Real straight guys vs straight identified.

[KS87]

Does it matter? Many elite worshippers will only deal with the former while the masses get duped by the latter pretending to be the former while some are equal opportunity. There is a certain subsect who dont rhink the former exists in this biz. What are your thoughts??

[hornytwells]

There are multiple threads on this subject here, it has been covered ad nauseam. Only telling you this as you might be likely to receive no new responses for that reason, but if you try searching you will get a ton of thoughts on this subject

[KS87]

There are multiple threads on this subject here, it has been covered ad nauseam. Only telling you this as you might be likely to receive no new responses for that reason, but if you try searching you will get a ton of thoughts on this subject

 

Even tho schools teach same curriculum every year new asses sit in the seat. New members might be able to chime in where they didnt chime in b4. Hopefully this topic resonates because among my circle it is extremely relevant for the aforementioned reasons.

Edited January 4, 2018 by KS87

[Rudynate]

Does it matter? Many elite worshippers will only deal with the former while the masses get duped by the latter pretending to be the former while some are equal opportunity. There is a certain subsect who dont rhink the former exists in this biz. What are your thoughts??

 

 

What is the difference between a "real" straight guy and someone "straight-identified?" Are you saying that a "straight-identified" guy is a gay or bi guy who is misrepresenting himself as straight? In present use, when we say that some "identifies" as a certain gender or orientation, it means that they experience themselves as being of that gender or orientation. To me, someone who experiences himself as straight is "really" straight.

[Chuckball]

I note @KS87 has been a forum member for less than a year. He has a right to pose a question without being told there are threads to be found elsewhere if he only does his homework. We are a discussion group after all and not writing an encyclopedia.

[KS87]

What is the difference between a "real" straight guy and someone "straight-identified?" Are you saying that a "straight-identified" guy is a gay or bi guy who is misrepresenting himself as straight? In present use, when we say that some "identifies" as a certain gender or orientation, it means that they experience themselves as being of that gender or orientation. To me, someone who experiences himself as straight is "really" straight.

 

Hi Rudy. The science of classification is,not without controversy. This is not a topic that cqn be discussed without ruffling feathers. Keep in mind there may be a disparity in classification from person to person and a spectrum even. However for simplicities sake i will give the prototype for each category in relevqnce to this forum.

 

 

 

Straight guy- Meets with men when there is a commercial incentive. Fantasizes about women and typically in relationships with them or always actively pursuing at least physical relationships with them. Hard drive is loaded with lesbian porn. Fits the typical str8 male stereotypes i.e. follows sport, not overly concerned with high fashion labels, unreserved relaxed personality etc.

 

Straight identified- actively markets himself using terms "str8 or masc". Not actively pursuing relationships with women. Apathetic to female advances or prescence. Fairly masculine but often not at the natural effortless level of the former.

 

A pwrfect textbook example would be awol marines produced by bobby garcia which featured 95 percent straight men involved in homosexual activity vs military classified which features all or mostly str8 identified guys who i am doubtful are going home to women.

 

More straight identified type porn includes randy blue, corbin fisher, straight fraternity etc.

 

More actual porn featuring straight guys doing gay things woikd be vinnie russo's str8boysseduced, old reliable studios, and many of the men captured on candid can by diksukka and those captured on hidden cam by publicsucker, who was an actual cop who got arrested for luring mechanics, marines, and all types of hypermasculine men to his gloryhole.

 

While i will never question anyones identity to their face just cuz someone says they are something doesnt mean i have to accept that. Just like how i dont accept that someone trans can will themselves into the gender they want. They can delude themselves and purchase the corresponding bodyparts and features, a luxury not afforded poorer impoverished trans people.

 

So what im saying nicely is some guys are the reql deal and some are full of shit. You just gotta deal.

[KS87]

What is the difference between a "real" straight guy and someone "straight-identified?" Are you saying that a "straight-identified" guy is a gay or bi guy who is misrepresenting himself as straight? In present use, when we say that some "identifies" as a certain gender or orientation, it means that they experience themselves as being of that gender or orientation. To me, someone who experiences himself as straight is "really" straight.

 

I experience myself as a millionaire. Let me go check my account.

[hornytwells]

Even tho schools teach same curriculum every year new asses sit in the seat. New members might be able to chime in where they didnt chime in b4. Hopefully this topic resonates because among my circle it is extremely relevant for the aforementioned reasons.

I totally get that, and it wasn't meant as an admonishment....more as something useful in case you didn't get a lot of responses from many forum members who may have felt this topic had been covered so much in the past. A lot of conflicting views expressed in previous threads......

Edited January 5, 2018 by hornytwells

[hornytwells]

I note @KS87 has been a forum member for less than a year. He has a right to pose a question without being told there are threads to be found elsewhere if he only does his homework. We are a discussion group after all and not writing an encyclopedia.

Please do not put words into my mouth. See my previous reply-it was meant to be helpful as I considered the fact that maybe he would find the previous threads interesting. you added the phrase "if only he does his homework" which was nowhere to be found or implied in my response

Edited January 5, 2018 by hornytwells

[+ quoththeraven]

My two cents: contemplating this is just tying oneself up in knots needlessly. (Or watching angels dance on the head of a pin, to use a metaphor someone else used in another thread.)

[KS87]

My two cents: contemplating this is just tying oneself up in knots needlessly. (Or watching angels dance on the head of a pin, to use a metaphor someone else used in another thread.)

 

Couldnt disagree more. You dont understand the mindset of the worshipper who wants to worship the a1 alpha male at the top of the chain. They dont want imposters posing like the real thing. The problem is too many on here give these imposters life and support studios peddling fake shit. See your faves like sean cody corbin fisher. Many in my circle scoff at that like old money at new money.

[Rudynate]

Hi Rudy. The science of classification is,not without controversy. This is not a topic that cqn be discussed without ruffling feathers. Keep in mind there may be a disparity in classification from person to person and a spectrum even. However for simplicities sake i will give the prototype for each category in relevqnce to this forum.

 

Straight guy- Meets with men when there is a commercial incentive. Fantasizes about women and typically in relationships with them or always actively pursuing at least physical relationships with them. Hard drive is loaded with lesbian porn. Fits the typical str8 male stereotypes i.e. follows sport, not overly concerned with high fashion labels, unreserved relaxed personality etc.

 

Straight identified- actively markets himself using terms "str8 or masc". Not actively pursuing relationships with women. Apathetic to female advances or prescence. Fairly masculine but often not at the natural effortless level of the former.

 

A pwrfect textbook example would be awol marines produced by bobby garcia which featured 95 percent straight men involved in homosexual activity vs military classified which features all or mostly str8 identified guys who i am doubtful are going home to women.

 

More straight identified type porn includes randy blue, corbin fisher, straight fraternity etc.

 

More actual porn featuring straight guys doing gay things woikd be vinnie russo's str8boysseduced, old reliable studios, and many of the men captured on candid can by diksukka and those captured on hidden cam by publicsucker, who was an actual cop who got arrested for luring mechanics, marines, and all types of hypermasculine men to his gloryhole.

 

While i will never question anyones identity to their face just cuz someone says they are something doesnt mean i have to accept that. Just like how i dont accept that someone trans can will themselves into the gender they want. They can delude themselves and purchase the corresponding bodyparts and features, a luxury not afforded poorer impoverished trans people.

 

So what im saying nicely is some guys are the reql deal and some are full of shit. You just gotta deal.

 

 

I think you are articulating a fantasy rather than a system of classification.

[LivingnLA]

At the risk of being labeled a broken record and consigned to the forum's dustbin, I shall repeat myself on this topic with a few minor changes.

 

What do you define as "real straight guy" versus "straight identified?"

 

As I have posted multiple times, the research and science on this is in very early days because human sexuality and identity are incredibly complex and surprisingly flexible given a variety of environmental incentives. Research generally seems to see a distinction between Sexual Orientation and Sexual Behavior Orientation. There may even be a Romantic or Affection Orientation. It's dreadfully tricky to "reduce" an organic analog life into neatly discrete categories and labels. Klein--the brilliant bisexual sexologist--did some very interesting work to try and capture a better picture in his "Grid" that is more comprehensive than Kinsey's famous scale.

 

I could go on and on, but the fact remains that identification is a very personal thing and how a person self-identifies is their truth. Unless you're planning to use a penile plethysmograph to measure a man's penile blood flow as a proxy for his sexual arousal to determine what turns him on, then what's the point?

 

As a man with a strong attraction to stereotypically straight men, I am indeed turned on by the thought of sexual activity with a "straight guy" because of such cultural tropes as "the thrill of the hunt" or "obtaining the unobtainable." It's all fantasy, but for me, since my first formative same-sex activities were with guys who were straight, it strongly affixed this kink of mine.

 

What gets really "fun" and interesting about all of this is how it intersects this particular hobby. Understanding the physiological and psychological "limitations" of these labels results in certain realities. For example, a 100% straight-identified man--what Kinsey would've called a zero--would not have any sexual arousal at same-sex porn and might even be physically repulsed by it. Klein would argue that interests change over time as life experiences affect us. Consider "situational sexual behavior" like homosexual activity in prison or the military or even "gay 4 pay" activity.

 

Hmm. I've rambled all over the place. I return to my original question: what is your definition of "real straight guy?"

 

I've had the fun and hot experience three times in my life of being the first man to suck three different guys who identified as straight at the time and still identify as straight. They said I was their best and we enjoyed many hot times where I could worship them and they could enjoy hot head and go home to their girlfriends/wives. However, those types of activities are somewhat rare. Especially now because Millennials are far more open and experimental. I imagine it's becoming more common to find a straight guy in his 20s who has been blown by a male friend and probably blown that friend too. We live in a more open and less restrictive time.

 

In my hiring, when I seek a worship or top scenario, the guy I seek is classically and stereotypically masculine from an American cultural perspective, because that's my kink. Yes, I prefer "straight guys" but a truly 100% straight guy would be unable to top well because he wouldn't be able to get hard without medical assistance. That means, I seek out men who are able to perform with men or women. I like tattoos and body hair. Muscles and that classically "cocky" borderline arrogant/asshole attitude of a confident dominant man who knows what he wants and takes it.

Edited January 6, 2018 by LivingnLA

[mike carey]

This discussion is interesting but in some ways misplaced. Are 'really straight' and 'straight identified' terms that make a distinction without a difference? I can understand people wanting their partners to conform to a certain set of stereotypes, and they have the right to question them to determine whether they do or not. The term 'imposter' is unhelpful and I would say presumptuous. People get to identify their sexuality as they see fit, and leaving aside the few who lie about it for whatever advantage (in this forum, commercial), no-one has the right to tell them that they are not what they say they are. Claiming that someone is not really straight because they do not conform to a set of stereotypes that an observer has decided upon assumes that stereotypes are definitive proof of someone's sexuality. In any other conversation in this forum a claim that stereotypes prove anything would be dismissed summarily.

[escortrod]

Couldnt disagree more. You dont understand the mindset of the worshipper who wants to worship the a1 alpha male at the top of the chain. They dont want imposters posing like the real thing. The problem is too many on here give these imposters life and support studios peddling fake shit. See your faves like sean cody corbin fisher. Many in my circle scoff at that like old money at new money.

You imply that same sex attracted guys, however they identify, cannot be ‘a1 alphas’. I call bullshit on that.

[KS87]

I think you are articulating a fantasy rather than a system of classification.

 

Your thoughts are your own and you have the right to think.

Edited January 5, 2018 by KS87

[Rudynate]

I experience myself as a millionaire. Let me go check my account.

 

If you're not a millionaire, then your statement that you experience yourself as a millionaire is self-delusion. You could however aspire to being a millionaire. But aspiration and being are different mindsets.

[KS87]

At the risk of being labeled a broken record and consigned to the forum's dustbin, I shall repeat myself on this topic with a few minor changes.

 

What do you define as "real straight guy" versus "straight identified?"

 

As I have posted multiple times, the research and science on this is in very early days because human sexuality and identity are incredibly complex and surprisingly flexible given a variety of environmental incentives. Research generally seems to see a distinction between Sexual Orientation and Sexual Behavior Orientation. There may even be a Romantic or Affection Orientation. It's dreadfully tricky to "reduce" an organic analog life into neatly discrete categories and labels. Klein--the brilliant bisexual sexologist--did some very interesting work to try and capture a better picture in his "Grid" that is more comprehensive than Kinsey's famous scale.

 

I could go on and on, but the fact remains that identification is a very personal thing and how a person self-identifies is their truth. Unless you're planning to use a penile plethysmograph to measure a man's penile blood flow as a proxy for his sexual arousal to determine what turns him on, then what's the point?

 

As a man with a strong attraction to stereotypically straight men, I am indeed turned on by the thought of sexual activity with a "straight guy" because of such cultural tropes as "the thrill of the hunt" or "obtaining the unobtainable." It's all fantasy, but for me, since my first formative same-sex activities were with guys who were straight, it strongly affixed this kink of mine.

 

What gets really "fun" and interesting about all of this is how it intersects this particular hobby. Understanding the physiological and psychological "limitations" of these labels results in certain realities. For example, a 100% straight-identified man--what Kinsey would've called a zero--would not have any sexual arousal at same-sex porn and might even be physically repulsed by it. Klein would argue that interests change over time as life experiences affect us. Consider "situational sexual behavior" like homosexual activity in prison or the military or even "gay 4 pay" activity.

 

Hmm. I've rambled all over the place. I return to my original question: what is your definition of "real straight guy?"

 

I've had the fun and hot experience three times in my life of being the first man to suck three different guys who identified as straight at the time and still identify as straight. They said I was their best and we enjoyed many hot times where I could worship them and they could enjoy hot head and go home to their girlfriends/wives. However, those types of activities are somewhat rare. Especially now because Millennials are far more open and experimental. I imagine it's becoming unusual to find a straight guy in his 20s who hasn't been blown by a male friend and probably blown that friend too. We live in a more open and less restrictive time.

 

In my hiring, when I seek a worship or top scenario, the guy I seek is classically and stereotypically masculine from an American cultural perspective, because that's my kink. Yes, I prefer "straight guys" but a truly 100% straight guy would be unable to top well because he wouldn't be able to get hard without medical assistance. That means, I seek out men who are able to perform with men or women. I like tattoos and body hair. Muscles and that classically "cocky" borderline arrogant/asshole attitude of a confident dominant man who knows what he wants and takes it.

 

I like your very detailed reply. However i would like to ask if my distinction between the two types didnt resonate with you?

[KS87]

This discussion is interesting but in some ways misplaced. Are 'really straight' and 'straight identified' terms that make a distinction without a difference? I can understand people wanting their partners to conform to a certain set of stereotypes, and they have the right to question them to determine whether they do or not. The term 'imposter' is unhelpful and I would say presumptuous. People get to identify their sexuality as they see fit, and leaving aside the few who lie about it for whatever advantage (in this forum, commercial), no-one has the right to tell them that they are not what they say they are. Claiming that someone is not really straight because they do not conform to a set of stereotypes that an observer has decided upon assumes that stereotypes are definitive proof of someone's sexuality. In any other conversation in this forum a claim that stereotypes prove anything would be dismissed summarily.

 

Once again i will always respect a well though out response as your was. However i think many, as you are, reqlly underestimate the amount of guys who are flat out lying and have no basis to make those claims. Over 50 percent of men posting in m4m sites now "str8" and when you add in those that are bi it may be about 75%. Those proportions dont line up with reality.

 

I do believe there is an acceptable rqnge on the spectrum where different straight men can fall. Some men making claims fall no where within that acceptqble range. Gay men who seek out these men probably have the most detailed data to analyze.

 

Interestingly enough many times men who seek out same sex contqct may still be well within the acceptable range. Thinl the 300 lb big bubba alpha dawg that bends over every pretty twink that wonders by his cell. These men very often only seek out females outside of prison and are able to compartmentalize their sexuality.

 

See guys this topic never gets old it is always very relevqnt with alot to talk about.

[KS87]

You imply that same sex attracted guys, however they identify, cannot be ‘a1 alphas’. I call bullshit on that.

 

Not impossible but much rarer than compared to str8 population. I know that point is controversial.

[+ goosh69]

At the risk of being labeled a broken record and consigned to the forum's dustbin, I shall repeat myself on this topic with a few minor changes.

 

What do you define as "real straight guy" versus "straight identified?"

 

As I have posted multiple times, the research and science on this is in very early days because human sexuality and identity are incredibly complex and surprisingly flexible given a variety of environmental incentives. Research generally seems to see a distinction between Sexual Orientation and Sexual Behavior Orientation. There may even be a Romantic or Affection Orientation. It's dreadfully tricky to "reduce" an organic analog life into neatly discrete categories and labels. Klein--the brilliant bisexual sexologist--did some very interesting work to try and capture a better picture in his "Grid" that is more comprehensive than Kinsey's famous scale.

 

I could go on and on, but the fact remains that identification is a very personal thing and how a person self-identifies is their truth. Unless you're planning to use a penile plethysmograph to measure a man's penile blood flow as a proxy for his sexual arousal to determine what turns him on, then what's the point?

 

As a man with a strong attraction to stereotypically straight men, I am indeed turned on by the thought of sexual activity with a "straight guy" because of such cultural tropes as "the thrill of the hunt" or "obtaining the unobtainable." It's all fantasy, but for me, since my first formative same-sex activities were with guys who were straight, it strongly affixed this kink of mine.

 

What gets really "fun" and interesting about all of this is how it intersects this particular hobby. Understanding the physiological and psychological "limitations" of these labels results in certain realities. For example, a 100% straight-identified man--what Kinsey would've called a zero--would not have any sexual arousal at same-sex porn and might even be physically repulsed by it. Klein would argue that interests change over time as life experiences affect us. Consider "situational sexual behavior" like homosexual activity in prison or the military or even "gay 4 pay" activity.

 

Hmm. I've rambled all over the place. I return to my original question: what is your definition of "real straight guy?"

 

I've had the fun and hot experience three times in my life of being the first man to suck three different guys who identified as straight at the time and still identify as straight. They said I was their best and we enjoyed many hot times where I could worship them and they could enjoy hot head and go home to their girlfriends/wives. However, those types of activities are somewhat rare. Especially now because Millennials are far more open and experimental. I imagine it's becoming unusual to find a straight guy in his 20s who hasn't been blown by a male friend and probably blown that friend too. We live in a more open and less restrictive time.

 

In my hiring, when I seek a worship or top scenario, the guy I seek is classically and stereotypically masculine from an American cultural perspective, because that's my kink. Yes, I prefer "straight guys" but a truly 100% straight guy would be unable to top well because he wouldn't be able to get hard without medical assistance. That means, I seek out men who are able to perform with men or women. I like tattoos and body hair. Muscles and that classically "cocky" borderline arrogant/asshole attitude of a confident dominant man who knows what he wants and takes it.

 

You had me until you told anplain old lie about most millienial men having received blow jobs from other men. ALL of those studies you cite would say that while it’s more likely versus older generations, it’s FAR from a majority.

[+ quoththeraven]

Couldnt disagree more. You dont understand the mindset of the worshipper who wants to worship the a1 alpha male at the top of the chain. They dont want imposters posing like the real thing. The problem is too many on here give these imposters life and support studios peddling fake shit. See your faves like sean cody corbin fisher. Many in my circle scoff at that like old money at new money.

1. There is no such thing as an alpha male. The wolf studies on which this term is based have been discredited.

2. But since perception is more powerful than reality and placebo effect is real, why complicate things this way?

3. Why are you covering up your fetish for straight men by referring to alpha males as if gay and bisexual men can't exhibit the overbearing/domineering/decisive traits associated with the term alpha male?

[+ BigRic]

Nice post (#13), @LivingnLA--you "had" me until "a truly 100% straight guy would be unable to top well because he wouldn't be able to get hard without medical assistance." You seem to be saying that "medical assistance" and "top[ping] well" are mutually exclusive. Am I reading/understanding you wrong? If not (and that's what you're saying), FWIW (from personal experience) I'd tend to disagree.

Edited January 6, 2018 by BigRic

[Rudynate]

Once again i will always respect a well though out response as your was. However i think many, as you are, reqlly underestimate the amount of guys who are flat out lying and have no basis to make those claims. Over 50 percent of men posting in m4m sites now "str8" and when you add in those that are bi it may be about 75%. Those proportions dont line up with reality.

 

Do you think you're the first one to have figured that out? Everybody knows that. It's promotion, puffery, advertising, etc. etc There are guys who say they're straight that aren't straight, guys who say they're 32 when they're 42, guys who say they are wealthy who live paycheck-to-paycheck, etc., etc. I think it's funny you're so preoccupied with something that everybody knows and that they just roll with. It's an age-old phenomenon.

[KS87]

Do you think you're the first one to have figured that out? Everybody knows that. It's promotion, puffery, advertising, etc. etc There are guys who say they're straight that aren't straight, guys who say they're 32 when they're 42, guys who say they are wealthy who live paycheck-to-paycheck, etc., etc. I think it's funny you're so preoccupied with something that everybody knows and that they just roll with. It's an age-old phenomenon.

 

Hi Rudy. Your opinions are differing from the poster i was addressing. He seemed to imply that sexual orientation identity is solely based on how that person sees themselves or declares themselves.

 

Everyone does not know the nuances you seem to think they do. The guys on polar opposites of spectrum may be discernible but the gray areas require much deeper analization. Someone who is about to spend 2k with someone they think is a navy seqseal l bqck from iraq doesnt want someone who bought a pair of camos at dicks sporting goods. This conversation is not one of relevance to you because you are not an upscale client if you were i promise it would.

Edited January 6, 2018 by KS87