Reviews and Rebuttals

[Will]

Perhaps this thread belongs in the Lounge. If so, I hope that the moderators will move it.

 

I've been thinking about the business regarding a Premier escort, Emilio, and his review by Jon. I've read all of the relevant material, and I agree with others that the "rebuttal" is vituperative. Not only that, many of the turns-of-phrase sound a generation older than Emilio seems to be.

 

In order to keep the playing-field level, so to speak, would it be possible to *require* that agencies respond to reviews of their escorts, rather than have the escorts write them themselves? That way, everyone would know that the agencies themselves were the authors -- doubtless working with the escort in question.

 

There is a strong element of commercial self-interest here that goes beyond the individual escort who works on his own. Premier, for example, seems to have a virtual monopoly on the whole escort industry in a major American city. How can that be?, I ask myself. I also ask myself, What happens if a string of clients writes a string of negative reviews about a string of different escorts working for the same agency?

 

Finally, it seems unfair as well that escorts who work for agencies might have ghost-writers, whereas those guys on their own have to do the best they can.

 

That's why I wonder if it might not be a good idea to have it an M4M rule that responses to reviews of agency-based escorts must be written by the agencies themselves. They, after all, are ultimately responsible for client satisfaction.

[+ Lucky]

The problem with that suggestion is that the agency wasn't there and would be funneling the information it received from the escort, who, if he wants to keep his job, better make it clear it wasn't his fault, even if it was.

[Guest Tampa Yankee]

Maybe true Lucky.

 

However, on the plus side... has the agency received complaints through other channels about said escort before? THis makes the agency aware and they want to maintain their reputation... so they watch their guy and he knows they are watcing him. Either it clears up the problem or eventually the agency dismisses it and the escort.

 

The main issue I see is the agency being unscrupulous, which would be revealed in time and more important info than for a single escort.

 

Also, I don't see a mechansim for 'forcing' an agency response but they surely could be invited to respond and failing to do so could be noted in a follow up -- not too subtle pressure, I think.

[+ Charlie]

I like the idea of asking the agency for a response, since it is they who arrange the experience and collect the fee. I definitely felt while reading the response that it was from someone much older and more educated than Emillio, who is supposed to be a 19 yr old security guard (or at least Premier advertises that he has the uniform). I don't know if someone at Premier wrote the response, but I would find it surprising that they would publicly trash a regular client; after all, it's easier to find new escorts than new regular clients. At least if the agency were asked to respond, we would know where they stood in a dispute like this one.

[+ deej]

First, an admin note.... we can't move threads. We can't rename threads. The only thing we can do to a thread is delete it.

 

I don't think it's realistic to "make it a rule" that we "require" an agency to provide reponses to reviews. For starters, it is their business to run as they see fit. We can't require them to do things a certain way any more than we can require Sears & Roebuck to open a store at a location convenient to us.

 

Would it be nice to have the "official response" in addition to a response authored by the escort? Yep. Does the response in question sound like it was written by (or at the very least edited by) the agency? Yep. Is the agency at least aware of the situation? I think it's a safe bet. }>

 

I can actually see why the agency may want to stay out of it. They don't participate here because every time they try, no matter how innocuous, their reception is hostile. Perhaps this is their way of giving us what we want without saying that's what they're doing, thereby sidestepping the stone throwing that so often goes on around here (while at the same time inciting discussion about them).

[Rick Munroe]

Maximum Escorts already does this as a policy. Check out this rebuttal that Stephen of Maximum wrote for one of their boys:

 

http://207.14.53.20/reviews/dannyc.html

 

Stephen is a friend of mine and he recently asked me to read it. I was impressed...I hadn't realized that his agency was so "hands-on." I had assumed that they just booked the jobs and had nothing more to do with the outcome. This rebuttal is how it should be done; regardless of the situation or fault, a good agency should take responsibility and be the one to rebut.

 

Of course, though, I personally feel that hiring independent escorts is the way to go.

 

And I still say Emillio is yummy. :9

[Traveller]

>And I still say Emillio is yummy. :9

 

Dude,

 

He looks like a young Ricky. I know you really get off on Lucy, but getting porked by her teenage son? Pretty soon you'll be telling me you want to get rimmed by Fred. Oh, that's probably already happened.

 

Later.

[Losgatan]

Time to think twice about Premier?

 

Just as an independent escort’s rebuttal to a negative a review can tell us much about the escort, a rebuttal to an agency guy’s review can tell us a lot about the agency.

 

I think we have to assume that agency management is involved in virtually all such situations. Sometimes that involvement is explicit (as with Rainbow in Atlanta and Man-to-Man in San Diego). And sometimes it’s covert (as apparently with Premier and Emillio).

 

I travel to Philadelphia frequently and have used Premier several times during the past year. Although the agency has received generally good marks here, there’s definitely room for improvement.

 

1) Several of the guys live in the distant suburbs. When they come to town, they often are scheduled for (nearly) back-to-back appointments. That leads to late arrivals and performance disappointments – both are well documented in the reviews of Premier’s guys.

 

2) It’s nearly impossible to arrange a firm appointment with a specific escort more than a couple of days in advance. If you try, you are told to call back later and then you must pick from a short list of the guys that are working that day or evening. Chances are, you will not be able to meet with your first choice.

 

3) Communications are often garbled. On my last visit, the escort was sent to the wrong hotel (with a similar name to the one in which I was staying) and arrived more than an hour late. Details about what the client has requested are frequently not transmitted to the escort.

 

In short, I fear that Premier may be getting spoiled by it’s own success. “Emillio’s” rebuttal is just one more indication that the agency is no longer as customer-oriented as it used to be. Perhaps it’s time for us to take notice.

[Will]

Here's a clarification, and I'm sorry that I wasn't clearer in the first place.

 

When I say "require" I mean only that Hoo or the moderators announce that they will not post a response to a review of an agency escort unless the response carries the imprimatur, however that be determined, of the agency in question.

 

Of course, it's true that the agency will take the escort's side, and it's also true that the agent himself isn't a witness to what actually happened. However, if the escort tells the agency his view of things, I don't see how that's different from an escort writing his own response.

 

What I'd like to see is responsible parties taking responsibility. After all, independent escorts have to manage all of their own business dealings, including responding to reviews. It's already been said, but it bears repeating that the agency, and not the individual escort, is the party of greater interest in these situations.

 

Hope that's clearer. On the face of it, it doesn't seem to be a rule that would be difficult to implement.

[Bilbo]

RE: Time to think twice about Premier?

 

One possible problem - If the escort is given a bad review which is not entirely merited, and then the escort agency fires him and writes a review answer which completely hangs him out to dry, only partly merited, then the escort, trying to go solo is stuck trying to get out from under a very convincing looking, but perhaps only partly merited 'don't go there' sign. Just a hypothetical possibility.

[Guest alanm]

RE: Time to think twice about Premier?

 

Most of Premiere's escorts are listed as being 20, 21, 22 (don't know how old they really are). It would be difficult for someone in their mid-to-late '20 to keep the kind of schedule Premiere requires of its escorts. On Saturday night, an escort might have 4 appointments - all

some distance from each other. In addition to the drive and parking, he then has to be an escort for an hour and perform and move on to the next client. Premiere charges low rates, so an escort has to see a lot of clients to make decent money.

[+ deej]

<<When I say "require" I mean only that Hoo or the moderators announce that they will not post a response to a review of an agency escort unless the response carries the imprimatur, however that be determined, of the agency in question.>>

 

Does anyone else think "HooBoy and the moderators" sounds like a 50's singing group? ;-)

 

I love ya Will, but you're mixing apples and oranges.

 

Moderators have nothing to do with reviews, nor do posts in the message center. Reviews (and rebuttals) are completely HooBoy's gig. HooBoy's #1 rule about reviews from day 1 has been "the escort has the last say".

 

Not so in the message center. }>

 

Let's keep these two entites separate, eh? They really are.

 

This isn't a new policy. It's been this way all along, but we haven't been good about making it clear.

[Will]

OK. For this particular suggestion it doesn't matter who's in charge. I wasn't confused. Just forgetful, as usual, about who does what with what and to whom.

 

As for "HooBoy and the Moderators," maybe they should feature in our first M4M Ball. They could sing "Where the Boys Are," "It's Raining Men," and close with "That's My Will."

[+ deej]

<<As for "HooBoy and the Moderators," maybe they should feature in our first M4M Ball. They could sing "Where the Boys Are," "It's Raining Men," and close with "That's My Will.">>

 

I get to wear the black sequin number. It's so slimming. ;-)

[mmk]

deej, you always get to wear the black sequinned number. Now who diesd and made you Kitty Carlyle?!?

[+ deej]

>who died and made you Kitty Carlyle?!?

 

Alan Hart. He was so damn generous with his gowns ... Kitty got so many good years out of them.

 

(Always did think she was a man. ;-))

 

Bea Arthur would be proud.

[Will]

Whaddaya mean "got"? Is Kitty Carlisle dead? I met her at a dinner party in New York a couple of years ago and she was the most intensely alive person I think I ever met. I've always assumed that she'd live forever. By the way, she was just as beautiful when I met her as she was when she was on Broadway.

[Will]

Kitty Carlisle was married to Moss Hart, not Alan. Or did I miss something here?

[Traveller]

>Is Kitty Carlisle dead?

 

She's on a couple of lists in the Dead Pool, but not mine, so thank God she hasn't been planted yet.

 

Later.

 

PS. And when is Brooke Astor gonna drop, dammit. She's been on my list for a few years now.

[Guest WetDream]

RE: Dead Pool Entries

 

Madame Chiang Kai Chek is at the top of mine....and has been for about 20 years. Is it genes are top-notch medical care?

[+ deej]

Woops! You're right! It was Moss Hart.

[Guest PhxMasseur]

I agree, I browsed the review site for almost a year before I ever stepped foot into the message center. Then one day boredom overcame me and I clicked in, then followed the board for a few weeks before working up the nerve to make my first post here.

[Will]

Brooke Astor, as it happens, was at the same dinner party, glittering in black lace and enough diamonds to sink the Titanic. When she drops it will be a sad day.

[Guest alanm]

Kitty is 90 and will probably live forever. But, she has never been willing to talk about Moss Hart's sexuality. When she understood that Steven Back's book on Hart called "Dazzler" was going to be truthful

about his sexuality (bi or gay), she refused to cooperate. Thus, the book (and history) lost a very valuable sourse of information. The

last laugh is on Kitty, because Moss Hary's reputation needs a boost.

He will probably be remembered for his book, "Act One," and directing ("A Star is Born" and "My Fair Lady.)" Except for "Lady in the Dark"

his plays are very dated.