Today's Review of Hayden - "Are You Too Proud to Admit Being Scammed?"

[bcohen7719]

Today's review of Hayden (below) posed the question: have you ever been

too proud to admit being scammed?

 

I'll join the club. I've been scammed often. I've not had the

nerve to ask someone "leave my house" because of fear of violence.

 

Here is the catalog of complexities, once again:

 

1) Practically all photos on Rentboy, and even the massage sites,

appear to be fake.

 

2) If an escort or masseur puts in their actual photo, it is usually

extremely dated-- and not just by a few years,

 

3) Many "rave reviews" on the other side of this site appear to be written

by the escorts themselves or their cohorts.

 

4) The best way of hiring someone safe and satisfactorily appears to be

by querying trusted friends/colleagues on this website--many of whom

are so wonderful--and asking

privately about their own experiences.

 

There are indeed some fantastic, wonderful professional escorts in

this underground community. But finding out who they are--my

God, it's an almost overwhelming challenge.

 

Have others faced this difficulty?

 

BC

 

http://www.daddysreviews.com/cruise/newest

[N13]

Hi! You have probably opened yourself up to a response to the review that will vilify you and exonerate this "poor put-upon" escort. Ignore it!!! I find that I have to agree with the majority of what you say about the whole thing in general. I don't know if it is me or the profession that has changed. Years ago (10 to 15) most of the escorts I hired lived up to their reviews and photos. I find that this is no longer the case. So much so that I have curtailed my hiring considerably. I am tired of opening the door to someone who has little or no resemblance to their photos and do not perform what they hold themselves out for.

 

Surprisingly some of the better reviewed escorts on this site have also not lived up to their reviews. I don't think it is me as I have had some good experiences - most notably David SF, Steven Draker and Kevin Slater. I tend to ignore or discount first reviewers....but am finding more and more that repeat reviewers are also not being truthful.

 

Don't know what the solution is but I like your idea of "querying trusted friends/colleagues on this website--many of whom are so wonderful--and asking

privately about their own experiences."

 

N13

[bigvalboy]

I read the review BC, but I don't see this as the client getting scammed. The two problems I have are that 1.) the client paid up front. Probably the biggest mistake anyone can make, and 2.) It was the client who asked the escort to leave, so we really don't know if the escort would have performed or not. The client admits that the escort was asked to do things that he hadn't done before, but the escort said he would try to go with the flow. Was the escort nervous and unsure, absolutely, and would I have, if in the same situation as this client, done the same thing, most likely, but I don't fully see this as the escorts fault. I see this more as the client and escort not clicking, and just not feeling comfortable with the situation. Should the escort have kept all the money? That is up for debate, but up until that point, the escort probably felt that he hadn't really done anything wrong, so he kept the money, and I feel the same way. If the escort didn't do anything wrong, had not misrepresented himself, was not under the influence, and it was the client who changed his mind, then he owes the fee...I would have just asked him to leave and taken the loss.

 

I say it was only 200 hundred bucks, and since the client felt uncomfortable, he was wise to send the escort on his way. Score this as a learning experience.

 

Only twice that I can remember I've had to ask someone to leave. It has been years and years, partly because I am much wiser, and partly because I don't host anymore...period, but that being said, on both occasions, I felt that there was a potential of me being robbed. I'm not a small guy, I always made sure that I was fully dressed, I was direct, to the point, confronted him eye to eye, and showed no hesitation or fear. It was basically you have 2 min to get the fuck out or this will go south real quick. Smart? ABSOLUTELY NOT, but it worked, and because of those uncomfortable experiences, I don't host anymore.

 

Often times, as in this situation, you just have to move on.

[jimboivyo]

if guys would do their homework, most would avoid the scammers

 

they pick escorts without long standing reviews. only go on pictures. let their dick do the thinking. wrong moves

[instudiocity]

Today's review of Hayden (below) posed the question: have you ever been too proud to admit being scammed?

We've all been scammed, it's fully a part of the risk we take.

 

I'll join the club. I've been scammed often. I've not had the nerve to ask someone "leave my house" because of fear of violence.

Just what kind of Queen are you? It's your fucking house, if you don't want someone there, tell them to leave. Have your phone ready with 9-1 already dialed if you're scared...

 

Here is the catalog of complexities, once again:

 

1) Practically all photos on Rentboy, and even the massage sites,

appear to be fake.

"Catalog of Complexities?" Four items total do not a catalog publish. You could paint my house in one stroke with a brush that broad. "Practically all" is a total bullshit supposition, besides, any reader of this forum can find out how to Google Image every photo on every rentable boy site.

 

2) If an escort or masseur puts in their actual photo, it is usually extremely dated-- and not just by a few years,

What's the definition of extremely dated if it's 'not just by a few years'? Total bullshit again, that's two broad brushes, but I don't have two houses.

 

3) Many "rave reviews" on the other side of this site appear to be written by the escorts themselves or their cohorts..

Daddy along with the M-F members are pretty good at vetting these reviews to know what's real and what's unreal. Remember, in order for a review to make it onto Daddy's Reviews, it's been vetted by Daddy first. It's undergone some analysis as to origin, content and identity of the reviewer. And REMEMBER, one client's experience doesn't guarantee you are going to gee-haw with that escort like the reviewing client did.

 

4) The best way of hiring someone safe and satisfactorily appears to be by querying trusted friends/colleagues on this website--many of whom are so wonderful--and asking privately about their own experiences.

Yes, but what escorts would you know to make inquiry about without the Daddy's Reviews?

 

There are indeed some fantastic, wonderful professional escorts in this underground community. But finding out who they are--my God, it's an almost overwhelming challenge.

So put on your big boy pants and get to work...

 

Have others faced this difficulty?

Without nearly as much trepidation as you seem to have faced it.

 

PS. It's best not to title a thread, "Today's...(anything)" because tomorrow it will be out of date and next week when folks see it they're going to be confused about where Hayden's review is located - 2/17/2014 - and the link you posted was to the current day's reviews - which changes daily.

[thickornotatall]

I always..ask many questions...If he doesn't or can't answer I move on....If someone shows up and is not the same person..and has used a fake photo.....bye bye...I always meet outside...never at my door....The last time I was disappointed was with a well reviewed escort on this site....He was the same person....but was physically different...emotionally stunted...and a real jerk....I asked him to leave....then told him to leave...then pushed him out the door...he yelled at me that he wanted to be paid....I said "me too"...won't happen....if you let someone get away..they'll try with the next....Frankly there are some great guys here and have met a few...and some idiots...The very idea of using fake photos and thinking someone won't care is ludicrous...and not to be tolerated....I work too hard to be scammed...ok?

[jimboivyo]

We've all been scammed, it's fully a part of the risk we take.

 

Just what kind of Queen are you? It's your fucking house, if you don't want someone there, tell them to leave. Have your phone ready with 9-1 already dialed if you're scared...

 

"Catalog of Complexities?" Four items total do not a catalog publish. You could paint my house in one stroke with a brush that broad. "Practically all" is a total bullshit supposition, besides, any reader of this forum can find out how to Google Image every photo on every rentable boy site.

 

What's the definition of extremely dated if it's 'not just by a few years'? Total bullshit again, that's two broad brushes, but I don't have two houses.

 

Daddy along with the M-F members are pretty good at vetting these reviews to know what's real and what's unreal. Remember, in order for a review to make it onto Daddy's Reviews, it's been vetted by Daddy first. It's undergone some analysis as to origin, content and identity of the reviewer. And REMEMBER, one client's experience doesn't guarantee you are going to gee-haw with that escort like the reviewing client did.

 

Yes, but what escorts would you know to make inquiry about without the Daddy's Reviews?

 

So put on your big boy pants and get to work...

 

Without nearly as much trepidation as you seem to have faced it.

 

PS. It's best not to title a thread, "Today's...(anything)" because tomorrow it will be out of date and next week when folks see it they're going to be confused about where Hayden's review is located - 2/17/2014 - and the link you posted was to the current day's reviews - which changes daily.

 

 

well said

 

if you want to keep being a victim, you will be. take control of your life

[Frankly Rich]

well said

 

if you want to keep being a victim, you will be. take control of your life

 

Well said? I thought instudiocity's response was unduly harsh and picky, but that's just my opinion.

[+ Gar1eth]

I've been hiring since 2002- although not as much over the last 2 years. But in that time I've had good and bad experiences. I would say that on the majority most of my experiences have been good with the caveat being that I tend towards repeat hiring if I like the guy. The guys I have found off of Daddy's website have in general lived up to their reviews, but I usually only pick well-reviewed escorts who have more than 1st timer only reviews. As for pictures- if they are professionally done- I don't always expect the escort to be in exactly as good a shape. Consider how much dieting and working out these guys must have done prior to having professional pictures done. So I'm ok if they aren't quite as ripped in real life.

 

It can be just bad luck if you are continually being scammed, but you do need to ask yourself if there is anything you are doing that perpetuates being scammed like- do most of the escorts you pick have 'ask me' for their fees- yes I know there are some genuine guys who do this- but I'll bet there are more iffy type guys; do you mostly pick guys no one has ever heard of; do you pick guys without face pictures; do you hire only by text without ever actually talking to the escort; have you searched for their pictures; do their reviews sound reasonable- ground rules like these have helped me in general have pleasant times when I have hired.

 

Gman

[instudiocity]

It can be just bad luck if you are continually being scammed, but you do need to ask yourself if there is anything you are doing that perpetuates being scammed like- do most of the escorts you pick have 'ask me' for their fees- yes I know there are some genuine guys who do this- but I'll bet there are more iffy type guys; do you mostly pick guys no one has ever heard of; do you pick guys without face pictures; do you hire only by text without ever actually talking to the escort; have you searched for their pictures; do their reviews sound reasonable- ground rules like these have helped me in general have pleasant times when I have hired.

 

Gman

Gman, it's good to be introspective when your hiring leads to to being scammed constantly. One the other hand, I doubt it's simply bad luck if someone is continually being scammed. It's more like self-fulfilling results of bad vetting and hiring.

 

The rules, restated here so frequently I cannot believe BC need to attempt his 'catalog',

1. Only hire well-reviewed escort and by well-reviewed, I mean from an independent site - Daddy's.

2. Tell the escort what you want. Get his agreement to the $ and the plan.

3. Don't be afraid to walk away if the guy who shows up isn't as advertised. Pretty simple.

[instudiocity]

Well said? I thought instudiocity's response was unduly harsh and picky, but that's just my opinion.

Glad you have an opinion. It wasn't harsh in my view, it was direct. And who invites someone into their home that they would be scared to ask to leave? Really? I'm afraid to have dominion over my own home? Seriously?

 

And why all the broad brushing generalities? Why Practically All? Are we hopeless to find a good escort as well as out of control in our own homes?

[+ azdr0710]

The rules, restated here so frequently I cannot believe BC need to attempt his 'catalog',

1. Only hire well-reviewed escort and by well-reviewed, I mean from an independent site - Daddy's.

2. Tell the escort what you want. Get his agreement to the $ and the plan.

3. Don't be afraid to walk away if the guy who shows up isn't as advertised. Pretty simple.

 

 

and, among other suggestions, communicate politely ahead of time that you will pay at the end of the meeting and that you do not want to discuss money at the meet....

 

if you MUST meet somebody with no reviews and questionable pictures, politely tell him your concerns about that and that you'd like to meet in the lobby or at Starbuck's.....

[MiamiLooker]

The last time I was disappointed was with a well reviewed escort on this site....

 

I’ve had very few bad experiences with escorts, but probably the worst was with a very well reviewed escort on this site, as well (a Florida-based escort). This was several years ago. He’s still escorting and I’m still hiring, but I would never hire him again. Another client told me he had to ask this escort to stop contacting him, because the escort had pulled a similar stunt with him. Not to get into specifics or naming names, but his modus operandi was (and probably still is) something like “I’m going to be in your town next week. When would you like to see me?” as well as “I’ve got some really good weed.” I would just say be careful who you’re dealing with.

[+ Gar1eth]

I do want to say that if the situation occurred as the reviewer recounted it in his review- that the escort seems either very inexperienced or had no intention of living up to what he said he would do. The first thing I would notice is that the 1st review for Hayden reads on the fake side to me-#1. The review to me reads more like it was written by someone younger than in their 40's. #2. In the review the reviewer says he is 44. Then in the description of himself he says 48. If this isn't a typo by Daddy, then that seems suspicious. As for the escort himself- well I've been told by escorts before that many of their clients don't actually want sex. But if I wanted sex, and the escort knew it but didn't sound enthusiastic about it- I would probably have asked him to leave much sooner.

 

And just to be clear- if I wasnt in my last post. I feel for the reviewer. I have ended up wasting money before for escorts. That's one reason aside from not having much money that my hiring has decreased. When I have so little money now, I find myself wanting more of a sure thing. I am much less willing to take a chance on guys without face pictures, guys without reviews, or other questionable ads.

 

Gman

[TruHart1]

...I doubt it's simply bad luck if someone is continually being scammed. It's more like self-fulfilling results of bad vetting and hiring.

 

The rules, restated here so frequently I cannot believe BC need to attempt his 'catalog',

1. Only hire well-reviewed escort and by well-reviewed, I mean from an independent site - Daddy's.

2. Tell the escort what you want. Get his agreement to the $ and the plan.

3. Don't be afraid to walk away if the guy who shows up isn't as advertised. Pretty simple.

 

Instudiocity, your first post on this thread had a few good points and a lot of criticism of the OP but these three rules have been my guidelines the entire time I have been hiring. I’ve found if rule #1 and #2 do not raise any red flags, there is seldom any need to even think about rule #3. Over 3.5 years of hiring quite a few escorts, I have had maybe 3 hires that have been a disappointment. One has wonderful reviews on Daddy’s and great word of mouth on the forum but just didn’t click with ME – I found him a really great guy who I would be glad to call my friend but I’d never hire him for sex again.

 

One has great reviews on Daddy’s but is just too aloof and controlling for my taste (not the boyfriend experience I always hope for) and now, thinking back on our appointment and his considerable attractions sexually and physically, I don’t really regret that experience because he is very hot but I know I never want to hire him again. The third is someone who left pertinent information about himself out of his ad regarding some of his personal traits, which I never called him on because he made up for it in other ways and because I enjoyed myself quite a bit after adjusting. In fact I have indeed hired him a number of times since!

 

Three duds or almost duds out of about forty different escorts, with multiple repeat sessions from nearly thirty of those forty guys seems an extraordinarily good record to me and it is all because of vetting each escort I find attractive by using my big head (as opposed to my small head) and following the rules instudiocity points out!

 

TruHart1

[bcohen7719]

I read the review BC, but I don't see this as the client getting scammed. The two problems I have are that 1.) the client paid up front. Probably the biggest mistake anyone can make, and 2.) It was the client who asked the escort to leave, so we really don't know if the escort would have performed or not. The client admits that the escort was asked to do things that he hadn't done before, but the escort said he would try to go with the flow. Was the escort nervous and unsure, absolutely, and would I have, if in the same situation as this client, done the same thing, most likely, but I don't fully see this as the escorts fault. I see this more as the client and escort not clicking, and just not feeling comfortable with the situation. Should the escort have kept all the money? That is up for debate, but up until that point, the escort probably felt that he hadn't really done anything wrong, so he kept the money, and I feel the same way. If the escort didn't do anything wrong, had not misrepresented himself, was not under the influence, and it was the client who changed his mind, then he owes the fee...I would have just asked him to leave and taken the loss.

 

I say it was only 200 hundred bucks, and since the client felt uncomfortable, he was wise to send the escort on his way. Score this as a learning experience.

 

Only twice that I can remember I've had to ask someone to leave. It has been years and years, partly because I am much wiser, and partly because I don't host anymore...period, but that being said, on both occasions, I felt that there was a potential of me being robbed. I'm not a small guy, I always made sure that I was fully dressed, I was direct, to the point, confronted him eye to eye, and showed no hesitation or fear. It was basically you have 2 min to get the fuck out or this will go south real quick. Smart? ABSOLUTELY NOT, but it worked, and because of those uncomfortable experiences, I don't host anymore.

 

Often times, as in this situation, you just have to move on.

 

Excellent points, BVB! As always you provide one of the best and most effective

calming voices. Yes, if the escort was nervous--that would be extremely

important. And you are right the dollar amount could not have been the

end of the world. Many thanks again for your invaluable insights.

 

Best,

 

BC

[cooldemo03]

The only way to avoid being scammed and its 100 percent effective..NEVER pay the escort upfront. Is everyone listening out there? NEVER do this and you'll never be scammed. And if the escort demands it, then tell him bye bye. There's no reason for it, and if they demand it, huge red flag. As far as asking someone to leave your home that you don't want there: absolutely tell them to go. You're a grown man, don't be afraid of that.

[Epigonos]

I like Gar1eth have been hiring escorts since 2002 and during those twelve years I have hired one hell of a lot of guys. Not once have I ever been scammed. Additionally I have never had a really bad experience although I’ve had a number of mediocre ones. To what do I attribute this lack of problems in hiring? RESEARCH, RESEARCH & MORE RESEARCH.

 

Furthermore I do not believe that many of the “rave reviews” written on the “other side of this site” were written by the escorts themselves. Why do I believe this, because I personally know many of the clients who have written those “rave reviews”.

 

When it comes to hiring escorts, like much else in life, we can set ourselves up for success or failure. It’s our choice and it’s just that simple.

[down_to_business]

Not too proud to admit to being scammed, but not happy about it either.

 

The escort will absolutely not be named publicly or privately because I am still dealing with his threats. I will say he was/is positively reviewed on this website. I felt absolutely intimidated. I could not get him to leave. I eventually had to get help just to get away from him. He got away with a lot more than $200.

 

I am not new to hiring. I have not hired since. I probably won't hire again as it just isn't worth it. The fact he was reviewed on this website offered me no protection or warning at all and unfortunately I am not in a position to warn anybody else about him unless I want to start dealing with more of his threats (which I don't). The threats made were/are serious. I have had good and bad experiences before and never anything like this. It has far overshadowed any good I ever experienced from escorting related activities.

 

All I can say is good luck out there, and try your best as a client to keep your anonymity because some day you might risk having everything exposed to your family, friends, employers, etc.

[imrthr]

Not too proud to admit to being scammed, but not happy about it either.

 

The escort will absolutely not be named publicly or privately because I am still dealing with his threats. I will say he was/is positively reviewed on this website. I felt absolutely intimidated. I could not get him to leave. I eventually had to get help just to get away from him. He got away with a lot more than $200.

 

I am not new to hiring. I have not hired since. I probably won't hire again as it just isn't worth it. The fact he was reviewed on this website offered me no protection or warning at all and unfortunately I am not in a position to warn anybody else about him unless I want to start dealing with more of his threats (which I don't). The threats made were/are serious. I have had good and bad experiences before and never anything like this. It has far overshadowed any good I ever experienced from escorting related activities.

 

All I can say is good luck out there, and try your best as a client to keep your anonymity because some day you might risk having everything exposed to your family, friends, employers, etc.

 

-

The above quoted response to the initial post of this thread is the first response that addresses the “real life” situation discussed in the opening post.

 

Those that posted comments about ordering an escort out of their house or demanding the escort leave are ignoring the police blotters that are filled with cases of clients being attacked by escorts.

 

Some of us know clients who have been attacked and even killed by escorts. I personally know of two clients who were robbed, then killed by escorts.

 

Furthermore, this forum contains other threads discussing certain well-reviewed escorts who were accused of harassing and intimidating clients. Some of those well-regarded escorts are presently in prison for drugs and other matters (those who have been posting to this forum for a while, know who those escorts are).

 

Even if an escort chooses not to physically attack the client after being ordered out of the client’s premises, look at the quoted post above. That particular client has been threatened and intimidated unmercifully and the fallout continues to this day. That poster vows never to hire another escort.

 

Remember, most clients are older than the escorts they hire. This means that in a physical confrontation, it is likely the client would not triumph over a young and violent escort. Therefore, a client being alone with an escort is potentially a dangerous situation.

 

In this day and age, many young people freely use drugs. Consequently, arrogantly or even politely insisting that an escort leave your house could set off a violent reaction.

 

Don't forget that you and the escort are alone together. Calling 911, if you can get to a phone, does not mean the police are at your rescue instantly. An escort can do a lot of damage between your calling 911 and the police arriving.

 

For those who reported that they have been hiring escorts for years without a problem, I say good for you. Clearly, luck has been on your side.

[+ ArVaGuy]

We have all at one time or another had bad experiences. This is equally true for clients AND escorts. I bet for every "client got scammed" experience there's a counter balancing "escort got scammed" experience. Clients who short change or skip without paying or become stalkers come to mind. A client is going to be much more likely to share a bad experience in a forum or review than an escort. It's not good business for an escort to make public any such client issues. Of course the escorts have their own networks for sharing info on clients so I'm sure many of the bad actors are known.

 

Let te me relate a few of my own bad experiences to offer perspective. I look upon the negative experiences as a learning opportunity. The worst experience was a near assault by an escort in Atlanta that was basically a robbery in 1999. Soon after I discovered this site an learned how to better screen my hires.

 

Another time, a set of brass knuckles fell out of an escort's backpack on to my living room floor. Fortunately, the appointment was over and it was a great experience with this well known guy at the time. Let's just say I never have guys over at my place since then.

 

A couple of guys in separate instances showed up bearing little to no resemblance to their pics. I handed the guys $50 for cab fare and told them to leave. Though stunned these guys left without an issue.

 

In each of these instances I let the little head do the thinking for the bigger head. I have a set of criteria for choosing my hires and seldom deviate from them. Each of my lousy experiences can be traced to not following the criteria. One can choose to dwell on a bad experience and thus paint all escorts with the same brush. Or one can choose to blame oneself and have a pity party. Better to learn from the bad experience and try not to repeat the mistake again.

[buckguy]

Something always seemed not right with Hayden's ads. I was curious about him because he was local, His porn work consists of a couple videos for an obscure porn company a couple years ago, which I took as a bad sign. he's been advertising for quite awhile, but never had sex? And the jacking up of the price?

[bcohen7719]

Well said? I thought instudiocity's response was unduly harsh and picky, but that's just my opinion.

 

He was a bit merciless, but he was trying to make a

point--and did!

 

BC

[bcohen7719]

Instudiocity, your first post on this thread had a few good points and a lot of criticism of the OP but these three rules have been my guidelines the entire time I have been hiring. I’ve found if rule #1 and #2 do not raise any red flags, there is seldom any need to even think about rule #3. Over 3.5 years of hiring quite a few escorts, I have had maybe 3 hires that have been a disappointment. One has wonderful reviews on Daddy’s and great word of mouth on the forum but just didn’t click with ME – I found him a really great guy who I would be glad to call my friend but I’d never hire him for sex again.

 

One has great reviews on Daddy’s but is just too aloof and controlling for my taste (not the boyfriend experience I always hope for) and now, thinking back on our appointment and his considerable attractions sexually and physically, I don’t really regret that experience because he is very hot but I know I never want to hire him again. The third is someone who left pertinent information about himself out of his ad regarding some of his personal traits, which I never called him on because he made up for it in other ways and because I enjoyed myself quite a bit after adjusting. In fact I have indeed hired him a number of times since!

 

Three duds or almost duds out of about forty different escorts, with multiple repeat sessions from nearly thirty of those forty guys seems an extraordinarily good record to me and it is all because of vetting each escort I find attractive by using my big head (as opposed to my small head) and following the rules instudiocity points out!

 

TruHart1

 

Your vetting skills are admirable! I wish I had your batting

average. Very jealous!

 

BC

[rvwnsd]

Your vetting skills are admirable! I wish I had your batting

average. Very jealous!

 

BC

 

I, too, have never been scammed. I've had a few mediocre experiences, all but one of which were very well reviewed on daddy's reviews and one of which was a very vaunted member of this forum in the mid-2000's. I attribute it not to luck, but the following:

 

 

1. Knowing what I want and being clear when I articulate that to the escort on first contact
   
2. Asking questions and listening to the responses
   
3. Being willing to walk away at any time if the responses I listened to do not sit well with me
   
4. Being a good judge of character
   
5. Being polite, but firm
   
6. Never, never paying up-front
   

 

It is easy to develop these skills. It simply takes practice, self-confidence, self-discipline, and evaluating every situation on its own merits instead of making sweeping generalizations.

 

Like some of the other posters, I do not believe the reviewer was scammed. He, not the escort, ended the session and he did so after he paid the guy. Neither the client nor us know whether the escort would have delivered what the client asked for (although we know that the escort wasn't experienced at one of the client's desires but offered to try) because the client asked the escort to leave.