Rentmen Donations/Fees Gone?

[hougalwizard]

I haven't been on any sites for about a month or so. When I signed onto Rentmen I noticed that not only has the "rentmen.com" option been replaced with just "rent.men" and "rentmen.eu". Furthermore, it looks like the information for fees/donations has been yanked? Have they had problems a la Rentboy or is there another alternative?

[rvwnsd]

There have been several threads about the redirect and the new practice of suppressing fee information. In fact, there was a notification about the redirect on rentmen.com's website.

[+ othermanc]

I just posted on the lounge forum that fee information appears only on the rentmen phone app. Try that.

[+ kov78]

I just posted on the lounge forum that fee information appears only on the rentmen phone app. Try that.

 

Well shit! I didn't know there was an app!!

[+ othermanc]

Yup. I always used my desktop or iPad, but one of my regular escorts informed me that the phone app was much better, including the prices escorts were advertising. "Ask an escort" if you want to know what's up, I guess.

[snogaholic]

you mean the prices are less on the phoneapp, or just that they exist (!)

[+ José Soplanucas]

Nothing in this thread suggests that you would receive a discount of any kind for using the RM app over the website. Pricing is set by the advertiser, not RM. The pricing being available on the RM app ( just a safari shell on the website ) is most likely just an oversight. We as advertisers are still unable to update the pricing and they may be out of date at anytime.

 

Wow. Another consequence of this messy and cowardly decision by Rentmen management. They need to fix that glitch right now.

[bostonman]

There is also a version of the app for windows, for use on a PC. Info to download the app is on the website. If you go to the rentmen.eu site, look for the icon on the bottom right. If you go to rent.men, the info will be in the stuff on the right hand side of the screen (scroll down a bit).

 

The ads on this app also include the escorts' rates.

 

Now, Kurtis may be right that this is a temporary oversight, but at least the rates exist for the time being.

[+ bashful]

Nothing in this thread suggests that you would receive a discount of any kind for using the RM app over the website. Pricing is set by the advertiser, not RM. The pricing being available on the RM app ( just a safari shell on the website ) is most likely just an oversight. We as advertisers are still unable to update the pricing and they may be out of date at anytime.

 

Sounds like there could be some potential for ill-will if a client sees those rates, doesn't question, and as good-byes are said, the provider says it's another rate, because RM app rates were out of date.

[coriolis888]

 

The pricing being available on the RM app ( just a safari shell on the website ) is most likely just an oversight. We as advertisers are still unable to update the pricing and they may be out of date at anytime.

 

 

Thanks for the update.

 

I wondered why some of the U.S. prices still show on the app but not the computer site.

 

Most good things comes to an end eventually.

[+ quoththeraven]

You're blaming the wrong party. Blame the political climate and existing laws that indiscriminately scapegoat sex work, force it to go through contortions like this, and fail to distinguish between consensual transactions between adults and trafficking.

 

That this is happening in the wake of Jeffrey Hurant's sentencing is probably not a coincidence either. It is especially telling that in his allocution he admitted to knowing that Rentboy's business model was illegal. Even if he said that to maximize his chance of getting a shorter sentence than the government wanted (getting no jail time was in my opinion not in the cards), it can be used as a precedent against owners of similar websites.

 

Sorry, while in certain instances escorting doesn't cross the legal line, which differs from state to state, in most instances payment for time, not acts is not a panacea. It's still unlikely to result in prosecution of clients, but all indications are that it will be increasingly difficult to find escorts as websites are either targeted for harassment and prosecution (Backpage) or become less useful as a result of efforts to insulate themselves from liability (Rentmen).

[marylander1940]

You're blaming the wrong party. Blame the political climate and existing laws that indiscriminately scapegoat sex work, force it to go through contortions like this, and fail to distinguish between consensual transactions between adults and trafficking.

 

That this is happening in the wake of Jeffrey Hurant's sentencing is probably not a coincidence either. It is especially telling that in his allocution he admitted to knowing that Rentboy's business model was illegal. Even if he said that to maximize his chance of getting a shorter sentence than the government wanted (getting no jail time was in my opinion not in the cards), it can be used as a precedent against owners of similar websites.

 

Sorry, while in certain instances escorting doesn't cross the legal line, which differs from state to state, in most instances payment for time, not acts is not a panacea. It's still unlikely to result in prosecution of clients, but all indications are that it will be increasingly difficult to find escorts as websites are either targeted for harassment and prosecution (Backpage) or become less useful as a result of efforts to insulate themselves from liability (Rentmen).

 

Wait till Jeff Sessions has to show something to his base... We're on top of the list

[coriolis888]

You're blaming the wrong party. Blame the political climate and existing laws that indiscriminately scapegoat sex work, force it to go through contortions like this, and fail to distinguish between consensual transactions between adults and trafficking.

 

That this is happening in the wake of Jeffrey Hurant's sentencing is probably not a coincidence either. It is especially telling that in his allocution he admitted to knowing that Rentboy's business model was illegal. Even if he said that to maximize his chance of getting a shorter sentence than the government wanted (getting no jail time was in my opinion not in the cards), it can be used as a precedent against owners of similar websites.

 

Sorry, while in certain instances escorting doesn't cross the legal line, which differs from state to state, in most instances payment for time, not acts is not a panacea. It's still unlikely to result in prosecution of clients, but all indications are that it will be increasingly difficult to find escorts as websites are either targeted for harassment and prosecution (Backpage) or become less useful as a result of efforts to insulate themselves from liability (Rentmen).

 

 

Do you have any recommendation that can be put into action?

 

Escort sites are closing and/or are being limited on what can be advertised. This now applies even to foreign based escorts sites.

 

If the escort site closures and advertising restrictions continue, escorts and clients just might return the streets for getting together. Prior to the Internet, this was an ordinary and customary method for clients and escorts to meet.

 

I understand how (but not why) rentboy (a U.S. based escort site) got into the snare of the U.S. Government. What I do not understand is why foreign based escorts sites are modeling and changing their sites to fit the rules that are for the U.S.

 

Why does rentmen, a foreign based escort site, now prohibit escort fee information from ads?

 

The U.S. has no jurisdiction in foreign countries with respect to escort sites or what can be advertised.

 

Can anyone explain this phenomenon, like I was a six year old?

 

In short, I am baffled why and how the U.S. influences the functions of foreign based escorts sites.

[Golem]

Because the advertising knowingly facilitates the commission of crimes* on U.S. soil.

 

Thus, where the website is based and where it is actually used are both relevant.

 

It would certainly take a lot more effort for the U.S. government to go after a site operator in another country, than a site operator in the U.S -- both in terms of extradition, and in terms of the arguments needed to secure a conviction. So I think it's less likely to happen. But it's not impossible.

 

*even if we think they shouldn't be crimes

[coriolis888]

Because the advertising knowingly facilitates the commission of crimes* on U.S. soil.

 

Thus, where the website is based and where it is actually used are both relevant.

 

It would certainly take a lot more effort for the U.S. government to go after a site operator in another country, than a site operator in the U.S -- both in terms of extradition, and in terms of the arguments needed to secure a conviction. So I think it's less likely to happen. But it's not impossible.

 

*even if we think they shouldn't be crimes

 

 

What you wrote makes sense.

 

However, for foreign based escort sites to agree to the demands of U.S. laws defies logic.

 

If I went to a foreign country, Singapore for example, and if I dropped chewing gum on the ground and if I did not pick it up, I could receive lashing by cane. If I did the same thing in the U.S. (dropped chewing gum and did not pick it up), a similar lashing would not occur.

 

In other words, because something is illegal in one country, does not make it illegal in another country. Then there is also the issue of jurisdiction.

 

The management of foreign based escorts sites currently behave as though they must conform to U.S. laws.

 

The foreign based escorts sites recently placed advertising restrictions that make escort ads less usefulness to buyers.

 

Although we have an unsettling man in the White House, does anyone really believe that the U.S. Government would send federal agents to Europe or to other foreign countries to arrest the owners and employees of escort sites?

[+ goosh69]

What you wrote makes sense.

 

However, for foreign based escort sites to agree to the demands of U.S. laws defies logic.

 

If I went to a foreign country, Singapore for example, and if I dropped chewing gum on the ground and if I did not pick it up, I could receive lashing by cane. If I did the same thing in the U.S. (dropped chewing gum and did not pick it up), a similar lashing would not occur.

 

In other words, because something is illegal in one country, does not make it illegal in another country. Then there is also the issue of jurisdiction.

 

The management of foreign based escorts sites currently behave as though they must conform to U.S. laws.

 

The foreign based escorts sites recently placed advertising restrictions that make escort ads less usefulness to buyers.

 

Although we have an unsettling man in the White House, does anyone really believe that the U.S. Government would send federal agents to Europe or to other foreign countries to arrest the owners and employees of escort sites?

Please try to gamble online in the US on a foreign website. It won't work, because Visa, MasterCard, PayPal etc are American companies, and no US or foreign bank with US subsidiaries is allowed to facilitate such. Please fill in blanks. You're welcome.

[+ quoththeraven]

Do you have any recommendation that can be put into action?

 

Escort sites are closing and/or are being limited on what can be advertised. This now applies even to foreign based escorts sites.

 

If the escort site closures and advertising restrictions continue, escorts and clients just might return the streets for getting together. Prior to the Internet, this was an ordinary and customary method for clients and escorts to meet.

 

I understand how (but not why) rentboy (a U.S. based escort site) got into the snare of the U.S. Government. What I do not understand is why foreign based escorts sites are modeling and changing their sites to fit the rules that are for the U.S.

 

Why does rentmen, a foreign based escort site, now prohibit escort fee information from ads?

 

The U.S. has no jurisdiction in foreign countries with respect to escort sites or what can be advertised.

 

Can anyone explain this phenomenon, like I was a six year old?

 

In short, I am baffled why and how the U.S. influences the functions of foreign based escorts sites.

See this post and below.

 

https://m4m-forum.org/threads/pricing-on-rent-men.127577/#post-1343602

[coriolis888]

Please try to gamble online in the US on a foreign website. It won't work, because Visa, MasterCard, PayPal etc are American companies, and no US or foreign bank with US subsidiaries is allowed to facilitate such. Please fill in blanks. You're welcome.

 

 

I can understand the potential danger for a U. S based escort paying his foreign based escort site advertisement cost using an American credit card.

 

The ad wording and the credit card payment leave a trail which could come back to haunt the escort.

 

As to a client who pays a membership fee to a foreign based escort site and paying with a credit card or check. the client is not in the same risk as the escort. There are no U.S. laws prohibiting paying for a membership to read something. The client is not making an offer for escort services.

 

If a client hires an escort from a foreign based escort site, most in-person payments to escorts are made in cash. Therefore there would be no credit card trail from the client to the escort.

 

Despite the above possible dangers to escort sites and to escorts, the likelihood of the U.S. Government going after a foreign based escort site is remote.

[+ goosh69]

I can understand the potential danger for a U. S based escort paying his foreign based escort site advertisement cost using an American credit card.

 

The ad wording and the credit card payment leave a trail which could come back to haunt the escort.

 

As to a client who pays a membership fee to a foreign based escort site and paying with a credit card or check. the client is not in the same risk as the escort. There are no U.S. laws prohibiting paying for a membership to read something. The client is not making an offer for escort services.

 

If a client hires an escort from a foreign based escort site, most in-person payments to escorts are made in cash. Therefore there would be no credit card trail from the client to the escort.

 

Despite the above possible dangers to escort sites and to escorts, the likelihood of the U.S. Government going after a foreign based escort site is remote.

 

OMG I spelled it for you!!!! With online gambling, the government went after the BANKS AND CREDIT CARD COMPANIES THEMSELVES!!!!! With Canadian drugs they did that AND the ISPS and even search engines!

[coriolis888]

OMG I spelled it for you!!!! With online gambling, the government went after the BANKS AND CREDIT CARD COMPANIES THEMSELVES!!!!! With Canadian drugs they did that AND the ISPS and even search engines!

 

 

I think you may be incorrect in your assertion that U.S. banks (that issue credit cards) have an influence for foreign escort sites changing their advertising criteria.

 

There might be some influence but nothing major that would cause the marked change in what is disallowed for inclusion in foreign based escort ads.

 

With respect to credit cards being used in illegal activities, please let me remind you that the current White House occupant has a henchman named Jeff Sessions (Attorney General) who said, many times, that he will enforce federal laws concerning marijuana even though numerous individual states have legalized the sales of the product.

 

Despite Mr. Sessons threats, there are banks that allow credit cards to be used for the purchase of marijuana - a federal illegal product.

 

See this -

 

http://www.cardrates.com/news/marijuana-dispensaries-starting-accept-credit-cards/

 

https://www.leafly.com/dispensary-info/ganja-goddess-seattle

[+ goosh69]

Uhhhh...People pay to be premium members and to post ads using credit cards. That being cut off - as it has been already for non-US online pharmacy sales as well as offshore gambling could EASILY happen to rentmen. As could going after Google and the ISPs to make the sites harder to find.

 

And this stuff happened under Bush AND Obama. Like, aggressively. So it could easily happen under Trump.

 

The Feds have not gone after marijuana YET. But most big financial institutions still steer clear of it. Which is why I couldn't buy pot with a debit or CC in Oregon. And you can't buy pot online.

 

I am telling you why Rentmen is probably running scared. Who knows for sure, but mynonline pharmacy and gambling examples are accurate.

[rvwnsd]

I think you may be incorrect in your assertion that U.S. banks (that issue credit cards) have an influence for foreign escort sites changing their advertising criteria.

 

There might be some influence but nothing major that would cause the marked change in what is disallowed for inclusion in foreign based escort ads....

 

@goosh69 is not too far off the mark. US-based card issuers and merchant processors do not have a whole lot of sway over individual businesses that are not based in the US. However, VISA, MasterCard, American Express, and Discover (all of which are US-based) can and have decided not to allow their cards to be accepted by certain categories of merchants and/or certain merchants. Card-issuing banks can also refuse to approve transactions from merchants that have a high instance of chargebacks and merchant transaction processors can drop clients.

 

In the case of online pharmacies based outside of the US, it appears that the pharmaceutical industry pressured the major US credit card companies to stop allowing their cards to be used at non-US based online pharmacies. The pharmacies have shifted to using electronic checks instead.

 

In my opinion, RM and M4RN are not running scared. "Running scared" would equate to blocking site access to US-based IP addresses until they figured out how to continue allowing access to US-based IP addresses. It seems like they are taking a very measured approach in response to the result of the Rentboy incident. I say this because they have removed the rates from their website but have reintroduced the guys' "interests" to users who are accessing the site from the US. They will probably start disallowing rate information from the ad text next. From a self-protection standpoint, this would make a lot of sense. Not saying I like it, but businesses have to adapt if they want to stay alive.

 

Regarding marijuana dispensaries accepting credit cards, they are doing so by using very generic descriptions of their businesses when signing up for merchant processing services. They do this by using a SIC (Standard Industry Classification) or NAICS (North American Industry Classification System) code that belies the nature of the business and by using a non-descriptive merchant name on the credit card statement. For example, NAICS 446191 (Food (Health) Specialty Stores) was one of the results when I searched the NAICS website for "herbs." Likewise, "Mary Jane's Herbal Farmacy" could register their business as "HF Enterprises" or "Acme Enterprises" and use one of those two names as the merchant name that appears on the customer's credit card statement.

[+ goosh69]

You can't even have an ATM inside a pot store in Oregon. So they may LIE to get around it, but the banks and payment processing companies aren't allowing it.

[rvwnsd]

You can't even have an ATM inside a pot store in Oregon. So they may LIE to get around it, but the banks and payment processing companies aren't allowing it.

With a few exceptions, the ATMs inside of convenience stores, bars, casinos, and restaurants are not owned or sponsored by banks. They are owned and maintained by companies who specialize in that type of business. It is similar to the "banks" that issue prepaid debit cards that have the VISA and MasterCard logos. USBank issues some (mainly the ones you can buy at a retail chain like Lowes, Target, the Safeway/Albertsons companies, and the Kroger companies) and Chase offered a product through their branches. However, the ones sold at convenience stores and gas stations are usually issued by the likes of GoBank and MetaBank. These are not your typical "banks."

 

At any rate, the institutions that service industries operating on (or outside) the fringe of legality are not your garden-variety banks, credit unions, and savings associations. That's not to say they do not provide a valuable service, as they fill a niche others don't have the corporate stomach to serve.

[+ goosh69]

With a few exceptions, the ATMs inside of convenience stores, bars, casinos, and restaurants are not owned or sponsored by banks. They are owned and maintained by companies who specialize in that type of business. It is similar to the "banks" that issue prepaid debit cards that have the VISA and MasterCard logos. USBank issues some (mainly the ones you can buy at a retail chain like Lowes, Target, the Safeway/Albertsons companies, and the Kroger companies) and Chase offered a product through their branches. However, the ones sold at convenience stores and gas stations are usually issued by the likes of GoBank and MetaBank. These are not your typical "banks."

 

At any rate, the institutions that service industries operating on (or outside) the fringe of legality are not your garden-variety banks, credit unions, and savings associations. That's not to say they do not provide a valuable service, as they fill a niche others don't have the corporate stomach to serve.

 

I didn't say BANK ATMs!!!! I said ATMS!!!! As in AS I SAID the PAYMENT PROCESSING companies won't cooperate.