Safety

[jakeleyman]

Could I ask your reaction to this statement about PREP from a guy I was talking to online: After explaining that he was on PREP, he said: "it's just as effective as using a condom."

[SteveEscort]

a) What proof have you got he was on PREP

b) He's almost certainly barebacking then and so therefore susceptible to other sexually transmitted diseases.

c) I would be very careful

 

A few months ago I received an email from a guy wanting to visit me for an incall. He is on the UK PREP trial, or so he claimed. He told me about a role play he wanted (this was all in one email with no, are you ok with any of this) and in the email he said "You will beg for my spunk and you WILL be barebacked". Will I now. I don't think so.

 

He called the treatment a "Game Changer". In my honest opinion, people like him shouldn't be entitled to free, expensive medication like this, when they wish to be reckless.

 

I turned down the appointment, unfortunately I am not as reckless as he is and I appreciate and respect my self worth and personal health. I've worked as an escort for 15 years now and in all of that time I have not caught a single sexually transmitted disease and I get an HIV test every month. This game changer he talks of, is sometime I don't need to change my life for. I am quite happy going along using the same tried and tested methods that have kept me safe for a long time.

[Guy Fawkes]

Survey says...

 

"When male condoms are used correctly and consistently, they are 80-95% effective in reducing the risk of HIV infection."

 

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http://www.amfar.org/uploadedfiles/in_the_community/publications/condombrief.pdf

 

"When taken consistently, PrEP has been shown to reduce the risk of HIV infection in people who are at high risk by up to 92%. PrEP is much less effective if it is not taken consistently."

 

-

http://www.cdc.gov/hiv/prevention/research/prep/

 

In the first case your taking responsibility for your health; In the 2nd case you giving him responsibility for your health.

 

Could I ask your reaction to this statement about PREP from a guy I was talking to online: After explaining that he was on PREP, he said: "it's just as effective as using a condom."

[justaguy]

In the first case (using condoms) you're taking responsibility for your health; In the 2nd case (relying on PrEP) you are giving him responsibility for your health.

 

Daddy just summed it up perfectly. Any other arguments aside, it's up to each of us to take responsibility for our health.

[Steven_Draker]

From AVERT:

 

Are condoms effective at preventing HIV and sexually transmitted infections (STIs)?

 

Studies into the effectiveness of condoms have shown that if a latex condom is used correctly every time you have sex, this is highly effective in providing protection against HIV.

 

The evidence for the effectiveness of condoms is clearest in studies of couples in which one person is infected with HIV and the other not (discordant couples). In a study of discordant couples in Europe, among 123 couples who reported consistently using condoms, none of the uninfected partners became infected. In contrast, among the 122 couples who used condoms inconsistently, 12 of the uninfected partners became infected. A recent review of 14 studies involving discordant couples concluded that consistent use of condoms led to an 80% reduction in HIV incidence.

 

In addition, correct and consistent use of latex condoms can reduce the risk of other STIs, including chlamydia, genital herpes, gonorrhea and syphilis.

 

The male latex condom is the single, most efficient, available technology to reduce the sexual transmission of HIV and other sexually transmitted infections.

 

How often do condoms fail?

 

“The main reason that condoms sometimes fail is incorrect or inconsistent use, not the failure of the condom itself”

 

There is no one answer to this, as different studies have shown different results. Many studies of condom effectiveness have counted how often women have become pregnant when their partners have used condoms for birth control. This "failure rate" includes cases where the couple did not use a condom every time they had sex, or they did not use the condom correctly. Some studies have included the times the condom was torn accidentally by people using it.

 

The main reason that condoms sometimes fail to prevent HIV/STI infection or pregnancy is incorrect or inconsistent use, not the failure of the condom itself. Using oil-based lubricants can weaken the latex, causing the condom to break. Condoms can also be weakened by exposure to heat or sunlight or by age, or they can be torn by teeth or fingernails. Also, remember to check the expiry date of your condom!

 

How often do condoms break or slip off?

 

A large body of research in the United States has shown that rates of breakage, caused by fault in the condom itself, are less than 2 condoms out of every 100 condoms. Studies also indicate that condoms slip off the penis in about 1-5% of acts of vaginal intercourse and slip down (but not off) about 3-13% of the time.

 

Various studies have shown that knowledge and familiarity with the use of condoms reduce the likelihood of condom breakage and slippage during sex. A major factor that can lead to a condom breaking or slipping off during sex is it's size, as this can affect how easy it is to put on and how likely it is to stay on. Different sizes of condoms are available, and it is important to make sure that the condom being used is the correct fit.

 

source: http://www.avert.org/condoms-effectiveness.htm#sthash.f4xL6Rmx.dpuf

[jakeleyman]

I'd just like to say thanks to this website for taking the time to give sound and sensible replies to my inquiry. Getting a perspective on these things is sometimes difficult when faced with the possibility of sexual encounters with otherwise desirable individuals..

[jimboivyo]

This is more of a general statement than a question. If someone can answer this it would be pretty awesome.

 

Latex condoms are non-porous hence diseases can't get through them, if used properly of course, which only requires rolling it down your dick taking the air out of the top and lubing it up. So maybe I am missing something? So someone can still get HIV from using a condom correctly, even though no fluids are getting through?

 

 

No. Condoms break routinely. They also slip, which even if put on right, can transmit any number of things

[down_to_business]

... So someone can still get HIV from using a condom correctly, even though no fluids are getting through?

 

Well, people have reportedly gotten pregnant (even though a very very low %) so I don't see why HIV transmission would be impossible (although it could be infinitesimal)

[+ Funguy]

This is more of a general statement than a question. If someone can answer this it would be pretty awesome.

 

Latex condoms are non-porous hence diseases can't get through them, if used properly of course, which only requires rolling it down your dick taking the air out of the top and lubing it up. So maybe I am missing something? So someone can still get HIV from using a condom correctly, even though no fluids are getting through?

 

Let's say it didn't slip, let's say it didn't break. On the back of condoms they quote 99% effective. Which woukd make sense based on what I said above. So the stats on the back of all latex condoms are wrong? Im sure those in the medical community would agree that in any study there has to be a margin or error. However let's look at our own lives. For the guys who have been fucking like bunnies for the past 25 years and are -, would you conclude that condoms were effective in protecting you? For the guys who are in a one partner + and one partner - relationship would you conclude condoms protected you? Would you now run the risk of now becoming + because a few studies that are only two years old state otherwise?

 

I don't think there's a right answer or a wrong answer, however there is a smarter solution. Use condoms and be on prep at the same time if that's how you want to protect yourself.

 

Something to remember - when is that condom going ON? There may be a lot of sexual/genital contact prior to actual penetration - oral, frottage, penile-anal rubbing, digital penetration, etc. Those are the times when you may catch an STI even tho you may use a condom "correctly".

[Nvr2Thick]

This is more of a general statement than a question. If someone can answer this it would be pretty awesome.

 

Latex condoms are non-porous hence diseases can't get through them, if used properly of course, which only requires rolling it down your dick taking the air out of the top and lubing it up. So maybe I am missing something? So someone can still get HIV from using a condom correctly, even though no fluids are getting through?

 

No. Condoms break routinely. They also slip, which even if put on right, can transmit any number of things

 

There are so many aspects of "using a condom correctly" that get overlooked in casual discussion. Some guys think it's enough to roll one one and take a ride to the finish line. Years ago I ended up taking a load from a top who pulled out when we were done and said, "damn, the rubber broke." More recently I had a top pull out because, "this is feeling way too good". He realized that the condom broke and he pulled out to suit up again. When we talked later he said that he really wondered about guys that don't realize that the condom broke. He said he could always feel the difference, and he thought that guys who would keep fucking through a condom break were aware at some level but were putting off dealing with the risk because they were caught up in the moment.

 

Another top said he couldn't fuck me deep because the last inch or so of his dick was always bare. Because his dick was much thicker at the root the condom would always roll down a bit. Syphillis is one STD where transmission can occur through skin on skin contact. There are usually some visible signs but not always. This man was aware of the risks of this type of contact, particularly when the last inches of unprotected skin are following the first several fat inches in repeated pounding of sensitive tissue.

 

At the first sign of blood you're taking on quite a bit more risk of transmission. How many guys are going to stop? Do you know the situation well enough to lube properly and relube?

 

Some guys are going to be more prone to slippage based on their technique and the shape and size of their dicks. They should be checking the condom frequently. If your dick goes from hard to semi you should know enough to stop if the condom isn't keeping up. If you precum a lot and it's frothing up the base or causing slippage you should stop.

 

In a lot of these scenarios the top has far greater opportunity to detect problems. I've always had a tough time with this as a bottom because I'm responsible for any situation I get into, but I'm more likely to submit to the top and ride out a rough fuck than to create opportunities to check. I've done best when I've talked things over with the top, and found that he works his spot checks into our routine. Pulling out to change position, showing off his rock hard covered dick, showing my ass some appreciation... all of these turn the mechanics of a "status report" into something much more appealing.

[+ Funguy]

There are so many aspects of "using a condom correctly" that get overlooked in casual discussion. Some guys think it's enough to roll one one and take a ride to the finish line. Years ago I ended up taking a load from a top who pulled out when we were done and said, "damn, the rubber broke." More recently I had a top pull out because, "this is feeling way too good". He realized that the condom broke and he pulled out to suit up again. When we talked later he said that he really wondered about guys that don't realize that the condom broke. He said he could always feel the difference, and he thought that guys who would keep fucking through a condom break were aware at some level but were putting off dealing with the risk because they were caught up in the moment.

 

Another top said he couldn't fuck me deep because the last inch or so of his dick was always bare. Because his dick was much thicker at the root the condom would always roll down a bit. Syphillis is one STD where transmission can occur through skin on skin contact. There are usually some visible signs but not always. This man was aware of the risks of this type of contact, particularly when the last inches of unprotected skin are following the first several fat inches in repeated pounding of sensitive tissue.

 

At the first sign of blood you're taking on quite a bit more risk of transmission. How many guys are going to stop? Do you know the situation well enough to lube properly and relube?

 

Some guys are going to be more prone to slippage based on their technique and the shape and size of their dicks. They should be checking the condom frequently. If your dick goes from hard to semi you should know enough to stop if the condom isn't keeping up. If you precum a lot and it's frothing up the base or causing slippage you should stop.

 

In a lot of these scenarios the top has far greater opportunity to detect problems. I've always had a tough time with this as a bottom because I'm responsible for any situation I get into, but I'm more likely to submit to the top and ride out a rough fuck than to create opportunities to check. I've done best when I've talked things over with the top, and found that he works his spot checks into our routine. Pulling out to change position, showing off his rock hard covered dick, showing my ass some appreciation... all of these turn the mechanics of a "status report" into something much more appealing.

 

Good points Nvr2Thick!

[jimboivyo]

I go through about 100 a month

 

I wouldn't go around bragging about that number

 

Shit happens- Just because you don't think it's possible doesn't mean it hasn't happened

[bigvalboy]

"When male condoms are used correctly and consistently, they are 80-95% effective in reducing the risk of HIV infection."

 

-

http://www.amfar.org/uploadedfiles/in_the_community/publications/condombrief.pdf

 

"When taken consistently, PrEP has been shown to reduce the risk of HIV infection in people who are at high risk by up to 92%. PrEP is much less effective if it is not taken consistently."

 

-

http://www.cdc.gov/hiv/prevention/research/prep/

 

In the first case your taking responsibility for your health; In the 2nd case you giving him responsibility for your health.

 

Daddy just summed it up perfectly. Any other arguments aside, it's up to each of us to take responsibility for our health.

 

Concise and to the point....

[Steven_Draker]

I think "correct use" of condoms comes with practice, experience and 'good will' I'd add.

 

To avoid too much friction and therefore breakage, I'd apply some lube on the cock, before putting the condom on. Use plenty of lube on the condom and lube up the ass gently using your fingers. Re-lube often and check whether the condom is still in place.

 

I can personally vouch that condoms are very efficient in preventing HIV and STIs transmissions.

[SteveEscort]

I wouldn't go around bragging about that number

 

Shit happens- Just because you don't think it's possible doesn't mean it hasn't happened

 

I will reiterate that. I don't go through near as many but I also agree with his point. I don't think condoms break as much either. Maybe I am lucky and someone else has a breakage with every other encounter. Most guys I see like oral and I do that without a condom I do allow all guys to cum in my mouth if they so wish. It's a low risk that i am willing to take. I have fantastically healthy jaws and teeth and I am confident that I would not catch hiv by oral sex to completion but what I will say is this

 

I've seen thousands of men. I have had only one condom ever slip off me and a condom has never broken inside of me. That's thousands of condoms of various brands.

 

Here in the UK I receive my condoms for free from the health authority for being a sex worker. You get what you are given, you don't get a choice and they've always been perfectly fine no matter what size, brand or style.

[+ sam.fitzpatrick]

I go through about 100 a month. I can't recall that ever happening.

 

I'll put your condom usage at 10x mine, and I've had condoms fall off twice in the last five years - - once as a top and once as a bottom.