Overnighter goes flat - it's a long one

[buttnovice]

To mark the passing of a significant event I hired my first overnighter. I had been forming a list of potentials for a while and seemed to hit it off with an east-coast guy during a visit to his town. We had a really great time, friendly, funny, easy to talk to, very passionate and affectionate and a firecracker in bed. . . with fun in the shower afterwards, too.

 

I approached him with the idea of meeting me in NYC. He was more than happy and quoted his fee. I phoned, chatted or e-mailed a few times, mostly to make sure he was into it and to let him know I was very nervous about this new experience. His replies were always charming and professional. At one point he did quote me a $300 higher fee because it was a holiday weekend, but later stood by his original quote.

 

He arrived at the hotel and we had some pleasant conversation and some drinks. He seemed very, very tired and I offered for him to go take a nap, several times. He declined. While in the living room there were no real fireworks, he barely sat next to me on the sofa. I would occasionaly touch his arm or something and it was never returned. We did play a little before going out to dinner when he was cold and wanted to get under the blanket.

 

We ended up going to a restaurant of his choice even after I outlined my preferences. He had a few more drinks with dinner and then we were trying to decided what to do next, it was getting late and just went back to the room. There he had another drink from the mini-bar ($14 with a mixer. . .NYC hotels!) Nothing happened,we watched some TV, he just sort of was there in the suite. I lead him into the bedroom and while on the bed he was a cold fish. Kept dozing off, turning his back to me. I was trying to get something from him when about 1 AM I just sat up and said this isn't working. He asked if I wanted him to leave and I said yes. I asked what I owed him and he said his full fee which I gave him.

 

As his was sleepily packing we talked about our previous visit and how this was nothing like before. I told him how he appeared very NOT into this or me. He said he had drunk too much and was very tired and would make things up to me in the am. Feeling awkward and like I had hurt HIS feelings I told him to stay. The next morning was a rerun of the night before. NOTHING At one point he just kind of rallied and perched his butt in the air and I fucked him for about 2 minutes, but it was very uninvolved, like a duty on his part. I jerked off while I played with his butt. We showered, separately and went to breakfast.

 

Forced conversation, returned to the room where he packed and primped and I read the paper. I stretched out on the bed hoping he would hurry and leave when he layed next to me and propped his head on my knees. I wanted nothing more than for him to leave and the silence was deafening.

 

Later we chatted and e-mailed. I told him how disappointed I was. I told him I felt cheap and unattractive by this actions towards me. We never once kissed. He admitted to being off and tired, and offered to make it up to me with an hour off the clock the next time I was to be in his town.

 

I thought about it and suggested in an e-mail that he make-up the overnighter and that I would be willing to pay all his travel expenses to meet wherever and whenever mutually convenient. 2 weeks later I chatted him and he said he was behind in his e-mail. A week later I called him and he was to call me back. That was 2 weeks ago. No response.

 

Gentlemen, what would you have done? I guess a deal is a deal and I did pay for his time. But pay for him to sleep in a very nice NYC hotel suite, meals and drinks, and then not even a "thank-you" for dinner at the restaurant of his choice? I feel I was used. And now I feel like this very nice young man is just a common whore.

 

I DON'T LIKE THE WAY I'M FEELING. Becoming less of a novice, one step at a time. . . .

 

BN

[Guest Tristan]

Sounds dreadful! I feel bad for you. I think he owes you more than a free hour. He should have been thankful for the free dinner and drinks. IMHO, you certainly didn't owe him his full fee for his time. (I'm sure some members will fire back at me for this statement.) I don't know what you paid for that overnight, but it must have been quite substantial. I also don't understand why you would want to see him again and pay him more, even with the one hour freebie. I'm skeptical that this was just a fluke for him.

 

Your next one has to be better. Just remember. There are good professional acting escorts out there who behave very differently.

 

Tristan

[Guest Utopia]

Write a review let others know what kind of guy this really is. Personally I would not have paid him his entire fee. Maybe I would have given him a 2 hour fee cause basically he had dinner with you and nothing more. Since you did pay his entire fee I felt you were 100% correct in requesting he make the overnight up to you not just an hour.

 

He sounds like a scam artist and they need to be exposed. That is what this site is all about .. write a review so we son't get burned by him.

[+ BenjaminNicholas]

We've got the same initials, thus i must respond

 

From an escort's viewpoint, let me apologize that you had such a crappy experience. Some escorts are great at making each time fresh, energetic and real, while others loose interest and just concentrate on the cash earned. You had the secondary case i presume.

 

Not good. Not acceptable. A total waste of money & your time.

 

Initially, i would write a formal review of this escort and let others know of his shabby treatment. IMO, if you feel anything less than elated after a meeting with an escort, you've been swindled and should really do better homework on who you choose. There are too many guys out there who hire escorts based on a pretty picture and mediocre reviews...

 

On the flipside, maybe this escort was truly having an off-evening. I won't try to discount the fact that this escort treated you the WRONG way though. I've had nights/weekends/weeks when i have had other things on my mind... Family matters, rising car insurance rates, the possibility of switching from Eros to Wet Platinum... but i've never let it affect the way i treat my guys. That would be unprofessional and a real pain in the ass. It would also garner an unsavory review.

 

As i said before, i would let others know of this escort. Don't totally chastise him, but do let people know that he wasn't up to snuff. As much as a bad review ultimately hurts, maybe it will teach this guy to clean up his act and keep others from throwing their money away.

 

 

Warmest Always,

 

 

 

Benjamin Nicholas

[CT Dick]

Clearly a rerun at this point would not be a good experience. You will always have the memory of the bad time and his lack or response.

 

You might have forgiven him if he apologized and offered, early on, to make up for the poor experience, but it is too late.

 

Now, the only course is to write a review. We deserve to know which escorts to avoid x( (and I expect that you will feel better for the posting.)

 

Dick

[chrismac]

Bad experience. I hate to hear something like that. I agree with everyone here - you need to write a review. You could basically just cut and paste your original post for the body of the review. It says it all.

 

Where the escort went wrong was in not agreeing to terminate the weekend early, and taking a much lowered fee for his time. It shouldn't have even been for the amount for one night.

 

I certainly wouldn't entertain the thought of seeing him again. True, we don't know all the factors involved, but as you state it, it was a ripoff.

[Guest ncm2169]

< switching from Eros to Wet Platinum >

 

What happened to Elbow Grease? }(

 

< a real pain in the ass >

 

Decisions, distractions, decisions, distractions. :+

[guyinsf]

I basically echo what everyone else has said. The guy acted unprofessionally. If he was that drunk or too tired or whatever, he should have at least admitted it and canceled the appointment. Yes, you would have been disappointed but perhaps you could have located someone else at the last minute and been more happy. The part of the encounter, as you describe it, that definitely smells of "scam" is that he actually didn't try to make it up to you in the morning. If he had given you a great time in the morning, you would have at least been partially satisfied with your overnighter.

 

The only question I had, in reading your description, was whether the conflict between you had gotten to be so "ugly" the night before that neither one of you wanted to be with the other in the morning. I say this because it doesn't sound like you really tried to get things going with him in the morning, either. Yes, I think that as the PAID professional he has the duty to initiate or at least encourage, but is it a possibility that you were so angry with him at that point that the date just wasn't salvagable?

 

I don't want to stray too far off your topic, but I've had many a great overnights with one particular escort. Sometimes I am tired by the time we get to bed and sometimes I haven't been particularly frisky because of that. Because I'm so comfortable with him, it doesn't necessarily seem like a bad thing to me if I fall asleep with him and don't have sex, even though I'm paying him. I'm glad that he knows that I really do want to have sex with him, though, and he WORKS to get my motor going (though, truthfully, it doesn't take much once we're kissing). Now that's how a professional escort should behave, in my opinion.

[VaHawk]

>Not good. Not acceptable. A total waste of money & your

>time.

 

Unfortunately, Benjamin, I believe almost all clients have been there and done that. I really don't understand why this poster would even consider seeing this escort again.

>

>Initially, i would write a formal review of this escort and

>let others know of his shabby treatment.

 

LOL! As if that would stop some clients, who insist on hiring an escort with bad reviews, and then come here and act all shocked and disappointed when their experience was the same.

 

>IMO, if you feel

>anything less than elated after a meeting with an escort,

>you've been swindled and should really do better homework on

>who you choose.

 

Well, I do believe the poster said he had been with the escort for an hourly session before (so HIGHLY recommended by the regular posters) so why place the onus on this poster for not doing his "homework"?

 

> As i said before, i would let others know of this escort.

>Don't totally chastise him, but do let people know that he

>wasn't up to snuff. As much as a bad review ultimately hurts,

>maybe it will teach this guy to clean up his act and keep

>others from throwing their money away.

 

Well, I think this escort should be "totally chastised", not because he wasn't up to snuff but because he should have accepted his situation and cancelled the appointment. And to insist on full payment is even more inexcusable. As you pointed out, some escorts can't sustain the energy/illusion/whatever for a second encounter with a client - I think that is evident in this case considering the amount of $14/shot booze the escort needed to interact with the client (assuming this escorts pathetic performance is an interaction). Clients don't pay big bucks to feel like crap, so why should this escort deserve anything but a total chastisement in any review? Any review of this escort, in this instance should come with a Big Red Flag and two thumbs down!

 

I think it is ridiculous that some escorts think they should be fully compensated and/or excused for nonperformance. This was an overnighter, the cheapest that cost in the high 3 digits and most 4 digits. And in return you get no affection, no conversation, no interaction and no sex, but poor little escort should be excused and forgiven and compensated anyway and God help us, let's not chastise him too harshly.

[+ BenjaminNicholas]

Hawk... Let's try not to throw the baby out with the bathwater~

 

You know full well that when i hear of an escort giving bad service that i am the first to call a spade a spade. I was simply trying to be somewhat objective in my response and not judge too harshly on what could have been a mishap, not a regularity.

 

Since i'm really not familiar with the escort, it's tough for me to make a true decision based on just getting one-side of the story. I am apt to believe that the said interaction happened as told though... Let's face it, with this fella being as cordial as he was to the escort, how the hell could the escort be anything but truly unprofessional & irresponsible? It's a real shitter when nice guys are paired up with hustlers.

 

 

BTW Hawk~ Nice followup. I love it when a guy gets a little rough

 

 

 

Warmest Always,

 

 

 

Benjamin Nicholas

[HooBoy]

Yes, plese send in a review....let me know its you and I'll put it on a fast track. I'm sorry you had a bad experience.

 

I do wish Deej or Totally Oz (two people I have spoken with about this) or even an escort would write a short essay about the importance of spelling out exactly what you want and what you expect when you set up your appointments. I see so many reviews where it is obvious lack of communication was the problem.

 

How many times have you seen, "he seemed to know exactly what I wanted?" I just wonder if that drives escorts crazy, trying to guess what this stranger really wants.

[Traveller]

A simple progression.

 

1. No kiss within 5 minutes, out the door.

2. Not fucked within an hour, out the door.

3. Too drunk after dinner, a bump.

4. Not pounded again, out the door.

5. Too tired after the second sesh, another bump.

6. Not plowed a third time, out the door.

7. Too wired at 6 am, ambien.

8. Not woken up with a cock up your ass, out the door.

 

If the guy can't follow these simple, and not very demanding, steps, why would you ask him back again?

 

Later.

 

PS. DickHo, this Foxx looks like he could be a go for the weekend. I've got a Splash guy for tomorrow night.

[VaHawk]

>Hawk... Let's try not to throw the baby out with the

>bathwater~

 

Well, I don't understand how I was doing that? I was not advocating that the escort should be totally chastised as an escort, but rather that his performance in this instance should be totally chastised if a review is submitted, and once again, not because he wasn't "up to snuff", but because he couldn't be professional enough to admit that he wasn't "up to snuff" and take the responsibility to cancel the appointment, rather than to be subpar and expect fully recompensed.

 

Yes I know your feelings on the subject and you know that you and I are in total agreement on this topic, but just like you I base my opinions only on what has been stated on the post, as one-sided or not that is all I can go on. I do believe were in like 99% agreement here?

 

>It's a real shitter when nice guys are paired

>up with hustlers.

 

Yep, all of life is a crap shoot.

 

>

>BTW Hawk~ Nice followup. I love it when a guy gets a little

>rough

 

Damn, does that mean I have to go back to your yahoo group and change my vote in your new poll???? :o

[marc anthony]

I want to emphasize something else

 

Most of the responses to your post are advice on what you should do about this past bad experience.

 

I just want to make sure that this doesn't impact your desires to do another overnight (a future experience from another guy).

 

Some people hire escorts for sex alone, and want a quick hour romp in bed, and that is satisfactory.

 

Others relish the companionship, the building of some relationship (even if it is a business one), and "romance" as it were.

 

Based on the things that bothered you about this overnight, you seem to be searching for the latter. That being the case, overnights and travel dates are absolutely the VERY BEST way to get them.

 

I cannot tell you how wonderful my extended dates have been with quality escorts. You know it is not real, but for that day(s) or week, it sure does feel right.

 

I am just hoping that this one bad experience does not deter you from trying it again. The dates I remember most are these long ones, and the escorts that are dearest to my heart are the ones who have shared them with me.

[OneFinger]

>...I do wish Deej or Totally Oz (two people I have spoken with about this) or even an escort would write a short essay about the importance of spelling out exactly what you want and what you expect when you set up your appointments. I see so many reviews where it is obvious lack of communication was the problem.

 

Well, I'm not Deej or Totally Oz but several escorts have complimented me on communicating expectations. Hope you don't mind my input.

 

I normally make initial contact by e-mail with a new escort whom I haven't previously seen. Once I find out if our schedules match, I follow-up with a VERY explicit e-mail. I make sure they understand my boundries (I'm not a bottom) and I tell them my expecations (i.e., "I want you to bottom for me, give and receive orally, tickle my ass with a feather duster, etc."). I also make sure they know I'm a poster on this site in both the Review and Message Center sections and provide them with my screen ID. I encourage them to read my past reviews and posts.

 

Here's what one escort recently wrote to me in response to my detailed e-mail.

 

"...Over the course of my engagements in the past 2 yrs, I have only run across several guys like you and I think we all look forward to having someone upfront and honest as you are."

 

I'm very sorry that the overnight session was a flop. Don't know if communication was a contributor to the problem. However, I agree with others that the escort appears to have been partially at fault. I encourage you to write an honest review with emphasis on what didn't work.

[TotallyOz]

Setting up a good encounter: For my Friend Hoo

 

Before I hire an escort, I always try to make clear my exact expectations. It is not often easy to do but it is possible. I try to be as clear as I can be as to my expectations before I see someone so I will get what I am looking for and the boy will have a good experience as well.

 

On an initial e-mail to someone, I will normally spell out several things. First, I tell them about myself and about what I enjoy doing. I am honest about myself as well. I am a big boy. I don’t feel that a boy spending an evening with me should not know this in advance. I usually spell out my age, weight, height and a little bit about my personality and what I am into sexually. After that, I tell them when I am looking to see them and tell them if they are interested to let me know.

 

If they respond, I will then write back to them with more detail. I don’t like to see someone for just an hour. I normally hire for overnights and want to make sure I get my money’s worth as well as make sure they don’t have a boring time. For example, when I first hired Ryan in Las Vegas, I told him exactly what I wanted in my second e-mail. It went something like this, “I want you to come to my hotel around 7PM and we will fool around. I would like to take you to see a show on the Las Vegas Strip and then dinner afterwards. I would then like to go back to the hotel and have sex again and you fall asleep with me and my boyfriend.” By the time he got the second e-mail he knew I wanted someone who was versatile and affectionate.

 

He agreed to see me and set a price. I never bargain with any escort because I feel that is unfair to them. I say either yes or not and leave it at that.

 

Before I am to arrive at our appointment, I e-mail again to make sure they are ready for me, remember what I am looking for during the course of the evening and give them my cell phone number. When I arrive at the hotel I stay at, I e-mail or call them again with the room number and the time we are to meet.

 

Let face it guys. Often times we are expect the guys we meet to remember an appointment made weeks in advance. If we don’t take the initiate to make sure the boys remember everything, it is our fault. And, believe it or not, most boys don’t keep their e-mails for weeks at a time and go back over them right before an appointment to make sure they remember what we want. I have run into very few situations where the boy I was seeing didn’t know exactly what I wanted for the night and made me unhappy. But, I am also very clear. If you want the money for an overnight, I expect certain things of you. If you don’t deliver, don’t expect me to. I have hired over 300 boys over the years for overnights, I have had only 2 bad experiences. I won’t go into detain on them, but it wasn’t for lack of communication.

 

On the night of the date, I try to make the escort feel at ease and make sure they know I am going to try to make them have a good experience. This can be done by being very nice and respectful of the boys.

 

If you are an asshole, no matter how good you want the experience to be, it may turn out different. I have seen too many boys get turned off by men because they were nasty to them or degrading to them than I have seen boys turned off because of the way someone looks. Most boys that I know can deal with someone who is overweight or older or bald or skinny or whatever you think your weakness in your body may be. But, they have a harder time dealing with someone who is nasty to them.

 

If you want a boy to be aggressive when you meet him, tell him that. Don’t expect him to read your mind. If you want him to look like the boy next door, tell them that as well. Make sure you are very clear with your expectations in advance and that your reiterate them and you will have a much better time.

 

Lastly, I always tip. I do this out of respect for what the boys do. They deserve it if they have meet your expectations. I also do it because if I want to see them again, I want them to remember me. I am not a wealthy man, but on an hour call, I may tip 40 bucks or on an overnight 100. For a weekend, I usually tip 300 or more. I have been with very few boys who don’t say thank you for the tip and really appreciate it.

 

I am a kisser and I love someone who is very oral and affectionate. I hate the smell of cigarette breath. I tell the boys all this in advance. I don’t mind if they smoke while we are together but if they do, I ask them to get some breath mints or a toothpaste before we being.

 

I didn’t really address all the don’t for the date and the things that are appropriate or inappropriate. But, this is just the way I set up an appointment and it has worked for me for 9 years. I hope this is helpful to someone.

[BuckyXTC]

Buttnovice:

 

I'm also sorry you had this bad experience. As I haven't hired any escorts for more than 4 hours at a time, I can't say I've such a bad experience. What I can speak about is repeat hiring, and how that sometimes turns out.

 

I've been with at least one escort, who blew my sox off the first time around, and was subsequently just ok on a repeat hire. The first time, very passionate and into things, the second time just pretty much going through the motions. I am generally quite generous in the tipping department with escorts, and when I got the flatline on the second meeting, I reflected my disappointment through paying the requested fee but no gratuity. I imagine he got the point. Not the way I like to do things, and while I suppose he could have had an off day, I actually think he lost interest in escorting and only cared about the money with little if any regard for "customer satisfaction" and repeat business. I pretty much decided that day that it was unlikely I'd be requiring his services again.

 

Then there are the escorts I've hired once who I can hardly wait to see again. Jason Carter of Dallas comes to mind. The day I was with Jason I was not in the best frame of mind because of a rough week of work, but I came away from the meeting feeling energized and amazed. Jason took charge of things and I'm pretty much counting the days to his return to my locale in a few months. From personal experience, if I chose to hire for an overnight, he'd definitely be one of my top picks.

 

Then, there are those whom I haven't met but would clearly expect to provide a good time, based purely on their reputation from people here I trust. In that regard, Benjamin Nicholas would be my first choice, due to my personal tastes, his killer looks and soulful personhood. I haven't forgotten how kind and supportive Benjamin was when I experienced a personal loss, and our only contact up to that point was through the message center here.

 

Best wishes to you, Buttnovice, and here's hoping your future experiences will be more positiive. I regret you paid the guy the full fee, and I'd be reluctant to go for a second round with this guy. Sounds like it would probably be more of the same. He got what he wanted, so it's doubtful he's really invested in making up for things, unless his business drops off and he's desperate to recoup customers.

[VaHawk]

GOD!! This thread is screaming for some reality!! Where is doug69????

 

All the info about communications and expectations, etc. being fully stated upfront is something I am 100% in agreement with and also follow. But unless, I totally missed something, this was an overnight booking based on a previous short term engagement and was fully communicated.

 

Based only on the facts as presented by the poster, I see the escort as totally at fault. Using these facts, how can anyone say the escort was only partially to blame? He agreed to an overnight with a previous client and whether that client was interested in conversation, companionship or just sex, from the posting he failed to deliver on all accounts, so why is it even remotely debatable that in this instance, regardless of his personal situation, that the escort failed to deliver as promised?

 

To expect an escort to not have an off day, is unrealistic, but to condone him following thru on an overnight in that situtation and not performing as a professional and to leave the client feeling like "crap" and still insisting on full recompensation, is even more unrealistic. Do I hear the word doormat, anyone?

[OneFinger]

>...Based only on the facts as presented by the poster, I see the escort as totally at fault. Using these facts, how can anyone say the escort was only partially to blame?

 

You've answered your own question. The only "facts" we have were provided by the poster. They are 100% accurate from his point-of-view but they haven't been confirmed by the escort who may have seen things differently.

 

ASSUMING that the client's expectations were clearly communicated, the escort is totally at fault. But, I don't want to jump the gun and blast the escort without trying to listen to his side of things. It's like a partially filled glass -- is it half full or half empty? Both answers are "correct" depending upon circumstances and perspective.

[BgMstr4u]

It is true that only one side of this experience has been given. But I weigh in with those who hold the escort responsible. These two had met before, so the escort knew his client's person and expectations. The client was laying out a major chunk of change for an enjoyable experience which featured the escort as the centerpiece. If the escort was not prepared to give what the client expected, he should not have agreed to the engagement.

 

This is show biz. The escort is the star of this little production. Remember Ethel Merman in "Annie Get Your Gun"? "There's no people like show people, They smile when they are low." Get with it or get out. If the play is dead in the water, the escort should be booed off the stage. Where does anyone invited out to such an experience get off by being so rude and disengaged -- let alone someone who is being paid big bucks to be charming, sexy, interactive and energizing to his client? Please.

 

How to handle this? Escorts are in the business of making their clients happy. If it starts badly, the client should immediately say what he feels is going on and give the escort a chance to restart his engine. If he can't or won't, show him the door, and pay exactly the fraction of the agreed fee for time elapsed, nothing more. Absolutely no tip, and certainly no prospect of a return engagement.

 

If the escort wants this to be an interactive date -- "I'm sorry, I'm not feeling well, I'm a little upset, my hair gel isn't working, etc.", and still wants to go forward with the client paying for all this, that changes the terms of the date. He should say something like, "I can't be an escort for you, but I would like to spend the rest of our time together", waive the fee altogether, and make the best of the rest of it. Nothing else is fair.

 

And by all means write it up. And be prepared for a response from the escort which burns his ass from here to kingdom come simply because the client wouldn't be a doormat for some two bit hustler who is not grownup enough to do an honest day's work for an honest day's pay.

[Will]

There's little to add to the good advice you've already got.

 

But: I URGE YOU TO WRITE A REVIEW!!!!

 

I also urge you to remember that your primary responsibility is to yourself. If you felt bad after this experience -- and only a brain-dead masochist wouldn't -- why should you run the risk of repeating it?

 

A review will not only raise a red flag for potential clients, it will make you feel better. And in this case that's more important than the warning. Middle-aged gay men who call themselves "novices" have had a hard time in the Department of Sex. Escorts should be the last people on earth to reinforce all the ways other people made us feel bad for our whole lives. Nuts to him.

[+ Axiom2001]

"You certainly didn't owe him his whole fee..." I'm in 100% agreement with you on this. After the client had taken the guy to dinner and had bought him that expensive drink and the escort being quite inactive-- hell no his full fee should not have been paid.

 

Two weeks ago I had a date in San Francisco with an escort who did not connect, I told him that I didn't want to continue and gave him half his fee once he had dressed; he accepted it, apologized, and left.

[langster]

BuckyXTC, glad to hear your comments on Jason in Dallas. Got the same response from Tony Ryan of Houston about him. I had told Ryan I may be going to Dallas in the near future when he was here in New Orleans with me a few weeks ago, check my review on Ryan. And all you guys out there looking for a great escort can't and won't go wrong with hiring Tony, what a great guy. Tony me and said he had just chatted with Jason in Dallas that I might be calling him and told Jason what a nice guy I am and what a great time he and I would have together. Looks like I'm going to Dallas!:+

[BuckyXTC]

>Looks like I'm going to Dallas!:+

 

Langster:

 

I'm jealous as hell! Guess I'll just have to count the days until Jason returns to Philly.

[Rick Munroe]

>>It's a real shitter when nice guys are paired

>>up with hustlers.

>

>Yep, all of life is a crap shoot.

 

Do we need to ask Hooboy to create a new Scatological Forum for the two of you? :+