STD Etiquette

[tenderloin]

Curious to get the group's thoughts on this one:

 

I have seen a very nice, very sexy guy a few times - one of the few times I have felt a real comfort re personality as well as some sexual magic. We hang out afterwards and can chat easily. He will remain unnamed.

 

Recently I discovered that he had given me some nasty (but curable) STDs - I had a few weeks of significant discomfort and medical costs to get things cleaned up. He was the only person I saw during this period, so there is no doubt as to the origin - he tested positive for the same STDs. He acknowledged it, was appalled and embarrassed, apologized profusely, and got himself to a clinic.

 

We've talked about getting together again, hence my question: do you think it is fair or reasonable of me to expect that I might get a little bit of a courtesy discount to make up for the expense and inconvenience I have been put through? Or is this simply the risk one takes, a la caveat emptor? I totally understand that this is the guy's income, but I guess I was hoping, as a repeat customer and someone with whom he seems to have a nice connection, he might be willing to "make it up" to me in some way. Thoughts? Thanks in advance.

[TruthBTold]

No. In any sexual encounter you take a risk. If he has a discount for being a repeat customer then fine. Otherwise, I don't think so.

[KennF]

Not to be indelicate, and please don't take offense...

 

While I acknowledge that you may have been with him during the time frame in question, are you sure the transmission wasn't the other way? If you are, that's fine. Just thought I should address the white elephant in the room.

 

As for the discount, I think you are not entitled to a discount for several reasons.

1) You most like share the responsibility for the transmission. I presume condoms could have prevented the situation.

2) You hired him for his time and companionship. He gave you that. You obviously were satisfied with his service, or you wouldn't be considering going back for more.

3) Would you feel obligated to pay him for his medical costs if the transmission were the other way? Further, would you have been willing to pay for the medical costs of everyone that interacted with him had you been the originating source?

4) He has no control over your medical costs. He doesn't know if it would cost you a $5 copay, or, $250 for out-of-network, or, free from a neighborhood outreach clinic, or, whether you lost time at work.

5) He didn't do it on purpose.

(If he did, then you are asking for all sorts of problems.)

 

On the other hand, he may choose to do something special for you in recompense, just as a matter of customer service, like, extending a session, or taking you out on his dime, or in some other way. That would be a great touch.

 

Again, I don't mean to offend.

[MikeBiDude]

No!

[tenderloin]

Not to be indelicate, and please don't take offense...

 

While I acknowledge that you may have been with him during the time frame in question, are you sure the transmission wasn't the other way? If you are, that's fine. Just thought I should address the white elephant in the room.

 

As for the discount, I think you are not entitled to a discount for several reasons.

1) You most like share the responsibility for the transmission. I presume condoms could have prevented the situation.

2) You hired him for his time and companionship. He gave you that. You obviously were satisfied with his service, or you wouldn't be considering going back for more.

3) Would you feel obligated to pay him for his medical costs if the transmission were the other way? Further, would you have been willing to pay for the medical costs of everyone that interacted with him had you been the originating source?

4) He has no control over your medical costs. He doesn't know if it would cost you a $5 copay, or, $250 for out-of-network, or, free from a neighborhood outreach clinic, or, whether you lost time at work.

5) He didn't do it on purpose.

(If he did, then you are asking for all sorts of problems.)

 

On the other hand, he may choose to do something special for you in recompense, just as a matter of customer service, like, extending a session, or taking you out on his dime, or in some other way. That would be a great touch.

 

Again, I don't mean to offend.

 

No offense taken. Without getting into detailed mechanics, I can confirm without doubt that the transmission went from him to me. He acknowledges that too. Reasonable question, but no doubt here. ; )

 

Would I feel obligated to pay him for his medical costs if the transmission were the other way? Yes. As a business man (in another line of work LOL), if I or my employees caused a client expense, discomfort, or other loss, I would certainly do whatever it takes to compensate the client and keep them as a client.

 

For what it is worth, while he did provide a service, he (and many others) advertise "STD Free" (right, not worth much).

[KennF]

he (and many others) advertise "STD Free" (right, not worth much).

 

And for all he knew, he was.

[hornytwells]

No offense taken. Without getting into detailed mechanics, I can confirm without doubt that the transmission went from him to me. He acknowledges that too. Reasonable question, but no doubt here. ; )

 

Would I feel obligated to pay him for his medical costs if the transmission were the other way? Yes. As a business man (in another line of work LOL), if I or my employees caused a client expense, discomfort, or other loss, I would certainly do whatever it takes to compensate the client and keep them as a client.

 

For what it is worth, while he did provide a service, he (and many others) advertise "STD Free" (right, not worth much).

Your response is admirable, but as previous poster said, the responsibility is ultimately yours when you enter into a sexual encounter. It is unfortunate, but one would assume he was unaware of his condition at the time, hence "STD free" but when I see that I never assume that it is accurate, for any number of reasons. In your situation, while I would appreciate the gesture on the escorts part if he were financially in a position to make it, I would certainly not expect it.

if you caught a cold from your partner or close friend, would you expect them to compensate you for any medical costs it entailed, or loss of income from days off work?

[Pulgasari1991]

We've talked about getting together again, hence my question: do you think it is fair or reasonable of me to expect that I might get a little bit of a courtesy discount to make up for the expense and inconvenience I have been put through? Or is this simply the risk one takes, a la caveat emptor? I totally understand that this is the guy's income, but I guess I was hoping, as a repeat customer and someone with whom he seems to have a nice connection, he might be willing to "make it up" to me in some way. Thoughts? Thanks in advance.

 

Are you just kind of curious, or is this actually relevant-relevant to you?

 

IMHO you'd better not ask nor expect, it's just easier that way. But it's up to you and how you feel, in the end.

[+ Avalon]

I hope that he informed others that he may have infected.

[tenderloin]

if you caught a cold from your partner or close friend, would you expect them to compensate you for any medical costs it entailed, or loss of income from days off work?

 

No, but then again my partner or friend is not providing a service for which he is being compensated.

[hornytwells]

No, but then again my partner or friend is not providing a service for which he is being compensated.

they might be...... my point was that I feel its a risk you take when you enter into the transaction. I understand your feelings, but in answer to your initial question my gut feeling is no

[FTM Zachary Prince]

No, but then again my partner or friend is not providing a service for which he is being compensated.

 

The service that you've paid for was the escort's time... He provided you with the time you paid for, and you even derived enough value from it to want to meet with him again, therefore IMO it seems unreasonable to expect a discount on a future session based on the compensated nature of the encounter.

 

It's not unreasonable for you to hope that he does something to make it up to you though. On a personal/emotional level I could see why you might feel like he should. There are lots of ways for someone to show that they appreciate your good-natured response to an awkward situation, especially when it comes to a client-provider relationship. I would suggest that you remove any expectations from your mind about how this should happen and just allow the escort to show you his appreciation in his own personal way.

 

Is this simply the risk one takes? Yes, yes it is. As escorts, we don't receive paid sick leave and don't qualify for any kind of liability insurance. The escort already had to bear the financial liability of his own treatment expenses & unpaid sick leave during whatever time he had off while treating himself for and recovering from these STIs. It's not fair to expect him to bear the liability of your expenses (and everyone else's who he might have unknowingly infected) too, even in the form of an innocent courtesy discount. It places all the responsibility on him for what in actuality was a mutual decision between the two of you.

 

Remember, it's your responsibility to educate yourself about the risks involved in sexual activity. If you're educated about them already, then you know that you should always assume there is a chance that someone who is sexually active with multiple partners could have an STI. When you willingly choose to engage in sexually risky behaviour with someone who could have an STI, you should accept the liability for whatever consequences result from your choice.

 

You paid the escort for his time. You could have chosen to sit around and watch Netflix, cuddle and jerk off. You made the choice to enjoy sexually risky behaviour with someone who you knew was sexually active with multiple partners. You hopefully chose someone who is getting tested regularly and practicing a level of safer sex that matches your comfort level... but you still ultimately have to acknowledge that you knowingly took the risk.

 

I'm not judging you at all; I apologise if it sounds that way... I'm just saying... I don't think he owes you anything, and you'll probably have a better experience with this escort moving forward if you can accept your own responsibility in the situation and let go of any expectations for courtesy discounts, etc.

[tenderloin]

The service that you've paid for was the escort's time... He provided you with the time you paid for, and you even derived enough value from it to want to meet with him again, therefore IMO it seems unreasonable to expect a discount on a future session based on the compensated nature of the encounter.

 

It's not unreasonable for you to hope that he does something to make it up to you though. On a personal/emotional level I could see why you might feel like he should. There are lots of ways for someone to show that they appreciate your good-natured response to an awkward situation, especially when it comes to a client-provider relationship. I would suggest that you remove any expectations from your mind about how this should happen and just allow the escort to show you his appreciation in his own personal way.

 

Is this simply the risk one takes? Yes, yes it is. As escorts, we don't receive paid sick leave and don't qualify for any kind of liability insurance. The escort already had to bear the financial liability of his own treatment expenses & unpaid sick leave during whatever time he had off while treating himself for and recovering from these STIs. It's not fair to expect him to bear the liability of your expenses (and everyone else's who he might have unknowingly infected) too, even in the form of an innocent courtesy discount. It places all the responsibility on him for what in actuality was a mutual decision between the two of you.

 

Remember, it's your responsibility to educate yourself about the risks involved in sexual activity. If you're educated about them already, then you know that you should always assume there is a chance that someone who is sexually active with multiple partners could have an STI. When you willingly choose to engage in sexually risky behaviour with someone who could have an STI, you should accept the liability for whatever consequences result from your choice.

 

You paid the escort for his time. You could have chosen to sit around and watch Netflix, cuddle and jerk off. You made the choice to enjoy sexually risky behaviour with someone who you knew was sexually active with multiple partners. You hopefully chose someone who is getting tested regularly and practicing a level of safer sex that matches your comfort level... but you still ultimately have to acknowledge that you knowingly took the risk.

 

I'm not judging you at all; I apologise if it sounds that way... I'm just saying... I don't think he owes you anything, and you'll probably have a better experience with this escort moving forward if you can accept your own responsibility in the situation and let go of any expectations for courtesy discounts, etc.

 

 

No need to apologize. To be clear, I am not expecting and did not write that the escort was responsible for my medical costs. I am not "demanding" anything. And I acknowledge my responsibility. You will note that I have not shared his name, and was actually quite reasonable in contacting him and alerting him in a non-confrontational way about the STI.

 

Instead, I am asking a question about what i think to be smart client service.

[mike carey]

I don't think he owes you anything, and you'll probably have a better experience with this escort moving forward if you can accept your own responsibility in the situation and let go of any expectations for courtesy discounts, etc.

I know this is absolutely not what you were saying, but as I read your words I thought 'you'll probably have a better experience' was a true statement in a different context. If @tenderloin continues to see this escort, regardless of the financial aspects, the fundamental nature of the relationship will have changed, most likely for the better. There would be a degree of understanding between them from their shared experience of that infection.

[FTM Zachary Prince]

I meant it in that way too actually. Accepting shared responsiblity would increase the sense of shared experience between the two of them, or that's how I see it anyway...

 

There are benefits to having a special place in an escort's heart that are more valuable than discounts.

[marylander1940]

Curious to get the group's thoughts on this one:

 

I have seen a very nice, very sexy guy a few times - one of the few times I have felt a real comfort re personality as well as some sexual magic. We hang out afterwards and can chat easily. He will remain unnamed.

 

Recently I discovered that he had given me some nasty (but curable) STDs - I had a few weeks of significant discomfort and medical costs to get things cleaned up. He was the only person I saw during this period, so there is no doubt as to the origin - he tested positive for the same STDs. He acknowledged it, was appalled and embarrassed, apologized profusely, and got himself to a clinic.

 

We've talked about getting together again, hence my question: do you think it is fair or reasonable of me to expect that I might get a little bit of a courtesy discount to make up for the expense and inconvenience I have been put through? Or is this simply the risk one takes, a la caveat emptor? I totally understand that this is the guy's income, but I guess I was hoping, as a repeat customer and someone with whom he seems to have a nice connection, he might be willing to "make it up" to me in some way. Thoughts? Thanks in advance.

 

Is part of the game... unfortunately now in the age of PrEP curable STDs happen more than before.

 

I guess you don't want to tell us what he gave you but I wonder if it was something he tried to conceal.

[tenderloin]

Is part of the game... unfortunately now in the age of PrEP curable STDs happen more than before.

 

I guess you don't want to tell us what he gave you but I wonder if it was something he tried to conceal.

 

I prefer not to mention, but based on his reaction when I spoke to him, he was not aware. Again, he seemed genuinely embarrassed and apologetic.

[mike carey]

I wonder if it was something he tried to conceal.

My reading of this was that the escort was aghast that this had happened, so no.

[marylander1940]

My reading of this was that the escort was aghast that this had happened, so no.

 

Yes, who wouldn't react like that.

 

That would be my reading too but do we know for sure?

 

How does the escort know the OP only had sex with him and not with others?

 

I've seen folks covering herpes with makeup and I'm sure sometimes they can do a good job. The following video is just an example. I don't think a syphilis a sore could he hide at all.

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AhHK8WSntOo

 

I guess the OP won't say what he had or he should have said it on his opening post.

[tenderloin]

Yes, who wouldn't react like that.

 

How does the escort know the OP only had sex with him and not with others?

 

I guess the OP won't say what he had or he should have said it on his opening post.

 

Granted this is an escort discussion site, but even so your curiosity is bordering on the prurient. What does it matter if it was the clap or Herpes XXIII?

 

Even in a somewhat anonymous forum like this, discretion is sometimes a good thing. I would prefer not to provide the gory details, if you don't mind. Suffice it to say that our activities and the location of the STIs were such that the route of transmission was clear. He did not challenge the point, and I can tell you (for what it is worth) I did not have sexual contact with anyone else during that time frame.

[+ Tarte Gogo]

My feeling is also no, he does not owe you a discount.

 

I am going to be a bit blunt, here:

 

You wanted to do something with him without a condom.

He said yes to you.

Therefore, he says yes to other clients who offer him the same amount ...

...and many of these other clients have similar non-safe sex regularly with other people, because that is what they like. That is why they hired him.

 

You should have known that the “std free” label cannot be worth anything from someone who says “yes” for non-safe sex.

How could it be worth anything given what we know about how STDs spread?

 

He could have caught this 3 days before meeting you, and he could not know. That is why we have condoms. You cannot know, if you are sexually active.

 

If you didn’t understand that, you are a bit of an idiot and it is your fault, he owes you nothing.

 

If you did understand that, then you knew the risk you chose, and he owes you nothing.

 

Sorry, that was very blunt.

 

If he had knowingly lied to you, I would have said yes. Actual lies always make the liar responsible.

[tenderloin]

My feeling is also no, he does not owe you a discount.

 

I am going to be a bit blunt, here:

 

You wanted to do something with him without a condom.

He said yes to you.

Therefore, he says yes to other clients who offer him the same amount ...

...and many of these other clients have similar non-safe sex regularly with other people, because that is what they like. That is why they hired him.

 

You should have known that the “std free” label cannot be worth anything from someone who says “yes” for non-safe sex.

How could it be worth anything given what we know about how STDs spread?

 

He could have caught this 3 days before meeting you, and he could not know. That is why we have condoms. You cannot know, if you are sexually active.

 

If you didn’t understand that, you are a bit of an idiot and it is your fault, he owes you nothing.

 

If you did understand that, then you knew the risk you chose, and he owes you nothing.

 

Sorry, that was very blunt.

 

If he had knowingly lied to you, I would have said yes. Actual lies always make the liar responsible.

That wasn't blunt as much as it was rude. You don't help the level of civility on this forum with that approach, but thanks for your thoughts anyway.

[tenderloin]

Since we're talking about healthcare costs...Get on PrEP, use the co-pay card and max out your health insurance deductible and out of pocket expenses at the beginning of the year. Problem Solved.

 

In any case, he does not owe you a discount in anyway as everyone must take responsibility for their own sexual wellbeing instead of placing the blame onto others. Slut shaming and placing the blame onto others is the reason why some people don't get tested as often as they should and are embarrassed to say anything when something does come up. If you're sexually active, you will eventually get something.

How is it "slut shaming" when I don't mention the name or location of the escort? WTF?

[marylander1940]

Granted this is an escort discussion site, but even so your curiosity is bordering on the prurient. What does it matter if it was the clap or Herpes XXIII?

 

Even in a somewhat anonymous forum like this, discretion is sometimes a good thing. I would prefer not to provide the gory details, if you don't mind. Suffice it to say that our activities and the location of the STIs were such that the route of transmission was clear. He did not challenge the point, and I can tell you (for what it is worth) I did not have sexual contact with anyone else during that time frame.

 

 

You're the one asking for a discount because someone you hired gave you an STD... and he admitted it.

 

In order to give advice it would have nice for you to give all the information. I never asked you what kind of disease he gave you that would have been nosy.

 

Next time you ask something on her you can always use the phrase: it's for a friend...

[mike carey]

How is it "slut shaming" when I don't mention the name or location of the escort? WTF?

I didn't think Kurtis was accusing you of slut shaming. You were not accusing the escort of anything, you were merely raising the question of what people thought was appropriate for you to do. Kurtis was pointing out that slut shaming was an issue and that if you were to push the issue that could amount to slut shaming. But you hadn't pushed the issue, so it wasn't about you.