Legal counsel for a divorce

[gallahadesquire]

a friend is being sued for divorce by his wife, who claims she just wants mediation and no almoner. He's the breadwinner, and she is unemployed.

 

I think my friend should have a lawyer. What do y'all think?

[AdamSmith]

http://pilotfire.com/wp-content/uploads/Yes.png

[Beancounter]

Yep! No brainer. Is this a community property state?

[bigvalboy]

http://pilotfire.com/wp-content/uploads/Yes.png

 

+1...

 

And anyone who walks into a court of law without legal representation is a fool.

[+ Keith30309]

+1...

 

And anyone who walks into a court of law without legal representation is a fool.

 

Amen... and that's not a lesson you want to learn the hard way.

[american executive]

Please tell your friend that he should get legal advice.

 

Don't trust the ex who says she does not want alimony or money. I had a very similar problem with my ex. She agreed to a settlement. She said she was not after money. She signed papers and agreed to 50%. Five months later she filed a law suit.

 

I was forced to hire an attorney. I had to pay 20K. My ex had an attorney and I assumed paid the same. We were in depositions over and over, meetings and then spent two days in court.

 

The judge denied my ex's claims. The judge did give her a little extra money but all-in-all it was not worth the 40K that we both spent and all of the trouble.

 

Make certain that his ex reads all of the info VERY carefully, so that she can't come back and say that she did not understand.

 

This may not be a legal issue: it is more of an issue as to whether his ex will change her mind. Tell him to expect the worse.

[MikeBiDude]

a friend is being sued for divorce by his wife, who claims she just wants mediation and no almoner. He's the breadwinner, and she is unemployed.

 

I think my friend should have a lawyer. What do y'all think?

Mediation absolutely can work. Calif resident here.

 

The Mediator (who IS a lawyer) will insist by contract that they meet with both of you together only. When a mutual agreement is negotiated (spousal support, child custody of applicable etc) and done, a good mediator will insist you EACH take the mediated agreement to your own separate attorney for review before filing.

 

It works (works for the dissolution of my ten year marriage) the ex and I are still friendly.

 

So yes - get a lawyer. But hiring a mediator does NOT equal no lawyer.

[gallahadesquire]

In passing, THANK YOU to the Comte de Crisco for his reverberant YES.

 

Yep! No brainer. Is this a community property state?

 

Nope.

 

+1...

 

And anyone who walks into a court of law without legal representation is a fool.

 

I like the quote:

 

A man who represents himself has a fool for a client

Which might be improved by

 

A man who represents himself has a fool for a client,

and an ass for a lawyer.

 

Please tell your friend that he should get legal advice.

 

Don't trust the ex who says she does not want alimony or money. I had a very similar problem with my ex. She agreed to a settlement. She said she was not after money. She signed papers and agreed to 50%. Five months later she filed a law suit.

 

I was forced to hire an attorney. I had to pay 20K. My ex had an attorney and I assumed paid the same. We were in depositions over and over, meetings and then spent two days in court.

 

The judge denied my ex's claims. The judge did give her a little extra money but all-in-all it was not worth the 40K that we both spent and all of the trouble.

 

Make certain that his ex reads all of the info VERY carefully, so that she can't come back and say that she did not understand.

 

This may not be a legal issue: it is more of an issue as to whether his ex will change her mind. Tell him to expect the worse.

 

I hear you there.

 

Mediation absolutely can work. Calif resident here.

 

The Mediator (who IS a lawyer) will insist by contract that they meet with both of you together only. When a mutual agreement is negotiated (spousal support, child custody of applicable etc) and done, a good mediator will insist you EACH take the mediated agreement to your own separate attorney for review before filing.

 

It works (works for the dissolution of my ten year marriage) the ex and I are still friendly.

 

So yes - get a lawyer. But hiring a mediator does NOT equal no lawyer.

 

I had to laugh at this. I am not the friend, but I know this sounds like one of those "Well, a friend of mine ..." jokes.

 

I'm trying to convince my friend exactly what you mentioned, as in the italics above.

 

To add to this somewhat farsical situation, there might be a bit of adultery involved.

 

A farmer bought a mule from his neighbor, who was retiring. He had guaranteed that the mule would plow 40 acres a day. He gets the mule home and NOTHING will get the mule to move. He gets his neighbor over to explain the false claim.

 

The neighbor picks up a 2x4 and whacks the mule upside the head. The mule shakes his head, and starts pulling the plow.

 

"How did you know that would work?" the farmer asked.

"Oh, I know this mule," the other farmer said. "He'll do the work; you just have to get his attention first."

[klifhangar]

Yes. I pay 4k per mo alimony and I have the kids AND she's remarried. Men get screwed.

[Brian Kevin]

Yes. I pay 4k per mo alimony and I have the kids AND she's remarried. Men get screwed.

 

Just shows your morals and how nice of a person you truly are.

 

You melt my heart

[m.yi]

Yes. I pay 4k per mo alimony and I have the kids AND she's remarried. Men get screwed.

 

In CA, alimony payments end when the supported spouse remarries.

[whipped guy]

Yes. I pay 4k per mo alimony and I have the kids AND she's remarried. Men get screwed.

Well, for every situation with which I am familiar the system is either rigged in favor of women or women are light years ahead of men as far as being cunning, clever, and calculating in terms of knowing how to work the system. For some reason to my ears it sounds better as the Italians reference it.... "le astuzie femminili".

 

Why else would my female neighbor decide after two kids that she did not want to be married because she fell in love with her female therapist after having surgery on her leg and get the whole nine yards as far as receiving alimony and child support etc.?!?! Of course she sprung this on the husband the day after the addition, new kitchen, and improvements to the house were completed. Oh, and you guessed it! She obviously got the house as well. Plus, when the ex comes to pick up the kids for the weekend she won't let him set foot on the property he has to park in the street and the kids come to him. It's as if all of this was the husband's fault.

 

An aquantaince aged 56 got married in February for the first time. He obviously waited for the right woman. The guy remodeled and refurnished the entire house to her liking. A month ago she said the she was no longer in love with him. He thinks that it will be a quickie and cut and dry divorce. I'll keep you posted on this one. She's Russian and was using him to get into the USA, but he blindly could not see what she was up to. I would hate to know how one says "feminine wiles" in Russian... I doubt that it would sound very encouraging for the guy!!!!

[wisconsinguy]

I have a different take on this. When my former wife and I decided to separate and then divorce, we both got our separate attorneys. We then sat down, looked at each and both decided it was nuts looking at spending that kind of money that we could take care of ourselves. However...we have no minor children to add to the mix...we both agreed to property distribution and other assets. We discussed it sanely over lunch and dinner a few times, got the assistance of the County Clerks office with necessary paperwork, filled it out together, sat if front of the judge for 15 min, paid court costs, and went out for lunch after. This sounds unique, and I know most divorce situations don't fit our profile, but it can work. The situations are variable and emotions are running all over the place. The County Clerks office was a pleasure to work with. The person we worked with made the comment: "If a couple is in agreement with everything that is involved in a divorce, there is no need for an attorney." My former wife and remain the best of friends.

[sincitymix]

Yes. I pay 4k per mo alimony and I have the kids AND she's remarried. Men get screwed.

hmm.. it may vary by state, but i thought if an ex wife gets remarried, the alimony stops... something about the new husband can provide for her and she no longer needs the support of the ex husband.

[MikeBiDude]

I have a different take on this. When my former wife and I decided to separate and then divorce, we both got our separate attorneys. We then sat down, looked at each and both decided it was nuts looking at spending that kind of money that we could take care of ourselves. However...we have no minor children to add to the mix...we both agreed to property distribution and other assets. We discussed it sanely over lunch and dinner a few times, got the assistance of the County Clerks office with necessary paperwork, filled it out together, sat if front of the judge for 15 min, paid court costs, and went out for lunch after. This sounds unique, and I know most divorce situations don't fit our profile, but it can work. The situations are variable and emotions are running all over the place. The County Clerks office was a pleasure to work with. The person we worked with made the comment: "If a couple is in agreement with everything that is involved in a divorce, there is no need for an attorney." My former wife and remain the best of friends.

After a similar experience 4 years ago (mutual mediation posted above) I'm happy to say my ex and I are still great friends as well. It can happen! Probably she and I are far better as friends than spouses.

[+ WmClarke]

I have a friend who just got divorced and they did it without lawyers. I was worried, but it was relatively quick and painless. It helps that he's a standup guy and took on most of their debt himself, but he's got the house--and I think the kids more than 50% of the time.

[Racketjock]

I have three brothers who live in different states (KS, NJ, and TX), all of whom have gotten divorces after 20+ years of marriage to women that decided they no longer wanted sex, intimacy, and be in a relationship. There were no issues with infidelity, children of minor age, or reported abuse and although all wives were college educated and had some jobs they didn't make the same income as my brothers. They all make about the same amount of money annually. My brother in NJ will have to pay his wife alimony for the rest of his life, regardless if she remarries. My brother in TX split everything 50/50, no alimony, but required to cover healthcare premiums for 3 years. My brother in KS had all bills and assets split 50/50, has to pay $9000/ month in alimony for 7 years, covered all healthcare premiums for those 7 years, fund an insurance policy payable to his ex-wife for the entire time, and was required to stipulate in his will should he die before the 7 years that she would get all that was due as a settlement to his estate. Not all divorces were amicable, took time, required lawyers, and varied based on the state in which they were filed. Agree with AdamSmith, get a lawyer in addition to the mediator to clearly understand what the rules are and help with navigation through the process.

[+ FreshFluff]

An aquantaince aged 56 got married in February for the first time. He obviously waited for the right woman. The guy remodeled and refurnished the entire house to her liking. A month ago she said the she was no longer in love with him. He thinks that it will be a quickie and cut and dry divorce. I'll keep you posted on this one. She's Russian and was using him to get into the USA, but he blindly could not see what she was up to.

 

Looks like someone fell for

Free Lunch! Arbitrage Opportunities in the Foreign Exchange Markets

 

Your friend sounds like a very decent man who must have had real hopes for this. I hope he wises up and gets an attorney who'll stop her from cleaning him out.

[whipped guy]

Looks like someone fell for

Free Lunch! Arbitrage Opportunities in the Foreign Exchange Markets

 

Your friend sounds like a very decent man who must have had real hopes for this. I hope he wises up and gets an attorney who'll stop her from cleaning him out.

FF he is really a good and trusting guy, the perfect type to fall for such a scheme. He has cared for family members unselfishly and finally when he had some time for himself thought that he had found the love of his lifelong dreams. Others who are closer to him than I am tried to warn him, but to no avail. I did meet the then fiancée at Christmas. She was gorgeous, but you know what they say about beauty...

 

One of his best friends is a summa cum laude Yale graduate who went through a very nasty divorce himself. He is trying to talk some sense into him regarding getting a lawyer. I hope he takes the advice. He did take the friend's advice about keeping the wedding festivities rather low key. So there is hope.

[klifhangar]

hmm.. it may vary by state, but i thought if an ex wife gets remarried, the alimony stops... something about the new husband can provide for her and she no longer needs the support of the ex husband.

It varies by state and Oregon is one of the worst in the US for men in divorce. Her remarriage is reason to bring her back to court to justify reducing alimony but it is no guarantee. I owe her to keep her in the lifestyle to which she had become accustomed. I sure as hell am NOT in the lifestyle that I had. A quote from Divorcenet.com

 

"Unlike most other states, in Oregon, the supported spouse’s remarriage is not legal grounds to automatically terminate alimony. To end alimony, the paying spouse must prove that the supported spouse’s remarriage substantially improved his or her financial situation. For example, if a wife receiving alimony gets remarried but can’t find a job and has the same or higher expenses as she did before getting married, a court is unlikely to terminate or reduce her alimony award."

 

When we got divorced, we had a 4000+ sf house in the country with a view, horses, cows, etc. I got the kids and I had to move out into an apartment with 6 kids and a farm dog. I had to drive out there whenever the horses needed hay etc. and she would do none of the work. It was and is ridiculous. Until the farm sold, I paid $7300 a month to keep her in that house.

 

I fought hard for the kids and that's all that mattered. Only 4% of dads in Oregon get custody and I was traveling a LOT at that time. I knew that they were better off with me and two court-appointed psychologists ultimately agreed.

 

At this point, she's getting 48k per year from me and is married to a dude that probably makes near 100k. BTW, she stole him from his wife and three kids. There is absolutely no reason that I should have to support them both.

[klifhangar]

My wife also waited until a 100k remodel was done. She also had already filed but didn't tell me until after Mother's Day ( I killed myself to make it special and spent a ton of money on her) and, of course, served me papers before father's day. She then tried to keep my kids from me on Father's day saying that she was going to take them to see her Dad. Oh fuckz no. I kept my kids on Father's Day.

 

At this point, only the 2 of 6 kids that are legally required to see her see her at all. The other 4 haven't spoken to her for years. She wasn't at our son's wedding and she doesn't see our grandson.

 

So really - I won.

[klifhangar]

Just shows your morals and how nice of a person you truly are.

 

You melt my heart

 

Likewise. Every time.

 

Marry me?

[klifhangar]

I have three brothers who live in different states (KS, NJ, and TX), all of whom have gotten divorces after 20+ years of marriage to women that decided they no longer wanted sex, intimacy, and be in a relationship. There were no issues with infidelity, children of minor age, or reported abuse and although all wives were college educated and had some jobs they didn't make the same income as my brothers. They all make about the same amount of money annually. My brother in NJ will have to pay his wife alimony for the rest of his life, regardless if she remarries. My brother in TX split everything 50/50, no alimony, but required to cover healthcare premiums for 3 years. My brother in KS had all bills and assets split 50/50, has to pay $9000/ month in alimony for 7 years, covered all healthcare premiums for those 7 years, fund an insurance policy payable to his ex-wife for the entire time, and was required to stipulate in his will should he die before the 7 years that she would get all that was due as a settlement to his estate. Not all divorces were amicable, took time, required lawyers, and varied based on the state in which they were filed. Agree with AdamSmith, get a lawyer in addition to the mediator to clearly understand what the rules are and help with navigation through the process.

 

 

That's interesting because I was told that Oregon and New Jersey are the two worst states in the US for men in divorce.

[mike carey]

We're luckier here in Australia, the family court is a federal court and there is a single set of rules for the whole country. Also alimony is not a thing, there is only child support, which is calculated on the income of the two parties. The law requires equally shared custody to be the starting point for deliberations, although it doesn't always end up that way, and there is still scope for lawyers to game the system. Matrimonial property is split at the time of the court ruling (and it includes de facto couples, not just married ones) and it's usually 50:50 including retirement savings, but the two people's income thereafter is their own issue, not their former partner's.

[+ WmClarke]

So really - I won.

Yes you did.