SouthOfTheBorder

not really. In the US, it has simply changed in most cities. there are still sex-parties everywhere & more underground/temporary venues for sex. The thing that has changed is who they let in & who they don’t. Most have some sort of door policy or advance list required. Thats how it is in NYC. And then there are the exceptions to all of that like in Ft Lauderdale. In other major cities outside the US, saunas & sex-clubs are still very common. I’d say there’s more sex happening now compared to decades ago. It’s not that it’s less free or less liberating - it’s far more likely that some are just aging out of those environments, particularly in the US where older gay men tend to become invisible. Im traveling outside the US now & in the city I’m visiting - there are at least 4 sex-clubs, several saunas with slings and everything else you can imagine. It’s far from being over. The younger generation would argue the apps make them more free & liberated than having to go to a public venue and mix with those they wouldn’t otherwise. and back to topic - if someone thinks bottoming isn’t for them, then they just haven’t found a good top yet: a complete & total game-changer. Lots of guys think they can top - very few actual good ones.

this is 100% true. In Madrid - it’s common to see much older gay men still doing everything and welcomed everywhere. It’s noticeably different there.

LOL - no, that’s completely wrong, many people confuse the city of Malaga with the greater province of Malaga. The province does indeed have many providers spread along the Costa del Sol from Malaga (city) to Marbella….about 40 miles away. Most providers are in Malaga city and they won’t even travel 5 miles. And providers in Malaga aren’t going to travel to Granada or Cordoba for an appointment- that’s 1-2 hours by car minimum each way. thats not how it works in Spain.

I think your comments need context. You’re from Argentina & speak fluent Spanish - this is not in any way similar to the average older white gringo visiting Rio who speaks no Spanish or Portuguese. And you have contacts among the sex-workers that other visitors do not not have. Your comments could be misconstrued to mean what is typical for you is typical for others, which is absolutely not the case.

I’m not sure renting an AirBnB with the idea of to bringing unknown people into a residential building is a good idea. Just imagine how the people who live there full-time will feel about that. I have a vacation apartment in a building that now forbids AirBnB, but there were two operating before the rules changed & they were grandfathered-in. The AirBnB renters are always obvious & everyone knows exactly what they’re doing. If sex-tourism was involved with strangers coming & going at hours - they would be asked to leave immediately. There’s nothing wrong with whatever you want to do - just be realistic about where you’re choosing to do it. Check the details too as many AirBnBs forbid any guests that aren’t registered upon check-in with proper ID. And - whatever happens as a result of one of your guests - you will be responsible. The hotels in Rio have non-registered guest policies for a reason - your safety & the other guests. I’ve found it’s somewhat flexible depending on time of day & how your guest presents themself. The hotels offer a better layer of security than AirBnBs anyway - much better for a first time visitor. Always a good idea to make sure your guest knows he has to pass through security & show ID before getting into your room, whether that’s true or not. Of course - the best advice is keep all the sex at the saunas where it’s convenient & safe. I’ve been in Rio more than a dozen times - always a nice hotel with a pool & all the services. When I first started going I remember wanting to bring guys to my hotel & I did a few times during the day without issues. That changed when I found one of the guys waiting for me (uninvited) outside my hotel a couple of times. After that, only the saunas in Rio.

recession ? not according to my broker. I just made $$$$$ stop complaining- start investing

there’s not much to discuss w a well written profile - when/where/how much ? this is what I’m looking for - that’s it anything more is like being at restaurant with someone that can never decide what they want - just wasting time

that type slang is thrown around frequently & it’s always derogatory. just makes the person using the term sound stupid & typically dated/out-of-touch obviously they don’t know any better

the OPs original question was which European city was most like Bangkok - the simple answer is no city in Europe comes close. But, if having to choose one it would be Barcelona. The one thing that makes Barcelona just a bit similar is Thermas - a venue where you can find paid sex. That’s it. Then there was another questions about Madrid vs Barcelona: if you remove Thermas from the equation - Madrid wins in almost every comparison. Madrid is vibrant, clean & relatively safe while Barcelona suffers overtourism & all the attendant problems of a very small city inundated w tourists & the after effects of Catalan independence referendum. While many may not understand why Barcelona is in decline - the actual decline is obvious if only visiting for a couple of days. Still beautiful of course, but not very pleasant; crowded, dirty & plagued by petty crime targeting tourists. btw - thousands of businesses, including big banks & corporations left Barcelona for Madrid post Catalan referendum because of political instability. That’s a fact. And it remains an unsettled question - so, they aren’t going back. The entire episode inadvertently gave Madrid an economic advantage & was really just self-inflicted harm for Barcelona. As for providers online - Madrid still wins. It is the center of Spanish speaking world and filed with recent arrivals from Cuba, DR, Colombia, Venezuela, Brasil (yes - not Spanish speaking), Argentina, etc. Spain has a relatively easy immigration policy and according tho the guys themselves, most prefer Madrid. I still visit Barcelona frequently, but it’s really for Thermas. If it wasn’t there, then probably not. Below is a Financial Times piece dated February 2023 which explains Barcelona’s lingering problems. https://www.ft.com/content/18f0ca8c-607b-4633-a83f-e99f71a046e8

@Marc in Calif do you want the receipts ? yes or no

Im in BCN every 6-weeks & know the city very well. I’m in Madrid frequently too & I’ll be there next weekend (again). You have no idea what you’re talking about. fyi - I don’t use Wikipedia as a source. you do - I’ve seen it. Want the receipts ? because when you run to the mods later, remember- you asked for it

If you want UES, then JoJo is always good. The Polo Bar nearby is fabulous & usually hard to get in - a good concierge should be able to make it happen. If you want a more authentic old New York experience, try The Benjamin Steakhouse (the original, not Prime) and/or The Oyster Bar at Grand Central Station - only for lunch and always sit at the bar (the menu is different). i agree on Russian Tea Room if only for the vodka flights & high-camp factor. The bar across the street at the Park Hyatt is well worth a visit & exquisite cocktails. The Trump Grill is not known among locals as somewhere to go for good food. It caters to tourists taking pictures.

well then - given English is the default language in Thailand for all foreigners, including Japanese, Chinese, Indians, Europeans, Russians, etc and the Thais who communicate with them - it would seem they are “pandering” to everyone who is not Thai. It’s the Thai people who have elected to use that term and put into everyday usage. And the very people who are the ladyboys are the people using that word the most - calling out to all foreigners passing by the numerous venues. Hard to fathom they would continue to use a word they find so deeply insulting & derogatory over & over & over. So, it’s not really for me - it’s for everyone who is not Thai. And that would include you & likely everyone else reading this forum. i guess you’re using “Thainglish” as a descriptor to imply the Thais don’t really know what they’re saying or some inappropriate mash-up of English & Thai. “Thainglish” is not a word in common usage & I doubt you’d hear Thai people use that themselves. That’s insulting, derogatory & condescending. But, if thats “amusing” for you - then who is really lacking the cultural sensitivities ? Hypocrites generally lack self-awareness which is on full-display here. October ? that says quite a bit. Omg - no. While Barcelona has it charms, including Thermas & many providers - it hasn’t been considered “lovely” for years. It’s one of the most over-touristed cities in the world, overrun with obnoxious loud Americans, digital nomads & cruise ship passengers. And it’s become very dirty & sketchy (in parts) post Catalonia independence movement when most major banks & business fled Barcelona to Madrid. There’s an economic malaise that’s settled in which translates to a general decline overall. It’s still worth a visit and I go frequently - but lovely is just not a word to describe Barcelona in its current state. Other than Thermas, which is the defining variable in this discussion - Madrid is superior in every way. Wikipedia might say something different, of course and as per usual - the trolls hijack a thread with comments that have nothing to do with OPs original question. the goal, it seems is to make it all about them. What’s amusing to me are the people who troll these forums but post nothing about the core subject matter, meaning providers & venues. Obviously the agenda is for something else.

you should get on a plane to Bangkok & ask the locals to change their advertising signs. and while you’re there, ask them to stop using that very common word as they try to lure customers of all ethnicities into their bars Im sure they will appreciate your very delicate sensitivities & Wikipedia expertise the ones who never get laid are always so bitter & jealous

this is a more accurate way to make the point - yes. It could also be the absence of Catholicism/Christianity since Thailand was the only country in the region that avoided European colonization

I think it’s more a matter of chemistry between two people. sometimes the chemistry is pre-determined based on one’s own ideas or agenda. If more open-minded & fluid, then very surprising what can happen.

100% true. Thai culture seems to have very little issue w gender either, thus the very visible ladyboy & trans presence in Bangkok. And the overall acceptance seems to include paid companions as well. I’ve never seen that degree of acceptance anywhere else. Once that feeling is understood by a visitor, then you are free to relax and really enjoy on a different level.

there were more Brazilians & Americans on RM in BKK than Eastern Europeans- not even close. There may be some difference depending on exact timing. There are a lot of Russians in Thailand but seemed to be more in Pattaya. doesn’t sound like you’ve been to Bangkok recently, if ever - lots of ultra luxury condo towers built & more under construction. The skyline is full of skyscrapers & really beautiful. Brand new shopping malls that make malls in the US look small & tired. Many luxury hotels & fine restaurants. Efficient & sparkling clean subway system & elevated rail lines. In many ways very sophisticated & modern - but of course this was in the core city and I didn’t see outlying areas. And it’s pretty much completely safe. Bangkok is the playground for rich Japanese, Chinese, Indians, Thais & more. It has everything anyone could want.

$300 is a very high rate in Bangkok. But, it depends on where you source providers. RM of course will have the highest rates & only a couple foreigners (Americans) there asking $300. Most on RM are $120-$200. On other apps, the average is more like $65 -$100. I typically don’t like to source from the “apps”, but in Bangkok that’s how it’s done, especially on Hornet. In the massage shops it’s even less, but then you’re dealing with a charge for a “massage” and either a minimum tip or whatever you negotiate. The most straightforward massage shop I found was Arena - Silom adjacent. The real difference in Bangkok re; rates is if you’re paying for an hour or two of sex or a massage with some sex.

anyone charging $1000/hour isn’t in it to build a base of repeat clients. It’s a one-off rate, which means he won’t expect to see you again & probably doesn’t matter about the actual service delivered. they’re banking on the idea that enough people will pay just to be in their presence - and they’re probably right.

this is 100% true in context of providers. I see providers in lots of different places at very different price points. the rate has nothing to do with performance or quality of service. the $1000 dollar question seems to be more fantasy or fetish focused than expecting excellent service from a typical provider. Probably Instagram or OnlyFans people. Hard pass - absolutely not. I don’t like to waste money.

agree there was no attitude whatsoever in Bangkok - although the sex is often not totally straightforward. In the massage shops, I think it can be very hit or miss, depending on the shop & the “therapist”. never experienced attitudes in Spain and many different experiences over the years - while they don’t have the venues as in Bangkok, it’s a very straightforward transaction w providers in that you know what you’re going to get. And then there is Thermas in BCN, which has been written about extensively in other threads.

in Bangkok, there is sex available in almost every context - massage shops (most with extras), gogo bars (where is the business model is to take guys off-site), saunas (not rentboy saunas) host bars, & dozens of providers available online through various sites. no other city has all those options - not even close imo

no city in Europe compares to Bangkok - that’s in a league of its own. If someone is looking for that type experience, they will be disappointed. the best overall European cities for providers imo are Barcelona & Madrid, lots of options & reasonable rates. London is there too, but with rates generally higher than Spain.