Check Check Who has the Check

[+ purplekow]

A friend of mine called and asked me to join him and some of his friends for dinner. When I arrived, present were my friend and his wife, her brother and nephew and a married couple I had never met. I realized on my way to the restaurant that I had left my wallet at work and when I arrived I arranged with my friend for him to pay for my dinner and that I would pay him back the next day. At the end of the evening, the check arrives and the man I did not know previously states that he is picking up the check for the entire meal. No one made even a perfunctory objection. I felt very awkward accepting dinner from a stranger, but as I had no means of paying for the meal, I thanked the man for his graciousness.

 

The next day, I went to lunch with the same couple and when the check came, my friend said: "well I guess this one is on you since I treated you to dinner last night". I laughed and then realized he was serious. When I said that his friend had picked up the check, he replied well he only bought you dinner because I was there. Strangely enough, my friend's wife agreed, saying that I should have offered to pay for my dinner the night before. She apparently was unaware of the arrangements I had made with her husband. After I explained that, she said: Well then you definitely owe him the money because he picked up your check and it does not matter how it was paid, you told him you would pay him back for that dinner today.

 

Lunch was inexpensive but I refused to pay for their lunch, I left my share with a significant tip and I left.

So who is crazy here me or them?

[+ Gar1eth]

A friend of mine called and asked me to join him and some of his friends for dinner. When I arrived, present were my friend and his wife, her brother and nephew and a married couple I had never met. I realized on my way to the restaurant that I had left my wallet at work and when I arrived I arranged with my friend for him to pay for my dinner and that I would pay him back the next day. At the end of the evening, the check arrives and the man I did not know previously states that he is picking up the check for the entire meal. No one made even a perfunctory objection. I felt very awkward accepting dinner from a stranger, but as I had no means of paying for the meal, I thanked the man for his graciousness.

 

The next day, I went to lunch with the same couple and when the check came, my friend said: "well I guess this one is on you since I treated you to dinner last night". I laughed and then realized he was serious. When I said that his friend had picked up the check, he replied well he only bought you dinner because I was there. Strangely enough, my friend's wife agreed, saying that I should have offered to pay for my dinner the night before. She apparently was unaware of the arrangements I had made with her husband. After I explained that, she said: Well then you definitely owe him the money because he picked up your check and it does not matter how it was paid, you told him you would pay him back for that dinner today.

 

Lunch was inexpensive but I refused to pay for their lunch, I left my share with a significant tip and I left.

So who is crazy here me or them?

 

I'm probably not the best one to answer as I'm pretty much a hermit. The last time I went out with someone was January, and I can't even remember the time before that. But I would say that sounds ridiculous. Unless you and the couple have an established custom of paying on an alternating basis for each other, you don't owe them a thing.

 

 

 

Gman

[Frequentflier]

A friend of mine called and asked me to join him and some of his friends for dinner. When I arrived, present were my friend and his wife, her brother and nephew and a married couple I had never met. I realized on my way to the restaurant that I had left my wallet at work and when I arrived I arranged with my friend for him to pay for my dinner and that I would pay him back the next day. At the end of the evening, the check arrives and the man I did not know previously states that he is picking up the check for the entire meal. No one made even a perfunctory objection. I felt very awkward accepting dinner from a stranger, but as I had no means of paying for the meal, I thanked the man for his graciousness.

 

The next day, I went to lunch with the same couple and when the check came, my friend said: "well I guess this one is on you since I treated you to dinner last night". I laughed and then realized he was serious. When I said that his friend had picked up the check, he replied well he only bought you dinner because I was there. Strangely enough, my friend's wife agreed, saying that I should have offered to pay for my dinner the night before. She apparently was unaware of the arrangements I had made with her husband. After I explained that, she said: Well then you definitely owe him the money because he picked up your check and it does not matter how it was paid, you told him you would pay him back for that dinner today.

 

Lunch was inexpensive but I refused to pay for their lunch, I left my share with a significant tip and I left.

So who is crazy here me or them?

 

I've never had a disagreement over who would pay when the check arrived so I may not be eligible to offer advice, except (here goes anyway - haha) if the lunch was inexpensive would it have been better to pay and not (assuming you did) jeopardize the friendship?

[bigvalboy]

Well if your asking who's crazy...they are. What transpired was a matter of bad communication. For them to assume that you suddenly owed lunch the next day was silly, but I also would have not refused to pay for lunch. I would not have made an issue of it at the restaurant. I don't know how good of friends they are, but sometimes you just have to choose your battles, so I would have just paid the bill and let the matter drop, telling myself that I would never let that situation happen again.

[Lookin]

In my opinion, nobody's crazy. You got a nice dinner because your friend's friend was a giver. Sounds like your friend and his wife thought they should get a little credit for that. They probably shouldn't have but it sounds like they felt you should likewise be generous the next day at lunch. Especially since you had offered to pay your share of dinner the night before. They might be mistaken but not crazy. And you sure aren't.

 

If you want to preserve your friendship, why not be a giver and take them to lunch. You'll forget about the money in no time, and hopefully your friendship will last forever.

 

Must confess, I don't like worrying about who's paid their fair share. I like being generous when I'm lucky enough to be able to, and I like my friends being generous when they're able to. The only way that works for me is to try being a giver surrounded by other givers. It might take a while but, if I start feeling someone's a taker, I'll start moving them out of my life. Maybe you're thinking about where your friends fit in that dynamic and, with any luck, they'll end up on the right side. Their friend who hosted you for dinner sure seems to be.

[+ Funguy]

Well if your asking who's crazy...they are. What transpired was a matter of bad communication. For them to assume that you suddenly owed lunch the next day was silly, but I also would have not refused to pay for lunch. I would not have made an issue of it at the restaurant. I don't know how good of friends they are, but sometimes you just have to choose your battles, so I would have just paid the bill and let the matter drop, telling myself that I would never let that situation happen again.

 

I agree mostly with BVB. However, where I take issue is BVB's statement that what took place was a matter of bad communication. It wasn't bad communication at all, it was totally poor manners - couple A who made the dinner invitation was not involved at all in paying the check for dinner. PK graciously thanked the gentleman who paid and that should have been the end of it. Cut to the next day and lunch and since husband of couple A did not pay for your dinner, you don't owe HIM anything. You really owed only for your own lunch. Once it is understood that that is the case, THEN you can choose your battles. If it were me, I would make a joke, pay and be very careful with all future invitations.

[+ FreshFluff]

He invited you, so it's unclear why you should have offered to pay. At most, you owed them for your own dinner, as you discussed with the friend.

 

Moreover, I doubt the wife was unaware of the convo with her husband. It sounds like they had planned this conversation ahead of time and ambushed you.

 

As far as whether you should have paid, it's a difficult call. Some of it depends on how expensive the dinner was compared to lunch. If dinner was much more expensive than lunch--say, $200 per head compared to $30 per head, then I probably would have paid for everyone's lunch.

[Guest]

Well, I agree with FreshFluff that if the cost of the two lunches was roughly that of your dinner (and especially if it was less) then I would have just agreed to pay for the lunches. After all, forgetting your wallet was your mistake. Yes, the way they did it was a bit dickish, especially since he never shelled anything out for you, but the whole scene would have been avoided had you brought your wallet. I'm curious as to whether these two are generally dickish, or if that was out of character. Even though I'm sure that your forgetting your wallet was an entirely innocent mistake, you should really try never to do that. Whatever the reason, others will view it as quite passive-aggressive. Of course, if this couple is generally dickish, you could have just said "You know that I would have offered to pay my meal, but, as you remember, I forgot my wallet that evening." I so despise the possibility of getting into such a situation, though, that I've only forgotten to take my wallet twice in my life, both times going to work when I didn't need to use it, as long as I didn't get pulled over by the cops (which I didn't, of course).

[Phil_musc]

I thought I would comment, but when Fluffy talked about a $200/head dinner, I realized I was so thoroughly out of my league that my perspective would skew the entire dialogue. By my calculation, PK's dinner party racked up a $1400 tab - there were 7 people at dinner. Some of us live in a different world, I guess.

[JT Brooklyn]

A friend of mine called and asked me to join him and some of his friends for dinner. When I arrived, present were my friend and his wife, her brother and nephew and a married couple I had never met. I realized on my way to the restaurant that I had left my wallet at work and when I arrived I arranged with my friend for him to pay for my dinner and that I would pay him back the next day. At the end of the evening, the check arrives and the man I did not know previously states that he is picking up the check for the entire meal. No one made even a perfunctory objection. I felt very awkward accepting dinner from a stranger, but as I had no means of paying for the meal, I thanked the man for his graciousness.

 

The next day, I went to lunch with the same couple and when the check came, my friend said: "well I guess this one is on you since I treated you to dinner last night". I laughed and then realized he was serious. When I said that his friend had picked up the check, he replied well he only bought you dinner because I was there. Strangely enough, my friend's wife agreed, saying that I should have offered to pay for my dinner the night before. She apparently was unaware of the arrangements I had made with her husband. After I explained that, she said: Well then you definitely owe him the money because he picked up your check and it does not matter how it was paid, you told him you would pay him back for that dinner today.

 

Lunch was inexpensive but I refused to pay for their lunch, I left my share with a significant tip and I left.

So who is crazy here me or them?

 

PK....I'm thinking maybe it is time to rethink your "Friend" List! Find some New ones who eat out alot and don't Bitch about the Bill! JT

[instudiocity]

I hate split dining checks, period. If I find myself in that situation, I attempt to avoid accounting for differences and generally suggest dividing the check evenly between all payers at the table or I'm buying.

 

PK's first scenario is AWKWARD, AWKWARD, AWKWARD. I had a similar thing happen when I put together visitors from out of town for a dinner. One gentleman stepped up and paid the entire bill for 10 folks - his family represented 4 of the diners. When I protested, he pointed out that I had furnished the wine for everyone. Later, he called to tell me that he'd received thank you notes from the 5 other guests and two of them had sent him a dining certificate for him to have a date night with his wife. WOW, I've got GREAT friends. But alas, no one compensated me for the 1/2 case of wine I furnished!!! LOL!

 

Generally speaking, when I invite, I pay. When I'm invited, I offer to split the check evenly even though I'm usually a third wheel. But my getting into complications with dinner companions over a dinner check is the most abhorrent thing to me. In PK's case at lunch, I'd have paid the check. And that would be the 'Last Supper' of that relationship, because our friendship would be dead!

[thickornotatall]

Dining alone takes care of that....otherwise I would have paid...chalked it up to pushy people and have been the better man...Noting that next time...well...probably no next time...table for one at Horn & Hardart?...I hear the apple pie and coffee is a good dessert...

[+ FreshFluff]

I thought I would comment, but when Fluffy talked about a $200/head dinner, I realized I was so thoroughly out of my league that my perspective would skew the entire dialogue. By my calculation, PK's dinner party racked up a $1400 tab - there were 7 people at dinner. Some of us live in a different world, I guess.

 

*Fluffy crosses Phil off list of guys to date*

 

Actually, I picked $200 and $30 out of the air, so that the cost of 1 dinner would come to the same amount as 7 lunches. The only dinners I've been to at that level are at Del Posto-level places or are a result of ordering an expensive bottle, which I discourage since I can only drink a small amount. Even nice places like Gotham Bar and Grill come out to far less than that before the wine.

[Phil_musc]

Awww geez, Fluffy, and I was sooooo looking forward to meeting you and maybe even having dinner together. I offered up pizza on another thread but there were no takers.

 

Actually this thread does show just how uncomfortable most people are about money matters. What is the problem here - are people just too unskilled with arithmetic to figure out an equitable way of splitting the check or is the insane need to come off like a well-healed big shot just too much for some people to pass up? Why should simply figuring out the bill equitably be such a traumatic venture for people? Will it actually ruin the evening if people have to think a bit and figure out a restaurant tab? The people in PK's dinner party were not old friends. It seems pretentious for the man to shell out for the entire meal unless it was that important to him to make everyone think he was a big shot - had I been there I would have appreciated the gesture but I would be wondering why he was being so generous. And this discomfort with money extends beyond the dining room - harken back to those threads where some people wrote about discussing fees with an escort and trying to negotiate a deal. Perhaps I'm crazy but I see these as related items.

 

I remember in my younger years - probably right after grad school - having dinner with a friend and a friend of his. I was watching what I ate and tended to order less expensive items. They had no such compunction and really strapped on the feed bags (and bottles). Then I was pretty much bullied into splitting the check evenly in the name of friendship. The lesson I learned from that was never to try to economize on a meal - if I have no idea how the check is going to be handled, I now usually get food from the high end of the menu. That way, when we're all just too drunk or whatever, I don't mind so much splitting the check.

[+ FreshFluff]

Aw, Phil, I'd give up Del Posto for you. Too bad you're in Philly; there's a deep dish pizza place in the Village that I'd love to try.

 

There's no easy answer to splitting meals in large groups. If there's a significant difference between the cost of each meal, those who ordered less get upset if the check is split equally. (I've seen this happen.) Some restaurants won't do separate checks for large parties because of the time required. So the calculation involves looking the check, adding up each person's items, and calculating tax and tip for each meal. While people are used to doing this for business meals, it can be a downer after a social meal when everyone is convivial and relaxed.

 

(I'll be honest: Splitting the check is so effective at crimping any kind of romantic mood that I insist on doing it when I'm not interested.)

 

And then there's the question of who ordered vs. who consumed; for example, say it was PK's idea to order a $200 bottle of wine, but his friends had a half-glass each. How do you calculate the contribution?

[+ poolboy48220]

I'm all over the place with this. A group of extended family meets monthly for dinner and we always get separate checks. A group of friends at work lunched together regularly, and we'd always divide up the bill, because a couple of us tended to eat a lot more than the others, and over time, splitting it evenly would have become inequitable. Vacationing with some friends, we'd do the same thing, and on the way out of one breakfast, a stranger at another table pulled me aside and told me how distasteful it was to figure out how much each person had had. With most other friends, we alternate treating each other. And at the Gold Coast, I'm buying drinks for the boyz all the time. :-)

[Diverdan]

The way that couple behaved, I would cross them off my list of friends. The way they treated you was rude and I don't see how they can call you their friend. That is no way to treat a friend, even if it was in jest, which it apparently was not. I have many friends, and we alternate paying the bill as I hate splitting a bill or asking the waiter to pay the bill. One time the meal may be very expensive, and another time it may be inexpensive. But, there is NEVER a discussion of how to make it "even". We have been doing this for years, and sometimes we even argue whose turn it is to pay the bill, but the way they treated you, I would cross them off my list that evening, and probably never return their call or see them again by themselves. I might go out with others where they were also invited, but as a courtesy to the others, not this couple. They apparently don't even realize or don't want to realize how RUDE they were.

[tom1980]

I agree with those saying to cross these "friends" off your list. Their actions say a lot about them. They took credit for a gift given to you by someone else and then demanded that you compensate them for the other person's gift. They apparently do not understand that gifts do not require repayment, especially not to someone other than the giver. People who are that concerned about getting their "fair" share from you are not worth having around. If they buy you a more expensive Christmas/birthday/April Fools' Day/etc. gift than you buy for them (God forbid you forget to get them something for an occasion they believe is important), they will feel slighted and call you cheap. They won't keep it to themselves either. All of their friends have probably already heard the tale of how you forgot your wallet, but the kind and generous husband was good enough to agree to buy your dinner (on the condition that you pay him back). But did you repay his generosity. Of course not! You were too cheap to buy their inexpensive lunch even though you got a nice, expensive dinner for free because of them.

 

Clearly these people think a they are owed a debt for every offer of generosity, whether or not you actually cash in the offer. Unless you are desperate for acquaintances (which is the best these people might be; they are not your friends), you should ditch them and be thankful it didn't cost you more than an unpleasant dining experience to learn their true character.

[Bart]

First terribly rude for anyone ever to announce after a meal that you are picking up the tab.

Second I would have picked up the tab and next time I was asked to a meal out by them I would decline and decline and decline until they got the hint. I would have them over or go over to their place but not out for a meal.

Third, group meals with friends always difficult, while separate checks are difficult for the staff, that saves many a friendship. I use to dine regularly with a group of friends, but there are always a couple of cheap ones in the group who believe in the $1 tip, don't consider entertainment tax and since we are in a group they almost always charge the 18-20% tip up front so guess what we are always short. Then they are the types who have at least 2-3 drinks with their meal and then say lets split the bill, I don't drink but will have an appetizer, so usually that balances one drink but add 2 or 3 drinks and the bill gets out of whack. After about 10 years of dining out as a group we no longer do so because people got sick of being $20 -30 short at end of meal. Funny how every now and then one couple will try to get it going again, but it was always the couple that would order one meal to split or each had an appetizer as main meal and never gave anything for a tip.

[Phil_musc]

I'm all over the place with this. A group of extended family meets monthly for dinner and we always get separate checks. A group of friends at work lunched together regularly, and we'd always divide up the bill, because a couple of us tended to eat a lot more than the others, and over time, splitting it evenly would have become inequitable. Vacationing with some friends, we'd do the same thing, and on the way out of one breakfast, a stranger at another table pulled me aside and told me how distasteful it was to figure out how much each person had had. With most other friends, we alternate treating each other. And at the Gold Coast, I'm buying drinks for the boyz all the time. :-)

 

How decent of a stranger to share his ideas on what is distasteful with you! I wonder if he was actually one of the diners in PK's little group.

[+ poolboy48220]

How decent of a stranger to share his ideas on what is distasteful with you! I wonder if he was actually one of the diners in PK's little group.

Yes, we all had a good laugh after that. I said something like "thanks for your advice" and left it at that.

[+ azdr0710]

this whole thread reminds me of the old "joke" about dudes vs. chicks going out to lunch.....if it's all dudes, each will just throw in $20 and call it a day....if it's women (with apologies to FF and tyro), out come the calculators!.....

[cany10011]

Your "friend" sounds like a tool. Usually, in my circle of friends, whoever invites, pays or everyone goes dutch. Friendships are long and hopefully lasting that these obligations work itself out in the long run.

 

Your friend was wrong to assume that you should reciprocate his friend's generosity by putting you on the spot for covering his and wifey's lunch. If he asked you to pay, i would have just graciously paid for lunch making a mental note not to be in any form of obligation to him again, forever.

 

OR, Since he insisted that you were indebted to him for his friend's largesse,I would have just asked for his friend's address so you could mail him a thank you note along with a check, and just paid your portion of lunch.

 

Bring cheap wine to his next house gathering if he invites you. I wouldn't lose sleep or mental energy fuming about him. Just too petty on his part.

 

 

 

 

A friend of mine called and asked me to join him and some of his friends for dinner. When I arrived, present were my friend and his wife, her brother and nephew and a married couple I had never met. I realized on my way to the restaurant that I had left my wallet at work and when I arrived I arranged with my friend for him to pay for my dinner and that I would pay him back the next day. At the end of the evening, the check arrives and the man I did not know previously states that he is picking up the check for the entire meal. No one made even a perfunctory objection. I felt very awkward accepting dinner from a stranger, but as I had no means of paying for the meal, I thanked the man for his graciousness.

 

The next day, I went to lunch with the same couple and when the check came, my friend said: "well I guess this one is on you since I treated you to dinner last night". I laughed and then realized he was serious. When I said that his friend had picked up the check, he replied well he only bought you dinner because I was there. Strangely enough, my friend's wife agreed, saying that I should have offered to pay for my dinner the night before. She apparently was unaware of the arrangements I had made with her husband. After I explained that, she said: Well then you definitely owe him the money because he picked up your check and it does not matter how it was paid, you told him you would pay him back for that dinner today.

 

Lunch was inexpensive but I refused to pay for their lunch, I left my share with a significant tip and I left.

So who is crazy here me or them?

[Lookin]

http://www.trinitychurchashland.org/wp-content/uploads/2012/08/original-picture-of-the-last-supper.jpg

 

I hardly ate a thing.

I had one glass of wine! .. . .. . . . . .

. . James had the lobster!

Your steak was huge! . . .. . . . . .

. . .

. . . . I paid the last time!

Don't look at me, I'm on a diet. . . . . .

. . .

This is the last supper I'm having with you guys.

. . .

 

.. . . . . I'm not made of silver.

John is such a cheapskate. . . .. .

. .

. . . .. .. . We should have gone to Olive Garden.

I thought we were getting comped... .

. .

. . . . …… . . .I'm so tired of all this bickering.

My purse is in my other robe.

. . . . . .

[Daverwr]

Since you asked.... I say those friends go to the bottom of the list. They made a ridiculous assumption. You did the right thing at lunch. Maybe a Christmas or Holiday card at the appropriate time, but that is it, IMHO.