Escorts exposed for being Anti-black Racists

[+ José Soplanucas]

I'm just here to post info on providers being anti-black racist as it shows up online.

 

Do what you will with the information. It's your choice.

 

EDIT: I don't want to have a debate on this thread and don't want this kicked to the politics sub forum. If you want to discuss the political details, do it on another thread.

 

Now you really confused me. How can you not be discussing politics when you are accusing a provider of being racist?

[former lurker]

I did not want to use the expression before, because Trump has appropriated it However, its existence precedes Trumpism for centuries. We are in risk of starting a witch hunt.

 

I already made this distinction above, let's try a different approach. Again, one thing is when we are living our lives and we have a clash with a Racist or a potential Racist. Of course we have to do something about it, and making it public may be the right decision depending on the circumstances. (REMEMBER: EVERYTHING ALWAYS DEPENDS ON THE CIRCUMSTANCES. WITHOUT CONTEXT THERE IS NO MEANING AND WITH NO MEANING THERE IS NO POSSIBLE JUDGEMENT).

 

Another quite different thing is to go looking for Racists, digging out everything someone said and/or did sometimes many decades ago. We are reading it out of context, out of malice or out of blatant stupidity. We are ignoring our (everyone's) ability to learn and change and get better. We have Internet! We just have to google people and shit may pile on. This is substantially different. I think the hunting is just wrong, and would be terrible for our smaller communities and for our broader society.

 

If you want a preview of what could happen, take a look at Porn Twitter. Right now, porn performers are accusing each other, digging trash from many years ago now.

 

Definitely, PLEASE we should not do this.

 

I'd add to what you've said that a lot of the guys we're talking about are young, not overly educated, and trying to support themselves by being a more or less constant online presence. The more people live online through social media and related posts, the less likely they are to stop and think about what they are saying and how others might hear/see it. They are accustomed to being careless with their words. That's not a defense, but it does suggest that it's a disservice to simply place people on a list for all sorts of different comments and behaviors, especially online comments that may lack context or background. It's also not particularly helpful to group together someone who expresses a preference or evidences racial bias with those excusing the use of deadly force or advocating laws and actions that are discriminatory, oppressive and deadly.

[curiousbynature12]

...My friend mentioned to me a bunch of OnlyFans and JustForFans creators like Jake Orion and Dillon Anderson, plus pornstars have been called out for recent and past remarks related to the issue.

 

For context, this is the tweet that got Jake Orion in trouble. Here is also his apology.

 

Dillon Anderson got called out for not using his platform to talk about George Floyd and the protests. He's also shared his preferences on Tumblr in the past, which may also get him in trouble.

[curiousbynature12]

.....Definitely, PLEASE we should not do this.

 

I am going to keep doing this. If you don't want to see or contribute, you do not have to be here.

 

 

Now you really confused me. How can you not be discussing politics when you are accusing a provider of being racist?

 

Racism absolutely is political, but this thread is about listing out providers and content creators who have been "exposed" as racists. The discussion of their racism and the larger racism in gay culture can be had elsewhere, but not here.

 

The point is to add transparency and a bit of context. From there, people can make their own decisions.

[curiousbynature12]

I'd add to what you've said that a lot of the guys we're talking about are young, not overly educated, and trying to support themselves by being a more or less constant online presence. The more people live online through social media and related posts, the less likely they are to stop and think about what they are saying and how others might hear/see it. They are accustomed to being careless with their words. That's not a defense, but it does suggest that it's a disservice to simply place people on a list for all sorts of different comments and behaviors, especially online comments that may lack context or background. It's also not particularly helpful to group together someone who expresses a preference or evidences racial bias with those excusing the use of deadly force or advocating laws and actions that are discriminatory, oppressive and deadly.

 

I didn't state that these people should be "canceled". I personally do not like cancel culture as I don't think people actually get cancelled, and it doesn't give them space to evolve and possibly become better people. However, as a client, that may not be my primary concern, and being involved with someone who can't manage their behavior online is a liability.

 

You are also making some generalizations (see the bold) that does not reflect all or arguably most providers.

 

If you want to discuss racial bias and how that may or may not link with people's positions on policing, please do that on another thread in the Politics sub-forum.

[CuriousByNature]

Perhaps one option would be for sites to offer an 'Avoid List' feature as well as a 'Buddy List'. There are many reasons why someone may not be adviseable for contacting aside from racist and political attitudes they may harbour. But I completely understand why the OP has focused on the racism factor given the horrendous things that are going on currently and the terrible history of discrimination in the US (and here in Canada).

[Becket]

This smacks of witch hunts. Or, more recently, high schools, colleges, and other young groups trying to weed out "the fags." Racism is endemic. But you gonna label every dude with the scarlet R who ever told a joke about race, who made a choice because of race. Count me OUT of this clusterfuck.

[curiousbynature12]

This smacks of witch hunts. Or, more recently, high schools, colleges, and other young groups trying to weed out "the fags." Racism is endemic. But you gonna label every dude with the scarlet R who ever told a joke about race, who made a choice because of race. Count me OUT of this clusterfuck.

 

...Yet you still took the time to post and bump the thread. Thanks Becket! ☺

[former lurker]

For context, this is the tweet that got Jake Orion in trouble. Here is also his apology.

 

Dillon Anderson got called out for not using his platform to talk about George Floyd and the protests. He's also shared his preferences on Tumblr in the past, which may also get him in trouble.

 

I think the two examples of Orion and Dillon Anderson illustrate how much of a hornets' nest any "list" would entail unless there was fairly clear cut criteria for placement on the list. Orion, in talking about White Lives Matter, etc, proves he doesn't get it. He's also proves himself to be concerned only with himself. He rejects calls for him to donate money to Black Lives Matter type groups, and says he "could" donate to orphans and other worthy causes but never says he does or will. And even if he did say so, who'd believe him -- he lies about everything until his subscriptions drop and he has to come clean.

 

Dillon is making a different statement entirely. He's rejecting the notion that porn performers with an online porn following are obligated to speak out on social issues. That's not a racist statement, it's a non-statement. Nor is expressing a preference for his own videos clearly racist. He may simply be thinking about what his viewers like to see, and what he thinks looks good with him on screen. It's not like he's working for a studio and refusing to work with Black models. It reminds me of how Michael Jordan has been criticized for not using his popularity to back causes and candidates back when he was the biggest star in the NBA. Jordan famously quipped that Republicans buy sneakers, too. Magic Johnson never took political stances until after he retired from playing and no longer relied heavily on endorsements. He became a property owner, business investor, and developer. Well after he stopped playing in the NBA, he became a Hillary Clinton supporter.

 

Players today are more apt to be open on political and hot button social issues. LeBron James has been. But LeBron, as much as he earns in endorsements, earns more from his NBA contract than from endorsements. Tiger Woods is the opposite -- he earns a ton from endorsements and relatively little from golf play.

 

So, we're now going to label people for NOT saying things as well as those who DO say racist things?

[former lurker]

I didn't state that these people should be "canceled". I personally do not like cancel culture as I don't think people actually get cancelled, and it doesn't give them space to evolve and possibly become better people. However, as a client, that may not be my primary concern, and being involved with someone who can't manage their behavior online is a liability.

 

You are also making some generalizations (see the bold) that does not reflect all or arguably most providers.

 

If you want to discuss racial bias and how that may or may not link with people's positions on policing, please do that on another thread in the Politics sub-forum.

 

First, I didn't reference "cancel culture". Second, I don't think the bolded comments are unwarranted. Of course there are more mature, better educated performers in porn, but those are not the ones who tend to make careless statements about race, and they are not a majority of the performers.

[+ José Soplanucas]

When do not allow opening threads with unvetted reviews of providers. There is a good reason for that. We are talking about people who make their lives from sex and/or adult entertainment, and we must be extremely cautious. Not only we are talking about their profession, but we are also talking about highly stigmatized and often marginalized jobs.

 

Still, @curiousbynature12 you want to open a thread for people to freely drop the Racist label. I understand we are all triggered and fired up. Hell, I am. But your idea is just WRONG. Think about it. Who decides who is Racist and who is not. Social Media? I beg you to reconsider your suggestion and to ask the admins to close this thread or to move it to the Politics forum.

[curiousbynature12]

I think the two examples of Orion and Dillon Anderson illustrate how much of a hornets' nest any "list" would entail unless there was fairly clear cut criteria for placement on the list. Orion, in talking about White Lives Matter, etc, proves he doesn't get it. He's also proves himself to be concerned only with himself. He rejects calls for him to donate money to Black Lives Matter type groups, and says he "could" donate to orphans and other worthy causes but never says he does or will. And even if he did say so, who'd believe him -- he lies about everything until his subscriptions drop and he has to come clean.

 

Dillon is making a different statement entirely. He's rejecting the notion that porn performers with an online porn following are obligated to speak out on social issues. That's not a racist statement, it's a non-statement. Nor is expressing a preference for his own videos clearly racist. He may simply be thinking about what his viewers like to see, and what he thinks looks good with him on screen. It's not like he's working for a studio and refusing to work with Black models. It reminds me of how Michael Jordan has been criticized for not using his popularity to back causes and candidates back when he was the biggest star in the NBA. Jordan famously quipped that Republicans buy sneakers, too. Magic Johnson never took political stances until after he retired from playing and no longer relied heavily on endorsements. He became a property owner, business investor, and developer. Well after he stopped playing in the NBA, he became a Hillary Clinton supporter.

 

Players today are more apt to be open on political and hot button social issues. LeBron James has been. But LeBron, as much as he earns in endorsements, earns more from his NBA contract than from endorsements. Tiger Woods is the opposite -- he earns a ton from endorsements and relatively little from golf play.

 

So, we're now going to label people for NOT saying things as well as those who DO say racist things?

 

Cool. I added the context. If you don't think it's racist, ok. You should make a post elsewhere about that.

[curiousbynature12]

First, I didn't reference "cancel culture". Second, I don't think the bolded comments are unwarranted. Of course there are more mature, better educated performers in porn, but those are not the ones who tend to make careless statements about race, and they are not a majority of the performers.

 

Ok, but I wanted to be clear that I wasn't doing this because of cancel culture.

 

People who make racist/racial statements come from broad walks of life. Educated or not. Mature (which is not always tied to age) or immature.

[curiousbynature12]

When do not allow opening threads with unvetted reviews of providers. There is a good reason for that. We are talking about people who make their lives from sex and/or adult entertainment, and we must be extremely cautious. Not only we are talking about their profession, but we are also talking about highly stigmatized and often marginalized jobs.

 

Still, @curiousbynature12 you want to open a thread for people to freely drop the Racist label. I understand we are all triggered and fired up. Hell, I am. But your idea is just WRONG. Think about it. Who decides who is Racist and who is not. Social Media? I beg you to reconsider your suggestion and to ask the admins to close this thread or to move it to the Politics forum.

 

The premise of these posts were clear in my op. Also these are not reviews - that's not allowed in this subforum.

 

Sex workers are professionals. This thread doesn't accuse people of being racist, just that they are accused of making them in public.

 

No one is forcing you to be here. Take your fragility elsewhere if this hiring criterion is too sensitive a topic for you.

[former lurker]

Ok, but I wanted to be clear that I wasn't doing this because of cancel culture.

 

People who make racist/racial statements come from broad walks of life. Educated or not. Mature (which is not always tied to age) or immature.

 

As to the variety of people's backgrounds, I agree. But that's not what I'm talking about. I'm saying that there are a lot of young guys with little in the way of post-secondary education or professional experience, and that they are constantly posting perhaps without care or insight into how they sound. As an attorney, the worst stuff I'd see was in the emails my clients' employees would write and send. People tend to be careless with email. Now, the explosion of social media has people acting the same way in public formats.

[marylander1940]

When do not allow opening threads with unvetted reviews of providers. There is a good reason for that. We are talking about people who make their lives from sex and/or adult entertainment, and we must be extremely cautious. Not only we are talking about their profession, but we are also talking about highly stigmatized and often marginalized jobs.

 

Still, @curiousbynature12 you want to open a thread for people to freely drop the Racist label. I understand we are all triggered and fired up. Hell, I am. But your idea is just WRONG. Think about it. Who decides who is Racist and who is not. Social Media? I beg you to reconsider your suggestion and to ask the admins to close this thread or to move it to the Politics forum.

 

Nice try after calling racist folks who disagree with you.

 

SO many providers have been badmouthed and even accused of crimes like theft and rape on here by anonymous posters... If an escort says something racist on a tweet and it's later picked up by the "gay press" at least we can see a pic of it on here. I hope you don't believe in the Roseanne excuse of "Ambien made me do it"!

 

A racist post by an escort/pornstar might backfire considering most gay men are liberals but there's a market out there of clients who only hire guys who believe in "conservative values" whatever that means now a days. Some guys might seek promotion out of saying something outrageous to most of us.

 

If you think this thread should we moved or deleted you could have asked on here without having to post and bump it back to the top of the deli.

[former lurker]

The premise of these posts were clear in my op. Also these are not reviews - that's not allowed in this subforum.

 

Sex workers are professionals. This thread doesn't accuse people of being racist, just that they are accused of making them in public.

 

No one is forcing you to be here. Take your fragility elsewhere if this hiring criterion is too sensitive a topic for you.

 

That's an odd statement re: fragility. You floated an idea to collect the names of people accused of being racist. You got some push back. You show no indication of willingness to adapt or revise your view in light of the comments you've received. Who's evidencing fragility?

[former lurker]

Nice try after calling racist folks who disagree with you.

 

SO many providers have been badmouthed and even accused of crimes like theft and rape on here by anonymous posters... If an escort says something racist on a tweet and it's later picked up by the "gay press" at least we can see a pic of it on here. I hope you don't believe in the Roseanne excuse of "Ambien made me do it"!

 

A racist post by an escort/pornstar might backfire considering most gay men are liberals but there's a market out there of clients who only hire guys who believe in "conservative values" whatever that means now a days. Some guys might seek promotion out of saying something outrageous to most of us.

 

If you think this thread should we moved or deleted you could have asked on here without having to post and bump it back to the top of the deli.

 

That's fine as far as it goes -- if it's posting or linking the "evidence". But what tends to happen is porn performer A says/writes something. Follower B then labels and describes what A said/wrote, but doesn't always link or reproduce the original statement/writing. Then, a comment is made here or on another forum and is "evidenced" not by supplying the offending statement/writing but what B has said about it.

 

But no one is censoring anyone. Posters can post what they see fit, within the rules. Other posters are free to challenge.

[marylander1940]

That's fine as far as it goes -- if it's posting or linking the "evidence". But what tends to happen is porn performer A says/writes something. Follower B then labels and describes what A said/wrote, but doesn't always link or reproduce the original statement/writing. Then, a comment is made here or on another forum and is "evidenced" not by supplying the offending statement/writing but what B has said about it.

 

But no one is censoring anyone. Posters can post what they see fit, within the rules. Other posters are free to challenge.

 

That was fast!

 

We're the owner of our silence and the slave of our words.

 

We can always apologize, take back or move on if we say something that is not received in a positive way.

 

Freedom and responsibility!

 

If A says something and B thinks that was racist and A shouldn't be working for Just For Fans, I'll read it and I'll make up my own mind about what A said. We must always go to the source of what A posted online.

 

We're are anonymous on here but having a blog or demonstrating in the streets shouldn't turn us into a celebrity and not even a reality TV star like the president.

[+ José Soplanucas]

The premise of these posts were clear in my op. Also these are not reviews - that's not allowed in this subforum.

 

Sex workers are professionals. This thread doesn't accuse people of being racist, just that they are accused of making them in public.

 

No one is forcing you to be here. Take your fragility elsewhere if this hiring criterion is too sensitive a topic for you.

 

The only one being sensitive here is you. I am appealing to reason. If you think your irrational and childish reactions and responses move one hair fro my bald head, you are drunk. Other members also call you, with empathy, to reconsider your proposal, and you chose to respond with bitching.

 

Usually I would troll you out of your mind. But because I empathize with your motivations and think that perhaps you are just as fired up as I was a couple of days ago, I give you a pass.

 

After appealing at your good senses several times, I am reporting this thread. It should be moved to the Political forums or closed, in my humble opinion. But it is @Guy Fawkes ' team decision.

[curiousbynature12]

The only one being sensitive here is you. I am appealing to reason. If you think your irrational and childish reactions and responses move one hair fro my bald head, you are drunk. Other members also call you, with empathy, to reconsider your proposal, and you chose to respond with bitching.

 

Usually I would troll you out of your mind. But because I empathize with your motivations and think that perhaps you are just as fired up as I was a couple of days ago, I give you a pass.

 

After appealing at your good senses several times, I am reporting this thread. It should be moved to the Political forums or closed, in my humble opinion. But it is @Guy Fawkes ' team decision.

 

This response doesn't seem to be rational. Are you ok? Did you have a bad day, latbear4blk?

[marylander1940]

The only one being sensitive here is you. I am appealing to reason. If you think your irrational and childish reactions and responses move one hair fro my bald head, you are drunk. Other members also call you, with empathy, to reconsider your proposal, and you chose to respond with bitching.

 

Usually I would troll you out of your mind. But because I empathize with your motivations and think that perhaps you are just as fired up as I was a couple of days ago, I give you a pass.

 

After appealing at your good senses several times, I am reporting this thread. It should be moved to the Political forums or closed, in my humble opinion. But it is @Guy Fawkes ' team decision.

 

Is calling someone racist based on his own public words wrong?

 

Folks should think before posting online, specially if they think there a mix between a pornstar and an influencer.

[Beancounter]

I wonder how the Dixie Chicks feel about all of this. Maybe we should ask Earl!

[Beancounter]

I’m old enough to remember the McCarthy era. I’m not ready for a repeat.

[Guest]

I agree with many here that preemptively rejecting clients in your ad copy based on race is a revolting practice. I'm usually very hesitant to criticise fellow providers but racial discrimination crosses a line.

 

That said, I also agree with many others here that launching an open season on call-outs is not the way to go about it. It's just too susceptible to abuse. My suggestion is to save it for threads about the providers in question, whenever those threads may arise. That way, one person's accusation can be seen in the context of all others' experiences with the escort. Plus, it might be a good reminder of the work to be done on equality in sex work months from now, when our immediate attention has moved on from these protests and the surrounding discourse.