TallMuscl37

When I’m in Saint Louis, most of the clients have been ones from out of town. At one point I had optimism that St. Louis would be a steady market and to make a full move (right now it’s just roommate and it’s his place). But local clients there have diminished considerably. It’s still a little better than Kansas City overall though. Kansas City on the other hand, I barely come across local or traveling clients on a day to day basis. But when I do it’s generally last minute incalls that I can rarely do, or I’ll get bookings when I’m planning to travel somewhere. When I reach out to the local ones here to follow back up and arrange something, they don’t even fucking return my messages or anything. In addition to that, I’ve found many of the ones who contact me in St. Louis have multiple reports for being timewasters. These 2 are like the worst market ever. But other cities like nashville and even Chicago seem to not be all that much better. At this point my RentMen is expired. I’m not going to even bother putting it back up yet, because I haven’t even gotten anything from it since I been back last Thursday.

Again? I’ve never stopped thinking about it lol. It’s just I’ve had my hands on a couple different projects over the past few months.

I know this is probably a case by case topic, and for some maybe even uncomfortable. But it has been awhile since race among providers has been brought up. But I do so because there does seem to be a truth in these things. I keep in touch with a guy in my local area, who's White (and a bit older). Whenever I reach out to him and chat, he's often mentioning that he has a full schedule of clients for the week (generally 3 or 4 because he works other job). I also chatted with a friend who came to town a couple of times last year and was busy the whole time with clients (on his 1st two trips), but noticed he didn't return a 3rd time and seemed to have slid out of the biz. Both guys in question were White. Meanwhile in my case (referring specifically to the Kansas City/St. Louis and surrounding cities market), it's often day by day I have next to no bookings. I go thru a cycle of either being completely void of calls, or I'll have a handful of clients reach out, but right off the bat are inconsiderate/difficult and either flake or don't seem to take arrangements seriously. It's not usually this way when I travel (in the right markets, I've met 3 or 4 clients in a day), but it still makes me wonder. Why does it seem easier for White (or more bluntly, non-Black) providers to connect easier with clients in certain markets, it seems?

But to answer the question: even though the reasons for raising rates are apparent, I don't think this would be a good time to do it. I don't believe I can reach enough clients at $350-400, especially again...in smaller middle America markets. It also bears repeating: these "new providers" are just that. Rookies. They aren't looking to sustain themselves from the business. They are looking for get rich quick shit. I had to dump a friend for that very reason, he spent all our time talking about how this date and that date he went on the guy had money and paid for all his shit. I was like, dude, I'm so fucking tired of listening to your quest to find a millionaire. He might as well have been a sex worker, yet criticizes me. This is not just about rates. It's about our culture seeing RentMen as some temporary extra cash thing in addition to their normal job. This has negatively impacted the industry because many clients operate in a way that shows 0 fucking respect and acknowledgment for those of us who do this full time. So many times I hear clients who think I'm just doing this for the hell of it, so that's why they thought it would be "okay" to flake out.

Just quoting all 4, as there's a lot of "stop and think" quotes here. For one, I didn't really realize $300-400 was "becoming" the norm. However, I think it'll help to first stop and take into context where this "norm" is coming from. If you're talking about New York/L.A. maybe. But that's defintely not the case in interior America (and Texas/Dallas isn't really a great example of that because Dallas/Houston have technically become the "new California" every since the 2008 recession). Hell, you'd be lucky to get $250 in places like Kansas City and St. Louis. People out here aren't even paying for shit to begin with. And like Lucky and Marylander said, I really do feel in some markets, clients aren't even hiring anymore. I think the last time I even had a "new" client in Kansas City was December 9th. Granted I've been out of town at least a couple of times since then. But I've had several "attempted" clients in the area who have proven to be full of shit or waste of time, or like the one from Saturday: quote my rate and they whine that it's too much. What the fuck were you expecting me to say, $100? These people have no fucking clue. And I told RentMen that in an email the other day, the clients contacting us on there are clueless. Clueless about rates, clueless about travel cities, clueless about how to even communicate initially partly because they haven't done enough. And because they haven't done enough, that's why I haven't renewed my ad yet, and have simply come out with my own website. JarrodBrandon.com. This year, I'm not playing anymore games. It's definently going to be time to change cities and change markets. I deserve to be somewhere that I can be felt respected and appreciated. It doesn't have to be $400, but at least have some clients who have the decency to follow thru when they contact.

This 100% And having an advanced booking cancelled is a lot more damaging than a last minute booking because you generally have more expectation of it happening. Plus you may have turned down other things. Lately, in the past few years or so…I’ve been booking sessions of “advanced” notice generally a day or 2 ahead…with the exception of a special City visit. But even then, that’s the most it’s usually been and that’s usually fine with me. I like a sweet spot with a bit of common sense: it doesn’t have to be “now”. But just be normal. 2 weeks ahead of time can be bit far out when a guy is “available now” and needs to make ends. I also prefer 4 hours notice for same day bookings because that’s usually about how long it’ll take to stop what I’m doing, commute, etc. unless I’m just already in town at a hotel and can take someone on the fly I see this in other situations as well: last weekend there were supposed to be 6 of us calendar guys attending the Kansas City model signing event for https://www.lupineenterprises.com However, only 3 of us showed up. This event was planned way back in November. So to hear 3 guys not show up (for valid reasons) kinda killed the vibe for a moment. But, the 3 who were in Kansas City made the best of it and it turned out really well.

Wow, you're beyond the realms of just traveling escort lol. You're an all around Renaissance man. You would be considered Mr. Worldwide 😄 That said your level of travel takes a lot of drive and desire. Despite my love of travel, it's just not as fun as it used to be. At-least within the states. And by fun, it's just in ways that things have changed when it comes to hotels and even bookings. A lot of cities lately have been slow. You may have dozens of inquiries but only 2 or 3 actually show up. And that's lucky because sometimes it'll only be 1 or 2. I also don't have desire to just sit in a city for days on end waiting for bookings anymore. Hotels are too expensive. Lately with the exception of select markets, it's get in and get out within 2 or 3 days. Unless I go to an actually undeserved market, which has been my focus majority of 2021 and will again in 2022. All the big city markets are whored out to oblivion. It's also sad how many people who don't escort rarely travel or relocate. Many, especially in the gay Black community, just never leave their home base. We can talk about how things have changed and gotten better, but there's still people who are stuck: stuck in the same neighborhoods, the same counties, the same fucking city and state where they grew up in. Being able to move across the country should be an accessible task for many. Unfortunately, only the corporate upper echelon get to do it with ease. Or us escorts if we don't intend to plant too much ties into the location we are.

Ha. And all this time I've been fantasizing about the big Burj

Oh. I actually didn’t get that. I was under impression that the providers reviewed him. I do recall RM saying we are not able to review clients, which was confusing. Makes sense now. But guess it goes to show even moreso…

There’s a truth in what you say re: “get omicron” I always used to say: I would get sick every year almost on point. Usually in January February or the odd mid summer/fall. Coupled with asthma, I would often feel like death. Exactly same thing happened earlier this year in February. Strep throat. Knocked me out for a few days. No vaccine for that 😂 However, I’ve also started to get vaccinated…for more things. So my philosophy has changed on it. If I’m going to get sick from something, I might as well get the vaccine anyway 😆

That was I was wondering. The damn variant coincides with the holidays, making it even slower. Add to that, being in an already dying escort market like Kansas City/St. Louis: it is devastating. I can’t even express the gratitude I have for regular clients and supportive forum members. I’m just trying to ride it out. Being a native of Florida, I’m no stranger to riding out storms. But this isn’t just a storm, it’s the power out AFTER the storm: Hopefully the horny guys break after New Years 🤞🏾 I do feel though the variant is fueling the slowdown. Even though we don’t always hear it, people have their concerns and it can affect things. I can just feel it in the air. It’s like when “race riots” (though I don’t like that term) breakout. Business just all of sudden gets slow. Is it the weather, or the city? Nope. It’s just the vibe is ruined. It’s like if a bunch of police cars showed up to a bathhouse, or the hotel where the escort is located. It just kills the vibe temporarily. One client of mine said he was “nervous” that I’m “in demand” due to Covid. I reminded him, all that demand is just text messages, not actual bookings. So nothing really more to be nervous about than any other time.

Considering there are 2 opposite responses above to this question, I think your question is a good question lol. I’m glad to hear some clients are still hiring. Despite the situation that’s being put on the plate, I’m sure there’s some of us who are really relying on bookings to follow thru. But at this point, this Holiday season is on par with last holiday season but almost worse: another variant just in time for the holidays, so nobody wants to hire until after “next year” due to family exposure concerns and such . Needless to say, this has been one of the more depressing leads up to Christmas I’ve experience. This week I’ve only booked 2 clients, despite seemingly DOZENS of “inquiries”. One last Sunday and another on Tuesday. I just BARELY set aside enough money to get my car fixed that’s been down for 3 weeks (by the Grace of God I have a backup vehicle). By the time I did that, and traveled across state (300 miles) to ensure I could at least be in the company of family for Christmas, I’ve been left with somewhere around $20. Can anyone imagine how depressing that is? Left with only $20 the week of Christmas? While everyone is out shopping and buying presents. So, you can throw out the virus facts and vaccine limitations and everyone can be scared, but for some there’s not always an immediate alternative. I even want to take clients, but I know that it’s almost pointless to be online in Kansas City because nobody is calling, and anybody who does call is guaranteed going to be a flake. I already know I’ll have to ask for a deposit on the 1st or 2nd text, to run them away, else they’ll bullshit me and end up on Mr. number in a heartbeat 😆 Or they’ll be available for 1 hour, and expect me to show up in 2 minutes. So, despite the real peril, I know likely the only thing I can do is advertise in another market, and hope I can have at least 1 booking locally to get me there. I was talking with a former client telling him last month: it’s been well over a year since I found myself in a very tight situation where finances were strained. However, seems like every since the week of Halloween, these slump times are recurrent. It’s been back to back. On and off. Somebody has to do something. I’m so desperate for change at this point, I’m willing to experience living out of my car for awhile (not technically but like “tour bus” mode) and leaving to a different side of the country or something. I can only take misery for so long, and the Midwest seems to have gone bottoms up. Thanks to Covid AND inflation.

I concurrently agree with you. Your point is valid. However, I can’t help but feel you may be slightly erring on a side of “privilege” rather than “fact” in some things you say. You feel “it’s never happened to me, thus it shouldn’t exist”. Even if you may not have experienced something personally, doesn’t mean that it doesn’t happen to anyone. I also don’t look at just the “dangerous” side of racism, but the “subtle and condescending” racism still exists. I can give examples even: There’s a client https://rent.men/Shanestur who contacted me, who had several great reviews from other providers on his profile. However, upon closer inspection of me clicking each escort who reviewed him: they were all White guys who reviewed him positively. 1 was a negative review, but the rest were fine. However, his communication with me was far less than stellar. Not only did he text me a gif of a “stereotypical” Black woman as a “funny” excuse for taking hours to respond to an important message I sent him, but he flaked on the session and ignored messages to confirm the booking that he claimed he would attend in the morning. Which subsequently caused me to be inconvenienced in the process. And if all that wasn’t bad enough, when I tried to get him to take responsibility for his bullshit and flakiness, he had the nerve to blame me for his flaking out. THAT: is what I called racism. It’s not always the KKK, hanging on a tree racism that we read in history books. I view racism as things like clients being flaky, making like I don’t mean anything (superiority) and don’t deserve anything for my spent time. And from talks on the forum, it seems White providers deal with this less than those of other backgrounds, specifically Black. It’s the disrespect and lack of consideration, that fuels racism towards certain sex workers.

also I appreciate your recognizing the challenges, but just to clarify: this is not the “only” thing I do. I actually do model gigs and the fans based sales as well. However, as a whole the provider circuit is a main pool for me. So essentially, it is important that my appointments happen when they are expected to happen. But even if it’s not an “appointment”. Some clients try to save face by saying they never made an appointment, therefore ghosting me is totally justifiable. However, If someone contacts my line and goes thru the basics of establishing we’re going to connect, it’s just a principle of being a MAN, that the person should have the decency to stick with it. Otherwise, it comes off as just not being genuine. And considering I been reading multiple reports/complaints from other providers about the same client(s) messing them about, I don’t quite buy the customer is always right mantra. I think what it really means: The customer WHO HAS PAID/ABOUT TO PAY is always right. Someone texting me; who can never host, never wants to book in advance, doesn’t ever know when he can meet, just trolling ads with no purpose because of boredom or collecting pics, is not a right customer for me. More like a pain in the 🤦🏽‍♂️

Good interpretation there. And yes, I echo the part about “are you available at 3” and it’s only 2 p.m. I get there are 1,000+1 reasons a client may have to book things that way, but in my 10+ years I still find it a bit hard to comprehend. When I try to plan things with those same clients, even with a day or few hours in advance, they can never accommodate because they always “have plans”. So I don’t know why they think we’re any different. If a client can’t be bothered to make or plan time with me, I start to feel taken for granted or not really important…I know that sounds taking it too personal, but some of these people clog up my line with texts, chat a bunch of BS, but then can’t find a time to schedule a booking. I understand what @italianboyph is saying about it being similar to Grindr, but I think what’s lost in 2021: Calling an escort/massage is NOT Grindr. Idk where people get off thinking talking to an escort is a pen pal. I don’t mind chatting with clients, especially if they’re out of state and it involves more communication. But some of these dudes live right down the street, and have no decency and respect. They think it’s entertaining. But that’s exactly why I have to start charging for my conversations at the door… However I also want to mention: some of the above mentioned is more of a result of being in the Midwest, and specifically in certain cities outside of Chicago. So I am aware I can’t tar everyone with the same brush.

It sounds like you come with good intent and purpose, but your reasoning is a bit skewed. And I’ll tell you why. First of all: let’s get rid of the “market rate” idea. That’s old school. 2003. 2010. This is 2021, going on 2022. There’s no rates being posted for ESCORTS hardly anywhere thanks to the oppressive Sesta/fosta bill passed in 2016 by president trump. Because where the fuck, (excuse my French), do you see any rates being posted places on escort sites? If I’m mistaken…please direct me to the right resource. Because I don’t see it. And I haven’t seen hardly anything of what other providers are charging either. On top of that: what other providers charge (or not) is irrelevant. People sometimes tell me, “oh, you’re too expensive for this town”. And I say, interesting you think that because I just had someone give me $400. I’m not serving “the town”. I’ve gone to towns where there’s no escorts hardly AT ALL, and still had no issue with 250-300 (which is my current preferred going donation, but I offer 150-200 for base level sessions). Everytime a client (which is less often these days) says my rate is too high or they looking for something cheaper, I tell them: “sorry but I can’t pay my expenses charging any less”. If I’m hit with a major expense (which has been the case TWICE this month, in the tune of $300+ each) in the middle of pandemic and Christmas is right around the corner, you think I’m going to get anything done with $100? There’s not going to be enough bookings, for 1. Even if I say,” instead of $300 I could charge 3 clients $100 each “, that rarely works out in theory. All 3 clients will want to meet at the same time, or flake/fake no show, and I end up only meeting 1. That’s just the reality. I been doing this since 2008. I’m not the hottest on the block, or the White or Brazilian guy everybody wants. But I have a decent fan base that I have to be smart about. So to charge whatever “the market” says I should charge would be a waste of time and talent. That said, I still say: don’t blame me. Blame the fakes. This is the right business for me. It’s not the right business for THEM. Maybe some people out here playing “client” aren’t cut out to be clients. Ever thought of that?

In all earnestly I hear what you’re saying but I’m also hearing excuses for inconsiderate behavior. I’ve heard it all before. In fact I just heard it today. And I can only expect that coming from a client standpoint. However, your last sentence is a bit counterproductive, and I’ll address that. If the escort “isn’t that hot” like you say, why contact them to begin with? Of course you do mention “rate being above market”, but what exactly is “market” anyway? Here’s what the real issue is, and I’ve had a client the other day say this and I agreed. I also had to tell a client this today: The majority of client contacting escort/masseurs on the “rent” sites have no real UNDERSTANDING of the fact that this is many guy’s bread and butter. Or they meet providers who just do this for “extra” cash versus someone who’s really putting work in round the clock. So, you get guys (possibly like you) who just have a insincere approach to us. I know people come to the Rent sites with a mindset of not wanting to shoulder the burden of being true to their word, but at the end of the day it’s not just a guy behind the phone. Here’s a better tip: maybe others need to view the industry differently than just an adult Nintendo/Grindr. These ads COST US. It’s not FREE. And sitting around answering texts from idiots who can’t figure out when they can meet, or wait 2.5 hours from a reply to a text after requesting an outcall…is also not free. Time is money, and time is not renewable. Respect that. I can change professions when I’m ready to. But you saying that without really knowing me is short sighted. What needs to change is the steady decline in respectful and serious clients in the Rent world. Because it’s gotten worse. Acknowledge and address that first, before making assumptions about whether I’m cut out for the work.

I want to speak that by faith and into existence, but hopefully it happens soon. This run up to Christmas has been tragic, clients either canceling everyday or half ass confirming sessions. People getting blacklisted or being seen with blacklist reports almost everyday. It doesn’t help that my 2 markets have been on a steady decline for business before this. Times like this takes brut strength and hope to get thru. And if you don’t have that, having at least 1 trusty reliable regular is paramount. And I mean, someone who will give you money even when you’re not participating in actual sex.

I don’t blame you. I was just talking to someone that I often end up wishing I could take the after part of Thanksgiving November and December off because it’s almost no real profit. And with this new variant going, things have gotten very dismal…ready to throw in the 🧺 That’s said: the 1,000 sounds nice but I’ll vote 🗳 for the $200 each.

That’s easy to say on paper, but without knowing what your business is…it’s kind of hard to compare it in the same way. I don’t have an issue with being kind and taking care of people. But I’m not going to be a door mat. They need to EARN that. And they are not going to earn that simply by sending me a few round of texts with no real intent to follow thru on a session. Also our ratio of time wasters=real clients are likely different than what you experience.

Yeah, but at the same time: it’s like how do you really know? Like I say, it’s not as simple as “shopping at men’s warehouse”. It’s not always the escort’s fault in such situations. I can give a little thought, but that is not extended forever. For example, here’s a post from a client who been contacting me since 2020, and would fake out everytime. Then he hits me up this morning, and I see he never replied to 3 texts I sent him back in October. I never thought to look him up, and here’s what I found:

You would think so right, but I’m noticing a higher number of flakes seem to be coming from massage based sites, in my area. You say you’ve been able to navigate that in a healthy way, please share… I guess it wouldn’t be so noticeable if there was still a good number of folks showing up, but that’s not quite been the case. It seems like with massage bookings, you have to always be there and be Square when they contact. They don’t always give much notice or seem able to schedule in advance. On top of that, the vast majority especially in “smaller” markets like Kansas City, almost never able to host. I can host, but the times I’m available to, they aren’t. Or something comes up. I’d get a consistent incall spot, but if guys are flaking the way they’ve been, I have little confidence that it would change if I were to get one. I don’t want to be in anymore situations where I’m paying for an apartment in a city I’m barely getting any serious clients in.

And here’s something I should add too that’s a little less transparent: We’re in different times right now. I remember the days when I started, and I used to never really worry about these things. But now, with Covid STILL not going away, I think it continues to affect things in ways we may not even understand on the surface. That’s why when times change, It calls for doing things a bit differently. To have this many fakes is beyond normal. Like I say, some cities pride themselves on being horrible for escorts, and clients manage to perpetuate the idea by showing their asses, but it’s so much bigger than that. In every city, in every state, there’s flakes. There’s a difference between being a “shy client working up confidence”, to just being an inconsiderate pest. The game has changed, and now I have to change. All that BS is so 2021. In 2022, I’m stepping the game up. It’s already started actually.

Okay, even though I answered that 1 time…this thread is not about “shopping at retail stores and how it is similar to contacting an escort”. You can definitely make another topic on that, if you choose to. Could be interesting to see how many other providers agree with your concept. This is more about situations where the person isn’t considerate of the escort’s time, and thus come off as “fake”. Faking like they want to arrange a visit, but really either too chicken shit or too pre-occupied to really make it happen. Or just being a plain dick. I googled an article on this yesterday, and one line in particular made a lot of sense to me: Meet the Fakes First of all, it’s important to understand who it is that is likely to waste your time without turning into a paying client. Let’s meet the fakes. You’ll hear from many different types of tire kickers, but the most common one are: Cheapskates. They want your work for next to nothing and are hopeful they can talk you down from your rates. They have no intention of paying you what you are worth and are likely to complain a lot if you do happen to work for them. Your competition. They want to know what you charge for your projects so that they can set their own prices. They’re hoping you’ll share your complete price list with them. Idea thieves. They want to get the details of how you do your work so that they can steal your ideas and do the work themselves. Or they may be planning to hire someone else to carry out your ideas. The lonely. They just want attention. They’ll take as much time from you as you’ll give them. They may even pay you a token amount, but they don’t need a freelancer. They probably need to join a social club. The angry (many of the types of clients contacting escorts). They haven’t paid you a dime and already they’re mistreating you. They may use a disrespectful tone or simply show a lack of respect. The sampler. This fake claims that your portfolio isn’t enough. He or she has to see a free sample of your work (to his or her specification) before hiring you for a project. http://freelancem.ag/how-to-keep-fake-clients-from-stealing-your-time-and-sapping-your-energy/ Fortunently, I’ve been having a fun time with the Mr. Number app. Just been Blacklisting idiots almost every other day. And many of those people have bad reports already posted.

Haha. I know you think that’s funny, but you really just came off sounding like a jerk. If being entertained by someone’s misery actually is entertaining (and who told you I was miserable in the first place, I’m just addressing an issue), maybe you should see a psychologist. So, jokes on you 👌🏾