TB drama...

[+ glutes]

Heck, I'd marry the guy too!

 

http://tbn0.google.com/images?q=tbn:eNOT-m2Ih1oC-M

[OneFinger]

Got to admit that I, too, find him rather attractive. But, there are several issues around this drama that I'd like to see answered.

 

1. Why did he intentionally try to sneak back into the country by flying to Canada and driving across the border? Doesn't that amount to reckless disregard and criminal negligence?

 

2. Why did the board guard ignore the warning on his computer that instructed him to detain the guy, put on a protective mask, and call the CDC? Is it enough that the guard is now doing administrative work? Shouldn't he be fired for not protecting our borders?

 

3. The guy was first diagnosed with TB in January. Why did it take so long to identify the strain and severity of the TB?

 

4. Knowing he had an infectious disease, did he inform his future wife? Did he decide to get married outside the USA because he would have been prohibited from getting a marriage license in most states?

 

IMHO this guy has some explaining to do. His legal background as an accident/injury lawyer may serve him well.

[+ glutes]

More explaining to do!

 

http://www.drudgereport.com/ta.jpg

 

 

The case of the US man who flew across the Atlantic and Europe while infected with a dangerous form of tuberculosis took a bizarre twist today when it emerged his father-in-law is a specialist on the infection.

 

The man, who sparked an international panic after becoming the first person to be isolated in compulsory quarantine by the US government since 1963, was named as Andrew Speaker, a 31-year-old personal injury lawyer from Atlanta.

 

It was also revealed that the man's father-in-law is Dr Robert Cooksey, a microbiologist at the US Center for Disease Control in Atlanta, who works in the division of tuberculosis elimination and conducts laboratory research into the disease. But in a statement issued by the CDC, Dr Cooksey denies there is any link between his work and his son-in-law's infection.

 

"As part of my job, I am regularly tested for TB. I do not have TB, nor have I ever had TB. My son-in-law's TB did not originate from myself or the CDC's labs, which operate under the highest levels of biosecurity," Dr Cooksey said.

 

http://www.buzzle.com/articles/139915.html

[+ purplekow]

>Got to admit that I, too, find him rather attractive. But,

>there are several issues around this drama that I'd like to

>see answered.

>

>1. Why did he intentionally try to sneak back into the country

>by flying to Canada and driving across the border? Doesn't

>that amount to reckless disregard and criminal negligence?

> He states that he was afraid that he would not get the care he needed in another country. Interestingly, his father in law is a well know researcher in TB. When questioned about his advice, the father in law stated that he gave him fatherly advice. That sounds a lot like get your well toned ass back to the US.

 

 

>2. Why did the board guard ignore the warning on his computer

>that instructed him to detain the guy, put on a protective

>mask, and call the CDC? Is it enough that the guard is now

>doing administrative work? Shouldn't he be fired for not

>protecting our borders?

 

His excuse, feeble as it is, is that the man did not appear to be ill. I would think career advancement in his case would include advancing out the door.

>

>3. The guy was first diagnosed with TB in January. Why did it

>take so long to identify the strain and severity of the TB?

 

TB is easily seen on special staining of sputum but it takes a very long time to grow and to have the sensitivities to the drugs tested. So though he may have been diagnosed in January, the drug resistance would not be know for at least 6 weeks. Chances are he was started on routine therapy which in this case, is ineffective.

>

>4. Knowing he had an infectious disease, did he inform his

>future wife? Did he decide to get married outside the USA

>because he would have been prohibited from getting a marriage

>license in most states?

 

His father in law was aware and he was not advised to stop the wedding. All states have discontinued blood tests for marriage license. NJ was one of the last to do so in the mid 90's. That blood testing was for syphilis. TB is not usually detected in the blood but in the sputum and it is not screen routinely.

>

>IMHO this guy has some explaining to do. His legal background

>as an accident/injury lawyer may serve him well.

>

>He could have civil suits should one of his fellow passengers develop TB of this strain. I am not sure this qualifies as a criminal act but there is an element of depraved indifference and he did try to circumvent the US customs by flying to Canada so there was premeditation.

[Samai139]

I drive to Montreal and return to the US,several times each year through the Champlain crossing(northern New York State/Quebec Prov), and I have a Nexus Pass---which means I have been investigated by both the US and Canadian governments and pose no security threat and promise NOT to violate the laws of carrying goods.

Having said all this, I am STILL stopped each time I enter the US, must produce both my US Passport and my Nexus Pass, answer a series of questions and twice have had my trunk inspected---perfunctorily, but still inspected. It amazes me that a single crossing official would have allowed Speaker to enter the US. Obviously he wasn't doing his job and perhaps is lying about the reasons for his actions. I suspect he either didn't read the warnings, and/or missed the man when he appeared at the border--it was Memorial Day Weekend and the lines were long and it could be a case of sheer laziness.

Should he be fired? Duhhhhh----no brainer IMHO

I just hope this case doesn't make crossing the border in the future more difficult than it already is. Getting back into the US can take a very long time at the wrong place, at the wrong hour.

[Luv2play]

Samai, your experience with the Nexus pass is instructive. It would appear that despite having the pass, you are treated as a casual visitor because of the frequency of your travel (ie. you don't cross the border often enough to qualfy as a frequent traveller). This raises the question of why someone would bother to get the pass unless he as intending to cross the border on a weekly or at least monthly basis. It probably isn't worth the hassle of getting the pass in cases like yours since your treatment is similar to mine and I have no pass. Also I have never had my trunk opened but then I have a VERY honest face!

[+ ArVaGuy]

The border agent claims he thought the advisory was "discretionary" and that the guy "looked healthy" so he ignores the protocols and let's him pass. Now the agent has been placed on administrative detail. His union is fighting any disciplinary action based on the latest news reports.

 

One question that has yet to be asked in this case comes to my mind. Just how did this idiot lawyer contract such a virulent strain of TB in the first place? He had to contract it from someone so he's not patient zero in this case.

 

What amount of domestic and international travel has this guy had in the last few weeks or months that would have exposed him to TB? Maybe he contracted it from a stripper hired for his bachelor party? }(

[kjun]

Usually, I learn more on this site than on news programs, i.e. Harlow and now this TB story. You guys must be tuned in better than I am. But, then, I live in the South.

 

the Cajun

[Guest zipperzone]

>Obviously he wasn't doing his job and perhaps

>is lying about the reasons for his actions.

 

He probably is. We all know the TB carrier is a cutie. So maybe he winked at the border official or was showing a nice "package". Who would question such a hot number.

 

On a more serious note, two things come to mind.

 

(1) As he was a returning US citizen, were the border guard's instructions to detain him or refuse him entry. If it was the latter, what did they expect to do with him? Dump him back in Canada who had nothing to do with the whole mess?

 

(2) I presume if he was driving across the border, it was in a rental car. I'm not sure of my ground here but I would not have thought it possible to rent a Canadian registered car in Canada and then drop it off in the US. How would this work as far as the rental company is concerned?

[+ glutes]

This guy is starting to strike me as a creep:

 

"Speaker said he never thought he was sick enough to infect others. He felt fine two weeks ago, walking around, jogging and trying cases as usual. He told Sawyer he had a tape recording of a meeting with health officials that he said would confirm his view that it was OK to travel in his condition."

[Luv2play]

Just how did this idiot lawyer contract such a virulent

>strain of TB in the first place? He had to contract it from

>someone so he's not patient zero in this case.

>

>What amount of domestic and international travel has this guy

>had in the last few weeks or months that would have exposed

>him to TB?

 

Your comments and questions betray a certain ignorance about several issues. You ask how he acquired TB? He obviously was in close contact with someone who carried this variant of the disease, which is most prevalent in Africa but probably exists in Eastern Europe as well. We are told this guy was a jet-setter and travelled extensively on many continents over the last number of years.

 

He is obviously an experienced traveller, just from the way he organized his honeymoon, and how he reacted to the news he received in Rome that he had the worst form of TB. What did he do? He immediately scheduled flights through third countries to return to the US from an overland port. He also bought air tickets direct from Italy to the US for a future period that he had no intention of using to throw off the authorities from his trail. This guy was cunning and deceptive!

 

As for your point about patient zero, you should recall that this was a Canadian airline host who travelled extensively as a result of his work. He was gay and was exposed to HIV in a third world country, probably in Africa, and spread it through his promiscuous lifestyle and extensive travel. Of course, at that time no-one was aware of what the virus was or was capable of doing, including him.

 

In a sense, if Andrew Speaker picked up his TB in Africa or eastern Europe, he is just like patient zero. That is because he is the vector that can transmit the disease quickly and efficiently through his lifestyle and personal proclivities. I find it somewhat disingenous that he claims he did not consider himself a threat to others, given his relationship to his father-in-law who works at the CDC in Atlanta on tuberculosis issues.

 

IMO, he evidently values his own personal pleasures and indulgences above any concern for the possible harm he might be causing others. And this guy is a personal injury lawyer, let us not forget! And his father tried to excuse his behaviour by blaming the media. If it wasn't for the media, his inconsiderate son wouldn't have been exposed in the way he was. x(

[Luv2play]

>(1) As he was a returning US citizen, were the border guard's

>instructions to detain him or refuse him entry. If it was the

>latter, what did they expect to do with him? Dump him back in

>Canada who had nothing to do with the whole mess?

 

We are told that because his passport had been red-flagged, the border agent, when he received the warning on scanning his passport, was supposed to restrain the traveller, don protective gear and call his superiors pronto.

>

>(2) I presume if he was driving across the border, it was in

>a rental car. I'm not sure of my ground here but I would not

>have thought it possible to rent a Canadian registered car in

>Canada and then drop it off in the US. How would this work as

>far as the rental company is concerned?

 

Car rental companies will rent you a car on either side of the Canada-Us border and drop it off in the other country, usually with a drop-off charge. Hertz, Budget and all the other companies operate in both countries and there are no problems driving their cars in either direction.

[Samai139]

Luv2--

I assume you were joking about YOUR honest face, as opposed to mine----granted I have a beard, and a dark complexion, but otherwise should not arouse suspicion ))

Seriously, I applied for the Nexus Pass when I was traveling to Canada both Quebec and Ontario. I was told then that the Nexus Pass would be good for both border crossings, and that is now true. The Niagara Falls crossing is notoriously slow for re-entering the US. But I have also seen very, very long lines at Champlain also. So I invested the $50 and the time involved in applying for the Pass to hopefully speed up the process. When I was interviewed for the Pass, I was candid about how often I crossed---not weekly, monthly, etc, and was told that that made no difference. I am also aware that even though you have the Nexus Pass, you are still subject to inspections---there are no guarantees that you will not be searched and I can live with that. As far as you never having to "pop" your trunk---if you cross often enough, you will be, just wait ))

[+ ArVaGuy]

>Your comments and questions betray a certain ignorance about

>several issues.

 

I am going to assume that your comment here was a poor choice of words and you were not intending to insult me. If they were, then I am perfectly willing to move this portion of the discussion off line since I’d rather refrain from ungentlemanly discussions in this regard. }( :-)

 

You ask how he acquired TB? He obviously was

>in close contact with someone who carried this variant of the

>disease, which is most prevalent in Africa but probably exists

>in Eastern Europe as well. We are told this guy was a

>jet-setter and travelled extensively on many continents over

>the last number of years.

>

 

I am well aware of how TB is transmitted and fully understand that he was a well-traveled individual. My question was meant to imply that thus far it has not been reported as to where his point of infection occurred. It’s noted that he was overseas several weeks prior to his seeking medical treatment. However, he did not necessarily contract this disease overseas. It’s just as likely that he could have contracted here through someone he came in close contact with. It has been reported by the Associated Press that he and his wife intended to spend up to 5 weeks on travel in Vietnam and Southern Asia later this summer so it’s a good thing he’s been placed in isolation.

 

>He is obviously an experienced traveller, just from the way he

>organized his honeymoon, and how he reacted to the news he

>received in Rome that he had the worst form of TB. What did he

>do? He immediately scheduled flights through third countries

>to return to the US from an overland port. He also bought air

>tickets direct from Italy to the US for a future period that

>he had no intention of using to throw off the authorities from

>his trail. This guy was cunning and deceptive!

 

Yes, he’s very cunning and deceptive obviously he’s a lawyer for good reason. Last time I checked Italy was not a third world country. His alleged fear of not receiving good treatment in an Italian hospital is, IMHO, a huge load of BS. Furthermore, his protestations that the CDC and/or his doctors did not tell him he should not travel do not ring true to me.

 

I’d say he’s behaving exactly like a trial lawyer by tossing up every conceivable excuse for his behavior in the hope that one sticks. Well it’s pretty clear not many people are buying what he’s trying to sell. In the end he does his case no good by appearing in the media seeking to justify his actions. Had I been his lawyer I would have advised him to keep his mouth shut and start hiding assets from future lawsuits.

 

>As for your point about patient zero, you should recall that

>this was a Canadian airline host who travelled extensively as

>a result of his work. He was gay and was exposed to HIV in a

>third world country, probably in Africa, and spread it through

>his promiscuous lifestyle and extensive travel. Of course, at

>that time no-one was aware of what the virus was or was

>capable of doing, including him.

 

>In a sense, if Andrew Speaker picked up his TB in Africa or

>eastern Europe, he is just like patient zero. That is because

>he is the vector that can transmit the disease quickly and

>efficiently through his lifestyle and personal proclivities. I

>find it somewhat disingenous that he claims he did not

>consider himself a threat to others, given his relationship to

>his father-in-law who works at the CDC in Atlanta on

>tuberculosis issues.

 

Granted, this guy seems to exhibit many of the attitudes of Gaetan Dugas in his reckless disregard for the safety of others. But at this time no actual infections have been traced directly to him – yet. However, there are going to be more than a few hundred people sweating medical tests for weeks to come.

>

>IMO, he evidently values his own personal pleasures and

>indulgences above any concern for the possible harm he might

>be causing others. And this guy is a personal injury lawyer,

>let us not forget! And his father tried to excuse his

>behaviour by blaming the media. If it wasn't for the media,

>his inconsiderate son wouldn't have been exposed in the way he

>was. x(

 

Actually Speaker is not that different from any of the gay men who are positive and still choose to engage unprotected sex without regard to their partner. I cannot help but notice the prevalence of bareback videos and dare I say - the porn stars who appear in them, are escorts, and are reviewed on this site and others. My how the attitudes of our own community have changed in just a couple of decades about the risk of exposure to HIV to ourselves and others.

 

IMO this young man deserves whatever punishment he gets whether it be in the media, the court of public opinion, or an actual court of law.

[+ Gar1eth]

Whatever he knew and whenever he knew it, even if he had stayed in the US of A to begin with, he would still be quarantined now. The quarantine is not a punishment for leaving. It's because the authorities don't want this strain of TB to spread.

 

Usually TB patients are told that they can't be in the public until they are proved to be non-infectious without wearing a mask. I know where I live the county health deaprtment tracks TB cases and goes over the guidelines.

 

So he most likely ignored whatever they told him about keeping himself out of the public. It is also probably true that he could have been told that he was not very liable to be infectious if the number of organisms in his sputum was low. Plus it can take a month or more to find out the antibiotic susceptibilities of the TB germ.

 

 

I have to say though that once I had disobeyed guidelines--and was outside the country and if I discovered at that point that I had highly resistant TB, I probably would have tried to get back to the US of A for treatment also.

 

Gman

[Guest zipperzone]

>I have to say though that once I had disobeyed guidelines--and

>was outside the country and if I discovered at that point that

>I had highly resistant TB, I probably would have tried to get

>back to the US of A for treatment also.

 

Could it be that he had a health plan that covered his expenses in the US but would not have covered them for extended isolation in Italy?

[Luv2play]

My impression is that this guy was ordered into quarantine because of his behaviour, namely flouting the advice of the CDC not to travel on commercial aircraft. We are told that there have been other TB cases like his in the US in the last number of years and yet these people were not ordered into involuntary quarantine since Speakers is the first such case in over 40 years.

 

The fact that this guy is a lawyer is going to work against him, especially since he is what is known as an "ambulance chaser", i.e. a civil torts lawyer. He of all people should have appreciated the advice he was receiving from CDC no matter how it was couched.

 

He is lucky that at least he chose to fly back to the US through Canada in that Canadians are not a litigous people. On the other hand, he was on that Airfrance flight out of Atlanta and that was packed with Americans, who will sue at the drop of a hat, particularly when they can go against someone with some assets. At least he will appreciate the irony of his position!

[AdamSmith]

>All states have discontinued blood tests for marriage

>license. NJ was one of the last to do so in the mid 90's.

>That blood testing was for syphilis.

 

Off the main point, but just to say: not so. Massachusetts still requires the syphilis blood test before issuing a marriage license -- for straight and gay couples alike.

[Guest ReturnOfS]

I'm sure that people in the Whitehouse would love to shake Speaker's hand. This whole TB scare is distracting people from whats happening in the Justice Department, the Iraq war, and all of the other messes os the administration.

 

 

Isn't it amazing that with all of these security efforts that the wrong people in up on no-fly lists and that you almost have to get strip searched to get on a plane nowadays, yet this guy on the no-fly list finds a way around the system.

[+ Gar1eth]

>>All states have discontinued blood tests for marriage

>>license. NJ was one of the last to do so in the mid 90's.

>>That blood testing was for syphilis.

>

>Off the main point, but just to say: not so. Massachusetts

>still requires the syphilis blood test before issuing a

>marriage license -- for straight and gay couples alike.

 

 

That's interesting. I was under the impression that all of the stats had stopped testing prior to issuing marriage licenses. Has Massachusetts always tested or did they reinstitute it with civil unions"

 

Gman

[Guest zipperzone]

>and that you almost

>have to get strip searched to get on a plane nowadays,

 

If only it were true - I'd be in the sky everyday.

Perhaps that could be offered as a perk in lieu of airmiles!

[Luv2play]

It's not really that surprising. This guy knew how to game the system. He's a lawyer, smarter than the types that man the borders earning , what, $35,000 compared to his $500,000 or so. Put a guy with at least two university degrees up against a highschool graduate and see who figures out the loopholes fastest. We have the same problem in Canada. Our much vaunted RCMP are mostly guys who are high school grads and when they encounter white collar criminals with MBA's, who are becoming more prevalent these days, they end up looking dumb or dumber. :-(

[Guest EWC]

The question that no one seems to have asked is "How dim is the woman who would marry a guy that would put hundreds of people across the world,including herself, at risk of a deadly disease?" Normally, one could excuse this sort of thing by assuming that denial is not just a river in Eqypt; however, her father has been working on deadly strains of TB for years. One must assume that her knowledge of the disease was at a much higher lever than that of the average Joe. All of their behavior is way beyond mere self centered stupidity. It is criminal.

[+ glutes]

He's still fuckable, and Kosher too?

 

http://i.cnn.net/cnn/2007/POLITICS/06/06/tb.borders/newt1.speaker2.ap.jpg

[Guest zipperzone]

Watched his interview with Larry King tonight.

 

There appears to be inconsistancies in his story and he is very careful about how he answers questions (and some questions he just sidesteps altogether) In my gut I don't think I fully trust him.

 

On the other hand, I think it is possible that some of the health authorities are trying to cover their ass and are also being less than truthful.

 

All said - I'd still do him although what I have in mind might be slightly difficult to perform if I had to wear that stupid looking facial mask.