Massageislife

I'm afraid the earlier sarcastic remarks redirected this thread to being one about specific experiences or masseurs we liked. I think the question is "What is it in general about m4m massage that we love?"

I love getting to pick a man I'm attracted to and, usually, he's caressing my body and often more than that in a short span of time. That's a fucking miracle. What's been important to me about massage, however, is forcing myself to relax and be touched. I enjoy handling men's bodies and get such pleasure from feeling that I've satisfied them that it's hard for me to just lie there and let him work on--and maybe even sometimes enjoy--me. But it's healthy to surrender oneself physically to another person. And my experience with m4m (and even "legit") massage has been so positive. In amost every massage I've ever had, it's moved me how earnestly the masseur has either worked to heal my body, to make me come, or both. I can say it's generally more reliable, in this respect, than experiences with men who spent time with my body without getting paid. Thank God for men who give themselves to this work. I can never thank them enough.

I think it will always be hard to resist going for some MT immediately, but I'm always glad when I'm patient and experience the unique pleasure of being attended to. Afterwards, there's usually plenty of time for that and more!

Hey, thanks for sharing. Agree that his photos would lead one to think there's more sensual or erotic elements...especially since he lists both options in massage style offered.

 

Sorry it was a let down!

Yeah, I would put it more strongly: not offering erotic elements after including "erotic" as one of his massage types and pornographic pictures is false advertising, a type of fraud.

I find it amusing that I occasionally will get PMs about someone I commented on many years ago. I don't know why anyone who is more interested in looks than massage skills would want a report from someone whose only interaction with said masseur was many moons ago.

 

At any rate, I don't get explicit in any of my responses, mostly because I've always believed that just because I had a certain experience with a guy doesn't mean everyone else will have that same experience. I don't want to put a masseur in a position of having to explicitly decline to do something with someone else that's well outside the normal expectations of an erotic massage just because he happened to do something while he was with me. It's up to a masseur to discuss with his potential clients what he has to offer.

 

So, I mostly offer general feedback about massage skills, looks, hygiene, and whether my expectations were met.

Maninsoma, thank you! Excellent advice. I'm working hard to be a good citizen of this community.

Also remember that your experiences with a masseur, may be exclusive to YOU.

 

Giving explicit details to the wrong person could result in some jerk with no manners, reaching out to the masseur, hoping on his table, and literally asking for the exact same thing you experienced, as if he’s ordering from the dollar menu, and then saying “you did this for xxx”....

 

Definitely get a feel for the person who is asking the questions, and ensure they aren’t a jerk with involuntary celibate tendencies, before sharing such info...

Monarchy, your comments take the crown!

Cristian will be in Minneapolis for a few days starting tomorrow. After reading comments above re not wearing pants, DIY HE, etc., thought I would note that his Rentmasseur ad lists only therapeutic massage. Should this be interpreted as YMMV?

My guess is that he only lists therapeutic to be discrete. Given my experience--and the price!--his massage is always erotic

Thank you for this thread. I posted a favoble comment about a masseur last week and then received a flood of questions about him in PMs. It was my first time for this happening, and all of a sudden I realized I wasn't comfortable with the kinds of questions I was getting: "Is he hung?" "Is he a top or bottom?", etc. I was a little torn because I understand PMing for more intimate information is an element of "citizenship" in this community, but the considerations in the comments above will be really useful going forward.

I had the same experience two years ago in Dallas.

Can you share more?

I saw him in the subway the other day! He looks just like his current pictures. The info about him on this site, however, is a whole forest of red flags!

90 minutes $200 base plus $50 for erotic time that includes oral performed by client.

Thanks!

His price for mutual touch/contact is out of my range, and I will not see him.

What did he quote you for that?

https://rentmen.eu/RobertRIO (note the escort is 2" shorter than the masseur, lol)

Phone number shows up as used by a masseuse (yes, female) in Hoboken.

One of the pics connects to a Brazilian model who was a candidate for Mr. Brazil in 2015 (so the pics is at least that old). Neither ad lists Portuguese.

One of the rentmen reviews complains he's using fake pics but the others are positive.

Thanks for the research. You're good!

This guy has been on my radar for years but I haven't tried. I'd love to hear more details about the quality of his massage skills from anyone else who's experienced his work. Thanks!

Going to him was a bit unusual for me, since I generally go for masseurs advertising erotic, but I wanted a good legit therapeutic massage, and his website looked professional. The massage, which lasted for over an hour was excellent. He's definitely trained.

He and CJ seem to have been dating and now not. When I reached out to CJ last year, he said he and "Anjrped," as he was calling himself then only massaged together. Anjrped replied the same thing. Beware of constant name changers!

So, sensual/erotic aspects involved?

Yes, there were

Dmitri- I truly appreciate your response. While I read all of the inane responses regarding his assumed masculinity, I just kept thinking: "Guys, address the op's thread or query: what kind of a masseur is Garic, and did you enjoy your time that you spent with him?" That "effete/effeminate" shit could linger, and what's the initial purpose!

I guess a masseur's gender performance is something that some men on this site want to hear about and factor into their decision-making about who to hire, but gender (not sexual)--like race and age--preferences are so linked to (basically they originate from) such hateful forces in our history that I try not to air any that I might have on this site. We all understand (right?) that men who are looking for sensual/erotic massages from other men are considered by many--by that fact alone--"effete/effeminate"?

They weren't.

 

IMO, it depends. Some MTs take their massage work seriously, and they enjoy when their talent is respected. Others, usually those with no accreditation, are more focused on sex. They're basically escorts who pretend to focus on some version of massage. Those who are focused on sex typically don't mind discussing expectations over a phone call or text. They often like to know what's going to happen so they can prepare, mentally and physically.

 

I don't like guessing games or forcing someone to read my mind. I like honesty and confidence. Ordinary HEs don't work for me anymore because they take too long. Mechanical HEs would leave me flaccid within seconds. It's far better for me to relieve the MT of any expectation or pressure to perform a specific act. With chemistry and the right positive attitude, some major, joyful stuff can happen. I find the organic experience to be far more stimulating than anything else.

 

That said, if sensual doesn't happen, even when I desired it, I don't care. I don't leave disappointed or think I was scammed as long as the massage was worth the time and effort. Chemistry has a lot do with connection, no matter what the ad or photos suggests. You can't force chemistry. I would never take that personally. It's either there or it isn't. No one is at fault.

I know that I could have maybe have avoided the couple of frustrating experiences of the sort I had with Max if I had asked more questions; it's just not part of how I want to interact with masseurs I haven't met. I guess I will have to swallow a few bad experiences (unless my brothers on this site give me some better heads-ups!).

I'm also with you on HE. The first time a masseur succeeded with one on me, I was surprised. I found a few since then that know (or care) what they're doing. Maybe because of this, I don't see HE as implicitly agreed to in an erotic massage, although a lot of us see HE as what differentiates a sensual from an erotic massage. I'm not sure how you're using the word, "sensual," in your post, but I do think some contact with my ass/asshole/dick, even just natural brushing against during the massage, is suggested by "erotic" (not by sensual). What is the difference between the two otherwise?

I'm actually happy with the variety of experiences I've had, almost all of them with masseurs who advertised (by price, by photos, by text, and by rate) erotic massage. Those experiences, however, have ranged wildly, from (at the low end) a masseur who kept his underwear on and didn't offer HE but was very open to my touch and treated all of me (including my ass and dick) as parts of my body that would have some role in the massage to (at the high end) one who almost immediately turned the session into a sexual encounter. All of these experiences fall into the range of what I consider "erotic," and I don't have any complaints, even though sometimes (maybe there's no such thing as perfect satisfaction) there was more or less "erotic" elements than I wanted going in. They were still all great and memorable experiences!

The "low end" I describe above, however, doesn't have anything to do with chemistry (even if the "higher" levels of eroticism do). If a masseur is not going to get naked or at least underwear, is going to avoid my private parts like the plague, and is going to disallow or tried to avoid MT, then he shouldn't be advertising erotic massage. It's not about reading my mind. I'm responding to what the masseur is saying will be involved in the massage. Non-scammy therapeutic masseurs advertise on masseurfinder only, don't post nude or shirtless photos, don't list "sensual/erotic" as one of their modalities, or don't charge the erotic rate. If a masseur really does offer different modalities at different rates, he should find a way to communicate this to the client. I don't care if a therapeutic masseur doesn't give me extras; in fact, comments on this site about hoping for free "extras" bugs me. Respect goes both ways! But I do care if I pay for advertised service, and I don't get it. I want the m4m massage experience to be, first of all legal (We're fucking adults, here!), but, while it's still got a semi-underground status, I want it to be--on both sides--as professional as possible.

I feel like I’ve seen him discussed before but can’t find anything. Anyone with experience?

 

https://www.masseurfinder.com/massage-therapists/6239/

Yeah, I feel like I've seen him discussed, but I can't find a thread. Here's his personal website: https://www.georgejamesspa.com/

I had a COMPLETE experience with George, starting with an excellent massage and moving on...

When does the “calm down” phase usually begin? Asking for a friend.

Speaking for myself, at the five year mark, it takes longer than five years!

Customers should feel uncomfortable asking for anything sexual since it is illegal. I also think it is very unrealistic to assume anything about a masseur and the service he offers simply by judging the photos in the ad or the price. There is no such thing as trusting the ad.

 

If you have the balls to ask about a particular expectation in advance (before ever meeting), always expect the MT to say YES. The MT is not motivated in any way to discourage a new customer appointment. It's far better to get the new person in, even for one time, then to say no to anything.

 

I would find suspect any customer who wishes to lock in details in advance of his appointment. I'm sorry to say this, but if you feel any need to insist on a particular action, like "touch my cock or my asshole," you're probably a fool for a customer or worse, something is off about you.

 

Every time I book an appointment with a HE massage therapist, I say in my communication, "I love a sensual man, but the massage is the most important element to me. I will arrive in your studio freshly showered, with no expectations." All I can say to readers is I have never been disappointed in the sensual department. I have had some mediocre massages, though.

 

I can say this from my spa experience, service providers don't like pushy, needy, demanding customers. They can feel and sense when a customer is desperate for something. People who enjoy giving massage tend to be very sensitive. If you drop the desperation and go with the flow of an organic experience, you're likely to experience the best results.

Hey, Roger, you quote me, but I'm not sure all your comments are directed at me. Maybe they are?

Anyway, I agree totally: given the (unjust) legal issues around m4m massage, I don't think it's good for the client or the masseur to discuss sexual matters in setting up an initial massage. That's why I never do it. I also agree that ads are not a sufficient way to assess whether a masseur is a good fit. That's why we're all on this site, right: to get additional information?

I like the way you write a masseur, but that for me would still feel too suggestive (and I wouldn't expect or hope for HE, if I used the word "sensual" explicitly). I am still holding onto the idea, which has generally served me very well, that between the information I glean on this site about a masseur and the way he advertises himself (erotic is indicated by price ($150/60 currently), pictures (shirtless/nude), and text (ADVERTISING EROTIC)) it should be clear what is expected. We're professionals here!

As for verbally asking for things during the massage (which I don't do) or coming across as needy or demanding, which I don't think I do, my point is exactly that: the purpose of the ad--which in the vast majority of my experiences have been accurate--is to indicate what a client can expect. One of the things I like about this site is that my brothers' actual experiences with specific masseurs add information (occasionally the kind that reveals the dishonesty of the ad) to what the masseurs are saying about themselves. On a larger level, I really value the discussion of what the ads themselves mean. There are lots of discussions on this site--all very valuable to me--about things like rates. People often write that an amount is too much for a therapeutic massage, and the top questions are almost always what elements are included in an erotic massage (since beyond nudity, some MT, and some dick/ass contact which should be (rightly) assumed as included, there is an endless range of things which cannot be expected but might occur). One of the chief ways I evaluate whether I will go to a masseur is his price. As I wrote above, I have recently gone to a masseur whose rate of $120/hr and whose ad (on masseurfinder only, with headshots only and without suggestive text) made me understand in advance that sensuality or eroticism would not be involved, and they weren't. I was satisifed and didn't push for or expect anything more. What I have been writing about are ads that falsely advertise erotic massage and, secondarily, about clients who seem to go to bat for masseurs, rather than simply add their positive impressions to the mix.

Guys - this all boils down to what most of us on this Forum have experiened and said and that is . . . YMMV. Plain and simple.

I find that a lot of people on the forum have very high/varying expectations of what a masseur should/shouldn't be providing at a particular price point. I do understand that it can be difficult at times to understand just what you may be getting, but I do also think that as three types of a massage are listed, that perhaps different services come with different rates. My main thing to say, is be upfront about what you are looking for and don't leave things to assumptions.

 

I've asked regarding the erotic part to certain masseurs and they have said, yes it does depend on chemistry, but at the same time, they are not escorts and the assumption that something very specific may happen isn't fair, unless it is discussed prior to the meeting.

 

I have been to Max on numerous occasions and have left satisfied on each and every one. He's very personable (perhaps this comes with seeing him over time) but I don't think it is fair to expect to just give someone a BJ because they are giving you a massage. Further, he runs two ads on two different sites, so unless you are specifically saying where you found said ad, and what you expect, I'm not sure the masseur owes you more than what you contacted them for, and that is a massage.

 

Regarding rates, I myself have been frustrated at high rates at times, but if i am not willing to pay a higher amount for a therapeutic massage, I move on.

NYCTwinkbod, I appreciate your message. I feel like this thread has value for evaluating whether or not to try Max, but for the issues it raises more generally as well. For what it's worth, I told Max I found his ad on rentmasseur. He did not ask me which type of massage I wanted. He did not undress, touch my ass or dick, or allow mutual touch (I didn't really try, since his body language discouraged it). I paid him the full rate for 90 minutes and a good tip. I didn't write about him negatively on this site until a thread popped up presenting a very different view of him than I had. A number of people have, indeed, described great experiences with him. Others have had negative experiences or have thrown out red flags, even if they were happy with the experience overall (Jasonmathison describes confirming nudity in advance that Max did not follow up on; aiekaryoko describes finding out that there is an upcharge for erotic). I'm curious what type of massage you receive from Max and if there is an upcharge. A thread describing multiple people's experiences is the kind of "YMMV" discussion (to quote Redwine) that is valuable in this forum. A multiplicity of opinions and experiences really helps!

What I'm saying shouldn't vary--and what I think we can support each other with--are our shared ideas of what we can expect from masseurs collectively or individually. To use Max (perhaps I should start a new thread, since this isn't about Max, really) as an example, I wish those who advocated for him would have disclosed that they, for example, asked for an erotic experience in advance and/or that he told them there was an upcharge for it. That would have helped me either make my experience with him better or avoid him. Information that flags good masseurs or warns us off of problematic ones is the central role of this site, right?

The larger thing I value on this site is the discussion, which is not always direct, of how we understand advertising terms like "sensual" and "erotic," what it means when masseurs have shirtless or nude photos, the difference between advertising sites (mostly rentmasseur and masseurfinder), and what rates suggest about the services provided. I've learned a lot from my years of massage, and I would like to use that knowledge to help others navigate the m4m massage world more successfully than I sometimes have, especially as a beginner.

As I always write, I don't feel comfortable (for myself or for them) being upfront about the details of what I expect from an erotic experience before I meet a masseur for the first time. I have almost always been successful in getting a basic erotic experience (both of us nude, basic organic mutual touch, some genital/anal contact) by identifying the fundamental markers in an ad (a price of $150/60 currently, shirtless or nude shots, and, of course, ADVERTISING EROTIC). If an ad has those things, the masseur is promising "more" than a massage; it's not that I feel they "owe" it to me. It's why I'm shocked by an experience like I had with Max, which was only therapeutic. I agree totally that a blowjob, in either direction, cannot be expected as basic erotic massage service, but more basic erotic things, like those I list above, don't have anything to do with chemistry. And it's simply false advertising to expect a customer to ask the different prices of listed services when a single price--one that is generally the price of an erotic massage--is listed.

I'll end with my massage experience from last night. I went for the second time and received an outstanding massage again from George (https://www.masseurfinder.com/massage-therapists/38637/). As his only ad is on masseurfinder, there are no topless photos of him, of course. He also does not use suggestive language in the text of his ad. Finally, his rate of $120/hr clearly communicates that it will be a therapeutic only massage. Now, I basically never go for therapeutic m4m massage (That's what legit spas are for) because I like a therapeutic and erotic mix, but I really needed a legit massage and he was so cute--and he IS so cute--that I went for it last month. Because I was nude and he is sexy as fuck, I experienced the massage as extremely sensual, but he wasn't nude, my hands had almost no contact with him, and he didn't touch my dick or my asshole. I didn't expect or try anything more because of the way he marketed himself. I would love to see him open up his services, but I'm never going to push it. He's been clear in the all the ways that I think he needs to be. I don't have unreasonable expectations from masseurs, and I'm not frustrated by high rates for therapeutic massage. I only dislike being scammed by masseurs advertising for erotic services and not following through.

i tried search but no results. here is like to his profile.

https://rentmasseur.com/RoberttNY

I couldn't either. Wow, he's cute!

I just perused written narratives at https://hide.me/en/proxy. You type in the preceding then when it comes up-- the web address and escort's name. This hottie has a few written narratives, all positive except for the most recent.

 

https://rentmen.eu/CjBlake

Hey, Axiom, I think I confused this thread. That comment was about this guy: https://rent.men/Hhermess

That's him, but don't let me discourage you. There's a lot of comments on him on this site, if you can track down his former names.

Thank you. I definitely like CJ. But in this case I was referring to Mmike

 

Gman

Gman, Sorry for not reading more carefully. Yeah, that guy is sexy beyond words, but the talk about him on this site is pretty bad.

I just saw the posts of @Massageslife and I quote above sentences that are unacceptable criticism without any grounding in fact or semantics. To suggest that I am being paid to write a review is downright insulting; to say that I am his advocate because I wrote a good review is downright stupid. And yes, we are here to provide our own opinions about our experiences. I had great sessions with Max/Johnsport,( and will have another one either tomorrow or Monday) and wrote about them enthusiastically because that is how I felt. If you did not have a good session with Max, it is your problem; spare your resentfulness.

Harry, one of the purposes of this site is for us, as a community, to give heads-ups to each other about our positive and negative experiences with masseurs. We do that for each other. Your comment "If you did not have a good session with Max, it is your problem" is woefully out of line with this sensibility. I feel for guys on this site who have been taken advantage of or treated shabbily by a masseur, and I participate in these discussions to do my part to reduce the incidence of such experiences.

As for my crack about "paid reviews," here are the "facts" that I was responding to:

1) 3 of the 6 reviews of Max on rentmasseur were written by you. Before I discovered this site, I depended on such reviews. I didn't notice that, in a few cases, many of the reviews were from a single poster, the purpose of which can only be to recruit customers for a masseur. It's likely that the masseur himself or a friend might be the source of such reviews. It is in fact the case that I looked at Max's reviews on rentmasseur before I booked him and didn't notice that half of them were from you. I had also reviewed the comments about Max on this site before I booked him, and although there were some red flags (including your own warning that Max might come across as cold, which he did), there were many positive comments, so I booked. Only after I later saw a thread praising Max did I decide to put in my two cents. At that point, it all came out in your and my exchange, which was collegial, that you had not only written half of Max's rentmasseur reviews but many of the positive comments on threads about him (n.b. the day after our exchange, a seventh, one-line 5-star review showed up on rentmasseur from "MartinMax"). I don't think multiple postings of favorable reviews is a proper use of this site or the review function on massage sites. I don't know why someone would do that except to act as an advocate for a masseur. If you meant otherwise, Harry, I wish you would consider this in the future. One rave review should be enough to let people know that you had a good experience with a masseur. I don't know your relationship to Max (look, this site is anonymous, so it's possible you ARE him; maybe I am?), but it's beside the point. We should add our individual experience with a masseur to the mix, positive and negative, and let our brothers here sort it out to make more informed decisions based on the whole of what is said.

2) My sentences, which you quote (and it's disingenuous to make a point quoting selectively as you have done), are an immediate response to EVdude's own response to your comment about Max. You quoted your own rentmasseur review of Max, and EVdude responded "you should go into business writing reviews for masseurs. Your description of Max reads almost like poetry! You sold me." In response, you replied, "I like your idea... I would get a free session from each masseur on masseur finder and rentmasseur and provide a thoughtful review." It's all on this thread. The context of my remark therefore was your own joking about getting free massages for posting positive reviews.

Best, Massage is life