TallMuscl37

I figure at least he was honest, in a sleazy kinda way. I been mulling over how to go about doing it. I know one porn escort guy told me years ago, not to advertise further out than 2 weeks, because by the time you get there, they won’t be horny anymore. I think that’s a reasonable time limit, though not as predictable. Even that could be too long. I think more like 2 days is the limit 😆 What I have been doing, is posting in cities before I even had a date planned, just to give people the opportunity to notice me before I arrive. Considering that 1 or 2 days visiting a city isn’t really enough time for the whole city to notice someone. But then by the time I get dates planned and get it into action, the same people from 2 weeks ago, usually aren’t available anymore. I think going forward, I’ll only advertise in advance as long as I’m actively in between destinations. Right now I have advance locations, but I know it’s going to be within the week that I arrive because I’m already traveling and have bags packed. But trying to plan trips in advance while still at home, or on the back end of the trip, it’s just too many changes that can get in the way on both sides. Like right now, I know I’ll be going back thru Denver before the month is out…but I’m not going to post again in my travel dates until I am back. And I never post in my home location at all while traveling. Because by the time I get back home, most of the people who contacted me while I was away maybe made other plans.

Yeah I suppose that would be a good way of going about it if someone is able to notice that a bit further out. Similar to the other thread running about providers changing plans, sometimes that’s an issue I run into as well. In the past month, seems like every time I’ve been ready to “go” somewhere, there’s a major weather event that had me either postponing or going along anyway…and being snowed in for 2 days and wishing I didn’t go thru the trouble of going. I could only go to warmer destinations, but from my area the option is limited to Texas within a day commute. It seems a lot of people I speak to in the Midwest are moving to Texas, but the escort scene is too crowded and overdone. Many of the opportunity locations are in the northern areas. All those cities like Atlanta, Dallas and Houston and Phoenix with the good weather, there’s like a million escorts all trying to meet the same clients. Hence a message I received from a client I been communicating with for nearly a month, and was expecting to meet him when I arrived to town: 🤦🏽‍♂️ Like really bro? Really?

Well, it’s not a matter of agreeing or disagreeing, because you’re not necessarily operating the same way…you just said it that you don’t travel outside of London. So booking sessions outside of town is an entirely different concept for you. A client can choose what time works for them, but it also goes both ways. You can’t just have it working for just one person and not the other. When I work with photographers, and do my photo shoot gigs, I still have to work with their schedule and availability. I’m not suggesting that it’s okay to constantly change plans, but like I said…sometimes it’s a matter of coordinating schedules. Nothing can work if both parties aren’t in a position to meet.

Well clearly you seem entertained. Lol. Your perception of this discussion is a bit skewed. Whenever I hear someone referring to something as “fault” that insinuates a false sense of guilt or blame. I’m not blaming anyone for anything. I’m just discussing a dynamic. Fault is why Dems and Repubs can’t get along. I’m not fault finding anyone. Get it straight. That said; I think my living in KC and St. Louis (both very cliquey places where you really have to grow up there to really develop a friend circle) for the past couples months have been making me slightly delusional. I came back to a city I used to live (Denver) and last night I had a blast with my former friends and his friends. But that was 5-6 years living in a city versus just 2. I also hear more that once you get past 30, it just becomes harder to make friends anyway. I know that applies moreso to straights than gays (a city like Palm Springs you have guys in 40s, 50s and 60s who still “hangout” simply because there’s less emphasis to stay home and be a “working dad” so to speak).

But not always… This thread relates to another thread I put up about advertising travels in advance. I admit I have needed to move schedules around a bit, but it wasn’t so much of a “Meet me at hotel XXX at 6 p.m.” but more of a “I will be arriving to your city this week, what DAYS are you available.” They’ll either claim to be free whenever, or will offer me only ONE day within an extreme narrow time window that they can meet, and then expect me to perform miracles and just drop my life to accommodate. And see, some clients will run with that and try to gaslight me into believing we never had any expectation of an appointment. Yeah umm…I’m not a time genie that pulls out schedules out of a hat. It’s all about coordinating. And some clients don’t want to coordinate: they expect us to magically appear when and where they want us without any compromise. It’s like: First I coordinate, get an idea of what is even possible. Then, once I see an alignment of both schedules, l can go ahead and narrow down a time and place. But what (some) clients want to do is say: “hey you, I’m available NOW. Or, Tomorrow at 3 p.m. ummm, sir…you just walked into my life 3 minutes ago. Do you have a clue of what the actual FUCK may be going on it? No? Well…Maybe don’t assume seeing an ad on a website means I have nothing better to do than point my dick in your direction at your beck and call. And the funny thing is: they never do the same for us. That’s why I’m getting less accommodating to clients these days. They want us to go out of our way, but they don’t want to go out of their way. So why the fuck should I? Just because someone is paying me, isn’t permission to treat my schedule and responsibilities as less important than yours.

…Because it doesn’t work and it’s not worth doing it anymore. This may come as a surprise considering I usually am an advocate of booking sessions with some notice, but for now on…the most notice I’ll be giving for travel cities is the amount of time it takes to get there from wherever I’m departing from, on the day of. “Maybe” the day prior if I’m already en route to a city, and certain to be passing thru on my way. I am so tired of the wasted time, hope and energy communicating with inquiries in other cities and states, only to be told they can’t meet when I arrive. Some even cancel or flake as I’m commuting to the destination. Today it happened 3 times. Actually was 4: one gave a deposit the Friday and still cancelled Sunday, claiming to be sick. 2 others sent cancellation courtesy, the other just didn’t even bother. And then, I have been posting before I went to Denver since February. Especially because it’s become such a impossible market due to the amount of guys there likely out number the clients. But yet I didn’t meet with a single person who contacted me when I was advertising in advance. Either they were from out of town or didn’t respond to my messages when I arrived. The only bookings I had were 2 long time regulars and 1 “almost” client who contacted me after my appointment with my regular. I didn’t even take the booking because it was too last minute. This is very similar to the thread here: I don’t know the specifics for other guys, but I can imagine the not so advance booking guys out there probably are doing it for good cause: who the fuck wants to waste time and energy trying to book sessions before arrival, only to be told the person can’t meet once you do?? And then all it does is cause arguments and fallouts with clients because, I will have them on my “guest list”, and then I arrive after paying for travel expenses and hotels, and they don’t come thru. And the other problem is: we can’t even advertise in a different city without putting dates up. I don’t understand why the fuck these sites don’t make it easier to advertise in a city just for visibility like RentBoy used to allow. RentMen used to also, but then they force us to put dates up if it’s further then 250 miles away from the “current” city, as if clients are making our schedule like an employee business trip. It’s not like clients are cutting us checks, booking hotel rooms and flights/travel with conference dates like a regular job. I’m just 1 person, trying to figure out a multi city trip. The dates are going to get messed up sometimes. It takes a lot to leave my home for a week or 2, get everything I need done to prepare to travel, etc. Guys put expectations on us to get places, but don’t understand the leg work to get there. I have figured it out that clients these days, operate on a Grindr mentality. There doesn’t seem to be enough commodity for sex workers, to book anything out in advance anymore. It used to be something I could do back in 2012, but in 2022 very few clients are consistent in the business. It seems like every trip I did last year, all the clients were people I booked the day of, or the day before. This will make planning trips easier and harder in some ways. I’m usually open to go on trips with limited funds, with the confidence that I’ll make back what I spend plus more. But now, if I don’t have enough travel money to feel comfortable with (getting there and back plus 2 nights minimum hotel in case nobody shows up), I likely won’t do the trip at all anymore.

Well, yah I’m referring to it as a whole…not necessarily a by product of being in the industry. That said: I’ve been fortunate to be able to leave my state and go to an area I used to live. And I had 2 movie dates in a weekend (one an old friend and another a former hookup buddy/former masseur himself that we reconnected into a date finally). So, that’s a good sign overall. I’m just going to continue diversifying and working new markets overall. I’ve often found friends just by doing that. Sometimes the irony is, when a place sucks for biz, it usually sucks for making connections too. But a place like Miami that’s not the best for business, it is good for making friends/hookup buddies (actually it isn’t, there’s just more people to choose from to give the illusion that you’re making friends, but a lot of those guys are flighty and pretentious down there). Being you’re in Fort Lauderdale I’m sure you get my drift.

As an update: The biz seems very sleepy right now. I’m hoping my next move to some different markets will help jumpstart my schedule back to action. I had a decent weekend of a couple bookings (a return and a fan) but since then not a whole lot. Idk if there’s less clients or much more providers, but it feels like the momentum just isn’t there rtn. I had a client tell me the other day, “I thought you were (in his area) 3-4 weeks ago”. How? People see an ad and don’t quite get it that it doesn’t mean there today. Then when I’m ready to go, ironically everybody either busy or has Covid. Over it 🤦🏽‍♂️

I think there may need to be some “clarifying” of the topic. For me, it’s gotten to a point where I haven’t even really been able to meet friends. Most everyone I meet now is from a hookup app, client or the very occasional bar guy. But it always seems that: if it’s not mutual sexual attraction, it’s nothing. Or, if we do meet and there’s mutual attraction, the friendship is over soon as things don’t seem able to pan out or they too fucking lazy to put any effort in making things work.

I’ve been in sort of a quandary with this lately. Sure it’s come up before, but for 2022 it needs to be discussed again lol. Over the past couple/few months I’ve really hit rock bottom as far as my social life goes. I literally have no “nearby” friend circle and the ones I do have are out of state who I see maybe every couple or so months. I’ve pretty much given up on the dating circuit because all it seems are people with potential who end up not panning out. I’ve already had like 4-5 dead end “dating” situations since the summer. Sometimes I can’t always see where escorting may have a direct effect on any of those situations, considering the guys really weren’t all that perfect themselves (either rude, judgey, or not really serious about anyone long term). But, I do feel like the nature of the biz doesn’t naturally let us meet people in a platonic environment. I had a guy last month who met me as a client awhile back, but we agreed to meet “off clock” because there was a mutual attraction established. But that quickly dissipated on my end because he invited me to a hotel where he was snowed in with his airport co-workers, and couldn’t even have the decency to be seen anywhere in the common areas with me…because he “didn’t want his co-workers asking questions”. It’s things like that which really give off a disrespectful vibe to me. I also cultivated friendship with another client, but anytime we hung out, it was always under his (and his partner’s) schedule. Eventually that lead to a fallout, and even though we’re on better terms, we haven’t hung out since Labor Day weekend. Another client friend told me about Facebook gay men’s social, but I kinda tried those types of meetup groups, and it doesn’t work for me. I don’t like to be around too many random “personalities” without a real purpose of meeting. To me it still feels like being on Adam4Adam or Grindr, but just with a little extra engagement. Not really into it. How have other guys adjusted or make it work in favor? I’ll also mention that, most of my local “friends” are (single, not married) clients now. I’ll hang with them off clock and every now and then they’ll want to book me and it’s fun. However, most are a bit older than me, and sometimes the difference in “energy” (many clients also don’t like to go to bars, happy hours, or the latest gay club events. And that’s been a big part of my social life and meeting others) makes it to where I can’t hang with them “every” weekend kind of way.

I’d have to wonder how many people actually do that anyway. One of my peeves is when someone contacts me, and then can’t recall who they reached out to. There’s been the once in a blue time someone contacted me and expected someone else to show up. That’s why nowadays I really have to make sure they have all the details at time of contact.

Yah that’s definitely a given. However, being it’s beyond our realms of control. We can only hope the proper measures are taken to address that and ensure the best possible mitigation. At the same time, the effect could go either way. If there’s a mass immigration from Ukraine, there may be a new segment of providers/clients developing as well. But I wouldn’t know when, or what cities that may be noticed in. Depends who gets designated as a refugee City. I can see that being the case. I’m currently posting in cities in advance of my visits, but apart from a few interested responses, the schedule seems a bit up in the air on who will show up. Almost a matter of just getting there and seeing who I can fill….in (pun)

Trying to consolidate 2 different questions here. Hope it doesn’t confuse lol. But, I’m curious if other providers feel the impending “war” will play an effect on us? I know for me, it’s already seeming to be the case since I need (to pay) fuel to get to bookings, often in other cities. Also, what do clients and escorts feel about the large number of RentMen guys on the market nowadays? I’m seeing cities that only had a handful of guys back in 2010, now having double or triple the amount of ads. There’s a known fact that many of these ads aren’t “real”, But I personally don’t snoop into profiles and read reviews or get into investigating how another guy operates unless we are in a setting for that. This comes on the heels of the thread about Full time/part time escorts. At this rate, and with RentMen not showing any rates, I’m just not sure where the biz is going to go. I’d be kidding myself if I said I’m not a bit concerned 😦

It’s a challenging scenario, but I’ve done it a few times. Many, in fact. I am really into 3, 4, even 5 ways. I’ve done it with clients and escorts I’ve never met the 1st time. It’s pretty much like a live porn (without the film crew) and I find it sexy and adventurous. The only time I wouldn’t appreciate it, is if we were at a public setting and the escort happened to show up. I had that occur couple times before, but 1 didn’t go well. After being at a restaurant for nearly half hour or longer, he chose the other provider over me. Not even a 3 way. Then had the gall to say, “you can join but I’m only paying him “. I seriously wanted to kill that client. (I was a bit younger and not in tune with my emotions or the concept of blacklisting/cancellation fees at the time) 😆 Fortunately, another (local) client contacted me on my way home…he became a regular and turned out we shared a mutual friend. So it was really a blessing in disguise. The other escort died off the market after a few months. To disparage a provider in front of another provider in a public setting, is the lowest form of integrity. Most escorts don’t sign up for an in person “audition”. We are quite aware of that in our postings already. Once we have a client, we want to feel we have the client. Not go thru an additional challenge with another provider. That said, if a provider agrees to do a session with another…by all means. No harm no foul!

I think the key is: timing. Okay. It’s not about someone reaching out to other providers, it’s the tact behind it. It takes a bit of integrity and patience to be able to understand, but…that’s what’s missing today. I can’t necessarily say what is “adequate” timing, but if trying to get something accomplished it’s a good idea to just give people time. I know gay male sex often defies all logic and principles and many want it “ASAP”, but there’s a time and a place for that.

I just gotta joke with you: Asian can be anywhere from Russia to China to India to Saudi. So, you have to specify which All-Asian look you're referring to 😉 But if you're talking about China/Japan/Vietnam/Laos...I can see that especially in the west coast, but I've seen a good number of "East Asian" clients. So, don't be fooled into believing that Asian guys only go for White guys. Plus (and this is no invitation to an argument or debate), like I said earlier...I believe "all American" guys have a tendency to generalize on certain subjects. So, you can't just hear from one "type" of source. I have one locally who often hits me up. However there is a truth in that, especially on the west coast. I've been to San Diego, Los Angeles and San Fran a few times, but hadn't met any Asian clients there. But in Saint Louis I had 1 Asian client and 2 Asian friend with benefit.

I appreciate your point of view, I really do. But: I don’t really need to see it differently based on what I already said. I already clarified: everyone’s definition of success in escorting will vary. And if that person has a separate income stream, what they may be happy with may not suit someone who’s doing it full time. One guy working a 9 to 5 may be okay with 1 or 2 clients a week. Someone doing this full time may wish to see 3 or 4 clients a week. If the full time escort is only getting the amount of bookings the part time escort is getting: that’s not going to be the same perspective. And that’s not taking into consideration many times, it’s never “per” week but more of an “average”. At the end of the day: if someone wants to do a 9 to 5 and escort, more power to them. You’re insinuating it’s a wiser choice, which respectably, it can be for different reasons. However that doesn’t speak for everyone. For example: the other day on a MONDAY (hypothetical work day), I had a client who contacted me at 11:45 a.m. in a city at a hotel I was at (I’m getting ready to checkout at 12:30 because if I’m just visiting a small market just to take clients, if I don’t get any word by mid-morning, I don’t want to chance paying for an extra day without having any bookings). I’ve done that many times, and it’s a gamble and a waste of money. Now, this will also tie into your “flake” discussion, but I’m just going to show you it’s not just the flakiness, but the level of stupidity some of these guys are on. He contacts saying, “hi welcome back to town”. Mind you, I’ve never met the guy, but he did contact me previously. Last time he pussied out when I asked for a deposit to arrange a session. So this time, I reminded him again: And I told him; “I can meet you, but last time you had an issue with my deposit policy. If you want to meet, you need to be here by 12:30. He’s like, okay yeah I can be there by then. I send map with approximate location and the blue dot. Sure enough, he’s like, “oh I can’t make it there by 12:30, I thought you were downtown”. And I’m like okay, I can give you until 1, but you need to send the deposit so I know you’re coming. He’s like, “oh I’m not comfortable with sending that”. Obviously he didn’t forget what my policy is, and it’s there in the ad. But as it relates, if I had a regular 9 to 5, I wouldn’t be able to see him anyway because many times, people want to book the daytime sessions…and unless it’s a night time job (which is often common with restaurant/retail), there could be a lot of bookings missed between the hours of 9 to 5. So if I take that route, it would make it very part time. I’d just be taking the occasional night time bookings when they come, which isn’t very often in places like Kansas City and St. Louis and other “closeted” markets. At the same time, I agree wholeheartedly that it’s tough out here. The whole male escort/masseur market has been consolidated onto just a couple of platforms: RentMen/RentMasseur with a handful of copy profile sites. So when I get into my next market, I likely will pick up a side job to cover the bases.

Okay let me just first clear the air on something, because I don’t want to spend much time addressing it: This site’s well thought design made it easy that I didn’t have to look far to find who I was referring to. By “all American” I mean: I know that’s doesn’t “define” All American” (that could be any and every native-born American) but it’s similar to the grocery stores: The “international food” section and the “ethnic hair” section is generally a “safe” way of saying Chinese/Mexican/Black without necessarily “referring” to that. We have to be very politically correct when discussing race lol.

I am in agreement with all that. I wasn’t trying to make it like I’m fixated on what is considered “desirable” in the market because, I realize I have my own following to entertain and that’s sufficient. I guess I was just feeling some type of way, and making sure I can understand the perception of it all. I still wish things were a bit balanced, You citing age differences isn’t really as biased as race based differences. A 23 year old White escort and a 23 year old Black escort may still experience a different experience regardless.

They “gotta” be White because that’s who it is I’m referencing in this particular discussion. Plain and simple. It’s not racial generalizations, it’s the actual demographic that make up the majority of timewasters and bullshit mother fuckers who have proven to be such. I know because I screen every booking that comes thru to me, and based on the results, that’s who it shows. Many of the timewasters contacting on RM sites are the White guys (some even send pictures and STILL end up being fakes). Not saying other races don’t (I’ve had my share of Black clients be bullshit MoFos too, and in some markets it’s far too common)…but, it’s the White “clients” that generally do most of the game playing out here. Idk if they do it with just the Black providers, or everyone. And in case I have to make it obvious: I’m talking about @Kevin Slaterand @Rod Hagenare different ethnicities from ME. From ME. (I’m actually just under 30% White though, so we’re not “too” distant 😆 Why do I even need to clarify that?? lol First off: I didn’t take it as offense. I agree with all the points you made, but when you made it about me, by saying “you”, that’s where you went in error. And then I had to clarify that. Because what you did: was say, “other black guys are in the business and doing well”…which insinuated that I’m not. That’s why I corrected you. On top of that, @Storm4U just said in another thread, that he quit his Massage business. Idk what his particular reasons for it was, whether it was because business related or not, but obviously it’s some indication that some providers have reasons for leaving.

Let me just address something ASAP: just because I bring up a conversation about something, does not mean I’m broke or struggling. Just to clear that up. I don’t think it’s necessary to compare me to another escort because one’s definition of success may be different than mine. Similar to what I said to someone previously: He said $1,200 a month doesn’t sound like much (which was not my earnings). $1,200 a month to a part time escort/masseur with a Mon-Fri. job may be successful. $1,200 a month to a full time escort like myself, may not meet their goals. And if an escort can make $1,200 in 4 days (true story on my 1st trip to San Francisco), that can certainly make $1,200 a month feel like nothing. That said: I’m pretty cognitive that much of it is due to location of one’s market. You compared me to 2 Black providers, one who lives in L.A. and the other who lives in Atlanta. Both of those places reach a large audience, but they’re also popular with competition and flakes. I know because I have been to each location more than a couple of times to know. And since I made this thread, the White provider in question hasn’t even had his ad up. He went from Gold to Basic, to disappeared. So maybe his claim that he’s sooo busy was bluff. I know for a fact Kansas City/St. Louis (Saint Louis fairs a bit better though, however it still gets regular lulls to where I don’t like to be home more than a week or 2 at a time) are not busy markets, except busy with flakes. Many of the White “client’s” in this area pretend to be clients, and then never fucking show up. So, it may “seem” like you’re doing well…and rightfully so, but in reality the numbers don’t add up. I think before you try to assume some shortcoming about me, you should read the other thread about Full time/part time escorts. Several guys said they could not do it Full time because it’s not reliable enough. I said I am doing it full time. So, obviously, there’s guys who’s success is assisted by their main job: which isn’t bad, BUT the real test of success is going to be who can do this as their main or sole job, and feel the same way. So far only @Kevin Slater and @Rod Hagen have said they been only doing sex work. And considering the difference in ethnicities, the question still remains…

Ya, I wish there were more like you out there. But, there's just some shitty guys out here in the gay sex world. Lately, it's been so bad that I don't even have a desire to meet with any dudes who aren't paying me. Not because I'm greedy or all about money, but because they don't appreciate it. It is just bad. Guys out here come to the table only to get something for nothing. The quality of guys were actually better during the pandemic. Now, it's just tragic. So when I see text exchanges like above, it just reiterates. The bossy, bitchy, and moody attitudes are pervasive. At some point, somebody has to say; "let me treat you the way YOU want to be treated".

I love your ever forgiving, relaxed approach to some things, but in this case it seems a bit more than anxiety and awkwardness. Like @maninsoma described, the interaction didn't share much, but rather had the goal of the escort doing all the leg work. This lead to frustration and aggravation on both parties, which apparently is a big deal considering how much of an epic fail it was. Now, a distrust has been created and if the poster never came here to discuss it, you'd just have 2 people with no understanding of how to fix it and avoid it next time. Thus, the cycle repeats. And he's not the only one, because I just had a similiar client last week "give me permission" to block him as well after I told him to stop wasting my time asking about explicit activities if he can't figure out when he's available. Yet he's the one who's been contacting me since July 2021...I have a block for him, and it comes in a size 13 cowboy boot 🤠 Some clients can use a bit of feedback on how not to book an escort. And to me, that's a big deal. I agree. "Normal" on app culture and normal when contacting a sex worker isn't quite the same thing. One thing that nobody has mentioned: "what's your rate, do you bareback" technically that's considered the "P" word, and even though a properly screened client doesn't pose a risk, for a client to text a provider this puts the client at risk for a charge (suppose this escort was a cop), and the escort at risk for a charge (if the client was a cop).

That's cool and understandable. But, I don't see it as having all eggs in the sex work basket. I just see it as being focused and prioritizing sex work. I'm not trying to argue or disagree, but I see it more as some people like being busy and having multiple things going on. Which is fine. However, as seamless as it may sound, I know reality is it doesn't always go that way. Projects take longer, unexpected clients may book, and suddenly your plate is full and something (or someone) gets pushed to the back burner. I do the same thing, except I prefer to use my non-sex work hours doing hobbies, modeling gigs, traveling, gym, etc. Traveling while in a part-time job may appear to some as being irresponsible, the reality was: traveling was part of a greater access to opportunities that would have otherwise not been present where I was at the time. At the same time, I can still see the merits in having other income streams for the reasons stated. However I still stand behind the fact that there seems to be less recognition to those who are mainly just doing sex work. Though: not sure if that extends to massages and video material as well. A sex worker may only do sex work but still have 3-4 jobs (escort, masseur, porn star, model). I guess it's all relative and at the discretion of a person's financial goals.

Dude, I'm talking about something years ago that I did to reach a short time goal. I didn't "ask" for the work, they needed the workers because it was a fairly high turn over position. It wasn't something I really wanted to do anyway, but I tried it, and realized I could do better for myself just prioritizing sex work. Which I did. It was easier to make $500 in a night than $500 in commission at the other place. So, don't assume and be condescending..