Learning to like red meat

[Rudynate]

Kind of the same deal when I was growing up... ground meat etc in a sauce... and we didn't reference is as bolognese either. It was just another variation of the theme. Later on I heard about the carrot, pancetta, chicken livers, and the gods only know what else. I think we had a discussion here a while back regarding if cream was part of the recipe...

 

 

I'm not Italian, but I grew up in a region that was full of Italian-American families. Each family had a recipe for red sauce that was a family treasure. Grandma had learned it from Great-grandma and Mom learned it from Grandma. The common characteristic to all of them is that they were slow-cooked for hours, sometimes even overnight. And everyone swore that their family's recipe was the only true one. A lot of them called red sauce "gravy." I have talked to Italian-Italians, and they say that they don't have such a thing in Italy. The closest thing to it is a meat sauce that they call ragu.

[AdamSmith]

I have a time-life "Fresh Ways with Vegetables" cookbook and it's kind of amazing. Not as 'bland' as I would have expected from Time-Life cookbooks.

Martha Stewart's online compendia of vegetable recipes are a fund of good ideas. One of her many:

 

http://www.marthastewart.com/275563/vegetarian-recipes

[MikeBiDude]

I'm not sure, but I think you may be right. I vaguely remember talking about it somewhere, probably in this forum. I apologise for repeating myself!

Too much time on my hands today, lol!! And I wasn't calling you out on a repeat!!

http://m4m-forum.org/posts/1082271/

[mike carey]

Thanks, @MikeBiDude, I knew I had commented before. I stand by my previous comments!

[whipped guy]

I'm not Italian, but I grew up in a region that was full of Italian-American families. Each family had a recipe for red sauce that was a family treasure. Grandma had learned it from Great-grandma and Mom learned it from Grandma. The common characteristic to all of them is that they were slow-cooked for hours, sometimes even overnight. And everyone swore that their family's recipe was the only true one. A lot of them called red sauce "gravy." I have talked to Italian-Italians, and they say that they don't have such a thing in Italy. The closest thing to it is a meat sauce that they call ragu.

 

Depending where you come from from in Italy determines now you make your sauce. Most Italians came to the USA from southern Italy at the start of the Twentieth Century hence the emphasis on a red sauce that cooked slowly for hours. Yet they also brought with them what they called a meatless quick sauce that is mostly referenced as a marinara sauce.

 

Incidentally the word ragù translates today more as a meaty stew but 100 years ago it referenced a red sauce with probably quite a bit of meat in it... such as meatballs, chunks of beef or pork, braciole (a rolled thin steak stuffed with parsley and/or basil , garlic, pine nuts, and possibly even raisins), plus even the kitchen sink... at times even pork or beef ribs. It was the classic "Sunday sauce", and the tradition continues with many Italian-American families to this very day...

 

As a child "ragù" referenced a tomato sauce... Hence the Ragu® brand trademark. In southern Italian dialect the "g" was usually omitted and it was pronounced more like "raù".

 

Interestingly our backyard neighbors came from northern Italy and they did not fit the mold. They made a very light sauce with butter (as opposed to olive oil) that was mostly quickly cooked diced and/or crushed tomatoes either fresh or from a can. It was looser and less was on the pasta.

 

Today even when I make a meatless sauce, which is what I normally do, I still cook it for hours and I put tomato paste in it because that adds extra flavor (think the taste of sun dried tomatoes). Of course when in a hurry I make that "quick sauce".

 

Incidentally Italians in Italy don't have a warm chicken with pasta dish. So next time you order chicken parmigiano with a side of red sauced spaghetti it is not what a present day Italian from Italy would do... Nor would they have a cappuccino after dinner... and fettuccini Alfredo naever became popular in Italy either!

[+ FreshFluff]

There are so many variations of strizzapreti. Some make it like a version of gnocchi with ricotta cheese as an ingredient

 

http://www.teacupkittens.net/wp-content/uploads/2015/08/Teacup-Persian-Kitten-Gallery11.jpg

 

 

But @FreshFluff ... you should have that bistecca (steak) if that is what the doctor ordered! Just don't be afraid to have some pasta as your primo piatto (first course)!

 

Oh, you can bet I do.

[+ FreshFluff]

@SundayZip and @rvwnsd , great idea! I already have a Foreman grill, so I'll get some organic, grass fed meat raised in a spa.

 

FYI Vitamin C helps with iron absorption. I know this because I am on the border of the other extreme - hemochromatosis(iron overload).

Cooking in a cast-iron skillet will also cause some of the iron to get into the food you are cooking.

 

Thanks, Sniper I keep forgetting that. My understanding is that vitamin C only increases absorption of non-heme (plant-based) iron. Some abstract I found says that

 

"Food iron is absorbed by the intestinal mucosa from two separate pools of heme and nonheme iron. Heme iron, derived from hemoglobin and myoglobin, is well absorbed and relatively little affected by other foods eaten in the same meal. "

 

@OliverSaks , I could easily eat a lacto ovo vegetarian diet. But because I absorb iron poorly and don't eat huge portions, I have to take the lowest-resistance route, which is meat.

 

@Eric Hassan , I totally agree about eating less processed foods. It's not easy though.

[+ FreshFluff]

Culotte is not as tender as filet, but has much more flavor

 

Sounds tempting if I can find it.

[+ SundayZip]

@SundayZip and @rvwnsd , great idea! I already have a Foreman grill, so I'll get some organic, grass fed meat raised in a spa.

 

The cows don't actually need to be raised in the spa, but a weekly visit would be good.

[Epigonos]

I am really enjoying this tread.

 

I was born in Southern California and grew up here in the forty’s and fifty’s. We never had a large immigrant Italian population in L.A. so my exposure to Italian food was very limited. If my family went to an Italian restaurant our choices were: 1.) spaghetti with marinara sauce, 2.) ravioli with marinara sauce, 2.) half and half, 3.) lasagna, or 4.) margarita pizza – that was it. I really only came to appreciate the various regional Italian cuisines once I started traveling and visited Italy. Now when I entertain I usually prepare Italian dishes. The only two vegetables that I will readily accept as meat substitutes are eggplant and zucchini. There isn’t a way those two vegetables are prepared in Italy that I don’t absolutely love. Indian cuisine also does wonderful things with eggplant.

 

As a child our neighbors on one side were Mexican American and on the other Japanese American. I used to toddle from one house to the other where my Mexican and Japanese grandmothers would feed me. Mexican, Japanese and Chinese were the three major foreign foods most commonly available in Southern California at that time. Interestingly to this day when I’m in a mood for down home foreign comfort food it has to be Mexican or Japanese -- damn I do love these two cuisines.

 

I will eat some vegetarian dishes but vegan dishes do absolutely nothing for me, I find them boring and flavorless. Eliminating dairy from my diet is simply beyond my comprehension. The very thought of living without cheese is frightening to me.

[+ nycman]

My idea of a great death is a deadly heart attack while eating a luscious very rare steak and drinking a great red wine

 

If I die tomorrow – so what – I’m 76 and have a great life eating and enjoying great food all over the world.

 

You're my IDOL!

[rvwnsd]

Sounds tempting if I can find it.

Here's the link to Brandt Beef's online store.

Culotte is out of stock (it often is) but check back frequently. Another option is hanger steak, which Trader Joe's sells. They also have culotte sometimes.

[+ azdr0710]

not a beef cuts expert here at all, but I often see "bone-in" on menus...like it's a good thing.....why would anybody want the bone in?.....I like meat, not bone......

[AdamSmith]

not a beef cuts expert here at all, but I often see "bone-in" on menus...like it's a good thing.....why would anybody want the bone in?.....I like meat, not bone......

The bone during cooking adds great flavor to the meat.

[BSR]

The bone during cooking adds great flavor to the meat.

It does, but I don't think it adds that much flavor. After all, since most of the steak is not attached to the bone, the majority of the cut will taste exactly the same. I was at a steakhouse recently where the dry-aged ribeye was $60 and a "tomahawk" ribeye (with the long rib bone intact, therefore the tomahawk shape) was one of the specials. I always ask how much the special costs to avoid any rude surprises, wow,was I glad I did. The tomahawk ribeye was a whopping $155!! Since the ounces of meat for both cuts were about the same, you're paying an eye-popping $95 for a little extra flavor. No thanks! I didn't get "boned" that night.

[AdamSmith]

It does, but I don't think it adds that much flavor. After all, since most of the steak is not attached to the bone, the majority of the cut will taste exactly the same. I was at a steakhouse recently where the dry-aged ribeye was $60 and a "tomahawk" ribeye (with the long rib bone intact, therefore the tomahawk shape) was one of the specials. I always ask how much the special costs to avoid any rude surprises, wow,was I glad I did. The tomahawk ribeye was a whopping $155!! Since the ounces of meat for both cuts were about the same, you're paying an eye-popping $95 for a little extra flavor. No thanks! I didn't get "boned" that night.

Capitalist gross distortions do not disprove objectively measurable phenomena.

 

As I am a bit startled one would need to remind you.

[+ nycman]

A timely NY Times article about "buying the cow"....Link

 

And the site they mention in the article...Link

 

Anyone wanna go 50/50 on a cow?....seems kinda cool to me!

[whipped guy]

It does, but I don't think it adds that much flavor. After all, since most of the steak is not attached to the bone, the majority of the cut will taste exactly the same. I was at a steakhouse recently where the dry-aged ribeye was $60 and a "tomahawk" ribeye (with the long rib bone intact, therefore the tomahawk shape) was one of the specials. I always ask how much the special costs to avoid any rude surprises, wow,was I glad I did. The tomahawk ribeye was a whopping $155!! Since the ounces of meat for both cuts were about the same, you're paying an eye-popping $95 for a little extra flavor. No thanks! I didn't get "boned" that night.

Well bone in was always good for the dental business. For a period of time there was rib restaurant across the street from the office. When it becsme a Malaysian restaurant the lemon grass that they served didn't quite have the same effect on business.

 

In all seriousness I don't like paying for bone either. Plus you have to be a surgeon to maneuver around it. However, it does add a certain amount of flavor,

[Epigonos]

If I'm eating a nice steak at home I prefer one with the bone in. Why? Because I enjoy picking up the bone and gnawing on it. Most definitely a major NO NO in a restaurant. If I were ever even to consider the possibility of doing something like that in public my mother would come out of her grave and slap me across the side of the head.

[whipped guy]

The best "bone in" deal was a number of years ago where a local rib joint had ribs that were so tender that the bone would slide right out of them. You literally were able to remove every bone, put them in a seperate bowl, and eat what was in your plate like a gentleman. They said that the ribs came from Denmark if I recall correctly???!!! You had to wait hours to get in the place... Unfortunately that's not the current situation... and the line to get in is gone as well. Perhaps in Kansas City?

 

I think that @TruHart1 is a rib expert. Perhaps be might be able to tell us if such a scenario is still possible.

[Rudynate]

Nor would they have a cappuccino after dinner...

 

 

When we were in Rome, the Romans all had cappuccino in the morning. They would stop into a cafe on the way to work, have one of those rolls that resemble croissants ("cornetti"), knock back a cappuccino on the run and as they were bolting out of the cafe, they would toss back, over their shoulders, "Grazie, buon giorno."

[+ FreshFluff]

A timely NY Times article about "buying the cow"....Link

 

And the site they mention in the article...Link

 

Anyone wanna go 50/50 on a cow?....seems kinda cool to me!

 

See if you can get the milk for free first.

 

I'll show myself out.

[whipped guy]

When we were in Rome, the Romans all had cappuccino in the morning. They would stop into a cafe on the way to work, have one of those rolls that resemble croissants ("cornetti"), knock back a cappuccino on the run and as they were bolting out of the cafe, they would toss back, over their shoulders, "Grazie, buon giorno."

Exactly!!! Cappuccino is for BREAKFAST!!! Along with some biscotti or cornetti, etc. Not an after dinner thing.

[Rudynate]

That cut is called "petite tender steak" or "Teres Major." You can read more about it here. (I usually use blue for links, but red seemed to be more appropriate. )

 

Another cut that you might like is a culotte.

 

Also, tri-tip steak can be very tasty. Another fave of mine is to make a small London Broil, slice it, and eat only a few slices when I cook it. Then, I make lemon-tahini sauce and place the leftovers in pita, drizzle to sauce over the steak, and top with tomatoes and cucumbers.

 

 

You haven't lived until you've had a flatiron steak. It's one of those cheaper steaks, costs about the same as top sirloin. It has an incredibly beefy flavor that will hook you once you try it. It's also very lean.

[rvwnsd]

You haven't lived until you've had a flatiron steak. It's one of those cheaper steaks, costs about the same as top sirloin. It has an incredibly beefy flavor that will hook you once you try it. It's also very lean.

I LOVE flatiron. Trader Joe's sells it every so often.