Sao Paulo, almost unrecognizable compared to prior to pandemic.

[coriolis888]

Sao Paulo was one of my favorites cities in the world. 

In addition to the fabulous rent-boy saunas, there was the Praca da Republica that had hustlers galore.  And, there were many "cines" (theatres that showed sex movies) where one could meet some gorgeous hustlers.

I decided to return to Sao Paulo last week and I noticed a major and depressing scene.

The only thing still in tact from my prior visits is the sauna Lagoa that was moved and downsized a few years ago.  The replaced Lagoa was busy each night I went there.  There were many handsome garotos available.

Today, I went to the Praca da Republica.  It is now filled with hustling drag queens instead of garotos.  There was not one male hustler in the park like in prior years.  

I then went to a former "cine" that had been very popular and where numerous garotos were available for a fee.  After I paid my entrance fee and went inside, I was shocked to see the place was empty.

I went to another formerly popular "cine" and it was boarded shut.

I then decided to walk over to a restaurant that I had known and liked.  I knew that the restaurant had been closed during the virus pandemic.  I entered the restaurant but there were only a few customers using the restaurant.  I looked around the restaurant and saw that much of it has been torn down and the cooking area was reduced to a fraction of its prior size.  I decided not to eat there. I also walked to a few other places I formerly enjoyed but those places were boarded shut.  

If anyone who formerly knew Sao Paulo well, expect a big shock if you visit there at the present time.

I plan to check out the sauna that supposedly replaced the old sauna, Fragata.  Last time I was there in January of this year, the place had few customes and garotos.

Also, two new saunas started up earlier this year but they are no longer in existence.

If the Fragata replacement is doing well, I will report back, hopefully, with good news.

The guys I knew from the site vivalocal.com no longer advertise.

Bottom line?  Lagoa sauna is the only remaining fun place that withstood the virus.  Those going to Sao Paulo and using Lagoa, will have a spledid time.

 

Nothing lasts forever.

Edited July 20, 2022 by coriolis888
spelling

[Luv2play]

I had a great time at both of the saunas 20 years ago during the 3 days I was in Sao Paulo. Glad one is still thriving in its new location.

.

[sydneyboy]

São Paulo is one of my favourite cities too. I am at least consoled by the fact that the new Lagoa is a viable proposition. I have incredibly fond memories of the old Lagoa. How do compare the old and the new?

[sydneyboy]

20 hours ago, coriolis888 said:

Sao Paulo was one of my favorites cities in the world. 

In addition to the fabulous rent-boy saunas, there was the Praca da Republica that had hustlers galore.  And, there were many "cines" (theatres that showed sex movies) where one could meet some gorgeous hustlers.

I decided to return to Sao Paulo last week and I noticed a major and depressing scene.

The only thing still in tact from my prior visits is the sauna Lagoa that was moved and downsized a few years ago.  The replaced Lagoa was busy each night I went there.  There were many handsome garotos available.

Today, I went to the Praca da Republica.  It is now filled with hustling drag queens instead of garotos.  There was not one male hustler in the park like in prior years.  

I then went to a former "cine" that had been very popular and where numerous garotos were available for a fee.  After I paid my entrance fee and went inside, I was shocked to see the place was empty.

I went to another formerly popular "cine" and it was boarded shut.

I then decided to walk over to a restaurant that I had known and liked.  I knew that the restaurant had been closed during the virus pandemic.  I entered the restaurant but there were only a few customers using the restaurant.  I looked around the restaurant and saw that much of it has been torn down and the cooking area was reduced to a fraction of its prior size.  I decided not to eat there. I also walked to a few other places I formerly enjoyed but those places were boarded shut.  

If anyone who formerly knew Sao Paulo well, expect a big shock if you visit there at the present time.

I plan to check out the sauna that supposedly replaced the old sauna, Fragata.  Last time I was there in January of this year, the place had few customes and garotos.

Also, two new saunas started up earlier this year but they are no longer in existence.

If the Fragata replacement is doing well, I will report back, hopefully, with good news.

The guys I knew from the site vivalocal.com no longer advertise.

Bottom line?  Lagoa sauna is the only remaining fun place that withstood the virus.  Those going to Sao Paulo and using Lagoa, will have a spledid time.

 

Nothing lasts forever.

Please report back back on the “new” Fragata. I have very fond memories of the old.

[musclestuduws]

On 7/19/2022 at 11:43 PM, coriolis888 said:

Sao Paulo was one of my favorites cities in the world. 

In addition to the fabulous rent-boy saunas, there was the Praca da Republica that had hustlers galore.  And, there were many "cines" (theatres that showed sex movies) where one could meet some gorgeous hustlers.

I decided to return to Sao Paulo last week and I noticed a major and depressing scene.

The only thing still in tact from my prior visits is the sauna Lagoa that was moved and downsized a few years ago.  The replaced Lagoa was busy each night I went there.  There were many handsome garotos available.

Today, I went to the Praca da Republica.  It is now filled with hustling drag queens instead of garotos.  There was not one male hustler in the park like in prior years.  

I then went to a former "cine" that had been very popular and where numerous garotos were available for a fee.  After I paid my entrance fee and went inside, I was shocked to see the place was empty.

I went to another formerly popular "cine" and it was boarded shut.

I then decided to walk over to a restaurant that I had known and liked.  I knew that the restaurant had been closed during the virus pandemic.  I entered the restaurant but there were only a few customers using the restaurant.  I looked around the restaurant and saw that much of it has been torn down and the cooking area was reduced to a fraction of its prior size.  I decided not to eat there. I also walked to a few other places I formerly enjoyed but those places were boarded shut.  

If anyone who formerly knew Sao Paulo well, expect a big shock if you visit there at the present time.

I plan to check out the sauna that supposedly replaced the old sauna, Fragata.  Last time I was there in January of this year, the place had few customes and garotos.

Also, two new saunas started up earlier this year but they are no longer in existence.

If the Fragata replacement is doing well, I will report back, hopefully, with good news.

The guys I knew from the site vivalocal.com no longer advertise.

Bottom line?  Lagoa sauna is the only remaining fun place that withstood the virus.  Those going to Sao Paulo and using Lagoa, will have a spledid time.

 

Nothing lasts forever.

I understand that Bolsonaro’s politics have made it difficult and scary for gay guys to live their lives openly. I am sure his fascist rhetoric and life threats against leaders of the gay movements in Brazil have had a chilling effect on most gay people. 

[coriolis888]

2 hours ago, musclestuduws said:

I understand that Bolsonaro’s politics have made it difficult and scary for gay guys to live their lives openly. I am sure his fascist rhetoric and life threats against leaders of the gay movements in Brazil have had a chilling effect on most gay people. 

Sorry, my post was so long that you missed the thrust of my message.  I tried to explain the major decline in the city based on the covid effects from the virus.  

The gay scene in Sao Paulo continues but with major changes effected by the virus that hit the world.  

Non gay venues are also effected.  Long-time stores have gone out of business.  Jobs are scarce.  These declines relate to the quarantines and the virus effect on the population.  

Although I do not care for Bolsonaro, his dislike of gays had nothing to do with the major decline of the places I mentioned in my long post.  

 

Edited January 17, 2023 by coriolis888

[musclestuduws]

7 hours ago, coriolis888 said:

Sorry, my post was so long that you missed the thrust of my message.  I tried to explain the major decline in the city based on the covid effects from the virus.  

The gay scene in Sao Paulo continues but with major changes effected by the virus that hit the world.  

Non gay venues are also effected.  Long-time stores have gone out of business.  Jobs are scarce.  These declines relate to the quarantines and the virus effect on the population.  

Although I do not care for Bolsonaro, his dislike of gays had nothing to do with the major decline of the places I mentioned in my long post.  

 

I disagree completely. Both things are related. Also, Bolsonaro’s handling of the pandemic was horrifying, refusing to take any serious action for months. Nobody knows the exact number of people who died. Official numbers were grossly manipulated. And several  friends of mine living in Brazil attest to the fact that many gay people and in particular the transgender community now live in constant fear. Hate crimes have multiplied exponentially and hate rhetoric is everywhere on social media. Fortunately for Brazil, this fascist clown lost the last election. You can choose to bury your head in the sand and ignore the political context but reality proves otherwise.  

[coriolis888]

17 hours ago, musclestuduws said:

I disagree completely. Both things are related. Also, Bolsonaro’s handling of the pandemic was horrifying, refusing to take any serious action for months. Nobody knows the exact number of people who died. Official numbers were grossly manipulated. And several  friends of mine living in Brazil attest to the fact that many gay people and in particular the transgender community now live in constant fear. Hate crimes have multiplied exponentially and hate rhetoric is everywhere on social media. Fortunately for Brazil, this fascist clown lost the last election. You can choose to bury your head in the sand and ignore the political context but reality proves otherwise.  

Although the handling of the virus pandemic by Bolsonaro was not good, do you think that Trump did a better job? 

Most leaders of most countries around the world did a poor job of handling the virus.  No one could foresee the horror the virus would bring to the world.  

I have visited Brazil over the past two decades more than one hundred times.  I spend a lot of time in Brazil.  I have many Brazilian friends and I speak their language.  

Please let me assure you that gays are not, as you wrote, living in "constant fear" in the gay scene.  Many are in fear because they cannot find a job or because they have no money to pay for housing or food and other necessities.  

Despite their financial problems, they are still going forward, next month with a huge festival called Carnaval.  

https://www.riocarnaval.org/gay-carnival/gay-carnival#:~:text=The Gay Carnival%3A An Event in Itself&text=And there's no grander festival,%2C transgender and bi-sexuals.

 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brazilian_Carnival

So, when you say that you "disagree completely" with what I wrote, I have to say that you likely have not been to Brazil to witness what I personally saw and continue to witness.  

 

 

Edited January 18, 2023 by coriolis888
spelling

[coriolis888]

23 hours ago, musclestuduws said:

I understand that Bolsonaro’s politics have made it difficult and scary for gay guys to live their lives openly. I am sure his fascist rhetoric and life threats against leaders of the gay movements in Brazil have had a chilling effect on most gay people. 

Not true!

I do not care for Bolsonaro but let us not make up untrue stories to make him worse than he already is.  

Again, if the gays were so frightened as you claim, how is it there are thousands of gays participating, openly, in the Carnaval next month in many major cities in Brazil?

How can it be that there are hundreds of gay saunas in light of the supposed fright you claim exists.

Again, check out this ad for the gay Carnaval:

 https://www.riocarnaval.org/gay-carnival/gay-carnival#:~:text=The Gay Carnival%3A An Event in Itself&text=And there's no grander festival,%2C transgender and bi-sexuals.

 

Edited January 18, 2023 by coriolis888

[CuriousByNature]

2 hours ago, coriolis888 said:

Not true!

I do not care for Bolsonaro but let us not make up untrue stories to make him worse than he already is.  

Not to venture into politics in this forum, but I saw an interview with him a couple of years ago, and his comments were quite anti-LGBT.   

[sydneyboy]

18 hours ago, musclestuduws said:

I disagree completely. Both things are related. Also, Bolsonaro’s handling of the pandemic was horrifying, refusing to take any serious action for months. Nobody knows the exact number of people who died. Official numbers were grossly manipulated. And several  friends of mine living in Brazil attest to the fact that many gay people and in particular the transgender community now live in constant fear. Hate crimes have multiplied exponentially and hate rhetoric is everywhere on social media. Fortunately for Brazil, this fascist clown lost the last election. You can choose to bury your head in the sand and ignore the political context but reality proves otherwise.  

These far right lunatics are all the same. Trump and Bolsonaro’s handling of COVID was lamentable. Going back further into history was Ronald Reagan’s handling of the AIDS crisis. It took him literally years for him to even mention the issue.

[Marc in Calif]

On 1/17/2023 at 11:29 PM, CuriousByNature said:

Not to venture into politics in this forum, but I saw an interview with him a couple of years ago, and his comments were quite anti-LGBT.   

I hate the guy as much as anyone else. But I think that everyone should read up on how his stance on these issues changed in the past several years. And he hasn't been in Brazil since December 30, 2022. 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jair_Bolsonaro -- under the heading Views on homosexuality you'll find some interesting details you didn't know before. As far as I can tell, the Brazilian government never made new anti-gay policies during his entire presidency. Maybe others can comment on that. 

So I don't think any gay people "feared" him or his policies.
 

[coriolis888]

2 hours ago, Marc in Calif said:

 

snip 

So I don't think any gay people "feared" him or his policies.

Precisely!

[pubic_assistance]

Are we in the politics forum ?

[coriolis888]

4 hours ago, pubic_assistance said:

Are we in the politics forum ?

Of course not.

Six posts up line, someone made a ridiculous statement claiming that the gays in Brazil are living in fear because of the former president of Brazil and his dislike for gays.  

Several posts were made to put the erroneous post to an end. 

Brazil is fun and a good place.  In fact, I return again to Brazil at the end of this month. 

 

Edited January 21, 2023 by coriolis888

[+ Axiom2001]

28 minutes ago, coriolis888 said:

 

 

Brazil is fun and a good place.  In fact, I return again to Brazil at the end of this month. 

 

Oh, lucky you.  I hope that I can see her in 2024.

 

[pubic_assistance]

2 hours ago, coriolis888 said:

Brazil is fun and a good place. 

My last visit to Brazil, I was robbed at gun point, in broad daylight by two young favella boys.

No more visits to Brazil.

[coriolis888]

9 minutes ago, pubic_assistance said:

My last visit to Brazil, I was robbed at gun point, in broad daylight by two young favella boys.

No more visits to Brazil.

I have been to Brazil more than one hundred times. 

Never robbed. 

Had great times.

I will be returning at the end of this month.  

You should not let one bad experience spoil potentially great times you could have while visiting Brazil.  

[pubic_assistance]

9 minutes ago, coriolis888 said:

You should not let one bad experience spoil potentially great times you could have while visiting Brazil.  

I've been to Brazil several times, and have visited most every region. It's a beautiful country with a fantastic food culture, and bright joyful citizens. Unfortunately it's also extremely corrupt and crime is getting more and more out of control as the kids from the poor drug infested favellas branch out on their own, robbing tourists. You don't see it coming because they are children. You wouldn't even think to worry they'd have a loaded gun in their Sponge-Bob backpack.

[coriolis888]

2 minutes ago, pubic_assistance said:

I've been to Brazil several times, and have visited most every region. It's a beautiful country with a fantastic food culture, and bright joyful citizens. Unfortunately it's also extremely corrupt and crime is getting more and more out of control as the kids from the poor drug infested favelas branch out on their own, robbing tourists. You don't see it coming because they are children. You wouldn't even think to worry they'd have a loaded gun in their Sponge-Bob backpack.

I am sorry to read that you had your bad experience with a gun in Brazil.  

I travel often to Europe and to Brazil. 

The only time I ever had a gun pulled on me was not in Europe or Brazil. 

It was in Manhattan, New York.  

In short, terrible things can happen anywhere.  

If your number comes up, it comes up.  Regardless of where you are at any given time.  Luck is a strange thing.  

[pubic_assistance]

Just now, coriolis888 said:

In short, terrible things can happen anywhere.  

Absolutely.

And I consider myself a VERY savvy traveler. I LIVE in NYC...so I'm not at all naive about my surroundings on a daily basis.

I've traveled to more obviously dangerous places in very poor third world countries.

But I must say having two CHILDREN pull loaded weapons and point one in my face as they shot the other one into the air, and knocked my wife to the ground, was bold, brazen and emotionally rattling because children don't think at all about the consequences of this kind of behavior. Fortunate for my wife and I they were only interested in our money and didn't shoot either of us in the face. Just spit on us as they rode off on their kiddie bikes, saying "MONEY" ( yes in English, not Portuguese )

I will take my tourist dollars elsewhere in the future.

 

[coriolis888]

2 hours ago, pubic_assistance said:

 

I will take my tourist dollars elsewhere in the future.

 

The "luck of the draw" was not on your side that day. 

It must have been a hell of a frightening thing with that incident.  

Currently, in large Brazilian cities there are many police walking around on foot that prevents that sort of robbery. 

Police in Brazil think nothing of shooting at someone they think is robbing or hurting tourists.  Tourist money means a lot to Brazil.  

 

 

[Deadlift1]

11 hr plane ride to get robbed at gun point.  PTSD.

[coriolis888]

1 hour ago, Deadlift1 said:

11 hr plane ride to get robbed at gun point.  PTSD.

Six hour plane ride to get robbed in New York City, from Los Angeles.

Six of one, half a dozen of the other.  

[pubic_assistance]

1 hour ago, coriolis888 said:

Tourist money means a lot to Brazil.  

You would think that was the case...but we were walking in broad daylight in Leblon..not far from all the luxury boutiques. The kid shot his gun in the air with reckless abandon and everyone just ran into the surrounding buildings and closed the door as if this was a familiar routine.