Will it ever fly?

[Max]

Buy good companies on bad news?

 

That's the theory. Worked with BA in July 2013 when they had a Dreamliner fire.

[Max]

The Boeing 787 has become a PR nightmare for Boeing, I also think a financial catastrophe at the end of the day. Having just announced another delay yesterday after saying it was going to make a maiden flight by the end of this month. The Paris Air Show crowd must have known that Boeing Execs were bullshitting them...

 

Karma. I recall more than a few smug comments coming out of Boeing when Airbus had its trainwreck with the super-jumbo.

 

And here we are ten years later. The Dreamliner is now profitable for Boeing and Airbus has announced the end of the A380 program. Not saying I would have predicted these outcomes, but it is interesting.

[TruthBTold]

Boeing's safety analysis of 737 MAX flight control had crucial flaws: Seattle Times

Boeing Co's safety analysis of a new flight control system on 737 MAX jets had several crucial flaws, the Seattle Times reported on Sunday. Boeing's safety analysis of the flight control system called MCAS (Maneuvering Characteristics Augmentation System) understated the power of this system, the Seattle Times said, citing current and former engineers at the U.S. Federal Aviation Administration (FAA).

The FAA also did not delve into any detailed inquiries and followed a standard certification process on the MAX, the Seattle Times reported citing an FAA spokesman.

The FAA declined to comment on the Seattle Times report but referred to previous statements about the certification process. It has said the 737-MAX certification process followed the FAA's standard certification process.

The report also said both Boeing and the FAA were informed of the specifics of this story and were asked for responses 11 days ago, before the crash of an Ethiopian Airlines 737 MAX last Sunday that killed all 157 people on board. The same model flown by Lion Air crashed off the coast of Indonesia in October, killing all 189 on board.

Last Monday Boeing said it would deploy a software upgrade to the 737 MAX 8, a few hours after the FAA said it would mandate "design changes" in the aircraft by April.

A Boeing spokesman said 737 MAX was certified in accordance with the identical FAA requirements and processes that have governed certification of all previous new airplanes and derivatives. The spokesman said the FAA concluded that MCAS on 737 MAX met all certification and regulatory requirements.

 

https://www.yahoo.com/finance/news/boeings-safety-analysis-737-max-flight-control-had-164251214--finance.html

[+ quoththeraven]

Boeing's safety analysis of 737 MAX flight control had crucial flaws: Seattle Times

Boeing Co's safety analysis of a new flight control system on 737 MAX jets had several crucial flaws, the Seattle Times reported on Sunday. Boeing's safety analysis of the flight control system called MCAS (Maneuvering Characteristics Augmentation System) understated the power of this system, the Seattle Times said, citing current and former engineers at the U.S. Federal Aviation Administration (FAA).

The FAA also did not delve into any detailed inquiries and followed a standard certification process on the MAX, the Seattle Times reported citing an FAA spokesman.

The FAA declined to comment on the Seattle Times report but referred to previous statements about the certification process. It has said the 737-MAX certification process followed the FAA's standard certification process.

The report also said both Boeing and the FAA were informed of the specifics of this story and were asked for responses 11 days ago, before the crash of an Ethiopian Airlines 737 MAX last Sunday that killed all 157 people on board. The same model flown by Lion Air crashed off the coast of Indonesia in October, killing all 189 on board.

Last Monday Boeing said it would deploy a software upgrade to the 737 MAX 8, a few hours after the FAA said it would mandate "design changes" in the aircraft by April.

A Boeing spokesman said 737 MAX was certified in accordance with the identical FAA requirements and processes that have governed certification of all previous new airplanes and derivatives. The spokesman said the FAA concluded that MCAS on 737 MAX met all certification and regulatory requirements.

 

https://www.yahoo.com/finance/news/boeings-safety-analysis-737-max-flight-control-had-164251214--finance.html

More about that certification process, which involves Boeing, not the FAA, doing the certification, and which apparently completely failed to note the anti-stall software.

 

https://www.washingtonpost.com/investigations/how-the-faa-allows-jetmakers-to-self-certify-that-planes-meet-us-safety-requirements/2019/03/15/96d24d4a-46e6-11e9-90f0-0ccfeec87a61_story.html?utm_term=.dd1f73bfd743

[TruthBTold]

More about that certification process, which involves Boeing, not the FAA, doing the certification, and which apparently completely failed to note the anti-stall software.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/investigations/how-the-faa-allows-jetmakers-to-self-certify-that-planes-meet-us-safety-requirements/2019/03/15/96d24d4a-46e6-11e9-90f0-0ccfeec87a61_story.html?utm_term=.dd1f73bfd743

 

Well it helps if the CEO of the company of a plane that should be grounded speaks a lot with the President of the country. The company also appointed Nikki Haley (longtime sycophant) to the Board of Directors.

 

https://in.reuters.com/article/ethiopia-airlines-trump/ties-between-boeing-and-trump-run-deep-idINKBN1QT2VB

[+ glutes]

Will be a simple software fix, if nothing else to simply disable that system while sorting out issues. Wish I'd caught BA when stock was down at open yesterday. Still hopeful that the FAA will down them in US and present another buying opportunity.

 

Max, I'm shorting my BA stock.

 

"Flawed analysis, failed oversight: How Boeing, FAA certified the suspect 737 MAX flight control system"

 

https://www.seattletimes.com/business/boeing-aerospace/failed-certification-faa-missed-safety-issues-in-the-737-max-system-implicated-in-the-lion-air-crash/

Also, from the Wall Street Journal:

 

Prosecutors, Transportation Department Scrutinize Development of Boeing’s 737 MAX

 

Federal prosecutors and Department of Transportation officials are scrutinizing the development of Boeing Co.’s BA 1.52% 737 MAX jetliners, according to people familiar with the matter, unusual inquiries that come amid probes of regulators’ safety approvals of the new plane.

A grand jury in Washington, D.C., issued a broad subpoena dated March 11 to at least one person involved in the 737 MAX’s development, seeking related documents, including correspondence, emails and other messages, one of these people said. The subpoena, with a prosecutor from the Justice Department’s criminal division listed as a contact, sought documents to be handed over later this month.

Edited March 18, 2019 by Oaktown

[+ quoththeraven]

Well it helps if the CEO of the company of a plane that should be grounded speaks a lot with the President of the country. The company also appointed Nikki Haley (longtime sycophant) to the Board of Directors.

 

https://in.reuters.com/article/ethiopia-airlines-trump/ties-between-boeing-and-trump-run-deep-idINKBN1QT2VB

And the Acting Secretary of Defense (or has he been confirmed?) comes from Boeing.

[Max]

Max, I'm shorting my BA stock.

 

My crystal ball is worthless, so that may not be a bad strategy. But I'm getting closer to adding.

[mike carey]

It appears Lion Air had a similar incident the previous day in which the crew were able to shut down the MCAS.

https://www.canberratimes.com.au/business/companies/pilot-who-hitched-a-ride-saved-boeing-737-max-a-day-before-it-crashed-20190320-p515sq.html

(The article was sourced from Bloomberg.)

[Max]

It appears Lion Air had a similar incident the previous day in which the crew were able to shut down the MCAS.

https://www.canberratimes.com.au/business/companies/pilot-who-hitched-a-ride-saved-boeing-737-max-a-day-before-it-crashed-20190320-p515sq.html

(The article was sourced from Bloomberg.)

 

All pilots are trained (or at least I was) to deactivate runaway trim systems. Appears the system design was not ideal, but these accidents should not have happened.

[+ quoththeraven]

And the Acting Secretary of Defense (or has he been confirmed?) comes from Boeing.

More about him and an IG investigation as to whether he has inappropriately praised Boeing and slammed its competitors.

 

https://www.politico.com/story/2019/03/20/pentagon-investigating-shanahan-boeing-ties-1284597

[+ glutes]

“Oh, you wanted the planes that DON’T crash? That’s gonna cost extra.”

 

One of the major questions raised concerning Boeing’s 737 Max 8 is whether the MCAS (Maneuvering Characteristics Augmentation System) hardware installed on the plane to help prevent aircraft stalls could have malfunctioned and contributed to the loss of both Lion Air 610 last year and Ethiopian Airlines Flight 302 more recently. While that investigation is ongoing, new information indicates that Boeing sells upgrades to critical flight systems that might have improved their overall safety — but it sells them as value-added profit centers in much the same way you might add a stereo option to a car.

 

https://www.extremetech.com/extreme/288099-downed-787-max-8s-lacked-safety-features-boeing-only-sells-as-extras

[+ glutes]

“Oh, you wanted the planes that DON’T crash? That’s gonna cost extra.”

 

One of the major questions raised concerning Boeing’s 737 Max 8 is whether the MCAS (Maneuvering Characteristics Augmentation System) hardware installed on the plane to help prevent aircraft stalls could have malfunctioned and contributed to the loss of both Lion Air 610 last year and Ethiopian Airlines Flight 302 more recently. While that investigation is ongoing, new information indicates that Boeing sells upgrades to critical flight systems that might have improved their overall safety — but it sells them as value-added profit centers in much the same way you might add a stereo option to a car.

 

https://www.extremetech.com/extreme/288099-downed-787-max-8s-lacked-safety-features-boeing-only-sells-as-extras

[+ quoththeraven]

“Oh, you wanted the planes that DON’T crash? That’s gonna cost extra.”

 

One of the major questions raised concerning Boeing’s 737 Max 8 is whether the MCAS (Maneuvering Characteristics Augmentation System) hardware installed on the plane to help prevent aircraft stalls could have malfunctioned and contributed to the loss of both Lion Air 610 last year and Ethiopian Airlines Flight 302 more recently. While that investigation is ongoing, new information indicates that Boeing sells upgrades to critical flight systems that might have improved their overall safety — but it sells them as value-added profit centers in much the same way you might add a stereo option to a car.

 

https://www.extremetech.com/extreme/288099-downed-787-max-8s-lacked-safety-features-boeing-only-sells-as-extras

*headdesk* This is why groups like Public Citizen were founded.

[+ quoththeraven]

“Oh, you wanted the planes that DON’T crash? That’s gonna cost extra.”

 

One of the major questions raised concerning Boeing’s 737 Max 8 is whether the MCAS (Maneuvering Characteristics Augmentation System) hardware installed on the plane to help prevent aircraft stalls could have malfunctioned and contributed to the loss of both Lion Air 610 last year and Ethiopian Airlines Flight 302 more recently. While that investigation is ongoing, new information indicates that Boeing sells upgrades to critical flight systems that might have improved their overall safety — but it sells them as value-added profit centers in much the same way you might add a stereo option to a car.

 

https://www.extremetech.com/extreme/288099-downed-787-max-8s-lacked-safety-features-boeing-only-sells-as-extras

*headdesk* This is why groups like Public Citizen were founded.

[+ glutes]

Everywhere we look these days, from the college admissions scandals, Donald J. Trump's checkered business career, underscored by the testimony from his lawyer/fixer, and now the heartless treatment of the victims of Boeing's flawed airliner, greed is the driver of evil. If this is capitalism at work, give me socialism any day.

And put those responsible in prison.

 

JAKARTA, Indonesia — The families were still mourning relatives lost in the crash of Lion Air Flight 610 in Indonesia when they were crammed into a hotel conference room a few weeks after the crash. Sign this form, they were told by employees of the low-cost carrier, and they would receive 1.3 billion rupiah, or $91,600.

[+ quoththeraven]

More about him and an IG investigation as to whether he has inappropriately praised Boeing and slammed its competitors.

 

https://www.politico.com/story/2019/03/20/pentagon-investigating-shanahan-boeing-ties-1284597

This is delaying and possibly affecting whether he is nominated to be Secretary of Defense.

 

https://www.politico.com/amp/story/2019/03/22/shanahan-pentagon-nomination-boeing-1291109?__twitter_impression=true

[+ glutes]

Nothing to see here folks, keep moving along...

 

(CNN)A Boeing 737 Max 8 aircraft from the fleet that was grounded after two deadly crashes made an emergency landing in Florida on Tuesday.No passengers were aboard Southwest Airlines Flight 8701, which was being ferried from Orlando International Airport to Victorville, California, for short-term storage during the grounding, the airline said.

Just before 3 p.m. Tuesday, the two pilots aboard the flight reported "a performance issue with one of the engines shortly after takeoff," the airline said.

"The crew followed protocol and safely landed back at the airport."

[Max]

Nothing to see here folks, keep moving along...

 

 

(CNN)A Boeing 737 Max 8 aircraft from the fleet that was grounded after two deadly crashes made an emergency landing in Florida on Tuesday.No passengers were aboard Southwest Airlines Flight 8701, which was being ferried from Orlando International Airport to Victorville, California, for short-term storage during the grounding, the airline said.

https://www.cnn.com/2019/03/26/politics/boeing-737-max-hearing/index.html

Just before 3 p.m. Tuesday, the two pilots aboard the flight reported "a performance issue with one of the engines shortly after takeoff," the airline said.

"The crew followed protocol and safely landed back at the airport."

 

How was the engine performance issue related to MCAS?

[+ glutes]

How was the engine performance issue related to MCAS?

 

737Max, that was sorta the point of my post. Is the another issue going on with your name sake?

Edited March 27, 2019 by Oaktown

[mike carey]

How was the engine performance issue related to MCAS?

737Max, that was sorta the point of my post. Is the another issue going on with you name sake?

My understanding is that the MCAS affects the aircraft's attitude when sensors indicate that the attitude is making the aircraft unsafe. (The problem is that the sensors have been wrong, and instead of correcting a problem [that in fact didn't exist] it created a different, and catastrophic one.) The problem identified in this South West aeroplane was about engine function, and that is unrelated to the MCAS. From that perspective, your comment that there was nothing to see here was in fact accurate. It was unrelated to the factors that resulted in the 737 MAX fleet being grounded. Whether it turns out to be a systemic fault or just a one off incident remains to be seen.

[+ glutes]

From that perspective, your comment that there was nothing to see here was in fact accurate.

 

My comment maybe accurate, but was sarcastic.

[mike carey]

My comment maybe accurate, but was sarcastic.

Yep, I knew that, I should have said that its accuracy was perhaps ironic! Max seems more an expert than me, so I'll wait for him to chime in again.

[Max]

Yep, I knew that, I should have said that its accuracy was perhaps ironic! Max seems more an expert than me, so I'll wait for him to chime in again.

 

My point was only that airplanes of all types make diversions every day for one reason or another. That a MAX8 did so yesterday was in no way related to the MCAS issue and is of no significance at all.

[mike carey]

My point was only that airplanes of all types make diversions every day for one reason or another. That a MAX8 did so yesterday was in no way related to the MCAS issue and is of no significance at all.

I think that is what I was saying. But without expert knowledge on the subject.