The Slow Decline of Circumcision in the US

[Epigonos]

Much of the former Yugoslavia was, for several centuries, a part of the Ottoman Empire. The Ottoman Empire was primarily Muslim which is probably why circumcision was adopted by many including even Christians. Traditions die very slowly.

[+ BOZO T CLOWN]

 

Enough said!

 

Bozo

[EZEtoGRU]

Here's a link to an interesting website from, what appears to be, a anti-circumcision Jewish group. I still believe uncircumcised Jewish men are a small minority of the whole, but the topic seems to be getting a lot of attention within the Jewish Community. Interesting stuff.

 

http://www.jewishcircumcision.org/index.htm

[+ Tygerscent]

Two years back there was this big rally on pioneer square in Portland Oregon standing up for penis rights and protesting male genital mutilation~.

It's been growing in support~

 

Tyger

Tygerkink@yahoo.com

971.400.2633

http://www.tygerscent.biz

Men4rentnow.com tygerscent in Portland.

Rentmen.com AAAtygerscentxxx in Portland

Daddys reviews: Tyger in Portland

 

Traveling to Europe the month of Sept.

LA, SF, Midwest and East coast there after in semi arranged order~ inquire within~

[Guest]

Lots of different opinions, and lots of religious issues, but biologically it's how guys were meant to be. Most liberal countries see the practice as being barbaric. In a few years I assume people will view it the way we view cropping dog ears or tails, as something bordering on abuse. I'm glad I escaped the knife. It may be harder to keep clean but simple hygiene takes care of that whereas circumcised heads supposedly loose sensitivity and look somewhat strange and naked if you're not used to it.

 

BIG emphasis on supposedly. The "argument" about loss of sensitivity is complete bullshit. If anyone can give a reference to a REAL scientific study of men circumcised as adults which shows loss of sensitivity, I'd like to see it. Since I do a urology clinic once a week, I've met a number of men who've been circumcised as adults. I've never met one who said that sex is worse since they got circumcised. Is there anyone reading this string who knows a single man who was circumcised as an adult, and says the sex was worse after the circumcision?

[Samai139]

BIG emphasis on supposedly. The "argument" about loss of sensitivity is complete bullshit. If anyone can give a reference to a REAL scientific study of men circumcised as adults which shows loss of sensitivity, I'd like to see it. Since I do a urology clinic once a week, I've met a number of men who've been circumcised as adults. I've never met one who said that sex is worse since they got circumcised. Is there anyone reading this string who knows a single man who was circumcised as an adult, and says the sex was worse after the circumcision?

 

Unicorn--you certainly have more contact with adult men who have undergone circumcision as adults than I. Having said that, I wonder what is the average age of the men who have had adult circumcisions? How active were their sex lives BEFORE the circumcision? Perhaps men who have circumcisions as adults had experienced difficulty in their sex lives because they had all kinds of complications with their penises? (I don't know the technical terms for these, and I hope you will provide them.) I suspect the men you have met underwent adult circumcision for purely medical reasons, right?

 

My relections are based on only two personal experiences: an elderly uncle who underwent circumcision in his 70's because he had neglected the regular hygiene necessary for uncut men; and two a retired colleague who was circumcised in his 60's, again I suspect because he was not as careful with his personal hygiene as he should have been. Coincidentally, both men were diabetic. If asked, and I never did ), I suspect they would have said that their sex lives were not worse after circumcision..

Something to think about: if a healthy man in his 30's or 40's had a circumcision, not because he had any difficulty with his penis, but because of cultural or religious reasons, and he were asked if his sex life was better or worse, I wonder how he would answer. I'd also like to know his answer to the question about the sensitivity of his now exposed foreskin. And I would be very interested in any scientific study which examines that question. Do you think it's in the cards??

 

It's also interesting how this thread has gone from observations about the differences in percentages of cut and uncut to people's opinions about circumcision.

[Steven_Draker]

BIG emphasis on supposedly. The "argument" about loss of sensitivity is complete bullshit. If anyone can give a reference to a REAL scientific study of men circumcised as adults which shows loss of sensitivity, I'd like to see it. Since I do a urology clinic once a week, I've met a number of men who've been circumcised as adults. I've never met one who said that sex is worse since they got circumcised. Is there anyone reading this string who knows a single man who was circumcised as an adult, and says the sex was worse after the circumcision?

 

The question isn't whether sex is better or worse following the adult circumcision but rather if sensitivity/pleasure would be greater if there was no circumcision at all shortly after birth.

[desertguy1954]

I am cut and and the head of my cock and the area just below that get very sensitive during sex. In fact after I cum, it is so sensitive that I don't like to be touched for a few minutes.

[Guest]

The question isn't whether sex is better or worse following the adult circumcision but rather if sensitivity/pleasure would be greater if there was no circumcision at all shortly after birth.[/color]

 

???? Maybe you'd care to explain how one would study whether the sensitivity/pleasure is better or worse following an infant circumcision??? Even if you were to randomly circumcise only one identical twin, how could one twin compare the pleasure or sensitivity he had with his other twin's? How far they came? I really don't think there's a way to compare one man's pleasure to another's. Really, the only comparison one could make would be to compare the same man's pleasure/sensitivity before and after circumcision. Pleasure and sensitivity are not subject to objective measurements like blood pressure or glucose levels. I suspect I enjoy sex more than most guys because I obsess about it a bit more, escorts tell me that I cum more and longer than most other clients, and even the sperm bank told me they were impressed with my load. But I don't know that for a fact. And I certainly can't proclaim that it has anything to do with my circumcision status.

[+ BOZO T CLOWN]

American Academy of Pediatricians: Circumcision is a no-brainer. It saves lives and saves money.

 

[Steven_Draker]

A massive circumcision campaign is being carried out in Africa to Stem the AIDS Epidemic

 

 

An unprecedented circumcision campaign covering 13 countries in East and Southern Africa is being unfolded in a bid to break the epidemic of AIDS

 

From Kenya to South Africa, hospitals and tented clinics in the bush offering free circumcision are almost in danger of being overwhelmed by men, bringing with them boys and infants.

 

Kenya has performed 120,000 circumcisions.

 

In Zimbabwe, the pilot phase of the campaign projected 2,000 volunteers, but got 2,800. In a small tent in the Makonde area north of Harare recently, three doctors circumcised 70 volunteers in three days.

 

According to details announced at the International AIDS Conference in Vienna this week, the campaign aims to circumcise 38 million males — 80 percent of all males under 49 years at a cost of 2.5 billion US dollars.

 

The rationale is simple - removal of the foreskin reduces the risk of HIV infection by 60 percent.

 

Over the envisaged 15-year campaign period, it is envisaged that AIDS and the HIV virus that causes it will be brought down to manageable levels.

 

Not long after AIDS emerged in the 1980s as a deadly global threat, public health experts noticed a curious set of contrasts in Africa.

 

In countries where circumcision was an inherent practice, like in North and West Africa where it is dictated largely by Islam, AIDS was not engulfing whole populations as it was in parts of the continent where the practice was rare.

 

The first large-scale tests to confirm the occurrence were done from 2004 in South Africa, Kenya and Uganda. They proved conclusively that half the 10,000 subjects who had volunteered to be circumcised recorded 60 percent less infections than the group that didn’t undergo the procedure.

 

The inside of the foreskin, says urologist Christopher Samkange, chief trainer for the Zimbabwean campaign, is almost the only skin surface of the human body without the barrier of cells with the protein keratin that makes the outer skin layer hard and impervious.

 

“That is the entry point for the virus,” he said. “It has no defence. Whatever goes under the foreskin will get into your body and survive.”

 

The block of 13 adjoining countries — from Kenya in the north, South Africa in the south, Namibia in the west and Mozambique in the east -make up the highest HIV-infected part of the world, where the cause is almost entirely unsafe sexual practice.

 

“We have an epidemic,” said Samkange.

 

Zimbabwe in 1997 had an HIV infection prevalence of 29 percent, but the figure has dropped to 13.7 percent this year.

 

It still means 1,029 people are dying each week, outstripping sevenfold the death rate from the severe cholera epidemic here in 2008.

 

But within five years, after the first phase of the campaign aiming at males between 13 and 29 years, “we will have an immediate fall in prevalence,” he said.

 

Across the 13 countries, over the full 15 year period of the campaign, it is expected to prevent 4 million new infections, and save US 20 billion in medical costs, forecasts the Washington-based Population Services International, one of the major drivers of the programme.

 

 

“The real value of male circumcision means that the person circumcised has protection for life, it happens only once and it cannot be taken away,” said Samkange.

 

 

But he adds that it is imperative that circumcision is complemented by the use of condoms and change in behaviour to safe sex, the message that drummed into volunteers during their several counselling sessions.

 

 

They especially have to be warned against men regarding circumcision as a licence for accelerated risky behaviour, says Samkange.

 

 

The alternative to prevention by circumcision, he says, is to flood the affected countries with anti-retroviral therapy (ART) medication, like Botswana, “so HIV-AIDS becomes like hypertension, that can be kept under control throughout people’s lives.”

 

But the cost is staggering.

 

In Zimbabwe, he said, “it will cost 400 million dollars to prevent, but 4 billion dollars to treat”.

 

Besides, says Elizabeth Matuka, the United Nations special envoy for Aids in Africa, despite the improvements in access to ART in the continent, “for every two people who are put on ART today, an additional five are newly infected by HIV”.

 

source: http://www.sowetanlive.co.za/news/2010/07/22/massive-circumcision-programme-under-way

[seeker630]

American Academy of Pediatricians: Circumcision is a no-brainer. It saves lives and saves money.

 

 

But the video says they 'did not recommend routine male circumcision' - wonder why they stopped short of that? (Just to be clear - the 'no brainer' comment is your own, apparently.)

[IntoHotGuys]

A massive circumcision campaign is being carried out in Africa to Stem the AIDS Epidemic

 

 

An unprecedented circumcision campaign covering 13 countries in East and Southern Africa is being unfolded in a bid to break the epidemic of AIDS

 

From Kenya to South Africa, hospitals and tented clinics in the bush offering free circumcision are almost in danger of being overwhelmed by men, bringing with them boys and infants.

 

Kenya has performed 120,000 circumcisions.

 

In Zimbabwe, the pilot phase of the campaign projected 2,000 volunteers, but got 2,800. In a small tent in the Makonde area north of Harare recently, three doctors circumcised 70 volunteers in three days.

 

According to details announced at the International AIDS Conference in Vienna this week, the campaign aims to circumcise 38 million males — 80 percent of all males under 49 years at a cost of 2.5 billion US dollars.

 

The rationale is simple - removal of the foreskin reduces the risk of HIV infection by 60 percent.

 

Over the envisaged 15-year campaign period, it is envisaged that AIDS and the HIV virus that causes it will be brought down to manageable levels.

 

Not long after AIDS emerged in the 1980s as a deadly global threat, public health experts noticed a curious set of contrasts in Africa.

 

In countries where circumcision was an inherent practice, like in North and West Africa where it is dictated largely by Islam, AIDS was not engulfing whole populations as it was in parts of the continent where the practice was rare.

 

The first large-scale tests to confirm the occurrence were done from 2004 in South Africa, Kenya and Uganda. They proved conclusively that half the 10,000 subjects who had volunteered to be circumcised recorded 60 percent less infections than the group that didn’t undergo the procedure.

 

The inside of the foreskin, says urologist Christopher Samkange, chief trainer for the Zimbabwean campaign, is almost the only skin surface of the human body without the barrier of cells with the protein keratin that makes the outer skin layer hard and impervious.

 

“That is the entry point for the virus,” he said. “It has no defence. Whatever goes under the foreskin will get into your body and survive.”

 

The block of 13 adjoining countries — from Kenya in the north, South Africa in the south, Namibia in the west and Mozambique in the east -make up the highest HIV-infected part of the world, where the cause is almost entirely unsafe sexual practice.

 

“We have an epidemic,” said Samkange.

 

Zimbabwe in 1997 had an HIV infection prevalence of 29 percent, but the figure has dropped to 13.7 percent this year.

 

It still means 1,029 people are dying each week, outstripping sevenfold the death rate from the severe cholera epidemic here in 2008.

 

But within five years, after the first phase of the campaign aiming at males between 13 and 29 years, “we will have an immediate fall in prevalence,” he said.

 

Across the 13 countries, over the full 15 year period of the campaign, it is expected to prevent 4 million new infections, and save US 20 billion in medical costs, forecasts the Washington-based Population Services International, one of the major drivers of the programme.

 

 

“The real value of male circumcision means that the person circumcised has protection for life, it happens only once and it cannot be taken away,” said Samkange.

 

 

But he adds that it is imperative that circumcision is complemented by the use of condoms and change in behaviour to safe sex, the message that drummed into volunteers during their several counselling sessions.

 

 

They especially have to be warned against men regarding circumcision as a licence for accelerated risky behaviour, says Samkange.

 

 

The alternative to prevention by circumcision, he says, is to flood the affected countries with anti-retroviral therapy (ART) medication, like Botswana, “so HIV-AIDS becomes like hypertension, that can be kept under control throughout people’s lives.”

 

But the cost is staggering.

 

In Zimbabwe, he said, “it will cost 400 million dollars to prevent, but 4 billion dollars to treat”.

 

Besides, says Elizabeth Matuka, the United Nations special envoy for Aids in Africa, despite the improvements in access to ART in the continent, “for every two people who are put on ART today, an additional five are newly infected by HIV”.

 

source: http://www.sowetanlive.co.za/news/2010/07/22/massive-circumcision-programme-under-way

 

It won't be long before pulling ALL your teeth out is the recommended way to prevent tooth-and-gum diseases, not good dental and mouth hygiene. It's not rocket science that once you have no more teeth, the rate of cavity is ZERO! Oh the Humanity!

[Steven_Draker]

I don't know about tooth extraction, but didn't Angelina Jolie had recently a double mastectomy?

 

Now that's a diversion and please note that I didn't give my opinion on circumcision.

[Newly]

Wonder how age would factor into this? Older Americans don't really know anything else and like all humans are scared of what they're not used to. I would expect the percentages to change fairly rapidly in the US since younger, more liberal parents don't seem to be as keen to subject their sons to this.

[Samai139]

Wonder how age would factor into this? Older Americans don't really know anything else and like all humans are scared of what they're not used to. I would expect the percentages to change fairly rapidly in the US since younger, more liberal parents don't seem to be as keen to subject their sons to this.

 

 

First: I am an older American (73) and uncut.

 

For anyone to say that "older Americans" don't really know anything else is a stretch. I've seen and had experience with cut and uncut men. If you are speaking about what parents would do when a son is born: not that many "older American" are having sons in their old age.

As the first post in this now extensive thread stated---the percentage of circumcision in the country is declining. Period.

My own opinion about why so many Americans were circumsized in the 20th century is that many more boys were born in hospitals and the procedure became the "norm," and most parents bought into it.