YngMotionXTrey in Pittsburgh

[rickster]

1 hour ago, DMonDude said:

[B]artering/negotiating is not the norm and is actively frowned upon by most people on both ends of the transaction in this hobby (particularly for new first time clients). 

I guess I'm not sure that is true or that a norm has been established.  It is true that many people simply say that is more than I can pay and terminate the discussion.  But there are people who actually actively negotiate and also people like OP who say that is beyond my budget, I usually pay x amount.  In many instances, the provider continues the conversation because they want the work, even if they are unhappy.  I don't think it is "insulting" to suggest a lower amount; discussion of pricing is a subject for negotiation for most services including this one.  But what I think is most troubling to OP, and I agree, is that the focus of this discussion seems to be blaming OP at least in part and attempting to "educate" him about the proper way to have the pricing discussion, instead of on the behavior of the provider.  [This is coming from someone who has not negotiated price except for one time when I said that is more than I expected, after which the provider tried to negotiate, which I did a bit until I realized the discussion made it too icky to move forward.]

[ErikEriksson]

I don't see how the OP was in any sort of error, and I'm surprised that there is so much discussion on if he was right or wrong in any way.  He simply stated that it was over budget, gave context of what he finds the usual market rate, and ended the interaction by thanking the escort for responding.  

These are business interactions.  It should be expected to establish a price for service.  One possible outcome of listing a price is that it will be too high for the person wanting the service.  Most business people would appreciate knowing why there service was declined.  Even if they are justified in their price or truly believe they are justified in their price, they should appreciate knowing that they were not hired because of the price.

The escort in this case is a racist and narcissist who has no business acumen.  

I have also told escorts that their rates were too high for me.  My responses in those situations have usually been similar to the OP in that I merely state that the price is higher than I am willing to pay, thank them for the response and wish them well.  I have never tried to negotiate a lower rate, but most of the time the escort has come back offering a lower rate.  I generally still would not hire them even if the lower rate was within the range of what I was willing to pay because I think there is a chance that the experience will not be good because the escort is not getting what he thinks he is worth even if it is ridiculous.  

I contacted one escort who was new to the profession about meeting for a 2-3 hour session.  Of course, the question of rate came up.  He quoted is rate as $750-1000/hour.  This young man obviously had no idea what he was doing, and in the subsequent communication, it became evident that I would have been his first client.  I gave him some friendly advice which included that a typical rate in that market was $200-300/hour.  I also told him what the expectations of his potential clients would be.  He came back and said he would do $200/h. I stuck to my typical approach at that point, and wished him luck but didn't ask to set an appointment.  

Three months later, I saw he was still on rentmen when I was looking through the profiles for his town which I was going to again for a business trip, so I messaged him just to ask him how things were going and how was business, as I was curious if my advise had any sort of effect.  He said business wasn't good, and inquired again if I would want to hire him and what all I would want to do.  I told him what my typical expectation was.  He said it all sounded good to him and that $200/h would be his rate for 2-3 h.  So, we had an agreement to meet at my hotel when I got into town.   On the night of the appointment, I messaged him when my plane took off, when it landed, and when I had the rental car and an ETA for arrival at the hotel.  He, in essence started from scratch again wanting to know my stats, what I wanted to do, etc.  He then wanted to know how long I would be in town, and if we could mee the next day.  He already knew I was just in town that night, working the next day, and flying out the next evening.  His approach of 'how long are you in town; let's meet tomorrow' when I already told him my schedule is unfortunately a common tactic with escorts.  So, in the end, it was all a waste of time.  At least he wasn't racist or insulting or didn't try to give me an 'education'.

[DMonDude]

10 hours ago, ErikEriksson said:

I don't see how the OP was in any sort of error, and I'm surprised that there is so much discussion on if he was right or wrong in any way.  He simply stated that it was over budget, gave context of what he finds the usual market rate, and ended the interaction by thanking the escort for responding.  

These are business interactions.  It should be expected to establish a price for service.  One possible outcome of listing a price is that it will be too high for the person wanting the service.  Most business people would appreciate knowing why there service was declined.  Even if they are justified in their price or truly believe they are justified in their price, they should appreciate knowing that they were not hired because of the price.

Multiple people already explained why this isn't the harmless thing you and OP think it was and why it lead this shitty provider react how he did. If you and @JayCeeKy refuse to see that, that's both of your prerogatives. There are literally dozens of threads on this forum about how providers hate haggling and clients hate being up charged on services. The price is the price specifically to avoid miscommunications and bad reactions like this, and OP did not simply state the providers listed rate was out of their budget. Which i specifically said would have been fine. And OP certainly isn't the first one to have declined the provider over their price, and like i said, if it was losing them substantial business they'd have already adjusted. OP isn't the special straw to break the camels back there.

OPs issue was the "well I'm used to a drastically lower specific price" which implies "and that's what you should come down to" or "so you're not worth what you listed". This is, however unintended, an initiation of negotiation and is a step beyond just declining the providers stated price and something providers generally don't do. If you and OP are refusing to accept that, that's you both making a choice despite people here telling you why it's an issue. You both are clearly just butt hurt the comments section didn't turn into a "oh poor OP" pitty party thread when the better takeaway is just accepting there's an easy way to not get this kind of reaction from a provider again.

Edited 2 hours ago by DMonDude
clarity

[ErikEriksson]

54 minutes ago, DMonDude said:

Multiple people already explained why this isn't the harmless thing you and OP think it was and why it lead this shitty provider react how he did. If you and @JayCeeKy refuse to see that, that's both of your prerogatives. There are literally dozens of threads on this forum about how providers hate haggling and clients hate being up charged on services. The price is the price specifically to avoid miscommunications and bad reactions like this, and OP did not simply state the providers listed rate was out of their budget. Which i specifically said would have been fine. And OP certainly isn't the first one to have declined the provider over their price, and like i said, if it was losing them substantial business they'd have already adjusted. OP isn't the special straw to break the camels back there.

OPs issue was the "well I'm used to a drastically lower specific price" which implies "and that's what you should come down to" or "so you're not worth what you listed". This is, however unintended, an initiation of negotiation and is a step beyond just declining the providers stated price and something providers generally don't do. If you and OP are refusing to accept that, that's you both making a choice despite people here telling you why it's an issue. You both are clearly just butt hurt the comments section didn't turn into a "oh poor OP" pitty party thread when the better takeaway is just accepting there's an easy way to not get this kind of reaction from a provider again.

You misquoted the OP.  The statement you have in quotations were not in the exchange of messages.  You are fabricating a story.  The OP provided a simple response and did not initiate a negotiation of price.

[JayCeeKy]

Thanks to @ErikEriksson, @nomad et al. for their cogent remarks that clarify the issues and correct fabricated quotes. 

I made my original post to call attention to what I viewed as an openly hateful remark by a new provider who apparently believes that using the anti-gay slur beginning with "f" is acceptable. What never occurred to me was that some people here would ignore or minimize the provider's offensive language almost entirely and instead focus on my passing comment that his rates were beyond my budget and what I typically spend.

I was even called a "jerk" simply because I had the audacity to suggest that I might be interested if there were room for negotiation at a lower price point. Apparently, even raising the possibility of negotiating a price is, to some, an unforgivable sin.

Now I read a member's comment with the equally absurd claim that there is some sort of unwritten - but supposedly universally accepted - rule prohibiting discussion or negotiation of rates. If that's true, used car salesmen everywhere must be envious of an industry where asking whether a price is negotiable is treated as a moral failing.

Gratefully, after being portrayed as a time-wasting, lowballing jerk, I received a private (and consoling) message from another member encouraging me to ignore the bullying and assuring me that I had done nothing wrong. I appreciate that sort of kindness and support, but it's difficult to ignore the fact that the conversation has been diverted away from what should have been the real issue: an openly derogatory slur directed at our still-targeted community.  Instead of condemning that behavior, some have chosen to criticize an entirely innocuous comment about my budget. To me, that shift in priorities is far more troubling than anything I wrote.