coriolis888

I just returned to Sao Paulo today.  
Ubering from GRU, I noticed less traffic because today is a holiday in  Brazil.
I agree, there is a lot of important new Brazil information in this thread.  It would be a shame to have it removed because of a few posters that keeping interjecting politics and unrelated issues in this BRAZIL thread.
The Uber driver was nice and said he did not have much business today because of the holiday.
I asked him if he wanted to make additional money by driving past areas that were not included in my initial request from GRU to my hotel.
The driver agreed.  My Portuguese is good enough to know what the driver was saying and for understanding the contrast of how Sao Paulo has changed over the past couple of years since the pandemic..
The driver noted the deterioration of Centro greater than it was because of the coronavirus.  He also commented on more homeless people on the streets and he drove me past areas that now have tents with homeless people that were not there prior to the pandemic.
We eventually reached my area were I am staying.  I will be less likely to be involved with a mugger, therefore, the extra cost I pay to stay where I stay is certainly worth it to me (these hotels are only about one hundred dollars higher than less safe hotels.
There are some great hotels not far from Lagoa, including where I am staying.  I am Talking about Rua Alameda Santos where you will find Intercontinental Hotel, Marriott and other good quality named hotels that are in a safe neighborhood where you are not likely to meet a mugger.  This street is one block from Avenida Paulista which is the fanciest and safest street in Sao Paulo.  Surprisingly, even though you will stay in a fancy neighborhood, you will avoid most danger and you will see the better parts of Sao Paulo.
Try it, you might like it. 
 

Do you know where a mass shooting has never happened?  In schools that allow their teachers to conceal carry.  272 TX school districts have adopted concealed programs, and 28 states have adopted the program to varying degrees.  Not a single mass shooting (or even an individual shooting) during school hours.
Sorry, again, just responding to your post.  Please return to the subject of crime and tourist safety in Brazil.

this is a thread about São Paulo, Rio and attendant safety concerns.  But thanks for hijacking it to make your political talking points.  Well done 

I agree with you about the drugs and; all good things come to an end.    
I used to visit the Village a couple of times each month for several years.  Then the drug trade came to the village, clubs and also to the streets.  I believe the drugs started strong just across the street, in plain sight, from the park that could be seen from the former Gouverneur Hotel. 
From the Gouverneur Hotel, you could watch from your window or from the front entrance of the hotel and see drug sales take place.   
Over a short period of time, fun places in the Village began to change and/or close.   
I stopped visiting Montreal for other places. 
Like you said, all good things come to an end. 
Restaurant owner says she and her husband were attacked on their terrace in Montreal's Village
MONTREAL.CTVNEWS.CA The owner of a dumpling restaurant in Montreal’s Village neighbourhood says she and her husband were attacked on their terrace earlier this week...  

Agree with @coriolis888 There's no need to go to Republic, as those movie theaters are not only subpar but also unsanitary. I'm quite adventurous and enjoy mingling with locals, and Republic doesn't offer much in that regard. It's mostly an empty area with a lot of disheartened or intimidating individuals.
Furthermore, after spending time at bathhouses and clubs, I found myself lacking the energy I needed to rest and make the most of my free time exploring the sights and indulging in some shopping – and yes, I did quite a bit of shopping, thanks to the amazing prices. so is not worth, Dedalos bar is in the area, but i always took a Uber there, never walked for that area.
i need vacation to recuperate for all those GP that destroyed my  🕳️. i havent even changed any of my plans for nov/dec, i am not sure if i am up to travel again.

The last time a guy took my money and left without doing anything, it was because he was a meth addict.
Before that, I got screwed over by an escort who was also on drugs at the time.
I wish there were better ways to screen for addiction, besides the obvious facial symptoms.

Sorry you had to go through this.
If a guy is professional he is not going to ask for photos or stats. It’s different when someone send their photos when contacting the escort which is their choice and preference. 
Blocking you tells more about the escort’s character than anything. Consider yourself lucky you didn’t spend any money on these guys.

I will never again pay a deposit. If the provider demands one, then we're just not a fit and it won't happen.

correct - also it’s interesting to look at the maps of favelas in Rio & São Paulo for comparison, that was compiled by US Embassy in Brazil.
Maps of U.S. Citizen Caution Areas - U.S. Embassy & Consulates in Brazil
BR.USEMBASSY.GOV The caution area maps shown below were created to help U.S. Citizens travelers avoid potentially... In Rio, there are several favelas directly adjacent to tourist areas in Copacabana & Ipanema - and others in Zona Sul.  The favelas are literally on top of the areas where wealthy foreign tourists gather in a very small geographic area.  
By contrast - there are no favelas anywhere close to areas in São Paulo where most tourists stay.  This partially explains the crime differential tourists may experience between Rio & SP, with Rio being more dangerous or more simply where a tourist is more likely to be a crime victim.
Of course, if a tourist in São Paulo ventures into the more seedy areas like Republica although not technically a favela - the likelihood of crime greatly increases. 
It’s really not complicated- although seems to be an endless subject of conversation here.  Your chances of being a crime victim are exponentially greater in Rio, compared to SP, assuming you stay & move about in areas that are common to most tourist visits.  
The wild card, of course is how careful or careless the tourist may be.  All things being equal, SP is way safer. 

I strongly recommend that you not visit that favela. 
Even though @José Soplanucas mentioned that he had inadvertently gone to the favela and found the people friendly, do not count on the same friendly experience if you go there.  

Your decision will be based on how much you want to see Rio.  You recently got to know Sao Paulo.  
As you know, there are direct flights into Rio or Sao Paulo from the U.S.  
I personally prefer to spend more time in Sao Paulo than in Rio because there is so much more to do in Sao Paulo and the city is safer than Rio.  Rio has a large beach and two popular saunas and a higher crime rate than does Sao Paulo.     
Sauna wise, in Rio, you have:
Clube 117 which is a fun place and never disappointed me in the many years and times I visited there. 
Clube 202 can be a fun and busy place and easy to meet garotos.  However, the owner, Junior, likes LOUD
music which, when he is there, turns up the music loud which makes it difficult to have a conversation with the garotos or anyone else while in the sauna.  His sauna is located in Copacabana, right near a favela which makes it easier for street crime to come down the hill and bother people on the street near the sauna then quickly escape back up the hill.
There is also one smaller sauna in Rio that I never saw but supposedly has very young thin garotos.  I do not recall the name of the sauna.  
So, given the above and if it were I and the first time in Brazil, I would book Rio for a few days then proceed to Sao Paulo for the remainder of my vacation.  Of course, this is what I would do.  
When you travel between Rio and SP, while in Brazil, there is no need to go to the far out international airports.  There is a smaller downtown airport in both Rio and SP. - Congonas and Santos Dumont airports. 
It is only about an hour flight between the downtown two city airports.    

thanks @coriolis888 it is wise to be extra careful. In my case i bet i will end up getting drive everywhere and anywhere. Specially after getting pound so hard by those GP, i guess i am not as in good shape as used to, and took a lot of GP the same day
I am still paying the consequences of the excess i indulged in SP. it was really good, but painful ;/ i may need to hang the Bottom Out of Order sign 

Sorry, but for safety reasons of forum members who will visit Rio, I must make corrections to the above:
The street leading to the favela is NOT PAST sauna 202, walking from the beach to the sauna.  That uphill street leading to the favela is BEFORE you reach sauna 202 traveling from the beach area toward sauna 202.  
I make this correction because I do not want to read about a forum member(s) accidentally taking the wrong street that leads to an unfavorable event after entering a favela. 
Again, the described street that leads to a highly dangerous favela is before you reach sauna 202, not past that sauna (walking from Copacabana beach or area). 
Another correction I want to make is that the uphill street in question (that leads to the favela) is NOT near the  downtown beach area of Copacabana.  Sauna 202 and that uphill street (that leads to the favela) is about five or six blocks from the Copacabana beach but less than half a block from sauna 202.
Safety is critical to having a great vacation in Brazil.  
 

Sorry, but for safety reasons of forum members who will visit Rio, I must make corrections to the above:
The street leading to the favela is NOT PAST sauna 202, walking from the beach to the sauna.  That uphill street leading to the favela is BEFORE you reach sauna 202 traveling from the beach area toward sauna 202.  
I make this correction because I do not want to read about a forum member(s) accidentally taking the wrong street that leads to an unfavorable event after entering a favela. 
Again, the described street that leads to a highly dangerous favela is before you reach sauna 202, not past that sauna (walking from Copacabana beach or area). 
Another correction I want to make is that the uphill street in question (that leads to the favela) is NOT near the  downtown beach area of Copacabana.  Sauna 202 and that uphill street (that leads to the favela) is about five or six blocks from the Copacabana beach but less than half a block from sauna 202.
Safety is critical to having a great vacation in Brazil.  
 

In Rio, favelas are very close to almost everything - it's not an unusual thing. They surround all the popular beaches.  The favelas are full of gangs, drug dealers, weapons, desperate people & immense poverty.
so when they see the rich foreign tourists wandering about & some of them very stupid - of course they're going to rob them 

15 to 20 feet in? In all fairness, that’s less than the width of the first building. Certainly not enough to make a valid judgment about traveling alone as a stranger inside an unfamiliar anything, much less a favela.

Yep. 
Although this AP report is 8 years old, it could have been made yesterday!
Note: other Brazilian cities like Salvador have this bus problem, too.
 

Wow. You scare pretty easily. I don’t find anything remotely scary or intimidating about Junior. 

Agreed. 
 
It’s that “it hasn’t happened to me (yet), so it must not be true” mindset that is so dangerous, because it lulls you into a sense of complacency, when it’s important to remain vigilant. 
 
Yep. Every one I know as well has experienced at least a petty theft on the street or a mugging — no matter their size, gender or color.
Ask any attendant of last weekend’s Celebration of 100 years of The Copacabana Palace how that went. Over 500 arrests on the street and beach for theft and assault. 
 
The areas around the beaches of Copacabana and Ipanema are especially target-rich environments for the ladrãozinhos, but ironically, the Zona Sul / South Zone neighborhoods are still the safest neighborhoods inside the city limits of Rio. A casual or unseasoned tourist would be foolish to stay outside of Zona Sul — unless they have a very specific reason and are staying with someone who knows what they’re doing and where they’re going. 
 

I strongly recommend that you not visit that favela. 
Even though @José Soplanucas mentioned that he had inadvertently gone to the favela and found the people friendly, do not count on the same friendly experience if you go there.  

I agree about the "maybe try the Metro" in the above post.  However, do not use most Metro buses in Brazil.  If you can read Portugese, check the internet news for reported robberies aboard buses.  You will see several reports of incidents of robberies on buses daily.   
A metro speeds along fast and many metro cars have local police riding along for safety. 
However, the buses do not have that added protection of police on board. 
For most vacationers to Brazil, do not chance taking a bus while Ubers are so much faster and safer and cheap.  

it’s actually doing damage - leading some to think entering a favela is no big deal. 

there are some here that just won’t acknowledge real facts on the ground (or multiple similar reviews from unconnected people in this forum), but rather spin a different Rio reality based on a couple isolated anecdotes. 
All the Brazilians I know have been mugged, robbed or worse.  The general attitude is that if it hasn’t happened yet, it definitely will.  Your number just hasn’t come up as they say. 
Rio is extraordinarily dangerous - especially in tourist zones. You can still go & have a great time and not be a crime victim.  Just requires a different level of vigilance.  If not, they will find you.  They look for stupid tourists because they are the easiest targets. And always leave town shortly after the crime.

Your decision will be based on how much you want to see Rio.  You recently got to know Sao Paulo.  
As you know, there are direct flights into Rio or Sao Paulo from the U.S.  
I personally prefer to spend more time in Sao Paulo than in Rio because there is so much more to do in Sao Paulo and the city is safer than Rio.  Rio has a large beach and two popular saunas and a higher crime rate than does Sao Paulo.     
Sauna wise, in Rio, you have:
Clube 117 which is a fun place and never disappointed me in the many years and times I visited there. 
Clube 202 can be a fun and busy place and easy to meet garotos.  However, the owner, Junior, likes LOUD
music which, when he is there, turns up the music loud which makes it difficult to have a conversation with the garotos or anyone else while in the sauna.  His sauna is located in Copacabana, right near a favela which makes it easier for street crime to come down the hill and bother people on the street near the sauna then quickly escape back up the hill.
There is also one smaller sauna in Rio that I never saw but supposedly has very young thin garotos.  I do not recall the name of the sauna.  
So, given the above and if it were I and the first time in Brazil, I would book Rio for a few days then proceed to Sao Paulo for the remainder of my vacation.  Of course, this is what I would do.  
When you travel between Rio and SP, while in Brazil, there is no need to go to the far out international airports.  There is a smaller downtown airport in both Rio and SP. - Congonas and Santos Dumont airports. 
It is only about an hour flight between the downtown two city airports.    

I strongly recommend that you not visit that favela. 
Even though @José Soplanucas mentioned that he had inadvertently gone to the favela and found the people friendly, do not count on the same friendly experience if you go there.  

Your decision will be based on how much you want to see Rio.  You recently got to know Sao Paulo.  
As you know, there are direct flights into Rio or Sao Paulo from the U.S.  
I personally prefer to spend more time in Sao Paulo than in Rio because there is so much more to do in Sao Paulo and the city is safer than Rio.  Rio has a large beach and two popular saunas and a higher crime rate than does Sao Paulo.     
Sauna wise, in Rio, you have:
Clube 117 which is a fun place and never disappointed me in the many years and times I visited there. 
Clube 202 can be a fun and busy place and easy to meet garotos.  However, the owner, Junior, likes LOUD
music which, when he is there, turns up the music loud which makes it difficult to have a conversation with the garotos or anyone else while in the sauna.  His sauna is located in Copacabana, right near a favela which makes it easier for street crime to come down the hill and bother people on the street near the sauna then quickly escape back up the hill.
There is also one smaller sauna in Rio that I never saw but supposedly has very young thin garotos.  I do not recall the name of the sauna.  
So, given the above and if it were I and the first time in Brazil, I would book Rio for a few days then proceed to Sao Paulo for the remainder of my vacation.  Of course, this is what I would do.  
When you travel between Rio and SP, while in Brazil, there is no need to go to the far out international airports.  There is a smaller downtown airport in both Rio and SP. - Congonas and Santos Dumont airports. 
It is only about an hour flight between the downtown two city airports.