Sex after escorting

[Losgatan]

ExFratBoy,

 

You are absolutely correct in stating that there are large numbers of teenage boys who engage in prostitution because it’s the only way they can support themselves. However, I think you are confusing cause and effect.

 

Most of these kids turn to sex work because they are physically, emotionally, or intellectually unable to do anything else. Their disabilities are the root cause of their problems – not the fact that they get paid for sex.

 

I readily concede that the indignities of street hustling could further damage and alienate an already fragile teenager. But I cannot agree that sex-for-pay, in and of itself, is responsible for the terrible plight so many of these young men face.

 

I also think it’s a mistake extrapolate the experiences of these troubled teenagers onto the escorts reviewed on this board. To a remarkable extent, the men here are intelligent, emotionally stable, and well educated. They are clearly capable of supporting themselves in any number of different ways. They tell us that they have chosen to escort because the pay is good and they enjoy it. For some, it is a way to pay for college or other short-term goal. For others, it’s a career decision.

 

Either way, these men are in control of their lives and are certainly able to plan for their futures. Why can't we just take them at their words?

[CT Dick]

>Either way, these men (escorts) are in

>control of their lives and are certainly able to plan

>for their futures.(as opposed to teenaged hustlers) Why

>can't we just take them at their words?

 

I agree completely, Losgatan.

 

After watching "101 Rentboys," I was struck by how many of them were desperate. They hustle because they have no control in their lives. Most escorts I have met are stable, functioning members of society, who chose this career.

 

There is a big difference.

 

Dick

[Bilbo]

ex-Frat-Boy,

Wierd as it may seem, I do agree with you on one of your points. You said in one posting, I think, that most of the people who get fucked up by going into this profession start out quite young. And your posting #48 also says that the ones in the business that they are most worried about are quite young. And another posting (or the same one?) also refers to Covenant House, which I believe specializes in young, normally teenaged people. I fully agree with you that noone under the age of 21 should be in this business as either a client or a sex worker. I would like to see that be part of the law when this industry is finally legalized. However, I think you may also have said that most (many?) of the people who get into this business and do well at it both professionally and mentally started out a bit older. So, can you agree to calling off the hounds which might be out for those sex workers over 21?

[+ deej]

RE: Sex after failure at escorting

 

All I can offer right now is a high five, Jeff.

[Rick Munroe]

RE: Sex after failure at escorting

 

>All I can offer right now

>is a high five, Jeff.

 

Me, too. He said, more eloquently, what I was trying to say.

[Guest Zach DC]

..these men are in

>control of their lives and

>are certainly able to plan

>for their futures. Why

>can't we just take them

>at their words?

 

 

Thanks for your post, Logostan. Much thanks for these words in particular.

[Guest Zach DC]

And me thank Losgatan, to.

[BewareofNick]

>OK, so you're obviously an escort

>or have been one.

>This explains a lot about

>your anger & attitude toward

>the business and those who

>are successful at it.

 

 

Where did you get that? I thought he just inadvertently told us he's a sales clerk at the Clinique counter at Bloomingdales?

 

Perplexedly yours,

 

Neal

[BewareofNick]

A poem by Fin Fang Foom

 

FIN FANG FOOM

Out of my way

INSECTS

I am

FIN FANG FOOM

I offer no pity

no mercy

nothing but

DOOM

My slumber of 1,000 years

is THROUGH

There is nothing mankind can do

Beware the fury

of

FIN FANG FOOM

 

I will smash

I will crush

I will eat this whole country

I am unstoppable

So says the ancient and strong

FIN FANG FOOM

 

I dance on your corpses

your cities

your schools

Stomp you like grapes

as your bitter mortal blood

squirts between my toes

I am FIN FANG FOOM

 

There is no escape from

FIN FANG FOOM

I'll slay all mankding

I'll kill them real soon

They'll beg me for mercy

Though I'll give them none

For such is the way

of FIN FANG FOOM!

 

 

I think this should pretty much clear things up

[Guest jeffOH]

>>>Male prostitutes start shockingly young. The average age at which young women get involved in sreet prostitution is 16.9, according to a study conducted by the San Francisco-based Delancey Street Foundation, an organization that does outreach work with female prostitutes. Young men, however, enter into prostitution at 14 or even younger, says Sean Haley, director of adolescent services for JRI Health, in Boston -- the city's only outreach program for male commercial sex workers. )>>

>

>http://www.valleyadvocate.com/articles/wmacovpros4.html

>

>And finally, a final inspirational quote

>for you from a study

>done by the University of

>Maryland

>http://www.inform.umd.edu/EdRes/Colleges/SCHOLAR/ac/papers97/Cugini-ac1.html :

>

>>>There are about 1.3 million prostitutes in America. Many of them, an estimated 500,000, are children. One million to 500,000 children are involved in prostitution and pornography every year. Also, an estimated 50% of streetwalkers are HIV infected.

>Prostitution is a major source for the spread of a sexually transmitted diseases. One estimate in the "Free Teens" pamphlet states that two in five of all prostitutes in major cities are HIV positive. A high percentage of child prostitutes (those under18) were victims of incest, rape or sexual abuse as younger children. >>

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

 

EXFRATBOY...I am an ex-frat boy myself, Sigma Phi Epsilon. Anyway, this thread started out as a discussion about "sex after escorting" and turned into a debate as to whether or not escorts enjoy their work or are we just big liars when we say that we do.

 

And leave it to a lawyer to further muddy the issue. What's the connection between child prostitution/pornography and adults who

CHOOSE to work in the sex industry? I'd say very few "professional escorts" started out in their teens. I started at the old age of 27. There's a world of difference between what I do and child prostitution. Start another thread if you really want to pursue that topic.

 

Jeff4hire@aol.com

[Guest exFratBoy]

>I also think it’s a mistake

>extrapolate the experiences of these

>troubled teenagers onto the escorts

>reviewed on this board.

>To a remarkable extent, the

>men here are intelligent, emotionally

>stable, and well educated.

>They are clearly capable of

>supporting themselves in any number

>of different ways. They

>tell us that they have

>chosen to escort because the

>pay is good and they

>enjoy it. For some,

>it is a way to

>pay for college or other

>short-term goal. For others,

>it’s a career decision.

>

>Either way, these men are in

>control of their lives and

>are certainly able to plan

>for their futures. Why

>can't we just take them

>at their words?

 

I'm not sure what you're disagreeing with. My original post said that while FFF had a unique way of framing his thoughts, he did make a valid point: the sex industry can be very damaging to many people and that many of the boys and girls who go into it do so because they have no other way to make money, and it further screws them up. I specifically said that many of the guys on here got into escorting as a choice and that while they seem to be well-adjusted, there were far more sex industry workers who were exploited by the industry. At which point all hell broke loose and Rick Monroe was demanding "proof" that the sex industry harmed anyone.

So, to reiterate. There are a handful of guys who choose to work in the sex industry for a variety of reasons, but do manage to keep it together. But the vast majority of people in the sex industry (NOTE: NOT THE VAST MAJORITY OF ESCORTS REVIEWED ON THIS SITE) are exploited and wind up in worse shape than when they started.

To further clarify, the "sex industry" refers to everyone from Rick Monroe to crack 'hos to teenage boy runaways to Sidney Biddle Barrows. It is anyone who makes a living from selling their body to someone else for sex.

[Guest exFratBoy]

RE: Sex after failure at escorting

 

>>All I can offer right now

>>is a high five, Jeff.

>

>Me, too. He said, more

>eloquently, what I was trying

>to say.

 

Really? You sure?

Because what you wrote was this:

 

>>I know more than a few escorts of various ages and to my knowlege, not one of them does it to escape hunger and homelessness...although I suppose you could say that anyone who works at any job does it to provide food and shelter for himself. A lot of jobs are brutal &damaging...look what happened to Lucy & Ethel when they tried to work in the chocolate factory. >>

 

That was in response to my original post, noting that the sex industry-- NOT THE ESCORTS ON THIS BOARD AND YOUR FRIENDS-- the sex industry, which includes teenage runaways, crack hos, and the like-- is a very damaging and degrading way to make a living for most people in it. And as I have now proven to you, the guys on this board make up a small handful of the people engaged in the sex industry.

[Guest exFratBoy]

>And leave it to a lawyer

>to further muddy the issue.

>What's the connection between child

>prostitution/pornography and adults who

>CHOOSE to work in the sex

>industry? I'd say very few

>"professional escorts" started out in

>their teens. I started at

>the old age of 27.

 

>There's a world of difference

>between what I do and

>child prostitution. Start another thread

>if you really want to

>pursue that topic.

>

>Jeff4hire@aol.com

 

And leave it to a self-righteous, methinks-he-doth-protest-too-much-about-how-much-he-loves-his-job type like you to totally miss that in a previous post, I have stated the exact same thing you just said above:

 

And I quote from my FIRST post:

>>Those of you who seem most comfortable with being escorts seem to have gotten into it later in life (later than age 16, anyway) when your sense of who you are had already been formed.>>

Remarkably similar to your first point.

 

And as for your second point, Jeff, there is a world of difference between what I do and what some shady ambulance chaser does. But we are both lawyers and when someone talks about the "legal profession" they mean all of us. So yes, of course there IS a world of difference between what you do and what some 15 year old runaway who gives blowjobs in the backseat of cars on Santa Monica Blvd. does. But you are both in the same industry, the sex industry. You both sell your bodies for sex. And to repeat my point again, in the Sex Industry-- crack 'hos, teen runaways, porn stars and high class escorts like yourself-- is a nasty and degrading way to make a living for most of the people in it. IT IS NOT A NASTY AND DEGRADING WAY TO MAKE A LIVING FOR JEFFOH, RICK MONROE and other men (and women) who are at the top of the profession. But most sex industry workers do not share your good fortune.

[Guest exFratBoy]

>ex-Frat-Boy,

>Wierd as it may seem, I

>do agree with you on

>one of your points. You

>said in one posting, I

>think, that most of the

>people who get fucked up

>by going into this profession

>start out quite young. And

>your posting #48 also says

>that the ones in the

>business that they are

>most worried about are quite

>young. And another posting (or

>the same one?) also refers

>to Covenant House, which I

>believe specializes in young, normally

>teenaged people. I fully agree

>with you that noone under

>the age of 21 should

>be in this business as

>either a client or a

>sex worker. I would like

>to see that be part

>of the law when this

>industry is finally legalized. However,

>I think you may also

>have said that most (many?)

>of the people who get

>into this business and do

>well at it both professionally

>and mentally started out a

>bit older. So, can you

>agree to calling off the

> hounds which might be

>out for those sex workers

>over 21?

 

Guilty as charged on all of the above counts. Something our well-adjusted escort friends seem to have overlooked in their rush to defend themselves.

Sex workers over 21 probably do know what they are getting into. But until it is legalized, sex is a pretty rough way to make a living if you're not at the top of the game.

[Guest exFratBoy]

RE: Sex after failure at escorting

 

>The sex industry doesn't FUCK anyone

>up...they had issues before they

>got into porn or escorting.

 

Might being thrown out of the house by their parents at age 16 be one of those issues? Or feeling degraded and embarassed by what they are doing for a living? Might I remind you that you are the only escort on this board who said he told his parents what he did for a living. Which would seem to indicate the rest are not exactly proud of what they do.

And lets not even get into all of the 'str8' guys with girlfriends and wives (Mr. Brandt being a good example) who act in gay porn.

 

 

>I know people who are

>majorly fucked up in all

>sorts of professions from attorneys

>to corporate executives.

For every

>porn star or escort who

>is fucked up somehow, there

>are a dozen who are

>reasonably well-adjusted. We just hear

>more about the ones who

>are having a difficult time.

>

Perhaps. But for someone who has issues, working as, say, an accountant, will not exacerbate those issues. Working in the sex industry, however, seems to make marginal personalities even more marginal. Teenage runaways rarely take jobs as corporate executives to get themselves off the street. Porn actor (as opposed to porn star)- well, that's a viable option if you're 18 and have no home and no skills.

Do optometrists feel that they are committing a terrible sin by fitting people for glasses? Doubtful.

But does a 19 year old getting fucked up the ass on screen think so? Maybe.

Does a shoe saleswoman think that no decent guy would ever want to marry her because she sells shoes? Doubtful.

Does a prostitute think that no decent guy would ever want to marry her because she sells her body for sex? Maybe.

So maybe working in the sex industry isn't as good for the psyche as being, say a ferry boat captain. Or even a lawyer.

 

Look Jeff, you say you love your job and I have no reason to doubt you. Many of the guys who are reviewed on here seem to have chosen escorting rather than the other way around. But to deny that the majority of people who wind up fueling the multi-billion dollar sex industry, which caters primarily to heterosexual men, are being exploited and degraded, is to deny reality. Your tiny subset of the industry is not a reflection of the industry at large.

[+ Lucky]

RE: Sex after failure at escorting

 

Posts 61, 62, 63, 64, and 65 are all by the same guy! Must be a lawyer! Anyone else would have consolidated their thoughts.

[Guest 7Zach]

RE: Sex after failure at escorting

 

I understand everything u say about the sex industry, etc. And I think some of it has merit.

What I don't understand in this thread and others is this: if you feel so strongly about how negative the sex industry is for that person's emotional and physical well-being, why are you here? Why do you patronize (in both uses of the word, as a patron and as condescending) the ones that are doing it?

Sure, I have seen those who shouldn't be doing it, and I have discussed it with them. Similarly, others seem fine with it, and if not, for their personal reasons, they have elected to be a sex worker.

But is it a sign of their distress with the job that they don't tell their parents what they do for a living? Sex and money, those two topics are not always fully discussed, even among families. And if sex is the job, probably not. Are they ashamed? Maybe, I don't know. Lazy, maybe, but remember they sure make more than they ordinarily would in other jobs. But then they make more than most lawyers do, yes, even those in their 30s with a corporate practice, because they don't have either the overhead or the tax liability to whittle down the net pay of $150 plus an hour.

Is it hard on the psyche, probably, cuz sex is powerful and confusing for all of us at various times in our life. Is it a hard job, for a fact, cuz they're offering the most personal service imaginable to the public, and if they don't want to do it with a particular client, they get hammered here.

I guess what bothered me about some of the posts on this thread is that it just seems rude and arrogant to denigrate someone to their fact that one feels that their job is beneath them. And yet in doing so, you're obviously a consumer of such services.

[Guest jeffOH]

>IT

>IS NOT A NASTY AND

>DEGRADING WAY TO MAKE A

>LIVING FOR JEFFOH, RICK MONROE

>and other men (and women)

>who are at the top

>of the profession. But most

>sex industry workers do not

>share your good fortune.

 

exFratboy...I've worked in the "sex industry" for over 10 years

now. I'm sure I know many more prostitutes, escorts, hookers, porn stars and strippers than you ever will. So when I am expressing my opinion, it's from actual world experience not

anecdotal or academic references.

 

Sure, some people in the industry are fucked up, but the industry itself is not at the root of their problems. And yes,

because it can be at times an unforgiving business to be in--it may force them to deal with their issues. And if they don't,

they do what millions of people in other jobs do, they drink, do drugs,etc.. Yes, there are many unhappy endings to many porn stars' lives, but over the years there have been thousands who've worked in porn. There are more who are still alive, well-adjusted, made it through rehab, quit drinking, quit doing drugs,

got college degrees or whatever. My point is you hear more about the tragic cases than you do the others. It seems to me that YOU

believe the "sex industry" to be a "nasty and degrading way to make a living". You're assuming to know the mindsets of thousands of people based upon your opinion and that those of us who say we truly enjoy our jobs are a tiny subset.

 

I don't think it's nasty and degrading in and of itself. But, if someone who is working in the sex industry does believe it is nasty and degrading, it's mainly their belief system that's messing with them. For everything you've said to hold together,

we must assume that MOST sex workers are self-loathing because of what they do to make money. I simply don't believe that to be true. And I won't even get into the child prostitution/

pornography issue that you threw into the mix. Yes, it may be a part of the industry, but I'm talking about what I know well....

MANY adults who have CHOSEN to work in the sex industry and enjoy what they do and have never thought there was anything wrong with prostitution.

 

So, really, exFratboy, until you go out and get to know hundreds of sex workers as I do...what do you really know to be true. My extensive experience contradicts your limited personal experience on this issue.

 

Jeff4hire@aol.com

[Rick Munroe]

>At

>which point all hell broke

>loose and Rick Monroe was

>demanding "proof" that the sex

>industry harmed anyone.

 

Yo, stupid!! I am not going to respond to this crap anymore. I never said that and anyone with a brain (read: everyone else who peruses this site except you, obviously) can look above & see that. Stop twisting my words. This topic is dead.

[Guest cp8036]

Rod,

 

Well said. Where were you 50 posts ago? I used to like Captain Crunch cereal, but after too many bowls it became bland. Also, I had too many cavities.

 

Are you still flying? Do you have license yet?

[Guest Fin Fang Foom]

>exFratboy...I've worked in the "sex industry"

>for over 10 years

>now. I'm sure I know many

>more prostitutes, escorts, hookers, porn

>stars and strippers than you

>ever will.

 

Are you bragging or complaining?

 

>So, really, exFratboy, until you go

>out and get to know

>hundreds of sex workers as

>I do.

 

Let me get this straight.....you live in OHIO (of all places) and know HUNDREDS of sex workers? HUNDREDS!!??!!

 

First off, you need to make some new friends. If you've had the time to intimately get to know HUNDREDS of sex workers (to know who they are, how they feel about what they do, their lives in general, etc.) then you have a creepy obsession with sex workers and you need to be a little more well-rounded in who you chose to get to know.

 

Or, it's possible, you're just lying about knowing HUNDREDS of sex workers. Neither option makes you look very good.

 

But that's nothing new.

 

Observantly yours,

 

FFF

[+ deej]

RE: Sex after failure at escorting

 

>Posts 61, 62, 63, 64, and 65 are all by the same guy!

 

And they say pretty much the same thing.

 

But there's no rule against that.

 

I'm the guy that cleared them through the queue, and I did get tired of reading the same thing over and over again, but it's his right so be so repetetive.

 

He's just putting his best foot forward.

[Guest jeffOH]

>>exFratboy...I've worked in the "sex industry"

>>for over 10 years

>>now. I'm sure I know many

>>more prostitutes, escorts, hookers, porn

>>stars and strippers than you

>>ever will.

>

>Are you bragging or complaining?

>

>>So, really, exFratboy, until you go

>>out and get to know

>>hundreds of sex workers as

>>I do.

>

>Let me get this straight.....you live

>in OHIO (of all places)

>and know HUNDREDS of sex

>workers? HUNDREDS!!??!!

>

>First off, you need to make

>some new friends. If you've

>had the time to intimately

>get to know HUNDREDS of

>sex workers (to know who

>they are, how they feel

>about what they do, their

>lives in general, etc.) then

>you have a creepy obsession

>with sex workers and you

>need to be a little

>more well-rounded in who you

>chose to get to know.

>

>

>Or, it's possible, you're just lying

>about knowing HUNDREDS of sex

>workers. Neither option makes you

>look very good.

>

>But that's nothing new.

>

>Observantly yours,

>

>FFF

 

FFF...Asshole, yes, it has been over a hundred, perhaps not hundreds, but nevertheless I'm sure more than exFratboy or you know.

And yes, I have gotten to know many quite intimately and most of my friends have been in or are in the sex industry in some capacity.

 

Advice from you on making friends? That's the only thing you've ever said that I've found to be funny, actually hilarious. Most of my friends in the sex industry do enjoy their chosen professions.

 

And exactly what do you know about OHIO? Besides, I know escorts and porn stars all over the country. And no, I am not bragging or complaining, merely stating fact. My point is that I do know many well-adjusted people in the sex industry. I just had dinner Saturday eve. with two of the most grounded porn stars I've ever

met, Matthew Rush(who is a friend of mine) and Zak Spears. Yes,

FINFANGFLAMER...here in OHIO.

 

You are the only person on here who has made me want to break my

name-calling ban. You are a complete ass and personify the word

"creepy"!

 

My best friends are all in the sex industry and are some of the most wonderful people I have ever met. Will I lose sleep wondering whether or not FinFangFucker believes anything I say? NO!!

 

So, since you have pushed me to this point, I will no longer respond to any posts you direct to me. You can call me a liar...

whatever you want. But, I know what my experience has been.

 

Go to HELL you self-loathing FAGGOT!

 

Sincerely yours,

Jeff4hire@aol.com

[DaninWA]

RE: FFF(really another escort) and his "un" Lucky sidekick

 

Jeff,

 

It seems that you are insulted by what FFF has said. It also seems that you don't respect FFF.

 

My grandfather would ask,"How can you be insulted by someone you don't respect?" Why do you care so much what he thinks? Forget him. Enjoy your life.

 

I'm not trying to offend you or start a fight. Just offering a little free advice. (And you know what they say about free advice)

 

Dan

[Guest Fin Fang Foom]

>Go to HELL you self-loathing FAGGOT!

>

>

>Sincerely yours,

>Jeff4hire@aol.com

 

 

You say the sweetest things.

 

Lovingly yours,

 

FFF