Who's in the closet? (an informal poll)

[ariadne1880]

You know what ... it's just as bad to stereotype people as "rednecks" as it is to stereotype people as "fags."

 

Until the gay community learns that, there is little chance of acceptance yet alone embrace.

 

Mark

[Guest ncm2169]

Behind the false door in the back of the closet, having been a "family man" for 25 years (now divorced) with two grown children and two grandchildren.

 

I've mastered the art of compartmentalizing since I choose not to disrupt my immediate family's lives with my own idiosyncracies. They and most of my friends know I live with another guy (escort DJ in Mpls), but we cover that nicely by the facts that he has a daughter, worked as a DJ at a popular hetero Strip Club, and has an insatiable appetite for pussy, plus we are not a "couple," just good buddies who happen to have our own private life together. We characterize ourselves as having an "improbable friendship," which of course is totally true. I'm as content with my current situation as I could ever imagine being. I support GLBT causes quietly but firmly, and have no need to frequent gay clubs or parades. I don't criticize those who do otherwise, and I shrug off criticism of my lifestyle. Live and let live; each to his/her own, yadda, yadda, yadda. }(

[OneFinger]

Mark,

 

People in my industry refer to themselves as REDNECK!!!! I'm just echoing what they say about themselves.

 

Does that make you feel better?

 

There are very few people on this site that really piss me off. You're one of them.

 

I hope our paths never meet.

 

http://www.jcnot4me.com/images/Bush-%20cheney%20fuck%20you.jpg

[+ deej]

Please see http://mc.daddysreviews.com/dcboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=13&topic_id=1480&mesg_id=1480&page=

 

Don't feed the trolls and they'll either go away or kill themselves.

[Okliehomo]

Well, in my mind, I am very much in the closet because I don't talk about it openly with all my co workers or my boss, but I have very few doubts that my life is a mystery to anyone... especially the maids at the Courtyard Marriott every other weekend..... who pick up all the strangely stiff towels....

 

Like Gareth, I am in my late 40s and haven't had a girlfriend EVER. By choice and careful design. I did tell my Mother who was so incredibly cool about it after an incredibly bad break up. . How else could she be? The woman bought me Barbies from day one..... and thank God for that!!!! I can still remember what it felt like on a Saturday afternoon when we went downtown to the TG&Y that always smelled like popcorn and Brach's chocolate stars ( yes, I was FAT as a child...) and I got to sneak down the doll aisle and see all of them.... Barbie, Midge, Skipper, Francie ...... Ken and Allen, not so much..., all available in different hair colors... but I couldn't touch them or pick one up, God forbid... I just had to look and keep walking... toward the trucks or the bats. Please, like I gave a shit.

 

This is how gay I was..(am)... when "Valley of the Dolls" came out, I was so thrilled...I literally thought that somewhere out there was a valley full of dolls, like the Sears catalog at Christmas time. I was desperate to see the movie, but by then, I had read the book about 10 times and knew that it was about Garland and Monroe ...EVEN BETTER!!! My Dad actually got cable so that I could see "V of D" on channel 6 . God love him.

 

So, they both came thru for me and what a blessing to have such accepting parents. She was my best friend and my biggest fan. She loved my first boyfriend and he was a pall bearer at her funeral this past November. So, I guess, I am out to the people that I can trust but not to everyone..

 

That being said, I don't have an agenda. I am not trying to cram anything down anyone's throat. Nope, not even that. I am a model fairy, a hardworking, bill paying fag... and I , too, lived thru the Reagan years... but ALOT of people didn't. You may have grown up sitting on Nancy's lap and watching RR narrate "Death Valley Days", but in my mind, it was on his watch that he allowed AIDS to be a moral question instead of a medical one. Not saying that the outcome would have been any different, but the stigma would have been less. I think it was just "killing all the right people". And if that was the last time you felt good about the man in office, I am guessing you live in a big old log cabin somewhere south of way conflicted.

 

And his "trickle down" economics have trickled down to the absolute mess of "faith based" and "family values" bullshit that we are faced with today. The Bible says that laying with another man is an abomination, (if taken out of context, why yes it does ) but I think that owing the Chinese $1 trillion bucks ranks right up there. I don't even like rice. Unless it's "Rice a Roni" the San Francisco treat..

 

Hey.. I thought that was David.

 

Okie

[Lewis H]

From your own posts and the testimony of others, Oklie, you sound like a guy I'd love to meet and chat with one day! We already have a shared negative experience with the same porn star escort, so we have much to start chatting about. :+

 

Knew I was different since age 7, just didn't know what it meant save for than the derogatory labels I had been teased and saddled with all my youth. Finally came out after coming to New York at age 23, and have been out ever since. And pretty damn gay as you've no doubt found out, Rick, lo those many years ago when we first me (although apparently not as swishy as the tormentors of my youth would have had me believe).

[+ purplekow]

At this point in my life, I am not so much In or Out, I just am.

I lived a strictly heterosexual life, except for some minor teenage experiences only one of which involved any kind of nudity, until about 5 years ago. Through college and post-graduate training, I worked hard and played hard, strictly with women. At 36, after despairing of finding anyone, I decided to open the flood gates and consented to doing blind dates, which led nowhere, though I did have about 60 dates, in a three month period. Soon after, I met the woman who would become my wife. For the full extent of our relationship, I was totally commited to her. After her death, I could not even think about dating another woman. Two celebate years later, I decided that I would have sex with a man. Contact was made and I met my first escort. It was fun and guilt free, I did not feel that having sex with men compromised the memory of my wife, which was a consideration and then it turned out to be very hot and sexy.

So now, I see escorts. I don't date, neither men nor women and I am not stressed. A beuatiful woman definitely would change the focus. HAving been married for so long and so obviously in love, most assume I am straight. Since no ones asks, I don't tell/

 

Rick

[Guest zipperzone]

>Please see

>http://mc.daddysreviews.com/dcboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=13&topic_id=1480&mesg_id=1480&page=

>

>Don't feed the trolls and they'll either go away or kill

>themselves.

 

OK - but how long do we have to wait?

[Guest TBinCHI]

The Bible says that laying with another man is an

>abomination, (if taken out of context, why yes it does )

 

The Bible also says that wearing clothing made of different fabrics is an abomination. And so is eating shellfish. I'm done giving any credence to the religious institutions which use their prejudices and convenient biblical justifications to preach hatred.

 

And, Oklie, I agree with you that the Reagan Administration's lack of any meaningful reaction to the AIDS epidemic, except for the moral indignation, unnecessarily led to the deaths of tens of thousands of people. Look at the advances that have been made in AIDS research in the intervening years, that, with a sympathetic administration could have made years earlier.

 

My closet gets smaller everyday. I don't advertise that I am gay, but don't deny it if and when asked. I have found it very liberating to tell those who love me who I really am and must give many thanks to the escorts I have been with, some of whom post regularly on here, who have helped build my self esteem to the point that I have been able to open the closet door and take steps out from time to time. So thank you to them and they know who they are.

[+ ArVaGuy]

Great topic Rick and fascinating to learn the stories of many in our little community here. I'll share mine.

 

I grew up as an only child in the Deep South, northwest Louisiana to be exact. This area could refer to as the "buckle" of the Bible Belt since it linked Texas with the rest of the conservative south. Throw in that my family was Italian and Roman Catholic and there was plenty of potential for serious dysfunction.

 

My father died when I was not even 2 years old, my mother never remarried. I have absolutely no memory of my father and other than a few photographs would have no clue what he looked like. Relatives tell me I look just like him and I guess that's the case. Other than inheriting his cardiac issues I have no other legacy. It was my uncles on my mother's side that took the surrogate father role as I grew up but, honestly, they were poor substitutes for the real thing.

 

The earliest recollection of feeling different came when I was about 5 years old. I wound up with a crush on a boy at kindergarten. At least that's how I define it now 40 years later. By the time I hit my teens I knew I was gay and that led to some years of typical teenage angst compounded with all the guilt that a Catholic, Italian, Southern family can pile on in that regard.

 

I "messed around" with a few boys in the neighborhood and even a couple of the girls. Banging the girls really confirmed for me that I was gay. Although one of them claimed I was a better fuck than this guy Billy on my street. Funny thing was he and I was fucking each other as well so that was interesting to hear, bet the bitch was telling him the same thing .

 

At university I struggled against my natural proclivities for a while and nearly got married. When I really looked at the situation I realized that I could not do that to this very nice young woman and called a halt to the relationship. Ugly does not begin to describe the mess that resulted.

 

That experience made me realize that if I really wanted to live my life I needed to leave the state. So I would up moving away and came to DC where I plunged into the gay scene like so many repressed guys will do.

 

I came out here a couple years later after finding a mentor who befriended me, no sex, just advice. This man helped me deal with the issues I had related to my being gay. He brought me out so to speak and gave me the tools to tell my mother about my life. Later, I took care of this man while he died of AIDS and that process gave me a lot of tools I use to this day. I consider it one of the most important relationships I ever had in my life.

 

On Christmas Day 1992 I told my mother I was gay. I did not plan it for that day but circumstances just made it happen. Her reply was "You are my son and I love you." For me all of the angst and fear the previous 30 years of my life disappeared at that moment.

 

I've been out of the closet since then in all aspects of my life including work. I would not trade any of the life experiences I’ve had in this process. My life is better now than at any part of it previously and I’m indebted to a number of people (including ex boyfriends) that I’ve met along the way for making it so. :-)

[ariadne1880]

Let's face facts. Facts the gay community has never really wanted to face. People dying of AIDS in the 1980s had nothing to do with Ronald Reagan. It had everything to do with gay people's behavior. The fact that people don't want to face up to that is what turns so many off.

 

There isn't a single person who wouldn't have died had Ronald Reagan done whatever the hell it is that you all wanted him to do. He was president of the USA, not president in charge of doing something about AIDS.

 

Don't forget. There were many who saw it as a health crisis that should be quaranteened. Did Ronald Reagan order gays into camps? Nope. But considering how contagious the disease was it would have been a logical, though harsh, step.

 

AIDS quickly went from being a medical issue into a political one and it was AIDS activists who made it such. Much progress was made on the medical front but not due to the activists who did more harm than good. God knows how much more progress -- and quicker -- would have been made if it had remained a medical issue and not one that had to be politicized which only served to alienate more people.

 

Facts are tough, difficult things and some in the gay community want to persist in this fantasy about Ronald Reagan. How sad. Move on. It's 2008.

 

Mark

[ariadne1880]

I'm so glad I piss off a narrow-minded little bigot like you. Once more of your ilk are cleared from the gay community the more chance we have of being accepted and embraced.

 

But not until we get rid of every last one of you pieces of excrement who preach tolerance by being intolerant to most of the rest of the population.

 

But you're far too ignorant -- and stupid -- to realize that is what you are doing.

 

Mark

[Guest TBinCHI]

>>Facts are tough, difficult things and some in the gay

>community want to persist in this fantasy about Ronald Reagan.

>How sad. Move on. It's 2008.

>

Sorry, Mark, but I don't think that we are the ones persisting in a fantasy about Ronald Reagan. I certainly don't think that he was the demon that left wingers paint him out to be, but he sure as hell wasn't an angel, or as great a president as you fantasize him to be. His refusal to recognize AIDS for the epidemic it is surely delayed the research that has led to the advances we have seen. Had Reagan treated it as a medical issue instead of a moral one, those advances would have come earlier and lives would have been saved.

 

Yes, promiscuous gay men surely helped the spread of the disease and bear responsibility for their behaviour. But, the slow pace of research in those years stymied the discovery of how the disease was spread and how it could be prevented. The simple fact is that research was slow because the disease appeared most prominently in the gay community, not because gays moralized the issue.

 

So, the bottom line is that you are free to have your opinion, but my interpretation of the facts leads me to a different one.

[+ purplekow]

>>>Facts are tough, difficult things and some in the

>gay

>>community want to persist in this fantasy about Ronald

>Reagan.

>>How sad. Move on. It's 2008.

>>

>Pointing this back to the OP intention, Hollywood in the 40's and 50's was a hotbed for homosexual assignations with all the wonderfully handsome and definitely closeted actors of the time. So my guess, Ronald Reagan was closeted. Pure speculation but I would say Tyrone Power was his "mentor" in the ways of Hollywood,hence his thirst for Power so many years later. And then of course Reagan fucked us all in the ass for 8 years.

[JamesK840]

Rick, I also really wanted to thank you for this topic. There are a lot of gay forums where being in the closet is viewed very negatively, and to instead have a gathering of guys openly sharing their own experiences and reasons without being ostracized is great.

 

Personally, I'm obviously out to the friends I've met through Hooville but am ambivalently 'in' otherwise. It wouldn't really matter with my friends or my job, but I just don't see any benefit to outweigh the added awkwardness. Even gay people seem to assume quite confidently that I'm straight, but it's not a secret I consider valuable.

 

I believe my mother knows, for god's sake she rented 'Angeles in America' when I was home for x-mas several years ago... I'd tell her if she asked, but I don't think she wants to know for sure. She occasionally mentions girlfriends or grandchildren, maybe she's managed to convince herself it's only because of my weight that the last time I had a girlfriend was middleschool.

 

I think I'm a bit damaged because I can't really imagine myself with a boyfriend either, when I'm horny I can imagine all kinds of things, but other times (especially right after coming) not *at all*.

[Argos]

Rick:

 

Thanks for asking the question. I am definitely in the closet with respect to my male attraction. I love women and have been married but no kids. I definitely enjoy the company of and sex with men but I don't share this part of my life with my friends, coworkers or family. Like many I was raised in a very conservative Christian family and recognize that many in the fundamentalist ranks would consider my bisexuality nothing but hypocrisy.

[+ Italiano]

In my late 40s, born and raised in Milan, Italy in a traditional but not conservative "straight-oriented" family, I began to feel attracted to men when I was 8-9, I never had any sex experience with my straight adolescent friends, at 14 I jerked off and cum in the bathroom for the first time to a gay porn magazine (found by accident in the street) which I would then buy almost weekly in a local kiosk ashamed as a thief for years, my first sexual "contact" with a man (I was 15) was in a porn movie theatre in Milan when he touched me in the dark and I came in my pants (literally! He didn't even pull it out!), my first naked sex was when I was 17 with a married man in his late 40s, he fucked me and I didn't like it (I didn't even like the man!), I had a few girlfriends, petting but no intercourse, the first fabulous and totally enjoyable gay sex was with an Hungarian student in Paris I met in the street when I was 19 during a trip with two straight buddies (they didn't find out of course), at 20 while I was dating this girl (with whom I was trying to avoid the "intercourse" topic) I met a guy with whom I had sex and feelings secretly for two months until I came out to my family and my girlfriend (of course I broke up with her...).

 

Slowly I came out to my straight friends (I was a bit shocked to see how they accepted me even if very surprised) and somehow to the rest of the world.

 

My escort hiring from time to time is in the closet, yes!

[Rick Munroe]

>This is how gay I was..(am)... when "Valley of the

>Dolls" came out, I was so thrilled...I literally thought

>that somewhere out there was a valley full of dolls, like the

>Sears catalog at Christmas time.

 

That's really funny. Btw, though, I've never understood why people think that little boys who like Barbie dolls are necessarily gay. In your case, yes, but it's not really an indicator. Little Derek had a big collection of G.I. Joes and he was very turned on by them. He had no interest in Barbies because he had no interest in the female form. So, the stereotypes aren't always correct. Boys who like the macho G.I. Joe (as they are "supposed to") are actually being gayer than the little boys who love to dress and undress the tiny-waisted, big-breasted Barbie!

[Rick Munroe]

>And

>pretty damn gay as you've no doubt found out, Rick, lo those

>many years ago when we first met

 

Hey, it wasn't that many years ago! (and I still have the candle holder)

[Rick Munroe]

>I have found it

>very liberating to tell those who love me who I really am

 

Do you feel closer to them now, too? (I'm very happy for you, btw; you knew that.)

[Rick Munroe]

>And then of course Reagan

>fucked us all in the ass for 8 years.

 

Bareback, too, which is why we're all still paying the price.

[Rick Munroe]

>In those

>awkward times I liken it to jumping into a cold pool or lake -

>difficult to contemplate but if you just hold your breath and

>make yourself do it then you're in and can enjoy yourself.

>It's a corny analogy but works for me!

 

It's a great analogy! Maybe it'll work for someone else, too. That's what I love about this board.

[Rick Munroe]

>Have never made a point of "I am

>gay" but on the other hand I have not hidden the fact.

 

I see that a few others have said that in this thread, and I respect it, but I am the opposite. I like to let people know I'm gay, especially when Derek and I travel out of the "gay zones." I feel like everyone assumes everyone else is straight, so I want to do my part to let people know there are many of us LGBT's out there.

 

>I don't "ghettoize" my life by choosing my friends

>by their sexual orientation. I have friends without limiting

>myself by my sex life.

 

Same here. I think people would be surprised to learn that Derek and my closest friends are straight. And yes, they all know what we do for a living, and think it's cool (especially the guys).

[Rick Munroe]

>It bothers

>me a little when young activists feel that being out is the

>ONLY alternative. Perhaps, but then again, perhaps not.

 

I used to feel that way, but as I said above, I respect it as a personal choice now. I've met too many closeted guys who seem happy to think that they "need" to come out. Of course, it helps the rest of us (strength in numbers, etc.) but other than gently encouraging, I never push unless I sense it's wanted.

[Rick Munroe]

>Afterall, when I was a teenager it was the

>mid-1970s. It wasn't easy. There were no role models.

 

What about these guys?

 

http://splinteredsunrise.files.wordpress.com/2007/07/village_people_narrowweb__300x2880.jpg