Yet ANOTHER fake ad on Rentmen

[BabyBoomer]

A video chat between the escort and the site via Skype

 

I like this idea too.

 

~ Boomer ~

[+ honcho]

A video chat between the escort and the site via Skype

 

Any other measure about still pictures, like holding up a passphrase, or a current magazine could be photoshopped in;

but I think that doing it with live video where response is required in real time would be very, very difficult to

fake.

[Tonyko]

I SO applaud these efforts, but I myself have given up I was vigilant in reporting fakers and scammers to RB RM the boards Reviews anywhere I could (my Scott Sloan posts alone could fill a book lol) But I've resigned myself to the fact that it will ALWAYS be a chicken guarding the henhouse thang when the revenue source for these sites is THEM (the good and the bad) and not US. Anything short of an (impractical and impossible) world where a scort walks into an office IN PERSON and says THIS IS ME HERE'S MY PIX etc, will always leave room for fakers and scammers. I have resigned myself that in the end it's up to US. If a scort refuses to send a facepic then that's a dead end for me now. AND (no matter how HOT his pix are) if he says "no" or makes excuses why he can't text me a selfie holding up two fingers or a peace sign or ANYTHING etc etc, then tempting as he may be, I move on. (one actually said "I can't take pix on my phone" In 2014. . Adios)

PS IN MY OPINION ALL IT WOULD TAKE IS A REQUIRED 8 SEC VID SUBMISSION WITH ALL ADS THAT WOULD APPEAR WITH ALL ADS WITH THE SCORT SAYING THIS IS (WHATEVA HANDLE HE USES IN THE AD) AND THIS IS MY AD. VERY DOABLE IN THIS AGE

[+ stevenkesslar]

I have resigned myself that in the end it's up to US. If a scort refuses to send a facepic then that's a dead end for me now. AND (no matter how HOT his pix are) if he says "no" or makes excuses why he can't text me a selfie holding up two fingers or a peace sign or ANYTHING etc etc, then tempting as he may be, I move on.

 

Great lead in to my next suggestion.

 

I think we should form a little truth squad of people that are willing to do what Tonyko does anyway: ask escorts who we i.d. on this site and we think are scammers to send us selfies to our private cell phones or email addresses.

 

I asked Robbyy to do that and that helped get him booted from Rentmen, to Laar's credit. (It was actually the fake pics he uses that got him booted, but his inability to verify any of them helped). So Rentmen does listen. Laars himself is telling us that documentation can take a lot of time, which I think is fair to say, particulalry in cases where these guys are sophisticated in their scamming.

 

I'm willing to be one of the truth squad. Specifically what I mean is when we i.d. a likely scammer I will either phone or text the scammer and say I'd like to hire him but I'd like a current (meaning taken today) picture of him. If a potential scammer refuses to send several of us (3? 5? 10?) a current selfie, it will do two things: 1) provide more documentation to Rentmen, and 2) send a message to the scammer that we are on to him. Marylander posted something about not wanting to expose himself to attack or retaliation, which is smart thinking, but that was about confronting a scammer in person. Asking them to text or email a photo is no different than what a lot of you guys do all the time anyway. I never posted face pics on the internet, but I got lots of request to send face pics privately to potential clients, and I usually sent them. It's a completely reasonable request.

 

This of course only works on ads where scammers use face pics. If it works, arguably it could even incent scammers to stop using fake face pics. I would argue that in and of itself is desirable. If they use fake body pictures to scam, and then say "Oh, I gained a little weight," when the client shows up, in my mind it moves it further down the line of not really being Rentmen's fault.

 

Are there any other people out there willig to serve on a truth squad? (Including come up with a better name than "truth squad.")?

[+ Gar1eth]

I if he says "no" or makes excuses why he can't text me a selfie holding up two fingers or a peace sign or ANYTHING

I think holding up two fingers is really too easy. They might be able to find an online picture of that. I prefer the date.

 

Just something to keep in mind-if they use Google Voice, you can't send pictures on that. So they might need to use Dropbox or something to actually send a picture.

 

Gman

[+ stevenkesslar]

Just something to keep in mind-if they use Google Voice, you can't send pictures on that

 

I didn't know that. Can you receive pictures? Or is it only voice and text?

[+ WmClarke]

We can test that fairly quickly. I'll ask a friend to send me a pic to my google voice #. Or, if you want, I can PM you my google voice # and you can send me a pic.

[+ Gar1eth]

Just something to keep in mind-if they use Google Voice, you can't send pictures on that. So they might need to use Dropbox or something to actually send a picture.

 

Gman

I didn't know that. Can you receive pictures? Or is it only voice and text?

 

The way mine is set up-since it's tied to my phone number-I can receive MMS (pictures) but they show up in my regular Message 'app' and not inside Google Voice. Usually in the Google Voice App it tells me 'MMS Received'.

 

Gman

[+ WmClarke]

Exactly what happened wh

The way mine is set up-since it's tied to my phone number-I can receive MMS (pictures) but they show up in my regular Message 'app' and not inside Google Voice. Usually in the Google Voice App it tells me 'MMS Received'.

 

Gman

 

Exactly what happened when I just tested it. The pic shows up in my texting app but Google voice just says, "MMS Received".

[RussJohnson]

The way mine is set up-since it's tied to my phone number-I can receive MMS (pictures) but they show up in my regular Message 'app' and not inside Google Voice. Usually in the Google Voice App it tells me 'MMS Received'.

 

Gman

 

Exactly what happened wh

 

 

Exactly what happened when I just tested it. The pic shows up in my texting app but Google voice just says, "MMS Received".

 

You have to switch to Hangouts to send and receive pictures, and even then if it's an MMS it may or may not come through wifi and might have to be on cell data (I haven't fully tested that though)

[Despardo]

IN MY OPINION ALL IT WOULD TAKE IS A REQUIRED 8 SEC VID SUBMISSION WITH ALL ADS THAT WOULD APPEAR WITH ALL ADS WITH THE SCORT SAYING THIS IS (WHATEVA HANDLE HE USES IN THE AD) AND THIS IS MY AD. VERY DOABLE IN THIS AGE

Great idea.

[+ honcho]

PS IN MY OPINION ALL IT WOULD TAKE IS A REQUIRED 8 SEC VID SUBMISSION WITH ALL ADS THAT WOULD APPEAR WITH ALL ADS WITH THE SCORT SAYING THIS IS (WHATEVA HANDLE HE USES IN THE AD) AND THIS IS MY AD. VERY DOABLE IN THIS AGE

 

I think it has to be interactive (via skype or google hangouts or ...) Otherwise somebody could send in a canned

video of somebody else, or playback a video even in a skype session (via manycam.com).

 

You have to be able to see somebody talking and moving or doing something in response to something you say

right then and there, and not something they have a few minutes or an hour to do some digital spoofery.

[Despardo]

I think it has to be interactive (via skype or google hangouts or ...) Otherwise somebody could send in a canned

video of somebody else, or playback a video even in a skype session (via manycam.com).

 

You have to be able to see somebody talking and moving or doing something in response to something you say

right then and there, and not something they have a few minutes or an hour to do some digital spoofery.

I agree, however, I can understand that using a video interview for every new escort will be extremely time-consuming and hence expensive for Rentmen. A more realistic expectation might be for Rentmen to require a video chat after the pictures in an ad have been challenged.

[+ Gar1eth]

PS IN MY OPINION ALL IT WOULD TAKE IS A REQUIRED 8 SEC VID SUBMISSION WITH ALL ADS THAT WOULD APPEAR WITH ALL ADS WITH THE SCORT SAYING THIS IS (WHATEVA HANDLE HE USES IN THE AD) AND THIS IS MY AD. VERY DOABLE IN THIS AGE

 

I think it has to be interactive (via skype or google hangouts or ...) Otherwise somebody could send in a canned

video of somebody else, or playback a video even in a skype session (via manycam.com).

 

You have to be able to see somebody talking and moving or doing something in response to something you say

right then and there, and not something they have a few minutes or an hour to do some digital spoofery.

 

Tonyko had a good idea and Honcho - living up once more to his appellation of "Protector Of The Realm' -has made an even better one.

 

But one problem with both these is that we know escorts in many cases include headless physique and tallywacker pictures. The only way to make sure that the person advertising is as advertised that I can see is that Rentmen (or other sites) is going to have to look the escort or masseur totally over. After all while knowing someone's face is accurate may be half the battle-but there is still a w..

 

 

 

 

to fight regarding accurate and truthful ads!!

 

Gman

[BabyBoomer]

Good point, Gman.

 

~ Boomer ~

[Despardo]

Tonyko had a good idea and Honcho - living up once more to his appellation of "Protector Of The Realm' -has made an even better one.

 

But one problem with both these is that we know escorts in many cases include headless physique and tallywacker pictures. The only way to make sure that the person advertising is as advertised that I can see is that Rentmen (or other sites) is going to have to look the escort or masseur totally over. After all while knowing someone's face is accurate may be half the battle-but there is still a w..

 

 

 

 

to fight regarding accurate and truthful ads!!

 

Gman

That had occurred to me as well, but I think it would be asking for way too much. Best case scenario would be to verify at least some of the pictures posted are of the actual escort. Getting into specific body parts is just plain impractical, not to mention really awkward. The best we can hope for here is a baseline verification to screen out the total counterfeits. Exaggeration in the ads (imagine that, exaggeration in advertising!) would be really hard to control. No matter what system is implemented, it will still be up to the client to use sound judgement in making a hiring decision. Issues concerning dated pictures, wildly flattering pictures, photoshopped pictures, as well as misinformation regarding age, size, and performance ability is, I think, beyond the scope of this discussion. As we all know, what you see is not always exactly what you get. That is where reviews are helpful. I am hoping we can get the escort sites to agree to some basic ground rules and to provide better client recourse when fraud has been determined.

[+ Gar1eth]

That had occurred to me as well, but I think it would be asking for way too much. Best case scenario would be to verify at least some of the pictures posted are of the actual escort. Getting into specific body parts is just plain impractical, not to mention really awkward.

 

I don't think it would be that bad. And being the altruist that I am, I offer my eyesight for the cause!! Yes, I will dedicate myself to making sure the ads are correct down to the last inch . I just got my passport renewed. I can leave on a moment's notice by Rentmen. In fact RM doesn't even need to pay me. I'll volunteer for the good of us all!!!

 

http://thumbs.dreamstime.com/x/roman-soldier-saluting-fist-chest-isolated-over-white-background-41246388.jpg

 

 

Gman

[MrMiniver]

I'm beginning to think that everyone on Rentmen (except the established names we all know) is fake. I've had 3 fakes just in the past 3 weeks.

 

Just ran across this one. Anyone know if this guy is real?

 

http://rentmen.com/coolguy

[RussJohnson]

I'm beginning to think that everyone on Rentmen (except the established names we all know) is fake. I've had 3 fakes just in the past 3 weeks.

 

Just ran across this one. Anyone know if this guy is real?

 

http://rentmen.com/coolguy

 

Here is a thread about him: http://www.companyofmen.org/threads/411-on-alexandr-rb-in-nyc.105774/

 

Tough one...he might actually be real. Most of his pictures reference a russian(?) model (I don't read cyrillic) But I also saw on social media that the model (Andrey Otdelnov) is here in NY. I would call and if you get an eastern european accent then you are probably okay. The copy of the ad seems like someone trying to sound casual but english is not their first language, if you know what I mean.

[MrMiniver]

Here is a thread about him: http://www.companyofmen.org/threads/411-on-alexandr-rb-in-nyc.105774/

 

Tough one...he might actually be real. Most of his pictures reference a russian(?) model (I don't read cyrillic) But I also saw on social media that the model (Andrey Otdelnov) is here in NY. I would call and if you get an eastern european accent then you are probably okay. The copy of the ad seems like someone trying to sound casual but english is not their first language, if you know what I mean.

 

Thanks, long thread, but it seems no conclusion and no one took the plunge. I'm guessing ... another fake!

[+ stevenkesslar]

Tough one...he might actually be real. Most of his pictures reference a russian(?) model (I don't read cyrillic) But I also saw on social media that the model (Andrey Otdelnov) is here in NY. I would call and if you get an eastern european accent then you are probably okay. The copy of the ad seems like someone trying to sound casual but english is not their first language, if you know what I mean.

 

First off, I have to admit I am incredibly jealous of this guy. How can anybody be so fucking gorgeous? I hope at least the cock picture is fake, because nobody with a face and body like that has a right to get a perfect cock as well. It's just not fair!

 

Now that I have that out of the way, here's my take. This guy reinforces why I think the best policy is to require a real time "selfie photo" or "selfie video" as a verification tool, when Rentmen decides verification is even needed.

 

The pictures are clearly of a Russian model that goes by the name Andrey Otdelnov. A Google reverse image search leads you back to these two pages:

 

http://www.fashionbank.ru/models/user/112256.html

 

https://vk.com/wall197457498?own=1&offset=20

 

One is a set of model quality photos, the other is some kind of "Russian Facebook" page with lots of personal photos, including several of the ones in the Rentmen set. So most of the Rentmen ad pictures are definitely of Andrey. A few - like the cock shot with the "Trophy Boy" hat, and the ass shot of the model doing pushups by the bed, are all over the internet, on all kinds of websites, for the obvious reason that they are incredibly sexy. Even if the advertiser is actually Andrey, I could imagine he might be using "fake" x rated shots for people who want to see a cock and an ass. But there is absolutely no way to verify that (except, of course, unless Rentmen wants to hire Gareth). And even if they are fake, if the advertiser is Andrey, I doubt anybody who hires him is going to be disappointed in his looks. As pjp1492 pointed out in the older thread on Andrey linked to above, the same "Trophy Boy" cock shots were used by another escort, named MascFitStud, in a different Rentmen ad. My guess is that both advertisers are using a fake cock shot, but that's just my guess. Again, there's no way to verify whether a photo like that is real or not, and I think it would be unreasonable to ask Rentmen to do so.

 

So the only real issue is this: is this advertiser really Andrey, or a scammer pretending to be Andrey? My guess is he is real. I could actually post candid face photos of me in just about every photo Andrey is pictured - Pisa, Florence, New York, Singapore, Paris, the list goes on. I never modeled, and I never had the degree of vascularity and definition only steroids can give you, but for all practical purposes this could be a handsome, well built, and young (again, I am so fucking jealous!) model who doubles as an escort on the side and is willing to show his face in a way many models would not. There's nothing wrong with that. And if he wants to charge sky high rates, that's his business.

 

The "easy" way to verify that this is Andrey is to ask for a selfie. The trick is that if "Andrey" is a scammer, he picked a model who has lots of public selfies like this one:

 

 

If you look at the "Russian Facebook" page it also explains why it would be easy to fake a government i.d, like Sean/Mike/Toby apparently did. There are a limitless number of photos of Andrey that can be cut and pasted onto something like a New York drivers license or a passport. Rentmen probably does not have forensics experts on staff to figure stuff like that out.

 

So if Rentmen really did want to "verify" that Andrey is Andrey, the real time or close-to-real-time things you guys have been proposing make sense: a selfie with a newspaper dated today, or a "selfie video" with the same saying "Hi Laars," or a Skype chat assuming both Andrey and Laars or his staff have easy access to Skype. Any or all of them would be quick and cheap and would presumably provide more than reasonable "verification," even though no verification system is foolproof.

 

To go back to basics, is there any particular reason Rentmen should ask Andrey to verify he is not scamming? Neither this thread nor the earlier one about Andrey provide any suggestion this advertiser, whoever he is, is scamming anybody.

 

My own view is that it's better to focus on a "warning" system that alerts Rentmen to ads that have a high likelihood of being fake and scammy. If they have to require every escort to go through an exhaustive and/or expensive and/or invasive system of "verification," it is is system designed to fail. There are some easy things that Rentmen could do for all new advertisers - like a Google reverse image search - if they choose. That's how I easily figured out Robbyy was a fake. What makes the most sense to me is to provide a clear customer feedback loop so that when we do have good reasons to suspect someone is scamming - based on Rentmen's own written policies - we can count on the fact that Rentmen will investigate quickly and thoroughly. They did boot Robbyy off for using inconsistent fake photos. If they had a "selfie" policy I think they would quickly and easily boot Sean/Mike/Toby off as well.

 

In summary, I've amended the three requests I want to make to Laars based on this helpful discussion:

 

1. Have a clear written anti-scamming policy on the website that is easy to find. One thing it should say is that the photos used in the ad have to be real, and that Rentmen reserves the right to verify all photos - especially face photos.

2. Have a warning button that is easy to find on each ad that allows people to issue a warning to Rentmen, based on their written policies, that they think the advertiser is scamming.

3. Have a clear written policy that explains how escorts suspected of scamming or fraud may be required to verify that their photos are real through selfies - either images or videos - that are "real time" images taken in response to a specific Rentmen request. Examples: holding a newspaper dated today, holding an item (like a pillow), a video saying, "Hi Laars, it's Andrey," or a brief Skype chat.

 

As I listed when I got involved in this thread, there are other internal (software related) things I think other websites do that Rentmen could do also, but these are the three things other websites already do that Rentmen doesn't that make the most sense to prevent and deter scams, I think, based on this discussion.

 

Reactions?

[Guy Fawkes]

Please don't SHOUT inside the house. It's very hard to read.

 

PS IN MY OPINION ALL IT WOULD TAKE IS A REQUIRED 8 SEC VID SUBMISSION WITH ALL ADS THAT WOULD APPEAR WITH ALL ADS WITH THE SCORT SAYING THIS IS (WHATEVA HANDLE HE USES IN THE AD) AND THIS IS MY AD. VERY DOABLE IN THIS AGE

[MrMiniver]

Mr. Kesslar makes some amazing points and I can't imagine anyone coming up with something better. As to the video thing, even some of those are fake. I hired a guy from Backpage once who had a video posted (I figured he must be real). Nope, he showed up and wasn't the guy in the pics or the videos. With so many people posting videos of themselves online, he just stole one of those to go along with the fake pics.

[+ VeryHappyCustomer]

Syncing dubbed audio with a clear facial image is very very hard. I would be convinced by a brief clip of the advertised face saying something like "My name is HungryAss at rentmen. Call me at 123-456-7890".

[RussJohnson]

Mr. Kesslar makes some amazing points and I can't imagine anyone coming up with something better. As to the video thing, even some of those are fake. I hired a guy from Backpage once who had a video posted (I figured he must be real). Nope, he showed up and wasn't the guy in the pics or the videos. With so many people posting videos of themselves online, he just stole one of those to go along with the fake pics.

 

Between Facebook, Instagram, Vine, and all those other things if someone over shares you could very easily steal their social identity. I think thats what most of those BP ads are, all the pictures have filters and all the videos are just a few seconds. It's like all those poor straight boys being catfished into sending nudes for people's tumblrs and such...