Guilt

[Guest AtlGAyDad]

I am a generous Atlanta man feeling conflicted by my desire to meet and pay young men for sex. I love doing IT, but I hate the idea that I am ruining the lives of cute young boys who do not have the maturity to know the down side of what they are doing. When I was 18, I didn't have a clue about life. Should I pay to fuck, or be fucked, by an 18 year old with a great body, a big dick, and the mind of an teenager? I have NEVER included drugs in my play.

Larry

[CT Dick]

Dad, if fucking an 18 year old bothers you that much, why not hire 35 year olds. They are mature enough to know what they are doing.

 

Then again, if a 35 year old still wants to do escorting, why can't an 18 year old be mature enough to make that same decision.

 

Except for strung out street kids who are desparate for their next hit, most male sex workers are in complete control of the situation and are doing it by choice.

[johnnysneakers]

Bang on CT.

 

It is a consenting society we have. The State and the church have no business in the bedrooms of the nation.

 

I decided long ago that when I needed sex, that was what I was willing to pay for. It is far less complicated than going searching for a guy in a bar or wherever, plus you will get stuck going grocery shopping with him.

 

Make up your mind what it is you are looking for. If it is romance, they you are looking in the wrong place. Find someone who want to do the domestics with you, including grocery shopping!!!!

 

Love is love, sex is sex. But not everyone is comfortable with this distinction.

[Will]

First, it seems to me that guilt is useful and therefore healthy when, and only when, one has done something wrong. Otherwise, it is self-destructive and likely unrelated to whatever it is that one feels guilty about. Like a lot of men who might describe themselves as both "generous" and "dad," you may feel guilty about having sex with other men, regardless of their age or the economic circumstances surrounding your encounters. If that is the case, it doesn't make any difference whether you're paying a teenager or doing it for free with someone twice your age. Your problem there would be homosex, not sex with young men for hire. By the way, do you indeed feel guilty when you have sex with another man and money is not an issue? If so, read no further and get thee to a shrink.

 

Second, as regards prostitutes -- that's what we're talking about here, regardless of the escapist euphemisms -- your guilt is useless. Any escort you encounter through this site does what he does because he wants to. The chances are extremely good that, in his own way and for his own reasons, he will enjoy it as much as you do. As another contributor noted, unless you're preying on homeless kids who trade sex for security, you aren't exloiting anybody, with the possible exception of yourself. In other words, in the moral universe I am trying to describe, guilt of the kind you describe has no rightful place whatsoever.

 

I consider myself to be a person of pretty high moral standards that are nourished by deeply-rooted religious convictions. After many years I have come to believe that, for human beings, the drive to beget babies is only the efficient or empirical reason for the array of complex and largely symbolic sexual behavior that is not strictly necessary for the race to continue. Thus, and unlike most other primates, human beings are always available for sex and all human societies value sex for many reasons outside its strictly procreative function. The gorgeous panoply of our sexual attitudes suggests to me that the meaning of human sexuality extends far beyond the rather straightforward insistence of our selfish genes that they move forward into the next generation.

 

Which is to say that a consideration of human sexuality in all its complexity can only mean that consensual sexual behavior among adults (granted, defining "adult" is an exercise of cultural values) has as its primary function the giving and receiving of deep and even necessary pleasure. On that view, procreation is secondary, not primary. In other words, under most circumstances the human organism functions best when its sexual possibilities get exercised, regardless of whether pregnancy results. For those and other reasons I conclude that sex is one of God's most important gifts for keeping us happy and healthy.

 

But we live in a society that condemns some people for acting on their sexual needs, that insists on criminalizing or medicalizing their attempts to use the gifts that are their birthright. Because that condemnation is wrong, and is a wrong that persists, it generates guilt. Therefore, guilt surrounding the prohibition of homosex is a right, proper, and healthy emotion that ought to lead to the cessation of the guilt-causing behavior. But in this case, the guilt-causing behavior isn't sex with other men. The guilt-causing behavior is the homophobia that displaces the moral burden from those to whom it belongs -- those who condemn what is right and proper and, according to me, even holy -- onto those of us who are trying to live our lives as full -- happy and healthy -- human beings, behaving the way we were created to behave.

[GinoMancuso]

Will, you continue to amaze me with your insightful posts. Just when I think you've reached the pinnacle of your eloquence, you top yourself. (HEY -- that's MY job! ) We sure could have used your elegant analysis in an amicus brief before the infamously flawed 1986 Bowers v. Hardwick decision, in which a split U.S. Supreme Court examined and upheld Georgia's sodomy statute by failing to see through their veil of obsessive homophobia that the issue before it was not what the fellating defendant was doing in his bedroom, but rather what the STATE OF GEORGIA was doing there in the first place. Here we are, 15 years later, with similar sodomy (read: anti-homosex) statutes still in effect in over half the states in the land of the free. God bless (help) America.

[Guest shadow]

LAST EDITED ON Feb-15-01 AT 04:25PM (EST)[p]LAST EDITED ON Feb-15-01 AT 03:15 PM (EST)

 

That was a bit of a mouthful, Will.

Just a tid bit on the long side, but informative

 

Any one have the cliff notes to Will's reply? LOL

 

Hey AtlGaDad, forget the guilt and join me in posting amessage in my "Why twinks are Hot?" thread.

[Traveller]

> Should I pay to

>fuck, or be fucked, by

>an 18 year old with

>a great body, a big

>dick, and the mind of

>an teenager?

 

This can't seriously be a real question. Did you type in http://www.Disney.com and inadvertently land here.

 

 

>I have NEVER included drugs in my

>play.

>Larry

 

And Larry, I've NEVER played without drugs. To each his own.

 

Later.

 

PS. I've found that there is an inverse relationship between the ability to handle recreationals and an escort's age (the youngsters can pop E like it's pez), while the opposite is true of Cuervo or Jaeger.

[Guest shadow]

>> Should I pay to

>>fuck, or be fucked, by

>>an 18 year old with

>>a great body, a big

>>dick, and the mind of

>>an teenager?

>

>This can't seriously be a real

>question. Did you type

>in http://www.Disney.com and inadvertently land

>here.

>

>

 

Come on, Traveller, play nice.

 

>>I have NEVER included drugs in my

>>play.

>>Larry

>

>And Larry, I've NEVER played without

>drugs. To each his

>own.

>

 

Believe it or not, I never thought that there were any clients out there who "played with drugs" while with their escorts. I don't use any type of drugs or alcohol, but maybe this topic would make an interesting thread.

 

Well Traveler, at least we share the same joy of having been with Jason of Boston. That breaks back pleasant memories

[Guest DickHo]

> Should I pay to

>fuck, or be fucked, by

>an 18 year old with

>a great body, a big

>dick, and the mind of

>an teenager?

 

Any time you can find an 18 y/o that's willing to do it! The problem with most 18 y/o's is that they don't know what to do with their great bodies and big dicks...especially if you are looking to get fucked...

[Justice]

Atlanta,

 

In an earlier post you stated:

 

>Guys, I tend to avoid escort contact

>because I fell in love with a hustler

>who took advantage of both my emotions

>and my checkbook.

 

>I am prepared to pay for the sex,

>but don't want to revisit the

>mental and fiscal pain of a

>one-way relationship. Buying sex

>and expecting love are not the same,

>although that is what I

>have mistakenly sought in the past.

>Do others have insight?

 

 

In your current post you state:

 

>I am a generous Atlanta man

>feeling conflicted by my desire

>to meet and pay young

>men for sex. I

>love doing IT, but I

>hate the idea that I

>am ruining the lives of

>cute young boys who do

>not have the maturity to

>know the down side of

>what they are doing. When

>I was 18, I didn't

>have a clue about life.

> Should I pay to

>fuck, or be fucked, by

>an 18 year old with

>a great body, a big

>dick, and the mind of

>an teenager?

 

From these two posts, I can tell that you are a very sensitive guy. I can also tell that you are very conflicted by your decision to hire escorts. Until you can resolve these conflicts, I strongly suggest that you stop seeing escorts. A few minutes of pleasure is not worth the emotional turmoil that you keep putting yourself through.

 

Justice

[Traveller]

LAST EDITED ON Feb-16-01 AT 10:31AM (EST)[p]LAST EDITED ON Feb-16-01 AT 10:29 AM (EST)

[+ Lucky]

Isn't this the same guy who was so excited when he pissed on himself that he wanted to hire an escort to do it? And isn't this the same guy who, in another post, voiced a pretty negative opinion of escorts?

[+ Charlie]

Save your guilt for the time you seduce an unwilling teenager into having sex and then DON'T pay, or worse yet, when you patronize one of the oriental brothels where the boys are genuinely exploited.

[Guest shadow]

Were you trying to say something, Traveller?

[Justice]

>Isn't this the same guy who

>was so excited when he

>pissed on himself that he

>wanted to hire an escort

>to do it? And isn't

>this the same guy who,

>in another post, voiced a

>pretty negative opinion of escorts?

 

 

Yep. I strongly recommend that he stop seeing escorts.

[Guest EvilSwine]

My personal feeling is that his problem is less to do with how he feels about the guys he hires and their problems and more about his own feelings about his sexuality.

[Bilbo]

Considering the three threads he has started are all about subjects which are guaranteed to jerk our chains, isn't it awfully decent of us to keep trusting him and trying to offer him good advice? There are flags on this play, IMHO. So many that if he were a prospective client on the phone, there is no way that I, on a good day when I was focused on what I was doing, would ever consent to setting up an appointment with him. I know that we mustn't be tempted to decend to someone else's level, but does anyone want to explain to me why we trust this man?

[Guest shadow]

Aren't being just tid bit paranoid and overacting just a little?

[Justice]

Good question, Bilbo! Everyone time he posts, I'm tempted not to respond, but then something compells me to.

[Guest Tampa Yankee]

What a piss-poor time to be on travel without my laptop... now I'll never know................

[Bilbo]

LAST EDITED ON Feb-17-01 AT 04:30PM (EST)[p]Shadow, yes, I probably am. This month is the one year anniversary of my having been entrapped. One is normally whether one realizes it or not subject to the body and spirit's reacting big time to any major events around their first anni. Next month will be the first anni of a judge not finding me guilty (deferred adjudication) and next fall will be the first b'day of my losing my massage license over the arrest anyway. So, I am willing to upgrade my feelings about this man if someone will cite notes he wrote to threads he didn't start that show him trustworthy. However, I will be surprised if he even bothers bellowing like a gored bull when and if he finds me doubting him. BTW, I notice that he hasn't replied to any of the discussion on this thread and his three somewhat controversial threads come out of a total of only five postings.

[+ Lucky]

No, I don't think it is paranoia. My feeling is that this man is just toying with this board, and probably getting a big chuckle out of the responses.

[Guest albinorat]

>Considering the three threads he has

>started are all about subjects

>which are guaranteed to jerk

>our chains, [respectful snip] does anyone want to

>explain to me why we

>trust this man?<

 

Bilbo, you put into words what I've felt when I looked at this thread. Who knows, really? But there's something mighty queer about Larry and not in the way I (I can't speak for anyone else) trust. Someone who starts out telling us he's generous and then says a bunch of things that don't follow is fishing for something, far as I can tell. What, I don't know.

 

Will wrote something rich and considered and the guy didn't respond (how about 'thanks'?) others have had good practical responses and gotten no response or clarification. Anyway, considering what's out there to tempt young guys who may be open to commercial gay sex, a good considerate appointment with a "generous dad who doesn't use drugs" may be one of the better options they have.

 

 

Al

[Guest EvilSwine]

After reading Albinorat's post and looking at what this guy said again, I think it's safe to say he's trolling. If his posts weren't couched as pleas for help, you'd be able to put what he said in an ad in the paper. He's not responding on the board in any of these because he probably wants someone to be his email buddy. I have to agree that if he were really serious about any of the things he's said, he'd be responding in some way;at the very least to deny something or argue with some of the other posters who feel there's something shady about his posting.

[Guest shadow]

Then again, I can still be one of the few gullible guys still left in this day and age.