Jaroslav

@Simon Suraci, the clue that I was speaking hyperbolically was “my cynicism.” 😜

Another reason I don’t do in-calls. Meeting in a public place is a good idea if either of you is unsure.

My cynicism says this is the case 9:10 times…

Then happy error! Groceries haven’t decreased in any noteworthy way!

I read a different take on those same stats. Same hard numbers, but that the 0.2% decrease in grocery prices was “negligible” and “statistical noise.” According to what I read, gas and grocery prices continue to be unaffected by a decrease in inflation overall. For perspective… Groceries in 2021, $100 Groceries in June 2022, $109.10, 9.1% increase Groceries in March 2023, $108.79, 0.2% decrease Big savings!

One is ultimately responsible for oneself. We forget that. But I’m not going to disbelieve an escort who says he’s on PreP either. I’m on it so I’m not too concerned, at least about HIV. Monitoring your health and condition should be something you’re doing even if you haven’t been fucking escorts. If you develop a strange rash, see a doctor, regardless of sexual history. That seems self-evident to me.

I disagree. I have no interest in giving my money to anyone or any organization that works against my own rights and liberty. So it’s good for me to know that someone is that motivated to be outspoken in such a way that jeopardizes their professional life. That means they’re invested in it and motivated against me. The death row inmate doesn’t willingly sharpen the executioner’s blade… Unrelated to politics, I can’t be the only one who’s immediately turned off when I hear a provider has done straight porn, can I? I sometimes even hesitate with guys who are bi. Perhaps that’s discriminatory against bi guys, but I really prefer gay guys.

All these are treatable. Even HIV. And in a city of 10 million, 2000 cases is small. I’m not saying that you should ignore the potential for STDs nor take them seriously. But I don’t wear a hazmat suit to go out into the plant at work simply because there’s dangerous chemicals about. When approached appropriately, we can be okay. Absent a spill, hazmat suit unneeded. Absent a known infection, or if you’re on PreP and so is he, all you’re really protecting is your peace of mind.

Doubtful if you and the provider are doing other precautions aside from a condom.

Perhaps it’s a bit foolhardy, but to my knowledge, treated STDs (not just HIV) are quite manageable and no longer a death sentence. Given the cost of hiring, it’s probably safe to assume that guys who are engaging escorts can afford treatment for an STD if they should contract one. Add to that that many providers are also on PreP and take other precautions for other STDs, it’s hardly a life risk to go bareback. It’s some risk. Of course. So is walking across the street downtown, but people do it. Or taking your mask off in public now with COVID still among us. It’s a (consciously) calculated risk, but not one that carries with it the danger it once did.

That hasn’t been my experience. I used to be hesitant to ask about bareback, especially if it’s posted safe only, but I have yet to have a guy say no to it or charge more.

I’ve bitten my tongue in other threads on this topic but this thread seems alive again. Since reading the indignation of some in this thread over never hearing of a session less than an hour, I’ve read both clients and providers write about it here, speaking on another topic. So it’s very much something folks in this place are aware of and have done. Now, some here may not have read those topics, or if they did, they didn’t pick up on it. Either way – settle yourselves. Less than an hour isn’t crazy or unheard of. It’s even come up in supporting details in conversation here!

@DWnyc, we’ve all deluded ourselves and been the nice guy. Experience hardens the heart like atherosclerosis!

Eh. I’ll pass.

Kollege, “colleague,” which carry with it connotation of “work friend” Kommiltone, “classmate,” but at an institution of higher learning. Generally someone you actually interact with, not the person on the other side of the lecture hall. Bekannte, “acquaintance,” but can be more like the friend of a friend too. If you go out to eat with a Freund and they bring along a Freund of theirs who isn’t your Freund but you’ve met before and chatted it up socially, that’s also just a Bekannte.

@DWnyc, the regular in question who told me he found ghosting rude but ended up ghosting me received gifts from me in addition to payment, even when he wasn’t immediately going to be with me. And I paid for a trip to Europe with him (completely) for which he was also paid for his “time.”

Because you have your head on screwed on tight and don’t live in a fantasy world. You seem to me very reasonable and sensible – in touch with reality.

@Wolfer, I’ve felt it too. That’s why I can articulate it. You are not alone.

Don’t you realize? A provider is entitled to that! We clients should understand our place. We should be giddy to pay them for as little possible done! Smallest bang for our buck! (Meant with all musterable snark)

And ego. And lest we forget – all money exchanged is *strictly* for time… 😉

My ORIGINAL question had nothing to do with friendship. The conversation went that way over the course of the thread. The first poster to speak of “friend(ly)” was @Unicorn. My question was about who’s providing services to whom in, what I clearly assumed wrongly for the sake of generality, are the most common circumstances. Because we have to point to exceptions to the rule, we have to have such a broad understanding as to be meaningless. Got it 👍🏻 Either way, thanks for telling me what I’m interested in. I needed that clarification what’s going on in my own mind and I’m glad you, of all possible folks, could step up and tell me what I’m interested in. Was that a free estimate or do I owe you for that transaction, dear concerned friend? I can call you friend, right? Since this is a transaction, a human interaction?

I really don’t know what you’re arguing. Or why. The nature is a transactional relationship. Sure – all human interaction is transactional if you argue to the extreme, but living with someone in exchange for sex is a lot more extreme than an infant relying on a parent to care for them, although the infant is getting security and the parent (hopefully) satisfaction. Someone who “pays” someone to provide for them with sex is still paying, just not with currency. The nature of that arrangement, and that transaction, ends if one or both parties decide to terminate it. If a parent chose to terminate the “transaction” with their infant it would be whole lot different than a sugar daddy terminating a live-in relationship with a boy. How that’s not a clear distinction I don’t quite understand. Whatever the case, I’m not convinced and won’t be convinced that a transactional, quid pro quo relationship, no matter the means of transaction, between a provider and a client is a friendship unless the nature of the transaction changed. Sure. Friends receive mutual satisfaction from their friends, but until a client and an provider move on to that level, I simply refuse to see it as something other than business. Even if you genuinely like each other. I don’t need to be everyone’s friend. The thing about providers and clients is that the kind of activity shared together is often overlapped with friends and more-than-friends. So it’s important to keep in mind what is actually happening to protect yourself from disappointment or emotional entanglement. People are complex. You can have a friendly relationship with someone you do business with and not be friends. It’s okay in fact. I really have nothing more to say about this because I feel I’ve said it all and I’m starting to repeat myself.

It is. A means of trade need not be currency. cf. Bartering is a good example. Again…transactional relationships aren’t bad. But they’re transactional – something for something. Not a bad thing. Let’s just be honest about it.

When you say “in exchange” it means it’s a transaction. Why is it so bad to admit that it’s a transaction? I don’t have a problem with that, nor do I see it as pessimistic or optimistic. It’s facts. Reality. Not good or bad. Just is. Akin to saying someone’s a cocksucker. Why is that an insult? I enjoying a good cocksucker 😜 But still, if something is done “in exchange” for something, whatever the case, it’s a transaction. If you’d do it, or someone else would do it for the simple reason they like/love you, that’s different than “I get housing out of this if I have sex with this guy.” Again, not anything wrong with that. But it is a transaction. I for one would love that kind of transactional relationship with a guy. But it’d important for me to always remember as long as that’s the basis of the relationship, if, say for some reason I couldn’t provide the housing anymore or he wanted to move on because he could provide for himself now, then the relationship would end, at least under that arrangement. And that too is okay. But a transactional relationship (a relationship that has as a major component something done “in exchange” for something, especially explicitly) is one that is inherently different than a friendship. I for my part don’t need to be “friends” with every Tom, Dick, and Harry. Nor do I want to be.

Not the point, folks. The point is that a relationship that is typical in the client-provider relationship, even if friendly, isn’t friendship. Even if there are exceptions (“exception to the rule” exists as an expression for a reason), they’re exceptions, not the norm. Escorts-client relationships aren’t as a general rule friendships. Believe that they are at your own risk of emotional distress. Maybe you’ll win the psychological roulette. I’m not spinning the cylinder. Sorry if I offended anyone.