enter into binding contracts on their own. Any contract with a minor is voidable at his or his parents' will.

 

Last time I checked, prostitution is illegal in all states, except for a few counties in Nevada. Contracts covering illegal activities are not binding nor enforceable - period. Age has nothing to do with it. A contract to engage in prostitution is simply not binding nor enforceable.

 

We can get into a discussion whether 'escorting' is 'prostitution' because the 'escorting' contract is 'for time spent' but ... we all know what the deal is. Let's not be hypocrites.

[Moondance]

If memory serves, I think I recall reading something in the archive of this Forum from a poster who hired for the first time when he was 17 ... and was, at the end of the session, thanked by the escort, who said something like I ought to be paying you. When you read about that kind of experience, told in long hindsight, it sounds like one of those sweet "coming of age" stories that's been told, humorously or poignantly, in countless books and movies ... with the illicit thrill being the icing on the cake.

 

I'm all on board with everyone trusting their instincts (we make our worst mistakes when we don't), but I can't help thinking that if I was my horny 17-year-old self again--but, in this do-over, a horny 17-year-old with (a.) money and (b.) nerve--staring at Junior's sexy mug ... oh, temptation.

 

P.S. Not with regard to Junior in particular, but escorts in general, I wonder if a prospective client spoils his chance by broaching the subject of his age in advance rather than just showing up at an escort's door at the appointed hour, well-scrubbed, prepared to pay, ID available on request.

[+ quoththeraven]

Last time I checked, prostitution is illegal in all states, except for a few counties in Nevada. Contracts covering illegal activities are not binding nor enforceable - period. Age has nothing to do with it. A contract to engage in prostitution is simply not binding nor enforceable.

 

We can get into a discussion whether 'escorting' is 'prostitution' because the 'escorting' contract is 'for time spent' but ... we all know what the deal is. Let's not be hypocrites.

 

You're right, and so is Mike Carey, that the doctrine doesn't technically apply. But the policy behind it - that they're not mature enough to be making such decisions - does.

 

Sex is powerful and often shamed. The younger the client, the more likely emotional outbursts or immaturity (like not understanding where to draw appropriate lines) will interfere. It's not as though we haven't seen threads about, say, what happens if the client tells the escort he loves him. Or what happens if the escort falls for the client.

 

For the record, I agree that time spent is a fig leaf. It makes it less attractive to prosecute, but if, for example, a hotel room were bugged or surveilled (not that this is likely), it would be pretty easy to prove money had changed hands in exchange for sex. Don't know about other jurisdictions, but in New York, that's all it takes. Doesn't have to be money for specific acts, none of that.

 

Discussions of reductions in fee for failure to perform or engage in requested activities -- not necessarily sexual either, like bdsm or kissing -- also tend to undermine "time only." There's a time and activities/performance expectation. To say otherwise is to engage in doublespeak.

[+ quoththeraven]

If memory serves, I think I recall reading something in the archive of this Forum from a poster who hired for the first time when he was 17 ... and was, at the end of the session, thanked by the escort, who said something like I ought to be paying you. When you read about that kind of experience, told in long hindsight, it sounds like one of those sweet "coming of age" stories that's been told, humorously or poignantly, in countless books and movies ... with the illicit thrill being the icing on the cake.

 

I'm all on board with everyone trusting their instincts (we make our worst mistakes when we don't), but I can't help thinking that if I was my horny 17-year-old self again--but, in this do-over, a horny 17-year-old with (a.) money and (b.) nerve--staring at Junior's sexy mug ... oh, temptation.

 

P.S. Not with regard to Junior in particular, but escorts in general, I wonder if a prospective client spoils his chance by broaching the subject of his age in advance rather than just showing up at an escort's door at the appointed hour, well-scrubbed, prepared to pay, ID available on request.

 

Do you think your 17-year old self was emotionally mature enough to hire, or would he (for example) get so hooked on a particular escort that he swiped money from a job or parent to keep hiring? Entertain thoughts of running away together or becoming boyfriends? Make a nuisance of himself? Become jealous of other clients or abusive to the escort because of it?

 

(Not saying you would do these things, but these are concrete examples of emotional immaturity and a lack of understanding of the nature of the relationship.)

 

Yes, it sometimes works out. That doesn't make it prudent. Brightline rules exist to protect both parties.

[Rudynate]

If I were an escort, I certainly wouldn't take a 17-year old as a client, entirely out of the desire to avoid trouble with the law.

 

Having said that, I was 17 when I had my first experience with an older man. I was fine, glad I did it, came through it unscathed. When I went to school the next day, I felt really smug, thinking, "If they only knew what I was doing last night . . ."

 

I do not harbor any feelings that I was abused or taken advantage of. I had decided when I was about 14 that I was at least going to try male-male sex and was waiting for the right opportunity. My feeling about it was that, if I didn't like it, I didn't need to keep doing it. I was 17 before the right opportunity came along.

 

Some kid who has the presence of mind and resources to look up an escort, contact him and try to hire him probably has the emotional sophistication to come through the experience with flying colors.

[thickornotatall]

I would say "Come Back When You Grow up"

Paper Doll World...way too young...He should and needs to be with guys his own age...I remember being 17 and having all sorts of bf's my age or close...the friendship was most important for social growth...

[Moondance]

Do you think your 17-year old self was emotionally mature enough to hire, or would he (for example) get so hooked on a particular escort that he swiped money from a job or parent to keep hiring? Entertain thoughts of running away together or becoming boyfriends? Make a nuisance of himself? Become jealous of other clients or abusive to the escort because of it?

 

Seriously? I'm musing about being a horny 17-year-old with money and nerve (and the wherewithal to locate and contact an escort), and you want to speculate that that might lead to my being a thief and a runaway? It reminds me of the "scare tactic" approach that was a regular feature of my upbringing -- swimming without drowing (phew!), driving without a bad accident (a miracle!), sex without VD (saints be praised!).

 

Don't get me wrong, QTR, I think we pretty much agree on the "prudent" course ... and I did preface my speculation with a nod to the cautious instincts of Junior and other posters ... heck, I even understand that my mother's scare tactics were well-intentioned. I get it. But I also see Rudynate's point ...

 

Some kid who has the presence of mind and resources to look up an escort, contact him and try to hire him probably has the emotional sophistication to come through the experience with flying colors.

 

... and I think that most of us survive, unscathed, the adventureousness and experimentation of our late teens. It's not an argument against caution or rules, but I believe that's the reality. In hindsight, I don't wish I'd been more cautious at that time in my life, I wish I'd been bolder. (I don't mean reckless, just bolder.)

 

I'll also speculate again--as in the PS to my last post--that there are likely a number of escorts who have had teenagers at or above the age of consent show up at their doors without pre-announcing their age, and that most of those appointments have gone ahead as planned and without any unfortunate result. Just my guess.

[Rudynate]

 

I'll also speculate again--as in the PS to my last post--that there are likely a number of escorts who have had teenagers at or above the age of consent show up at their doors without pre-announcing their age, and that most of those appointments have gone ahead as planned and without any unfortunate result. Just my guess.

 

I agree. Another thing - the fact that the kid had the integrity and presence of mind to ask about an age limit instead of lying about it (which is probably what I would have done) bespeaks an unusual young man.

[BaronArtz]

Seriously? I'm musing about being a horny 17-year-old with money and nerve (and the wherewithal to locate and contact an escort), and you want to speculate that that might lead to my being a thief and a runaway? It reminds me of the "scare tactic" approach that was a regular feature of my upbringing -- swimming without drowing (phew!), driving without a bad accident (a miracle!), sex without VD (saints be praised!).

 

 

I can see both sides of the argument - caution vs. being bold at 17. I sort of wish I could have been that bold 17, or maybe 18 year old. I was seriously confused about being gay at that age and didn't really have anybody I trusted enough to open up to. Certainly not to my parents or to the Jesuits at my high school. This was a long time ago, before there was internet and chat rooms where teenagers can now find camaraderie with young people in the same situation. A male escort, if I had been bold enough to visit him, could have helped me a lot in finding acceptance. But I didn't. I was not bold enough. And yet, I grew up in a small country in Europe where prostitution was and is legal ...

[ChrisWydeman]

I was recently talking to an interested, potential client who asked me if I had an age limit. I don't like asking clients their age, and let them disclose if they choose. I don't mind older clients at all, but the client not because of insecurities of being much older, but because he's 17 years old. I did a little research, and in New York State the age of consent is 17. He was willing to show me ID proving he's 17, but I honestly don't think I can go through with it. Seventeen is much too young for me, plus the paranoid part of me can't help but think "entrapment!" - I'm wondering how other escorts would handle this.

 

Last year I was confronted with something similar. I had a client who was being treated for cancer and wanted to be with someone before he died. He sent me a picture of himself and I didn't believe it was him at first because he was so young.

 

He came over and I was a bit startled because he looked even younger in person so I asked to see his ID. He said, "today is my birthday" with a big stupid grin on his face, he was 18. I remember having to hold back the tears, I had never had a client come see me while they were all deaths doorstep but I was honored I could help him cross something off his bucket list and of all the people he could have chosen he picked me.

 

He was a sweet kid and nervous as hell but he had a good time from what I could tell. I never heard from him again but I still remember him fondly.

 

People will come to you of all ages and if your comfortable see the entire spectrum of clients. 17 is young but of all the people you could have had your first time with wouldn't you have wanted to do it with someone who was experienced and personable? Sometimes what we do is therapy and you could help guide someone into adulthood.