Looking for So. Cal Movers

[jackhammer91406]

Hey L.A. guys,

I am moving in a few weeks. Want to give the job to a local Gay owned company. There are a couple of them who advertise in Frontiers but would be interested to know if anyone has a recommendation.

thanks

[+ Lucky]

Be careful You can get just as ripped off by a gay mover as you can anybody else. I learned that the hard way.

Go for experience, reputation, and dependability before you go gay just out of pride. If you can match them up, great.

[jackhammer91406]

Lucky,

Thanks for the heads up. Good advice.

[+ deej]

Whatever you do, do not and I mean DO NOT consider a company called Load-Rock-N-Roll.

 

They advertise in the Gay Yellow Pages. It was a HORRIBLE experience and cost double their estimate, and we ended up doing the lion's share of the hauling.

[Justice]

Moving is never easy and the wrong moving company (gay or straight owned) can make the experience a nightmare. So I'm here to make the following public service announcement in the hope that it will go as smooth as possible for you.

 

Justice's Rules of Moving. (Specific details for your situation to follow)

 

Before ANYONE even THINKs of hiring a mover:

 

1) Call your local Better Business Bureau (BBB) and ask if they have any complaints about the movers that you may be considering.

 

2) When you call the BBB also ask if there is a State or local agency that regulates moves. It there is, then call them too and ask them if they have any complaints about the movers that you may be considering.

 

3) Anyone who violates rules 1 and 2 almost deserves what happens to them. (Just kidding! ;-))

 

Here's some specific information for Jackhammer.

 

1) Here a link to the website for the Los Angeles Area BBB. http://www.bbbsouthland.org/

 

Note: The BBB in New York charges a nominal fee, which is either billed to a credit card or a 1-900 number. Having to pay a fee annoying, but its better to be safe than sorry, IMHO.

 

2) The Public Utility Commission regulates movers in California. Here's a link to their website: http://www.cpuc.ca.gov/

 

 

Good luck with the move. And please keep us know how you make out.

[Flower]

>Hey L.A. guys,

>I am moving in a few weeks. Want to give the job to a local

>Gay owned company.

 

No matter how far or short the move is, nor how "trustworthy" or well-recommended the movers appear to be, get a BID IN WRITING!

 

In California the PUC regulates and they have to be within 10% of there bid--if you do not get a bid in writing, then I guarantee you will have problems all kinds of excuses for why the charge to unload the truck (cashier's check usually required) is so much more than the bid.

 

If you have a problem after getting a written bid, then the PUC can do something for you. As mentioned, it's a good idea to check out their web site--this is an industry fraught with corruption.

[Guest RetrdEscrt]

It's a nice idea to try and use a gay O&O business but if you are moving it might be advisable to go for an outfit who are professional especially if you stuff that is valuable or breakable or stuff that is high in sentimental value.

 

As someone who will also be moving later this year probably late spring if i can ever find the right house to move INTO.The main thing that i worry about is my stuff getting smashed to pieces during the move and i think that if you can afford to hire the best to do the job then you should do so whether they are a 'Gay' business or not.

[Guest RetrdEscrt]

DUH !!

 

Forgot to put this in the 1st message-Sorry its early and i haven't woken up properly.

 

I looked at a company called CNYX which specialises in moves from SoCal to NY but i would imagine move within CA i dont think its a gay company but you can call them on 888-680-7200 for a free estimate.

[jackhammer91406]

Thanks Guys for all your advice and research. Really appreciate the links as well.

[scott90746]

This might sound like a really sneaky trick, BUT it really worked VERY well for me last time I used a mover.

 

They required a cashier's check..Fine. I had my bank make the cashier's check payable to the mover AND me. When it came time (before the move was done) to give the check I did. Of course I did not counter-sign the check (which of course was required to cash it since it was made to them AND me). My stuff got to it's destination all jacked up. Since I knew I had only one form of real recourse, I called my bank and asked if the cashier's check had been cashed. They said yes it was cashed. I told them they made a mistake since it wasn't counter signed by me. The bank returned the check to the mover who called me. I said oh sorry I forgot to sign. They mailed me the check to sign, I took it to the bank and told them I didn't use it for the purpose intended and got my money back (100%)!

 

It's a dog eat dog world and you should protect yourself. If the move goes as planned, all you have to do is sign the check once they ask you to if it is is returned by the bank. Of all the times I've done this to protect myself, NO ONE has EVER noticed that the check needed to be signed by myself. So it is a good measure of protection!

[jackhammer91406]

RE: Rainbow update

 

Justice,

Thanks so much for the research of the links. I made a list of 4 GO&O moving companies listed in Frontiers and 3 Companies advertising in the str8 yellow pages in my area. 3 of the four GO&O are rated unsatisfactory at BBB. The fourth Gay owned company is not rated. Only 1 of the str8 companies is rated well at BBB, and in fact is

rated very satisfactory. This will probably drive ad rian nuts, but the company that is well rated (and one of the ones I will ask a bid from) is Nice Jewish Boy Moving. Thanks to you for the link info and to all who saved me a nightmare.

Will buy a drink to any of you who show up in NY to show my thanks. Local guys can collect here in L.A.

[bigguyinpasadena]

Boy Scott-you sound like a real piece of work!First you try to cheat an internet age verification site by looking to trade access codes,and now you a gloating over how you screwed over a moving company.

So when the guys come to break your kneecaps how smug will you be then?

[FrancoDiSantisxxx]

(800) STRVIN TWNKS

 

Just get a lot of jiffy pop corn, a bunch of bad porno tapes, a non-stop loop of "let's hear it for the boy" and all 20 something episodes of Queer As Folks.

 

You need to set aside two weeks to pack, four days to move, five weeks to unpack and you need to have plenty of fresh bottled water on tap, so to speak.

 

You also need to pack all glass, art, your lube, the dildos, and all your underwear yourself, or it will inadvertently 'disappear' or be damaged.

 

Packing? You mean you don't just shove everything into the van?

[Guest Ant415]

RE: Rainbow update

 

Hummm.... why does the moving industry have such a bad rep?? Are they worse than lawyers???

 

As someone who is gay...and used to work at a division of a major van line, hope I can add something.

 

If you are moving from LA to NY, doubt you will find O/O gay moving co. Most likely you will move with an agent of one of the major van lines... Allied, Atlas, United, etc. They have the fleet to move across country. To my knowledge there are not any gay owned van line agents. There may be, however, some gay-owned local movers that do local movers on an hourly basis. Local movers probably wont be much use in a cross country relo.

 

The above comment about the PUC is right on. Make sure you get a written and binding quote from the mover's rep. The only way to get a legitimate quote is to allow the rep to come for a visual estimate before the move. Be prepared for the final cost, invariably will be 10% more than the quote. I have never seen it come in less. The estimate is just that, but the final costs are based on weights. The weights are known after they load your goods onto the van.

 

You need to show the rep what EXACTLY is moving...pieces of furniture, boxes, and if you will pack boxes, or the movers. Vague rate requests such as "rate for typical two bedroom apartment" are meaningless. Also need to tell about conditions of the house at destination. Since the industry is so competitive, the tariffs are based on ideal access at both ends, and the final move being as quoted.... thus if they quoted based on 50 boxes and you end up with 60, the rate will change. A little change like a 4th floor walk-up in the lower east side of NYC will change the binding quote. As will adding a quick stop-off at your friend's house to drop off a sofa. Be sure to have your new house ready, as setting goods in storage will cost a fortune.

 

Many van lines have a tariff feature called TPG - True Price Guarantee. Ask them about it.

 

There are lots of unsavory players in the industry. Once they secure a move and have your goods, you cannot argue much, as your stuff is held hostage. But a lot of folks fail to provide a few details of their move, such as access issues, adding more items, changing dates, and the need for temp storage.

 

The major van lines are very competitive, and don't really cost much more than a do-it-yourself move with an UHaul. If you take quotes from a couple different carriers, show them the last written-binding quote. See if they will meet or beat. Most will quote based on a standardized tariff and give you a discount from that. You should get a 50-55% discount from the full tariff. Also keep in mind most of the moving industry has merged... Mayflower and United are the same... and Allied/Global/northAmerican are commonly owned.

[+ deej]

This story rings false, on many levels.

 

Movers generally ask for the money after the stuff arrives and is delivered, not when it's picked up. Even disreputable movers do this. And I can't imagine any bank going along with this scheme. Last I looked, once a bank cashes a cashier's check the money is gone and the check cannot be returned.

 

I've had to turn in cashier's checks that went unused for legitimate reasons. It involves the issuer endorsing the check, not the payee. Generally, checks made out to two parties require only one endorsement for deposit. So that part of the story rings false also.

 

It's a creative story, though.

[Justice]

There's an article from today's Philadelphia Inquirer that is right on topic for anyone considering a move. (It's also a good example of what can happen to anyone who violates Justice's Rules of Moving.) The article included the following links: http://www.movingscam.com/ and http://www.movingadvocateteam.com/

 

Here's a link to the article: http://www.philly.com/mld/inquirer/4966068.htm

and here's a copy of the article:

 

Posted on Fri, Jan. 17, 2003

 

To make a bad move, hire a rogue company

 

A growing number attract customers through the Web. Once your goods are on the truck, charges often soar.

By Mitch Lipka

Inquirer Staff Writer

 

BOB WILLIAMS / Inquirer Suburban Staff

 

Lori Burch Canorro of Lancaster County said her bill rose 411 percent above the estimate when she moved to Pennsylvania from Illinois two years ago. Complaints about rogue movers have been rising in recent years.

 

 

Rogue movers operating coast to coast, primarily marketing themselves on the Internet, are increasingly blending into the crowd of legitimate movers and luring unsuspecting consumers.

 

Their Web sites show moving trucks, happy customers, and supposed letters of recommendation. Come moving day, the picture changes dramatically.

 

When a rental truck rather than the one depicted on the Web site shows up, it is often the first sign that something is about to go seriously wrong.

 

Once household goods are on the truck, a $1,500 estimate can turn into a $5,000 demand. And if you do not pay, you do not get your things.

 

Lori Burch Canorro of Columbia, Lancaster County, for example, found that her bill rose 411 percent above the estimate when she moved to Pennsylvania from Illinois two years ago.

 

"I thought this was it, I'm never going to see my stuff again," she said.

 

Nearly 6,900 complaints were lodged with Better Business Bureaus against movers in 2001, up from 5,097 in 1999 and 2,970 in 1996. Federal officials logged an additional 4,000 in 2001. Consumer watchdogs say only 1 in 10 complaints actually gets lodged for the 1.5 million households moved each year.

 

It's not tough to open a moving company. All it takes is minimal liability insurance and an easily obtained interstate motor carrier permit.

 

Federal officials, who intend to create a publicly accessible complaint database, report receiving dozens of complaints a week. The primary places for consumers to learn of problem movers are Internet sites created by victims.

 

Problems with rogue movers have gotten the attention of the FBI, U.S. Postal Service, and state and federal regulators, although virtually no action has been taken so far.

 

One congressman who has been hearing the complaints for years plans to introduce a bill to help. U.S. Rep. Thomas E. Petri (R., Wis.), chairman of the subcommittee on Highways and Transit, is working on a bill allowing states a more active role in regulating interstate movers.

 

Law enforcement officials first began seeing the problem companies in the New York metropolitan area, South Florida and California. But as the number of bad movers and their victims began to grow, so did attention from lawmakers and law enforcement in those areas.

 

The result was the discovery by the movers that, if they conducted business across state lines, the moves fell under federal jurisdiction.

 

Since the Interstate Commerce Commission was disbanded in 1995, minimal federal resources have been allocated to consumer protection for those moving. Using that opening, rogue operators began expanding their operations from regional to national over the last three or four years.

 

"These folks are in this to rip people off," said David Longo, spokesman for the Federal Motor Carrier Safety Administration.

 

Despite thousands of complaints, law enforcement response has been muted. A two-year FBI investigation that has yet to deliver an arrest has frustrated consumer advocates. The motor-carrier agency focuses on safety, and does not have the staff to police movers.

 

At one time, the ICC had 50 investigators in its Philadelphia regional office alone. Now, three investigators with the motor-carrier agency scattered around the United States are responsible for looking into complaints nationwide, and they have additional responsibilities.

 

"They know how the game works," Longo said of the problem movers.

 

For online shoppers in particular, differentiating between legitimate movers and the aggressive minority that prey on consumers is difficult. Problem companies operate under a variety of names.

 

The industry is so contaminated that the U.S. Postal Service decided to exclude movers from the 68 million "Movers Guide" advertising packets distributed each year at the nation's 38,000 post offices.

 

"We found out that this industry is pretty much unregulated," Sue Brennan of the U.S. Postal Service in Washington said.

 

Canorro discovered just how out of control the industry is.

 

The Lancaster County woman called the Better Business Bureau in Chicago, where the movers she had hired claimed they were based. They weren't, which explained the lack of complaints against them there. They also claimed to be the agent of Bekins Co., a major national mover. They weren't.

 

"The people I talked to had been so nice," Canorro said. "I feel like an idiot, looking back on it."

 

For her move from Branson, Mo., Canorro hired Advanced Moving System, of Sunrise, Fla. The company, among the most complained about, heavily markets on the Internet and has been the subject of investigations in Florida, North Carolina and Wisconsin. Criminal charges were lodged against Advanced workers in North Carolina.

 

Canorro's move largely matched the circumstances in thousands of complaints. Victims tell nearly identical stories of believing they were paying one price, only to be presented with a monumentally higher bill once goods were loaded.

 

Her original quote of $1,644 swelled to $8,400.

 

Canorro's case was somewhat unusual in that she was able to interest local police. Police typically cite a lack of jurisdiction.

 

After several months of wrangling with Advanced, Canorro awaited delivery along with the Susquehanna Regional Police. Police charged her movers with theft by extortion, but later dropped the charges when the driver and helper cooperated and made statements against the company owner, Zion Rokah.

 

Rokah blames consumers, small-town attitudes, and small-town police.

 

"We move the stuff all the way to Pennsylvania. In Pennsylvania, they say it's stolen," Rokah said. "The police over there took the law into their hands. That's something they're not supposed to do."

 

He referred to police in Pennsylvania, North Carolina and Wisconsin - where his crews have been stopped by police - as xenophobic and racist.

 

Like Rokah, most movers in these cases are Israeli nationals. Law enforcement and regulatory officials said they were uncertain why Israelis dominated the dark side of the moving business.

 

Rokah said he knew what authorities could and could not do in a disputed move. Some have tried to cross the line, he said.

 

He also asserted that he had kept the Advanced name while competitors shuffled names every few months, making him an easier target. Rokah acknowledged he operated under other names but refused to disclose them. Internet registration and Florida incorporation records show they include Better Moving Services and Movers Directory, a Web site.

 

Federal motor-carrier safety officials fined Advanced Moving, Rokah's best-known company, $98,000 last summer for paperwork issues related to dealings with consumers. A handful of companies a year are fined, but federal officials acknowledge that few - if any - end up paying.

 

New Jersey and Pennsylvania officials said their power was limited in interstate moves.

 

"We just simply do not have the jurisdiction," said Genene Morris, spokeswoman for the New Jersey Division of Consumer Affairs.

 

New Jersey officials turned away 121 formal complaints against interstate movers from 2001 through fall 2002.

 

Pennsylvania does not keep the same statistics. Both states, however, have sued moving companies whose principal place of business is within their state borders.

 

Pennsylvania Assistant Attorney General Thomas Blessington said he had seen his share of devastated victims.

 

"There's real sad stories where people lost everything," he said. "The children's trophies, war medals. You name it."

 

Other customers pay the inflated price.

 

"When you're standing on the sidewalk with all the stuff you own on a truck, and they ask for another thousand dollars, they have a lot of leverage," he said.

 

Alida Nattress learned about leverage when she moved from New Jersey to California in 2001. She thought the price from America's Best Movers would be $1,095. On moving day, the movers from Majesty Moving & Storage of Plantation, Fla., (under the same ownership as America's Best), showed up, and the bill kept growing, she said.

 

Weeks of phone calls demanding cash followed.

 

"Most people cave in and pay the money, and I refused to do that," Nattress said. "We figured we'd just have to kiss our stuff goodbye."

 

The company's owner, Yair "Yanni" Malol, could not be reached for comment. In the past, he has disputed consumers' allegations, and has said that nearly every complaint of the dozens lodged against him had no foundation.

 

The motor-carrier safety administration fined his companies $71,000 last summer for problems in its dealings with consumers.

 

The agency has yet to comply with a formal Freedom of Information request made in early October to report which of his companies, if any, have paid their fines.

 

Nattress said Majesty finally relented, giving her the name of a nearby storage facility. She said she showed up to find a room full of goods belonging to several other families, along with her television, love seat and DVD player, all of which were destroyed.

 

Although Nattress estimated her loss at $100,000, she said she could not imagine paying Majesty. "I would not give them the money," she said. "They owed me money. I am not going to give in to them."

 

 

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Contact staff writer Mitch Lipka at 609-989-8990 or [email protected].

 

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[jackhammer91406]

Justice (and all who gave helpful info)

 

I read the post and was stunned to find the name American Best Moving listed in the article. After all the advice I received in these posts, I have carefully done my homework (I thought). I have taken a list of advertised movers both gay and str8. I have cross referenced with the data base of the CPUC (the governing body here in California). Surprisingly 2 of the best known local big name movers have had their Cal T license suspended for lack of insurance! I also checked every listing with the BBB. American Best Movers (who came and gave an outrageous bid yesterday. He was a nice and really hot guy) was not only current with the CPUC, but the BBB gave them a satisfactory rating!. Just goes to show. When checking the CPUC on other movers, I found the common occurance of having the actual CAL T license registered to someone other than the listed moving company. So all those were dropped from the list. As I mentioned in an earlier post, ALL of the GO&O companies advertising in Frontiers have numerous outstanding compaints, some going all the way back ten years.

The end result is out of a list of 12 movers that I listed, three were dropped by me for suspended CAL T licenses. 6 were dropped for unsatisfactory ratings with the BBB. That left three. Two have bid (including American Best) One is due Monday.

I had no idea this would be such a problem, filled with traps and pitfalls. I am moving three buildings away on the same street! Thanks to all of you guys for saving me many headaches!!

 

;-)

[Flower]

Generally, checks made out to two

>parties require only one endorsement for deposit.

 

While I agree the story is creative -- I mean who doesn't look at checks to see they require 2 signatures -- and you are right, once a cashiers check is cashed it's cashed and no recourse to bank

 

 

The bank, however, if this were a true story, should have refused payment for lack of the 2d endorsement--IF it read "Movers AND scott90746" -- it requires both endorsements. If it said "Movers OR scott90746," then either could endorse. If the bank wrongfully cashed due to only one of the two required endorsements, then they'd own scott90746 the money they wrongfully paid out--although his scam might be used as a defense in his action against the bank.

 

DEEJ -- Has there been a 'policy" decision made to prohibit changing font colors? If not, could you tell me how? I miss my green :-( and the old html method no longer works :-( x( ;(

[Flower]

I am moving three buildings away on the same

>street! Thanks to all of you guys for saving me many

>headaches!!

>

>;-)

>

For such a short move, have you thought of college kids or a college organization trying to earn money? There are a lot of young men out there willing to work for reasonable rates--seems like it's be a lot simpler and safer and faster. Just a thoght. :+

[Flower]

>Just a thoght. :+

...or thought, as the case may be

[Luv2play]

A number of years ago, I sold my house upon retirement and moved into a condo so I could travel more. This required a lot of downsizing so I gave a lot of stuff away. This required multiple small moves. I solved the problem by renting a truck myself and hiring two studs who were hustlers that I knew. They were happy to work for $20 an hour for jobs that only took a few hours to do. I fed 'em some beer too and since I live in a gay neighbourhood, I had three neighbours later ask me who the HOT movers were!!

[jackhammer91406]

Flower (and Luv2play)

Since this is a work related move, one of the conditions I made to the BOSS was that the company would move me. I have moved a few times in the past and I know it's a pain. I didn't want to go through the hassle. When I was younger I owned a van and believe me, every friend I had came to me to help them move. I am a strong guy, so they figured "strong guy...big van..natural" So I want someone to come in and pack everything, lift all heavy objects, take them down the stairs, load the truck, drive three doors down, lug everything up the twisting entry stairs and then up the narrow stairs to the unit, make the hard right turn into the unit and then put everything down where I tell them to. I'll stand back, pass out cold drinks, silently drool over the hotties and be done with it while the company pays the bill. If I do the move myself, I end up working for free , hiring the guys, supervising, leasing the truck, making sure nothing gets broken (since I won't have the insurance provided by professionals) and generally be cranky for three or four days. If any of you are local and want to help, hey cool. I am not out so, hiring local hustlers and having the neighbors drool, well, you get the idea. I have read somewhere that moving is one of the three most stressful things a human can do, the others being death of a family member and marriage I think. Just trying to reduce the stress level.

Appreciate the thoght (ha) tho Thanks

 

;-)

[+ deej]

>I am moving three buildings away on the same

>street!

 

I actually did that once. One of the most difficult parts was convincing movers I was serious. :9 Imagine the conversation:

 

Them: What size truck do we need?

Me: None. It'll be a shorter walk to carry it door to door.

 

My last cross-country move was company-reimbursed so I paid the movers to do all the packing. I'll never do it any other way again.

 

They sent one guy out at 8am the day before the move and he methodically wrapped and boxed everything in the place. He was done by 3:30, where it would have taken me several days.

 

Since you mentioned insurance, note that the "default" insurance sucks and they won't necessarily tell you about the coverage until afterwards. The default coverage is usually $.60/pound. So if they break a 10-pound lamp you get $6.00. (I found out the hard way.)

 

Inquire about insurance in advance.

[jackhammer91406]

RE: So. Cal Movers

 

Well Guys,

The company I hired, after taking into account all the good advice and input, turned out fine. The movers came on 1/30 to pack me. Two guys (one really hot kid that could bench press 280 and was a big dodger fan). The next day , three guys came to do the move. One of the guys was a huge muscle hunk from USC! Oh man. Everything was moved efficiently with very little breakage. The new place is two flights up so I was glad there were big guys to do the heavy lifting and it was fun to watch them. The price came in exactly at the bid and I have you guys to thanks for making me aware of what to look for and what not to do. And it was fun watching those kids in their tight t's. and shorts (the day of the move was the hottest Jaunary date on record)

Now if I can just get unpacked in time for the trip to NY for the Hooville gathering.... See all of you NY'ers in 10 days!

 

:9